| Why so much negativity towards Lampard? 23:16 - May 21 with 4602 views | Yaffle |
TLDR — Don’t discount the idea of Lampard as manager, his inexperience may not necessarily be as much of an issue as you fear.
I’ve read a number of posts discounting out of hand Frank Lampard as our next manager, purely on the basis of a lack of management experience, which I find quite odd. If, as it appears, the shortlist of 3 is Ross, Lampard and Hurst I think each offers something unique and in every case, I would be happy to see them take the helm and be given a go to move us forward.
What is clear is that we’ve tried the experienced manager with a track record of getting clubs promoted to the Premiership route, without success. The last 3 managers had 5 promotions between them and a single payoff semi is all we had to cheer about (that and not getting relegated the year McCarthy joined). The idea of going down the tried and tested, battle-hardened championship manager route again does not seem particularly appealing.
Of the potential shortlist of 3, some perspective on the other 2 candidates is needed.
Jack Ross has 114 games in management. Of those 34 were in charge of semi-professional Alloa Athletic with a 38% win ratio. His spell with St. Mirren, however, is undoubtedly impressive. Furthermore, he seems like a ‘good fit’ for Ipswich, whatever that means. I’ve seen it mentioned a few times and I feel it too, however, I’m not sure quite where the frenetic Ross support is really grounded in given his relative lack of overall experience or time managing at this level.
Paul Hurst has 10 years’ experience managing through the lower leagues with over 500 games in management. He has done well at Shrewsbury and it will be interesting to see what he does if they win the play-offs. I get the impression he may be less media-friendly than the other 2. That said its difficult to argue with a win ratio over 50% across 500 games. The question for me is why hasn't it happened for him before now?
Lampard’s (who will be 40 next month) credentials as a player speak for themselves. However, it wasn’t until I wrote them down that I was struck by what an incredible career he has had. 913 club games with 274 goals to his name. 106 (29 goals) England caps and an incredible list of honours over the years. Most relevant to Towns interest perhaps is that he has played under a huge variety of managers, experiencing their different styles, influences, tactics and man management over the course of his career. His bosses have included, Claudio Ranieri, Jose Mourinho, Luiz Felipe Scolari, Guus Hiddink, Carlo Ancelotti, Andre Villas-Boas and Rafael BenÃtez. With England, he would have played under Sven Goran Erikson, Steve McLaren, Fabio Capello and Roy Hodgson. It is difficult to deny that that is an impressive list to have worked with. Furthermore, this is unlikely to have been wasted on Lampard. His intelligence is well documented, his IQ is rumoured to be well over 150. He is media friendly, polished, driven and a proven winner, he could really raise the profile of our club without it becoming a media circus and he is very connected and respected across the game. He’s even got an Uncle ‘Arry! I don’t accept that he has nothing to lose. He is fiercely competitive and will want to maintain that winning mentality, especially when the focus will be purely on him. I think the case for Lampard is very strong and should not be discounted just because he’s got no management experience. I think the experience and credentials he does have stands alone among all the candidates (all 100 of them if Sky Sports are to be believed!) and if it isn’t at Ipswich, we will certainly get to see at some point in the future what kind of manager he will be.
But what about this lack of management experience issue? I looked at other very good/world class players who have turned their hand to management? There are plenty of examples of young players taking up management in their late 30’s early 40’s, in many cases taking on roles at huge clubs or even nations and going on to be incredibly successful. The following list makes the point pretty well.
Antonio Conte —36 with Arezo and then Bari
Didier Deschamps —33 with Monaco
Bobby Robson — 35 with Fulham and then Town year later.
Fabio Capello — 41 with Milan
Jupp Heynckes — 34 with Borussia Mönchengladbach
Kenny Dalglish — 34 with Liverpool
Diego Simeone — 36 Racing Club
Brian Clough — 30 Hartlepool
Mario Zagallo — 35 Botatogo and Brazil at 36
Carlo Ancelotti — 36 Reggiana and Parma at 37
Franz Beckenbauer — 39 West Germany
Pep Guardiola — 36 Bara B, 37 Barcelona
Johan Cruyff — 38 Ajax
Jock Stein — 38 Dunfermline
Fran Rijkaard — 36 Holland
Ernst Happel — 37 Ado Den Haag
Miguel Munoz — 37 Real Madrid
Vincent Del Bosque — 37 Castilla
Giovanni Trapattoni — 35 AC Milan
…and yes I accept there are some that have made a complete hash of it too. However, the higher up the footballing tree you go, the less examples there are of total failures in management.
So, in summary, someone is going to give Lampard a shot at management and there are plenty of reasons to believe that he could be a huge success. I for one would welcome him to Ipswich.
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| Why so much negativity towards Lampard? on 09:07 - May 22 with 674 views | tractorshark |
All 3 candidates are a bit of a gamble. They are all untried at this level.
The benefits of Lampard are he would attract decent loan players, he’s intelligent and he would raise the profile of the club. That may reignite an interest from Evans or a desire to give it one last push. At the very least Lampard’s presence would make the club more attractive to potential foreign buyers.
The disadvantage is he has no managerial experience. He would certainly need a strong assistant alongside him, although he’s not walking into the same divisive dressing room that Mick did in 2012.
It’s interesting comparing him to high-profile players who have gone into management.
Their track record is mixed, although I feel Lampard has more about him than someone like Gerrard.
I also think he would walk if it went wrong. |  | | |
| Why so much negativity towards Lampard? on 09:07 - May 22 with 674 views | hype313 |
| Why so much negativity towards Lampard? on 09:06 - May 22 by hype313 |
Yeah agreed, I supposed the other side to my argument is the fact that they have got so much money they don't really have to worry if they get sacked, unlike Ross and Hurst as you say. |
I'm contradicting myself somewhat, might start an argument with Hype313, be a TWTD first, arguing with oneself... |  |
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| Why so much negativity towards Lampard? on 09:13 - May 22 with 664 views | Herbivore |
| Why so much negativity towards Lampard? on 09:06 - May 22 by hype313 |
Yeah agreed, I supposed the other side to my argument is the fact that they have got so much money they don't really have to worry if they get sacked, unlike Ross and Hurst as you say. |
To be honest, I'm just struggling to think of many (if any) high profile English players in recent times who have actually made a good fist of management. Neville, Sheringham, Adams, Merson, Platt, Barnes and Ince all spring to mind as having failed and disappeared from the management scene, I can't easily call to mind many successes. Hoddle is probably the pick of the bunch. Of course Lampard could be an exception but the odds look stacked against it. [Post edited 22 May 2018 9:16]
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| Why so much negativity towards Lampard? on 09:34 - May 22 with 645 views | Radlett_blue |
| Why so much negativity towards Lampard? on 09:13 - May 22 by Herbivore |
To be honest, I'm just struggling to think of many (if any) high profile English players in recent times who have actually made a good fist of management. Neville, Sheringham, Adams, Merson, Platt, Barnes and Ince all spring to mind as having failed and disappeared from the management scene, I can't easily call to mind many successes. Hoddle is probably the pick of the bunch. Of course Lampard could be an exception but the odds look stacked against it. [Post edited 22 May 2018 9:16]
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Absolutely. Many high profile players are now actually reluctant to start off in the lower leagues as the players aren't very good & they have little capacity to bring in better players. Much of the football is fairly basic & it's more down to motivation than brilliant tactics. Then, the new manager finds he is quickly written off as useless, especially by the media, so he then won't get a better job. Many really good players also struggle with why others can't do the things that they did, hence they actually want to manage or coach only at a high level. I think a bright, relatively inexperienced former top international can often be a good fit for running a national team & there are many success stories there. |  |
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| Why so much negativity towards Lampard? on 09:44 - May 22 with 640 views | Swansea_Blue |
Nobody's denying that he has to start somewhere, just not necessarily with us.
Some on that list of yours jumped straight into the deep end, but most cut their teeth as assistants or youth / reserve coaches.
Conte - worked as an assistant and then a stint as the B team coach
SBR - coached Oxford Uni team whilst doing his badges and then Fulham
Capello - spent about 5/6 years youth team coaching for Milan
Heynckes - started as an assistant
Clough - youth team coaching experience and started at the bottom
etc., etc.
Maybe he would be fine and the only person that can judge that is ME. Although that's going to be difficult for him to make a considered judgement as he won't have seen Frank's ability as a coach and can't call on anyone else who has either.
We talking a complete novice, being paid a lot of money and given a lot of responsibility to oversee our club (possibly a bigger role than you'd expect at another club due to ME's distance). It's entirely understandable why people would be nervous about this. None of us know what he's like as a coach /manager, nor as a person beyond his media front. It's harder to understand why people would be strongly advocating him tbh, as there's nothing to go on.
For the record, I'm just going to see how all this plays out. I can't influence it so have no strong feeling either way, although my gut instinct says we're missing an opportunity to go for someone like Ross or Nathan Jones who have demonstrated their (coaching) leadership qualities AND play the style of entertaining football we're all crying out for. But maybe Frank would be fine too - just a complete shot in the dark though.
It's a bit weird from ME too - he's normally so risk adverse, yet he's entertaining the most risky option. |  |
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