| This wholesale turning on the players 00:18 - Mar 28 with 7467 views | reusersfreekicks |
Is unseemly imo. They haven't been properly organised/coached for a couple of years. Now just cos Cook turns up and things don't improve many people turn on them as he can't be doing anything wrong. I beg to differ, he has achieved no bounce and has been less pragmatic than Gill was. He should be doing whatever works these last few games, same as Lambert should have when we were in the championship. Instead I see a fairly rigid adherence to a style/formation. As others have said we have no-one in form to play in the 3 behind the forward except maybe Judge who was poor today and Bishop who is required in a deeper role. So let's not play like that. A new managet should be able to galvanise and enthuse the players to do better
|  | | |  |
| This wholesale turning on the players on 20:27 - Mar 28 with 890 views | The_Flashing_Smile |
| This wholesale turning on the players on 19:05 - Mar 28 by PJH |
Sir Bobby did actually.
I pointed that out on another thread earlier but only just saw your post.
His first six games, in the top division, were:-
Everton(a) D
Man U(h) W
Leeds(a) L
Arsenal(a) W
Wolves(a) D
Man C(h) W
Next two were a draw at Spurs and a win at West Ham. |
I answered that above. |  |
| Trust the process. Trust Phil. |
| |
| This wholesale turning on the players on 20:29 - Mar 28 with 889 views | Horseboy |
| This wholesale turning on the players on 12:08 - Mar 28 by textbackup |
you are absolutely right.
however some cant see beyond the cowleys getting a couple of quick wins under their belts |
It's odd that most new Managers improve results and performances. Theres something fundamentally wrong in the club, serious cancer. |  | | |
| This wholesale turning on the players on 20:34 - Mar 28 with 873 views | N2_Blue |
| This wholesale turning on the players on 20:29 - Mar 28 by Horseboy |
It's odd that most new Managers improve results and performances. Theres something fundamentally wrong in the club, serious cancer. |
It's the players who are the biggest problem currently!
They are just not doing it for the club.
We need to stop blaming managers (although the previous two have been terrible admittedly) and look at the players. Most clubs get a new manager effect because the players get a boost of a clean start with a new manager and raise their game. However our lot cannot be bothered!
We have a whole squad playing for a new contract and the potential chance to play in championship next season rather than league 1.
However the majority have made made it clear they are not interested.
I can see it in Cook now and what he says, he is genuinely shocked at what he has has seen here so far and the reaction of the players but isn't going to outwardly say it as that would cause even more issues. He knows it's not good enough and week by week I expect many are losing any chance of a contract offer....and i for one am quite glad about that because i've lost all support i had for any of this group of players. They can all go. [Post edited 28 Mar 2021 20:38]
|  |
| |
| This wholesale turning on the players on 20:37 - Mar 28 with 869 views | PJH |
| This wholesale turning on the players on 20:27 - Mar 28 by The_Flashing_Smile |
I answered that above. |
So you did, sorry.
I thought that you and the poster on the other thread that I responded to were saying that we did not get an upturn in results when SBR first arrived because saying that was factually incorrect.
The much mentioned 'Robson out' chants were after he had been here about 30 months. |  | | |
| This wholesale turning on the players on 21:37 - Mar 28 with 835 views | The_Flashing_Smile |
| This wholesale turning on the players on 20:37 - Mar 28 by PJH |
So you did, sorry.
I thought that you and the poster on the other thread that I responded to were saying that we did not get an upturn in results when SBR first arrived because saying that was factually incorrect.
The much mentioned 'Robson out' chants were after he had been here about 30 months. |
I didn't know his individual early games as I wasn't born. I was making a general point that people wanted him out early in his ITFC career (before he'd won anything). And then obviously we know what he went on to achieve after that.
I don't think this early into any manager's career with a particular club is a good judge of anything, particularly when he hasn't had a transfer window. One of these posters was even talking about Cook's ITFC PPG. After 6 games, no transfers possible, and only 1 week of proper training available!!
If Cook had been brought in during the summer - had months to work with the players and bring others in - and we'd started the new season as we've played in these 6 games, I'd be a bit concerned. But to judge him now is ludicrous IMO. | |
| Trust the process. Trust Phil. |
| |
| This wholesale turning on the players on 22:12 - Mar 28 with 818 views | PJH |
| This wholesale turning on the players on 21:37 - Mar 28 by The_Flashing_Smile |
I didn't know his individual early games as I wasn't born. I was making a general point that people wanted him out early in his ITFC career (before he'd won anything). And then obviously we know what he went on to achieve after that.
I don't think this early into any manager's career with a particular club is a good judge of anything, particularly when he hasn't had a transfer window. One of these posters was even talking about Cook's ITFC PPG. After 6 games, no transfers possible, and only 1 week of proper training available!!
If Cook had been brought in during the summer - had months to work with the players and bring others in - and we'd started the new season as we've played in these 6 games, I'd be a bit concerned. But to judge him now is ludicrous IMO. |
I don't think he is being judged now.
Some people are correctly pointing out that when a new manager arrives there is more often that not an upturn in results-there has not been in this case.
Some people wanted Bobby Robson out after he had been here about 2.5 years which I suppose as he eventually spent 13 years here it was early in his career although it would be very rare for 2.5 years to be early in anyone's management career these days. | | | |
| This wholesale turning on the players on 22:25 - Mar 28 with 813 views | LeoMuff |
| This wholesale turning on the players on 20:34 - Mar 28 by N2_Blue |
It's the players who are the biggest problem currently!
They are just not doing it for the club.
We need to stop blaming managers (although the previous two have been terrible admittedly) and look at the players. Most clubs get a new manager effect because the players get a boost of a clean start with a new manager and raise their game. However our lot cannot be bothered!
We have a whole squad playing for a new contract and the potential chance to play in championship next season rather than league 1.
However the majority have made made it clear they are not interested.
I can see it in Cook now and what he says, he is genuinely shocked at what he has has seen here so far and the reaction of the players but isn't going to outwardly say it as that would cause even more issues. He knows it's not good enough and week by week I expect many are losing any chance of a contract offer....and i for one am quite glad about that because i've lost all support i had for any of this group of players. They can all go. [Post edited 28 Mar 2021 20:38]
|
Evans is the consistent thread of failure over the years not the players or managers.
Evans has consistently failed to buy the players requested by many managers, we get the third on the list or a loan.
When your on your 6th manager and dropping down the football pyramid, all the while mangers repeating the same issues, the finger only points one way. |  |
| |
| This wholesale turning on the players on 22:32 - Mar 28 with 809 views | ArnieM |
| This wholesale turning on the players on 08:54 - Mar 28 by gazzer1999 |
Remember all those that said any decent manager should get promoted with this squad? Well we were moving in the right direction before Cook arrived, now look at the dross we are being dished up.
This season is over with 10 games to go.
I fear this manager will be gone after a poor start next season and the cycle begins again, same c**p different manager. |
The common denominator is THIS SQUAD!! |  |
| |
Login to get fewer ads
| This wholesale turning on the players on 00:04 - Mar 29 with 773 views | haynes_toe1 |
| This wholesale turning on the players on 20:24 - Mar 28 by itfcjoe |
Mick Mills said that Cook will only be able to man manage throughout rest of the season, and that anything major needs to wait until the pre season as simply not time to do it.
We've got another 10 games to go this season, and need to find a bit of form from somewhere - if Cook sees us to 10th or 11th and a way from the play offs then that will be really disappointing - if we wanted to drift down the table and then clear the players out in the summer then we could have just left Lambert in for a few more weeks to achieve that - I expected a bounce from Cook, as did everyone else....if we don't get it then my optimism levels for next season will be down |
Exactly how I feel.
Despite all the hyperbole from Dollers I've not seen anyone want Cook out.
Just pointing out that he's not actually produced anything positive on the pitch yet. Unfortunately we've become slightly worse after getting rid of what was apparently (and I agree with this) one of ours worst managers of all time.
He will be given some time but if he ends up performing on a par of God forbid even worse than Lambert at the end of the season fans have every right to be concerned.
Our same fans who were part of the problem in giving Lambert too much time, the same posters that were at least a year late to the party really ought to consider that blind positivity can actually be damaging. The manager, players and owner should all feel under immense pressure right now to deliver the club a play off position. | | | |
| This wholesale turning on the players on 00:07 - Mar 29 with 767 views | chrismakin |
| This wholesale turning on the players on 00:04 - Mar 29 by haynes_toe1 |
Exactly how I feel.
Despite all the hyperbole from Dollers I've not seen anyone want Cook out.
Just pointing out that he's not actually produced anything positive on the pitch yet. Unfortunately we've become slightly worse after getting rid of what was apparently (and I agree with this) one of ours worst managers of all time.
He will be given some time but if he ends up performing on a par of God forbid even worse than Lambert at the end of the season fans have every right to be concerned.
Our same fans who were part of the problem in giving Lambert too much time, the same posters that were at least a year late to the party really ought to consider that blind positivity can actually be damaging. The manager, players and owner should all feel under immense pressure right now to deliver the club a play off position. |
"he's not actually produced anything positive on the pitch yet."
The problem with this is that it's actually not true, there are positives. In the overall scheme of things it hasn't led to a positive result no, BUT there are positives in the games to take, such as the higher backline, playing with the ball more in their half etc
No we didn't do much in the final third, but even the above positives is at least a sign PC has managed to get some changes worked on and listened too. |  |
| |
| This wholesale turning on the players on 00:15 - Mar 29 with 766 views | BryanPlug |
| This wholesale turning on the players on 16:42 - Mar 28 by braveblue |
Pros don’t need coaching to put more effort in. Nor to pass 10 yards. |
[content removed at owner's request] |  |
| |
| This wholesale turning on the players on 00:23 - Mar 29 with 762 views | chrismakin |
| This wholesale turning on the players on 00:15 - Mar 29 by BryanPlug |
[content removed at owner's request] |
Players also don't need coaching to know it's not a good idea to put your socks up whilst an opponent is running past you with the ball | |
| |
| This wholesale turning on the players on 00:34 - Mar 29 with 763 views | JDB23 |
I was expecting more of a bounce from Cook than we're currently getting but I'm not going to put it on him, this is 100% the players doing and you only need to look at one thing to see why, Accrington. Cook had no influence on that game other than saying hello to the players and instead of running through a brick wall to impress a new manager, they put in a gutless, pathetic, zero energy performance. That wasn't about organisation or coaching, it was about them not giving a toss. Fck the lot of them, full clear out in the Summer. | | | |
| This wholesale turning on the players on 08:09 - Mar 29 with 718 views | The_Flashing_Smile |
| This wholesale turning on the players on 22:12 - Mar 28 by PJH |
I don't think he is being judged now.
Some people are correctly pointing out that when a new manager arrives there is more often that not an upturn in results-there has not been in this case.
Some people wanted Bobby Robson out after he had been here about 2.5 years which I suppose as he eventually spent 13 years here it was early in his career although it would be very rare for 2.5 years to be early in anyone's management career these days. |
He most definitely is being judged now. People aren't just saying "when a new manager arrives there is more often that not an upturn in results," because I'd agree with that. They are saying he SHOULD have done better. Some are suggesting he's failing, doing worse than Lambert, his PPG aren't up to scratch, eh shouldn't get a free hit etc etc. Perhaps you need to read more of the posts on the subject. | |
| Trust the process. Trust Phil. |
| |
| This wholesale turning on the players on 08:17 - Mar 29 with 714 views | The_Flashing_Smile |
| This wholesale turning on the players on 00:04 - Mar 29 by haynes_toe1 |
Exactly how I feel.
Despite all the hyperbole from Dollers I've not seen anyone want Cook out.
Just pointing out that he's not actually produced anything positive on the pitch yet. Unfortunately we've become slightly worse after getting rid of what was apparently (and I agree with this) one of ours worst managers of all time.
He will be given some time but if he ends up performing on a par of God forbid even worse than Lambert at the end of the season fans have every right to be concerned.
Our same fans who were part of the problem in giving Lambert too much time, the same posters that were at least a year late to the party really ought to consider that blind positivity can actually be damaging. The manager, players and owner should all feel under immense pressure right now to deliver the club a play off position. |
I haven't suggested anyone wants Cook out, so nice straw man there. People such as you are giving him grief though, when he's only been here 5 minutes. That's wrong, and I'm not the only one saying that's wrong.
We know why you do it as well - because you did the same with Lambert. Slate them from the start so that when they 9 times out of 10 fail you can claim on the interwebz that you had some sort of footballing knowledge us mere mortals don't have access to.
You're full of sh!t, basically. With very low self esteem. | |
| Trust the process. Trust Phil. |
| |
| This wholesale turning on the players on 09:38 - Mar 29 with 682 views | haynes_toe1 |
| This wholesale turning on the players on 08:17 - Mar 29 by The_Flashing_Smile |
I haven't suggested anyone wants Cook out, so nice straw man there. People such as you are giving him grief though, when he's only been here 5 minutes. That's wrong, and I'm not the only one saying that's wrong.
We know why you do it as well - because you did the same with Lambert. Slate them from the start so that when they 9 times out of 10 fail you can claim on the interwebz that you had some sort of footballing knowledge us mere mortals don't have access to.
You're full of sh!t, basically. With very low self esteem. |
No, I slated Lambert from the start because it was blindingly obvious he was a useless manager. I'm sorry you couldn't see that. | | | |
| This wholesale turning on the players on 09:45 - Mar 29 with 676 views | haynes_toe1 |
| This wholesale turning on the players on 00:07 - Mar 29 by chrismakin |
"he's not actually produced anything positive on the pitch yet."
The problem with this is that it's actually not true, there are positives. In the overall scheme of things it hasn't led to a positive result no, BUT there are positives in the games to take, such as the higher backline, playing with the ball more in their half etc
No we didn't do much in the final third, but even the above positives is at least a sign PC has managed to get some changes worked on and listened too. |
If we're going to cling onto those positives then let's look at the negatives, and rather than opinions let's deal with the statistics:
- Less chances created per 90 minutes than under Lambert
- Less goals scored per 90 minutes than under Lambert
- Less shots over 90 minutes than under Lambert
- Less forward passes over 90 minutes than under Lambert*
*We are generally passing less per game than under Lambert but equally we're having less of the ball too. I'm not sure if this is a sign we're trying to play a bit more direct (can't say i've massively seen that) or if we're struggling to control a game even more than before.
Signs aren't great. I like your positives, it's something to cling onto but he certainly needs to start delivering something better than "hey, defenders, start 10 yards further up the pitch, sometimes". | | | |
| This wholesale turning on the players on 09:46 - Mar 29 with 673 views | The_Flashing_Smile |
| This wholesale turning on the players on 09:38 - Mar 29 by haynes_toe1 |
No, I slated Lambert from the start because it was blindingly obvious he was a useless manager. I'm sorry you couldn't see that. |
You knew that before he'd even taken charge of one game. You really are a footballing genius! | |
| Trust the process. Trust Phil. |
| |
| This wholesale turning on the players on 09:49 - Mar 29 with 666 views | noggin |
| This wholesale turning on the players on 09:45 - Mar 29 by haynes_toe1 |
If we're going to cling onto those positives then let's look at the negatives, and rather than opinions let's deal with the statistics:
- Less chances created per 90 minutes than under Lambert
- Less goals scored per 90 minutes than under Lambert
- Less shots over 90 minutes than under Lambert
- Less forward passes over 90 minutes than under Lambert*
*We are generally passing less per game than under Lambert but equally we're having less of the ball too. I'm not sure if this is a sign we're trying to play a bit more direct (can't say i've massively seen that) or if we're struggling to control a game even more than before.
Signs aren't great. I like your positives, it's something to cling onto but he certainly needs to start delivering something better than "hey, defenders, start 10 yards further up the pitch, sometimes". |
"or if we're struggling to control a game even more than before. "
Control a game? Most of our players can't even control a football. |  |
| |
| This wholesale turning on the players on 09:49 - Mar 29 with 666 views | haynes_toe1 |
| This wholesale turning on the players on 09:46 - Mar 29 by The_Flashing_Smile |
You knew that before he'd even taken charge of one game. You really are a footballing genius! |
His recent managerial history was a sure-fire sign and despite that I still gave him 10 games or so before I started to point out his inadequacies which were mocked by you at the time.
It's ok to be wrong. You're generall pretty good at it. | | | |
| This wholesale turning on the players on 09:58 - Mar 29 with 649 views | The_Flashing_Smile |
| This wholesale turning on the players on 09:49 - Mar 29 by haynes_toe1 |
His recent managerial history was a sure-fire sign and despite that I still gave him 10 games or so before I started to point out his inadequacies which were mocked by you at the time.
It's ok to be wrong. You're generall pretty good at it. |
As I've said several times, all you're interested in is being right on the internet. And saying the new Ipswich manager will fail is right 90% of the time regardless of any insight. You ought to be embarrassed that we can see through it rather than doubling down.
I prefer to wait, give a manager time to implement his ideas, and then decide if he's any good or not. Like any normal, sensible person.
You have as much footballing insight as a broken clock has insight into the time. | |
| Trust the process. Trust Phil. |
| |
| This wholesale turning on the players on 10:10 - Mar 29 with 629 views | haynes_toe1 |
| This wholesale turning on the players on 09:58 - Mar 29 by The_Flashing_Smile |
As I've said several times, all you're interested in is being right on the internet. And saying the new Ipswich manager will fail is right 90% of the time regardless of any insight. You ought to be embarrassed that we can see through it rather than doubling down.
I prefer to wait, give a manager time to implement his ideas, and then decide if he's any good or not. Like any normal, sensible person.
You have as much footballing insight as a broken clock has insight into the time. |
Nope. I'm not interested in being 'right on the internet'. You're just really good at being wrong, and then deciding to try the personal insult route because you're a little embarrassed yourself.
It's fine. Cook will be given plenty of time to prove me wrong so it's hardly a problem, is it? I've given my opinion based on what i've seen and the associated statistics to date. I'm allowed to give my opinion and you're allowed to disagree with it. If I were you, with your track record, i'd think twice because it's clear that football might not be something you're too clued up with. | | | |
| This wholesale turning on the players on 10:12 - Mar 29 with 629 views | Radlett_blue |
| This wholesale turning on the players on 00:40 - Mar 28 by chrismakin |
Once again though, it can't turn into another 'lets protect the players' era
To many are to comfortable, they have been for years, and when the same people are around and new players come into the club, the negative mentality breeds.
To much is being spoken of about formation etc, it doesn't matter what we play if the players haven't got the mentality to shoot, cross, pass or run forwards rather than back.
It's not even positioning etc which is a major problem, it's the lack of urgency, and no matter how much coaching you put in, if the player don't want to push themselves, nothing will change it. |
There does seem to have been a malaise & culture of mediocrity about Town, stemming from Mick's turgid last season. Probably some of the players knew they were going to be picked every week. Hurst tried to shake this up & antagonised some of the established players. While he didn't last long, I'm not sure Lambert changed anything beyond assembling a ridiculously large squad, including 6 loan players, which would do nothing to create a sense of unity & common purpose. Cook's comments about most of our players waiting around for someone else to take change rings very true. He can't change the culture at a drop of a hat, although the response from players who should be hoping to earn contracts at Town or elsewhere has been disappointing. It's going to take time to change it, but a huge clear out in the summer is needed, especially the old lags like Chambers, Skuse & Sears. |  |
| |
| This wholesale turning on the players on 11:54 - Mar 29 with 595 views | The_Flashing_Smile |
| This wholesale turning on the players on 10:10 - Mar 29 by haynes_toe1 |
Nope. I'm not interested in being 'right on the internet'. You're just really good at being wrong, and then deciding to try the personal insult route because you're a little embarrassed yourself.
It's fine. Cook will be given plenty of time to prove me wrong so it's hardly a problem, is it? I've given my opinion based on what i've seen and the associated statistics to date. I'm allowed to give my opinion and you're allowed to disagree with it. If I were you, with your track record, i'd think twice because it's clear that football might not be something you're too clued up with. |
You said above you gave Lambert 10 games. Here you've given Cook 6 (less, actually, because you were on his back before Saturday). And then have the temerity to say others aren't clued up on football.
You genuinely think those amounts of time are enough for a manager to get their ideas across and implemented, and for you to judge their abilities (despite having no opportunity to bring in their own players... and in Cook's case, just 1 week of proper training without games and travelling in the way).
It's fooking hilarious mate. | |
| Trust the process. Trust Phil. |
| |
| This wholesale turning on the players on 13:10 - Mar 29 with 566 views | The_Flashing_Smile |
| This wholesale turning on the players on 10:12 - Mar 29 by Radlett_blue |
There does seem to have been a malaise & culture of mediocrity about Town, stemming from Mick's turgid last season. Probably some of the players knew they were going to be picked every week. Hurst tried to shake this up & antagonised some of the established players. While he didn't last long, I'm not sure Lambert changed anything beyond assembling a ridiculously large squad, including 6 loan players, which would do nothing to create a sense of unity & common purpose. Cook's comments about most of our players waiting around for someone else to take change rings very true. He can't change the culture at a drop of a hat, although the response from players who should be hoping to earn contracts at Town or elsewhere has been disappointing. It's going to take time to change it, but a huge clear out in the summer is needed, especially the old lags like Chambers, Skuse & Sears. |
Indeed.
I don't think this is all on the players actually. I think they've been playing inside themselves for so long it's become, as you say, cultural. And despite what some of the 'experts' on here will tell you, that'll take a fair while to change. Perhaps some of these players can't change and we'll have to ship in new ones. | |
| Trust the process. Trust Phil. |
| |
| |
By continuing to use the site, you agree to our use of cookies and to abide by our Terms and Conditions.
