School Contradiction 14:51 - May 11 with 1236 views | BlueByYou | I'm a parent, and I am looking to gather some views on the primary school reopening, if anybody has some. No problem if not. To me, the potential reopening of schools in early June looks unsafe. The biggest signal of this to me, is that if it were safe, then high schools would be reopened then also. Sunday's announcement made it clear that year 7, 8 and 9 students won't return before September, and instead high schools were covered with some wide brushstrokes of an 'ambition' to get students sitting exams next year (year 10 and 12) into school at some point before the summer holidays. If it is unsafe to reopen the high schools, then the only conclusion for me is the primary school opening is unsafe, and a decision has been made based on economic benefit instead. I understand the logic, regarding getting people back to work, and the need for childcare arrangements. I also understand that for parents, making childcare arrangement for a five year old in year one, is much more challenging than for a thirteen year old in year nine. However the clear contradiction in the decision, shows the government aren't following the science, but instead following the economy. We were told the economy would be second, behind safety, but to me this is clearly untrue on the school decision. Do you think I'm wrong in thinking this? I understand that no decision has zero risk attached to it, and that perhaps some easing is needed so that the economy doesn't crumble to dust. It seems apparent that opening either a primary school or a high school would push the R value up by some amount. It just also seems very clear, that the R amount rise would be smaller for a high school when compared to a primary school (based on social distancing being easier to implement to 15 year olds compared with 5 year olds, and the school pick up and congregation of people being less for teenagers compared to young children). If we are easing out of this, don't we make decisions that rise R by the smallest amount possible? |  | | |  |
School Contradiction on 15:02 - May 11 with 1201 views | BloomBlue | Surely if the economy was first he would have said all businesses, shops, school etc can reopen today. Lots of business moaning today because they want to open now. For me the school question is a balancing act, I see a lots of Children not getting any real education. If they're disadvantaged already missing months and months of education is only going to make it worse isn't it |  | |  |
School Contradiction on 15:13 - May 11 with 1176 views | bluelagos | I think the bit you are missing is social distancing. As it stands, 30 kids in a class room, social distancing is impossible. Split the class over 2 or 3 classrooms, social distancing becomes possible. Stagger your playtimes, and again it becomes much more manageable. So if you can have socially distanced education, why wouldn't you? Education is important and they are targeting the critical ages, e.g. Year 6s who are transitioning to secondary school (hopefully) in Sept and need preparing for that. That said, the younger the kids are, the harder it is for them to understand, so the idea of reception age kids in school doesn't make a lot of sense to me. But my best advice would be to speak to your teacher(s). They will have informed opinions and may be able to share better insights than many on Twtd. They may also take your valid concerns to management and flex their approach accordingly. But don't forget, the educational and social damage being done in Lockdown is significant and the desire to get schools up and running is much more than just the financial upsides of freeing up workers. |  |
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School Contradiction on 15:26 - May 11 with 1150 views | BlueByYou |
School Contradiction on 15:13 - May 11 by bluelagos | I think the bit you are missing is social distancing. As it stands, 30 kids in a class room, social distancing is impossible. Split the class over 2 or 3 classrooms, social distancing becomes possible. Stagger your playtimes, and again it becomes much more manageable. So if you can have socially distanced education, why wouldn't you? Education is important and they are targeting the critical ages, e.g. Year 6s who are transitioning to secondary school (hopefully) in Sept and need preparing for that. That said, the younger the kids are, the harder it is for them to understand, so the idea of reception age kids in school doesn't make a lot of sense to me. But my best advice would be to speak to your teacher(s). They will have informed opinions and may be able to share better insights than many on Twtd. They may also take your valid concerns to management and flex their approach accordingly. But don't forget, the educational and social damage being done in Lockdown is significant and the desire to get schools up and running is much more than just the financial upsides of freeing up workers. |
I think your question of if you can have socially distanced education, why wouldn't you, is an excellent one, and I completely agree, that if you can, you should. Doesn't that reiterate the contradiction that I raised though. If our government think that socially distanced education is possible for primary school children, then why not open high schools also? |  | |  |
School Contradiction on 15:27 - May 11 with 1146 views | BlueNomad | It is an experiment. It is an acceptance that the virus cannot be contained. Young children will not understand the concept of social distancing, let alone practise it. Staff will be badly exposed but that isn’t part of the equation apparently. Having said all that, I think we are going to be hit with a second wave anyway. |  | |  |
School Contradiction on 15:32 - May 11 with 1141 views | bluelagos |
School Contradiction on 15:26 - May 11 by BlueByYou | I think your question of if you can have socially distanced education, why wouldn't you, is an excellent one, and I completely agree, that if you can, you should. Doesn't that reiterate the contradiction that I raised though. If our government think that socially distanced education is possible for primary school children, then why not open high schools also? |
Hey listen, am loathe to defend anything these idiots do. I think it might be down to the fact that teenagers are less likely to follow instructions than say 10 year olds? Can't see any other reason tbh. |  |
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School Contradiction on 15:49 - May 11 with 1106 views | stopmoaning | I work in schools - secondary, but have spent plenty of time in primaries. And to caveat this, I don't think any should open before the new school year - and even then it will be a tough task. And I do think most things they are doing are based on the economy. However, a secondary school is a very different environment to secondary. I guess first off, primary school kids usually never move classroom anyway, and have 1 single teacher for everything most the time - and that can continue. Also young kids need to get used to the learning environment, kids who are 13 for example don't - its an important age of development for children when they are young. I am pretty sure years 10 and 12 will be back in secondary schools in June or July, and that's because of exams coming up next year of course. Where I work year 6 actually start in secondary school at the end of the year, so it wouldn't surprise me if we see them them in the secondary schools. Also secondary schools are coping on the whole with remote learning better. But again, I think its wrong to do it now. |  | |  |
School Contradiction on 16:07 - May 11 with 1079 views | BlueByYou |
School Contradiction on 15:49 - May 11 by stopmoaning | I work in schools - secondary, but have spent plenty of time in primaries. And to caveat this, I don't think any should open before the new school year - and even then it will be a tough task. And I do think most things they are doing are based on the economy. However, a secondary school is a very different environment to secondary. I guess first off, primary school kids usually never move classroom anyway, and have 1 single teacher for everything most the time - and that can continue. Also young kids need to get used to the learning environment, kids who are 13 for example don't - its an important age of development for children when they are young. I am pretty sure years 10 and 12 will be back in secondary schools in June or July, and that's because of exams coming up next year of course. Where I work year 6 actually start in secondary school at the end of the year, so it wouldn't surprise me if we see them them in the secondary schools. Also secondary schools are coping on the whole with remote learning better. But again, I think its wrong to do it now. |
Thanks for your reply. I hadn't considered that primary school students tend to stay in one classroom for all their lessons, and that is a big detail compared to students moving around the secondary schools to get to their lessons. That's really why I wanted to open it up as a post, to help see what details I was missing, so thank you. |  | |  |
School Contradiction on 16:20 - May 11 with 1056 views | giant_stow |
School Contradiction on 15:13 - May 11 by bluelagos | I think the bit you are missing is social distancing. As it stands, 30 kids in a class room, social distancing is impossible. Split the class over 2 or 3 classrooms, social distancing becomes possible. Stagger your playtimes, and again it becomes much more manageable. So if you can have socially distanced education, why wouldn't you? Education is important and they are targeting the critical ages, e.g. Year 6s who are transitioning to secondary school (hopefully) in Sept and need preparing for that. That said, the younger the kids are, the harder it is for them to understand, so the idea of reception age kids in school doesn't make a lot of sense to me. But my best advice would be to speak to your teacher(s). They will have informed opinions and may be able to share better insights than many on Twtd. They may also take your valid concerns to management and flex their approach accordingly. But don't forget, the educational and social damage being done in Lockdown is significant and the desire to get schools up and running is much more than just the financial upsides of freeing up workers. |
Re your last point, a lot seems to depend on each individual teacher's qualities. We're hearing of friends who's kids are getitng weakly classroom zoom lessons and daily lesson plans. Our kid is lucky to get a 'well done' email back from his teacher every 2 or 3 weeks. We've had other questions over how she's run things this year, but then again, if you ave to miss school, maybe best to miss a bad teacher. |  |
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School Contradiction on 16:21 - May 11 with 1055 views | Pinewoodblue | It isn’t due to change until June and if conditions are Not-right it will not happen. |  |
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School Contradiction on 16:24 - May 11 with 1052 views | BlueNomad |
School Contradiction on 16:07 - May 11 by BlueByYou | Thanks for your reply. I hadn't considered that primary school students tend to stay in one classroom for all their lessons, and that is a big detail compared to students moving around the secondary schools to get to their lessons. That's really why I wanted to open it up as a post, to help see what details I was missing, so thank you. |
There are usually a number of adults in a classroom in primary school. They are tactile and fidgety. They have a variety of accidents. There is some suggestion young children are suffering from the virus which manifests itself in gastric problems I see the main driver for this being the economy. They want people back at work. Young children cannot be left at home for the day. |  | |  |
School Contradiction on 16:27 - May 11 with 1043 views | giant_stow |
School Contradiction on 16:24 - May 11 by BlueNomad | There are usually a number of adults in a classroom in primary school. They are tactile and fidgety. They have a variety of accidents. There is some suggestion young children are suffering from the virus which manifests itself in gastric problems I see the main driver for this being the economy. They want people back at work. Young children cannot be left at home for the day. |
To me, its also a wellbeing issue for the kids. It can't be doing the development or happiness any good being home, and that's just the kids in happy homes. |  |
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School Contradiction on 16:29 - May 11 with 1034 views | bluelagos |
School Contradiction on 16:20 - May 11 by giant_stow | Re your last point, a lot seems to depend on each individual teacher's qualities. We're hearing of friends who's kids are getitng weakly classroom zoom lessons and daily lesson plans. Our kid is lucky to get a 'well done' email back from his teacher every 2 or 3 weeks. We've had other questions over how she's run things this year, but then again, if you ave to miss school, maybe best to miss a bad teacher. |
I think plenty of teacher are doing amazing jobs in the cicumstances, parents too. But for me schooling is also about social interaction / child development which is yet another socially destructive aspect of lockdown. So often lockdown is presented as a health v cost choice when in reality the social costs are huge imho. |  |
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School Contradiction on 16:32 - May 11 with 1027 views | giant_stow |
School Contradiction on 16:29 - May 11 by bluelagos | I think plenty of teacher are doing amazing jobs in the cicumstances, parents too. But for me schooling is also about social interaction / child development which is yet another socially destructive aspect of lockdown. So often lockdown is presented as a health v cost choice when in reality the social costs are huge imho. |
Yeah, i think the social interaction part of shcool is the hardest to replace - I wonder what damage we'll see to this chort of kids down the line. |  |
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School Contradiction on 16:32 - May 11 with 1025 views | IpswichKnight | As i'm sure the primary school teachers will be along shortly to tell us, the early years education is important and very hard to catch up especially in a secondary setting which is one of the reasons why the younger kids are down to go back first. The wife teaches year 12/13s A Level Geography and her and her boss have worked there backsides off getting lessons planned and delivered either online or via interactive lessons ( I could hear one this afternoon ) the wife took the lesson while her boss answered the comment questions. Admittedly the wife only teaches one subject and to A levels only it must be hellish to try and do that for every year group from year 7 to year 13 as some school are doing! |  | |  |
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