| Without going all Pazelle, something does seem rather 'off kilter' 07:49 - Nov 9 with 22075 views | homer_123 |
with the whole Patel affair, dies it not?
Surely May's position as 'leader' would have potential been stronger had she 'sacked' Patel for breaking the Ministerial Code and/ or not being candid about all her meetings.
Might she have benefited from decisive leadership and sacking Patel as opposed to letting her resign. Could it be argued that by also removing Boris from his role, she would look stronger?
I'm not blind to the fact that she put these into their respective roles and she wouldn't like either on the back benches, so ideally she would rather not be in this position.
However, all that aside, I can't help feeling this morning that the reason Patel was allowed to resign is that there is clearly some truth in the notion that the FCO and/ or Downing Street were more aware of the situation than they have let on.
I'm no Tom Watson fan, far from it, but he's right to be asking more questions and looking to seek clarification on the matter. As I say, it all seems rather off kilter.
2 Cabinet minister gone
Brexit talks in deadlock
Majority slashed
Sexual harassment situation (appreciate this is hitting all parties)
Surely this government can't go on much longer, can it? |  |
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| Without going all Pazelle, something does seem rather 'off kilter' on 07:42 - Nov 10 with 1674 views | GlasgowBlue |
| Without going all Pazelle, something does seem rather 'off kilter' on 19:17 - Nov 9 by No9 |
I beleive all were wrong
We obviously have different standards |
What do you mean “we obviously have different standards”? |  |
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| Without going all Pazelle, something does seem rather 'off kilter' on 08:22 - Nov 10 with 1654 views | lowhouseblue |
| Without going all Pazelle, something does seem rather 'off kilter' on 04:45 - Nov 10 by caught-in-limbo |
yawn. you need to learn to read. i repeat 'it is clear you know nothing about PESCO.' you can say the same thing ad infinitum but you're missing the point. our government has been against PESCO and any resulting EU army. "Britain has long thwarted EU defence integration, fearing the development of an EU army would undermine its relationship with Nato." Source: The Telegraph 20 May 2017. the BBC for example has only ever mentioned the Permanent Structured Cooperation (PESCO) once, in 2010. Here is the main point: "The British Defence Secretary Dr Liam Fox said: "This is not a push for an EU army which we oppose... It has always been my view that defence must be a sovereign and therefore an inter-governmental issue." britain is therefore not taking advantage of the mechanism offered by the Lisbon Treaty. The treaty allows for what is called "permanent structured cooperation in defence". http://www.bbc.com/news/uk-politics-11669704 PESCO is an opt in agreement for EU member states. the fact that the UK is signing up to it is a clear demonstration that the UK with Fallon and Johnson negotiating details of PESCO means that the UK is not leaving the EU. |
the uk needs the eu to maintain a coherent defence strategy to protect against russian expansionism. that's a very basic political fact. we also need eu countries to spend more - particularly given trump's view. a similarly basic fact is that the uk leaving the eu is game changing. first, it removes our veto on various eu level defence initiatives. these are now much more likely to proceed than when we had the power to stop them. we need to come to terms with that - the world has changed. second the uk is losing direct influence and has to find new ways of promoting effective Europe wide security. it is therefore inevitable that the uk's precise approach to eu defence arrangements is changing - but the basic premise that we want eu defence cooperation is as it has always been. the uk will cooperate in collaborative arrangements as it has previously done.
but back to the chase and where all this started. ... so your line is that the people 'behind' Johnson leading the brexit campaign and who are now plotting to keep him in his job are doing it as part of a strategy to promote an eu defence merger. and the purpose of such a strategy is to confront the russians. what a surprise, or perhaps a coincidence, that this should be your line. [Post edited 10 Nov 2017 8:27]
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| And so as the loose-bowelled pigeon of time swoops low over the unsuspecting tourist of destiny, and the flatulent skunk of fate wanders into the air-conditioning system of eternity, I notice it's the end of the show |
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| Without going all Pazelle, something does seem rather 'off kilter' on 08:56 - Nov 10 with 1634 views | No9 |
| Without going all Pazelle, something does seem rather 'off kilter' on 20:44 - Nov 9 by caught-in-limbo |
It is clear you know nothing about PESCO.
You can say the same thing ad infinitum but you're missing the point.
Our government has been against PESCO and any resulting EU Army. "Britain has long thwarted EU defence integration, fearing the development of an EU army would undermine its relationship with Nato." Source: The Telegraph 20 May 2017
The BBC for example has only ever mentioned the Permanent Structured Cooperation (PESCO) once, in 2010. Here is the main point:
"The British Defence Secretary Dr Liam Fox said: "This is not a push for an EU army which we oppose... It has always been my view that defence must be a sovereign and therefore an inter-governmental issue."
Britain is therefore not taking advantage of the mechanism offered by the Lisbon Treaty. The treaty allows for what is called "permanent structured cooperation in defence". http://www.bbc.com/news/uk-politics-11669704
PESCO is an opt in agreement for EU member states. The fact that the UK is signing up to it is a clear demonstration that the UK with Fallon and Johnson negotiating details of PESCO means that the UK is not leaving the EU. [Post edited 9 Nov 2017 20:56]
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Don't forget Laim Fox as tory defence secretary cancelled a ot of British hardware includung the Harrier to buy American NOT European equipment.
As far as Brexit is concerened the British people will get a Brexit that is decided between tory donors and tory ministers.
Anyone who thinks this is a democratic process musr be blind or mad |  | | |
| Without going all Pazelle, something does seem rather 'off kilter' on 10:43 - Nov 10 with 1614 views | StokieBlue |
| Without going all Pazelle, something does seem rather 'off kilter' on 05:28 - Nov 10 by caught-in-limbo |
When I give my own opinions you want a source. When there is no source you won't accept it because you want proof of the things I believe will happen. When I give sources you claim that I have twisted words or cherry-picked information. When I provide sources with direct quotes you say I always do that and cutting and pasting is indicative of a troll factory. You appear not to accept anything I say, even if it's opinion or speculation unless it's in print somewhere. When I provide what you want, I'm "cut and pasting" and I work in a troll factory. I paste stuff when I give a source to something which I have lifted directly from the corporate press. I do this to show that I haven't twisted someone's words. I provide the source so everyone can read that the words are not taken out of context.
I said everything twice above, so that you read it at least once. I'm sure you'll respond to that by saying that it was written like a bot or that I've been insulting in some way.
It's clear that you and at least one other poster in this thread will not be satisfied by however I present information, your job is to do a hit job on me at almost every opportunity.
You accuse me of not answering your questions, yet you are guilty of that yourself. You accuse me of using insulting language, yet when i ask you to point out where I have been insulting you fail to do so while while filling your post with condescending language yourself.
"It's like the troll factories who have an archive of cut and paste clippings they can call upon. "
Well, you certainly seem to understand the workings of a troll factory better than me.
The BBC has mentioned PESCO once in 7 years. Normal people don't get their news from the Reuters website, they get it from the BBC.
You don't seem to understand the idea of having an opinion about what may happen in the future. Reality doesn't exist for you outside what is reported by the press - not only that, it has to be the media titles you approve of, in the time frame you deem relevant, reporting individuals you deem credible.
You say I don't answer questions AGAIN. When I point out that your question is answered in my first line of my reply you say that I've answered it in a weird way.
Your whole reason for exchanging with me appears to be to silence me by boring me (and anyone else reading these posts) to death. |
Lovely.
"The BBC has mentioned PESCO once in 7 years. Normal people don't get their news from the Reuters website, they get it from the BBC. "
Equally lovely, people are idiots of course.
It's early, I may have missed it so I will apologise in advance just in case (sorry!), but you still don't seem to have provided a source to your hugely repeated statement that the UK has signed up to PESCO (not we will, we have). I've provided a source saying they haven't so I will read your source when you provide it. If it's an opinion then fine but you present it as fact with stone cold certainly we will not leave the EU because we have signed up to PESCO.
Many apologies that myself and others are not intellectually stimulating enough for you. I suggest you play a game of chess or something on the side whilst replying to our posts that should stimulate the mind.
SB |  |
| Avatar - M51 - The Whirlpool Galaxy - Taken on 29th April 2024 |
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| Without going all Pazelle, something does seem rather 'off kilter' on 10:57 - Nov 10 with 1607 views | No9 |
| Without going all Pazelle, something does seem rather 'off kilter' on 10:43 - Nov 10 by StokieBlue |
Lovely.
"The BBC has mentioned PESCO once in 7 years. Normal people don't get their news from the Reuters website, they get it from the BBC. "
Equally lovely, people are idiots of course.
It's early, I may have missed it so I will apologise in advance just in case (sorry!), but you still don't seem to have provided a source to your hugely repeated statement that the UK has signed up to PESCO (not we will, we have). I've provided a source saying they haven't so I will read your source when you provide it. If it's an opinion then fine but you present it as fact with stone cold certainly we will not leave the EU because we have signed up to PESCO.
Many apologies that myself and others are not intellectually stimulating enough for you. I suggest you play a game of chess or something on the side whilst replying to our posts that should stimulate the mind.
SB |
According to 'British Voice' the UK signed up to PESCO in November 16 - after the Brexit vote | | | |
| Without going all Pazelle, something does seem rather 'off kilter' on 14:26 - Nov 10 with 1579 views | Bluesquid |
| Without going all Pazelle, something does seem rather 'off kilter' on 20:17 - Nov 9 by GlasgowBlue |
A disastrous manifesto launch with the social care proposals alienating the core Tory base was the reason. The polls went one way after that.
If you were being kind to Priti Patel you could say that she was trying to put in funding arrangements for Syrian refugees in the military hospitals in the illegally occupied Golan Heights. We do the same for the other countries who border Syria but of course the UK doesn't recognise Israel's occupation of the Golan Heights.
Alternatively, she could have been making a clandestine move to replace Theresa May by appealing to the right of the Tory party by cosying up to Benjamin Netanyahu. |
Terrorist sympathiser?
Al Nusra are Al Qaeda affiliated.
http://www.independent.co.uk/voices/priti-patel-israel-golan-heights-al-nusra-sy | | | |
| Without going all Pazelle, something does seem rather 'off kilter' on 15:35 - Nov 10 with 1552 views | ClausThomsen |
Pazelle wouldn't have concerned himself with such trivial nonsense.
You can vote for anyone to represent your democracy, but they'll all be sponsored to the eyeballs by the real powers that be. You have no democracy at all.
Don't let me stop you masturbating! | | | |
| Without going all Pazelle, something does seem rather 'off kilter' on 08:36 - Nov 11 with 1497 views | No9 |
| Without going all Pazelle, something does seem rather 'off kilter' on 15:35 - Nov 10 by ClausThomsen |
Pazelle wouldn't have concerned himself with such trivial nonsense.
You can vote for anyone to represent your democracy, but they'll all be sponsored to the eyeballs by the real powers that be. You have no democracy at all.
Don't let me stop you masturbating! |
"You can vote for anyone to represent your democracy, but they'll all be sponsored to the eyeballs by the real powers that be. You have no democracy at all."
Yet despite that those who voted to 'Leave' still can't see how they have been duped by the, wealthy to the super rich, to make them (not the voter) even wealthier. | | | |
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