| What was said by Butcher, Holt and Dixon last night was spot on 08:20 - Dec 16 with 3631 views | Chrisd |
Unfortunately, some might not like hearing it, but it’s true. We are a club that lives in the past based on achievements in the 70s/80s. The fact that Butcher is calling it exactly how it is should highlight where we are currently. Normally, our great players hold their counsel, but it’s about time someone of Butcher’s standing stepped out and called it for what it is. Even Holt calls it right. Dixon was pretty scathing throughout the match commentary, but I found I was agreeing with everything he was saying about us.
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| What was said by Butcher, Holt and Dixon last night was spot on on 10:34 - Dec 16 with 777 views | TJS |
I think we do live in the past to an embarrassing level and it has been bugging me for quite a few years.
If I was in charge I'm not sure I would have plastered yet more reminders all over the stadium as part of the refurbishment.
I wouldn't mind if we dropped the 3 stars on the shirt as well. |  | | |
| What was said by Butcher, Holt and Dixon last night was spot on on 10:44 - Dec 16 with 748 views | portmanking |
| What was said by Butcher, Holt and Dixon last night was spot on on 10:34 - Dec 16 by TJS |
I think we do live in the past to an embarrassing level and it has been bugging me for quite a few years.
If I was in charge I'm not sure I would have plastered yet more reminders all over the stadium as part of the refurbishment.
I wouldn't mind if we dropped the 3 stars on the shirt as well. |
For me, there is nothing wrong whatsoever in being proud of your club's history. But there needs to be an acknowledgement that this means nothing today on the pitch. Winning a European trophy 40 years ago doesn't help us on a cold night at Burton.
We have largely been an irrelevance in football terms for the last 10-15 years. What gives us the right to suddenly "walk leagues" overnight?
Sheepshanks had his 5-year plan. I don't see why we can't have a similar plan now. Maybe a 3-year plan to become a stable Championship club once again. | | | |
| What was said by Butcher, Holt and Dixon last night was spot on on 10:47 - Dec 16 with 747 views | jayessess |
| What was said by Butcher, Holt and Dixon last night was spot on on 10:08 - Dec 16 by portmanking |
Fan base gives us greater room for manoeuvre in the transfer market, certainly. But that still doesn't mean our recruitment is a guarantee to take the club forward - as a large number of the 19 signings have shown.
So much of what Cook used to say is spot on. It's about habits, repetition and standards. That doesn't just happen in 2-3 months. Whoever the next man may be, they need time. |
The thing lots of people don't get is that any plan to take Ipswich forward can't just be long-term, it has to be short term as well.
There's this idea that a manager can come in, spend a year with very little tangible improvement in the first team but eventually triumph because they've patiently nurtured good habits and standards. But it just doesn't work like that.
You need momentum, you need good feeling, you need people (players, supporters, owners) to buy in to what you're doing, you need support (financial, vocal), you need to alleviate pressure, you need to earn the time you're getting. All of that requires winning first-team football matches, above all else.
That means, you have to be able to look at the players you've already got, their abilities, their flaws, right this moment, and find ways to improve them, immediately. Otherwise, you might as well chuck every other plan you've got directly in the bin. [Post edited 16 Dec 2021 10:57]
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| What was said by Butcher, Holt and Dixon last night was spot on on 10:50 - Dec 16 with 741 views | Pinewoodblue |
I’m wondering how long Terry Butcher has had his current views on our football club and if there is any connection between those views and he no longer bring an active part of the set up. |  |
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| What was said by Butcher, Holt and Dixon last night was spot on on 10:54 - Dec 16 with 735 views | BtreeBlueBlood |
Butcher and holt have there views on itfc and have seen our slide because of their past and where they live, but both do want better for us!
Dixon can’t have seen to many of our games, he wouldn’t have many pulls to watch us!
But within 25 mins he had summed us up and what we should do - what manager after manager can’t or try to change.
Why was I shocked that we could play so bad? We did that last week!
Are we trying to perform even worse each time? |  | | |
| What was said by Butcher, Holt and Dixon last night was spot on on 11:05 - Dec 16 with 712 views | itfcjoe |
| What was said by Butcher, Holt and Dixon last night was spot on on 10:08 - Dec 16 by portmanking |
Fan base gives us greater room for manoeuvre in the transfer market, certainly. But that still doesn't mean our recruitment is a guarantee to take the club forward - as a large number of the 19 signings have shown.
So much of what Cook used to say is spot on. It's about habits, repetition and standards. That doesn't just happen in 2-3 months. Whoever the next man may be, they need time. |
It's a lot easier to recruit when you have money than when you don't - this is what I was saying about a club our size even hitting 75% of our potential.
it enables us to have a baseline that is so much higher than others - but it still takes work.
I don't disagree about forming good habits etc, but there are plenty of examples of clubs who have dropped to the absolute pits of existence that have turned it round quickly - we just had a hapless owner - the club has never been at risk |  |
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| What was said by Butcher, Holt and Dixon last night was spot on on 11:56 - Dec 16 with 673 views | Chrisd |
| What was said by Butcher, Holt and Dixon last night was spot on on 10:47 - Dec 16 by jayessess |
The thing lots of people don't get is that any plan to take Ipswich forward can't just be long-term, it has to be short term as well.
There's this idea that a manager can come in, spend a year with very little tangible improvement in the first team but eventually triumph because they've patiently nurtured good habits and standards. But it just doesn't work like that.
You need momentum, you need good feeling, you need people (players, supporters, owners) to buy in to what you're doing, you need support (financial, vocal), you need to alleviate pressure, you need to earn the time you're getting. All of that requires winning first-team football matches, above all else.
That means, you have to be able to look at the players you've already got, their abilities, their flaws, right this moment, and find ways to improve them, immediately. Otherwise, you might as well chuck every other plan you've got directly in the bin. [Post edited 16 Dec 2021 10:57]
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When you look back to August there was plenty of momentum both on and off the pitch, we were doing some and are still doing some terrific stuff away from the pitch and re-engaging with the community. Supporters were buying into the project, we felt thankful we had Ashton and O'Leary driving this project forwards. Think back to the reactions after the fan forums, lots of positivity. The fact we were spluttering with our form on the pitch, ultimately getting in a panic because we weren't in the top 6 and then PC got the tic-tac and the wheels have completely fallen off the wagon. It's all fallen flat at an alarming rate. | |
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| What was said by Butcher, Holt and Dixon last night was spot on on 12:06 - Dec 16 with 657 views | Vaughan8 |
Firstly, If you're agreeing with Lee Dixon you need to have a serious talk to yourself haha
We aren't a "small" club in terms of fan base. We still get or could get (saturday for example) bigger crowds than some premier league teams and certainly a lot of championship teams.
We are just rubbish, don't seem to have a plan which we stick to more than a year. The players bought in the summer we thought were good, but you can't just buy a mismatch of players and hope it fits.
If you look at someone like Nsiala, we are still playing him! I know some of you like him (and I have no problem with him as a person), but the fact he is still playing just shows how rubbish the other defenders are. [Post edited 16 Dec 2021 12:08]
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| What was said by Butcher, Holt and Dixon last night was spot on on 12:08 - Dec 16 with 654 views | portmanking |
| What was said by Butcher, Holt and Dixon last night was spot on on 11:56 - Dec 16 by Chrisd |
When you look back to August there was plenty of momentum both on and off the pitch, we were doing some and are still doing some terrific stuff away from the pitch and re-engaging with the community. Supporters were buying into the project, we felt thankful we had Ashton and O'Leary driving this project forwards. Think back to the reactions after the fan forums, lots of positivity. The fact we were spluttering with our form on the pitch, ultimately getting in a panic because we weren't in the top 6 and then PC got the tic-tac and the wheels have completely fallen off the wagon. It's all fallen flat at an alarming rate. |
Quite. There was plenty of the positivity and momentum that the previous poster speaks of. It's just that some fans had an itch that needed scratching right at that moment.
I fail to see how 'immediate' success goes hand in hand with a long-term plan? If we're going to adopt a long-term plan that doesn't work after 3 months, how on earth are we going to go forward? Just keep rolling the dice and hoping one manager will have a good first 3 months?! Sheesh.
Even Grant Holt said last night that the club has spent the last few years not knowing what it wants to be, resulting in us flitting from manager to manager. It's all true. Whoever comes in after this extensive search needs time to build. Sure, we want SOME signs of progress, but we're not going to steamroller teams from week one. [Post edited 16 Dec 2021 12:10]
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| What was said by Butcher, Holt and Dixon last night was spot on on 12:47 - Dec 16 with 615 views | TJS |
| What was said by Butcher, Holt and Dixon last night was spot on on 10:44 - Dec 16 by portmanking |
For me, there is nothing wrong whatsoever in being proud of your club's history. But there needs to be an acknowledgement that this means nothing today on the pitch. Winning a European trophy 40 years ago doesn't help us on a cold night at Burton.
We have largely been an irrelevance in football terms for the last 10-15 years. What gives us the right to suddenly "walk leagues" overnight?
Sheepshanks had his 5-year plan. I don't see why we can't have a similar plan now. Maybe a 3-year plan to become a stable Championship club once again. |
I'm not saying I'm not proud of the club's history but frankly none of the current set up deserve to be associated with it.
I would reinstate the 3 stars if/when we achieve a promotion. [Post edited 16 Dec 2021 12:48]
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| What was said by Butcher, Holt and Dixon last night was spot on on 12:48 - Dec 16 with 613 views | mrfixit426 |
| What was said by Butcher, Holt and Dixon last night was spot on on 10:34 - Dec 16 by TJS |
I think we do live in the past to an embarrassing level and it has been bugging me for quite a few years.
If I was in charge I'm not sure I would have plastered yet more reminders all over the stadium as part of the refurbishment.
I wouldn't mind if we dropped the 3 stars on the shirt as well. |
The three stars is embarrassing. Wasn't the idea of that originally for World Cup winners? |  | | |
| What was said by Butcher, Holt and Dixon last night was spot on on 13:07 - Dec 16 with 576 views | cressi |
| What was said by Butcher, Holt and Dixon last night was spot on on 09:01 - Dec 16 by textbackup |
You and I might realise we are a nothing club, but thousands of others hang on the fact their dad saw an fa cup win.
We are a joke of a club |
Why this site is called those were the day's | | | |
| What was said by Butcher, Holt and Dixon last night was spot on on 13:13 - Dec 16 with 557 views | BonneNIL |
| What was said by Butcher, Holt and Dixon last night was spot on on 08:55 - Dec 16 by Marshalls_Mullet |
Most of the goodwill is forgotten.
I grew up away from Ipswich. In the 90's when I told parents of my friends who I supported their eyes would light up and they would mention Sir Bobby and the big name players.
When I tell people who I support now, there is pretty much zero reaction. |
People view Town like they view Port Vale these days. When I say we were in the Europa League as recently as 2002 I get laughed at for talking rubbish, let alone the fact we've won all we have. It's long forgotten. I bet most of the players we're recruiting have no idea until they arrive what we have done, we've been irrelevant for 20 years. |  |
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| What was said by Butcher, Holt and Dixon last night was spot on on 13:35 - Dec 16 with 510 views | timothyeo |
Terry is right but context is always important.
We are not a big club overall. We are not even a big club in the championship. We are however, a big club for the third tier. Along with 3 or 4 others sure, but we are a big club for League One.
Apologies, just typing that was a little depressing.
Regardless, there's a difference between expecting Ipswich to not be in this division and the other subset of fans who thought Howe, Farke, Lampard, Mowbray were realistic targets for us. Those fans do need to dial it down a bit as it's cringeworthy.
I won't accept we aren't a big club for this league though. We're some way from being a 'big' team in the Championship - that's generally now reserved for those who have recently been in the Prem. | | | |
| What was said by Butcher, Holt and Dixon last night was spot on on 13:42 - Dec 16 with 497 views | jayessess |
| What was said by Butcher, Holt and Dixon last night was spot on on 12:08 - Dec 16 by portmanking |
Quite. There was plenty of the positivity and momentum that the previous poster speaks of. It's just that some fans had an itch that needed scratching right at that moment.
I fail to see how 'immediate' success goes hand in hand with a long-term plan? If we're going to adopt a long-term plan that doesn't work after 3 months, how on earth are we going to go forward? Just keep rolling the dice and hoping one manager will have a good first 3 months?! Sheesh.
Even Grant Holt said last night that the club has spent the last few years not knowing what it wants to be, resulting in us flitting from manager to manager. It's all true. Whoever comes in after this extensive search needs time to build. Sure, we want SOME signs of progress, but we're not going to steamroller teams from week one. [Post edited 16 Dec 2021 12:10]
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"The itch" is precisely the point though. In real life if the first team is poor for an extended period of time, then positivity and momentum dissipates. You'll get substantial numbers of supporters on your back, you'll get half-empty stadiums, you'll get players and managers under pressure. What good is a plan that doesn't survive contact with real life?
The short-term improvements are what buy you the time to do anything. Without that, there's no going forward. You hire your manager based on both. What are you going to do next week that makes this team better? How about the first 6 weeks? What are you going to need in your first transfer window? Making the players we already have at the club play better collectively isn't something that goes in the "long-term plans" column, it's in the "starting tomorrow" column.
Crucially, as a club, you also need to establish a long-term plan around the club that isn't dependent on the manager and make sure the people you hire fit into that long-term plan. That's the key to a real long-term blueprint, not just giving Paul Lambert or Paul Cook or whoever 2 years to not get results rather than 9 months. [Post edited 16 Dec 2021 13:52]
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| What was said by Butcher, Holt and Dixon last night was spot on on 14:25 - Dec 16 with 443 views | Darth_Koont |
| What was said by Butcher, Holt and Dixon last night was spot on on 08:41 - Dec 16 by Marshalls_Mullet |
I don't think we do live in the past.
20 years of sh1te makes us realise where we are, and where we have been for a long time.
And most of us didn't witness the glory years of the 70s and 80s, so I think it's nonsense. |
You’re right but that’s the purely rational take that most fans would agree with.
But nostalgia for a past that has gone, and expectations of a future that may never happen, have always been present over the same 20 years. They still seem to provide the dominant flavour on top of the meat and potatoes of our reality. |  |
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