| Prisons over full.... 06:47 - Aug 19 with 1185 views | Pippin1970 |
So emergency steps now to realise prisoners. Is it down to funding or just too many prisoners ?. The population has definitely got bigger. [Post edited 19 Aug 2024 6:47]
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| Prisons over full.... on 07:23 - Aug 19 with 1086 views | DarkBrandon |
It is down to terrible governance.
Increasing the supply of prisoners “longer sentences” but not building any more prisons.
Think it is hard persuading people that a few houses should be built next to them? Try persuading them that what they really want is a prison in the next field over. |  | | |
| Prisons over full.... on 08:42 - Aug 19 with 985 views | Radlett_blue |
Cameron's government cut prison funding & that's largely why the service is on its knees. The "long sentence" nonsense so loved by certain right wingers doesn't help. There is NO evidence that long sentences act as any sort of deterrent against committing crime; they are also expensive & make it even less likely that a criminal might be rehabilitated & become a useful member of society. |  |
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| Prisons over full.... on 09:04 - Aug 19 with 932 views | Pendejo |
| Prisons over full.... on 08:42 - Aug 19 by Radlett_blue |
Cameron's government cut prison funding & that's largely why the service is on its knees. The "long sentence" nonsense so loved by certain right wingers doesn't help. There is NO evidence that long sentences act as any sort of deterrent against committing crime; they are also expensive & make it even less likely that a criminal might be rehabilitated & become a useful member of society. |
Longer sentences as a deterrent - discuss
Even when we had the death penalty it was no deterrent, however, with regards to recent events heavy handed sentencing has, arguably, acted as a deterrent. As a short term measure it has helped calm things down, as it did in 2011.
First and foremost going to prison is a punishment; the removal of a person's liberty for a crime or series of crimes deemed to warrant detention.
Then there's that elusive "justice" whatever that may be. And it probably changes subject to the crime. For murder and a few other crimes I don't think there's true justice unless you enter "eye for an eye" territory, a dangerous slope.
Rehabilitation, conceptually, is good, but execution is probably pish poor. But it is, imho, or should be the key to early release, and should be earned. Once released needs to be backed by a functioning probation service and support network.
Like addiction, ultimately rehabilitation is down to the individual.
Persistent offenders are the ultimate entitled individuals; law doesn't apply to them, they'll take what they want, when they want, where they want.
Prison should be X% punishment, Y% transition, Z% rehabilitation
And I'm not qualified to put the numbers on, just an opinion. |  |
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| Prisons over full.... on 09:19 - Aug 19 with 903 views | DarkBrandon |
| Prisons over full.... on 09:04 - Aug 19 by Pendejo |
Longer sentences as a deterrent - discuss
Even when we had the death penalty it was no deterrent, however, with regards to recent events heavy handed sentencing has, arguably, acted as a deterrent. As a short term measure it has helped calm things down, as it did in 2011.
First and foremost going to prison is a punishment; the removal of a person's liberty for a crime or series of crimes deemed to warrant detention.
Then there's that elusive "justice" whatever that may be. And it probably changes subject to the crime. For murder and a few other crimes I don't think there's true justice unless you enter "eye for an eye" territory, a dangerous slope.
Rehabilitation, conceptually, is good, but execution is probably pish poor. But it is, imho, or should be the key to early release, and should be earned. Once released needs to be backed by a functioning probation service and support network.
Like addiction, ultimately rehabilitation is down to the individual.
Persistent offenders are the ultimate entitled individuals; law doesn't apply to them, they'll take what they want, when they want, where they want.
Prison should be X% punishment, Y% transition, Z% rehabilitation
And I'm not qualified to put the numbers on, just an opinion. |
As I understand it, the biggest factors in acting as a deterrent, are the perceived chances of getting caught, and the speed of the judicial process.
If you aren’t likely to be arrested, and can probably leg it before your trial comes up, then it doesn’t really matter if your maximum jail time is 6 years or 10. At least according to some research I saw many years ago.
“Persistent offenders are the ultimate entitled individuals “
I’d suggest spending a day in a magistrates court and look at these people, hear their stories and how the system deals with them. | | | |
| Prisons over full.... on 12:29 - Aug 19 with 765 views | Pendejo |
| Prisons over full.... on 09:19 - Aug 19 by DarkBrandon |
As I understand it, the biggest factors in acting as a deterrent, are the perceived chances of getting caught, and the speed of the judicial process.
If you aren’t likely to be arrested, and can probably leg it before your trial comes up, then it doesn’t really matter if your maximum jail time is 6 years or 10. At least according to some research I saw many years ago.
“Persistent offenders are the ultimate entitled individuals “
I’d suggest spending a day in a magistrates court and look at these people, hear their stories and how the system deals with them. |
Agree whole heartedly that there is a strata of people who operate in the basis of I won't get caught; this includes thousands of drivers a day who whilst they speed willingly would not consider walking into their local co-op and delivering a couple of bottles of Malbec
Are you saying all persistent offenders are victims of circumstance rather than choice?
I can see lack of moral compass due to poor upbringing to a certain extent, but persistent (possibly poorly constructed in my part, tried to finish before 9am) in my mind are the ones repeatedly caught for crimes, but because punishment "too lenient"?? Go on to repeat their crimes. o
At what point do you drop the notion of personal responsibility?
And if you do, does it then become a mental health issue? (Another under funded and resources service)
I have say in Magistrates Courts on a number of occasions, mainly as a professional witness. | |
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| Prisons over full.... on 12:39 - Aug 19 with 748 views | Ewan_Oozami |
| Prisons over full.... on 12:29 - Aug 19 by Pendejo |
Agree whole heartedly that there is a strata of people who operate in the basis of I won't get caught; this includes thousands of drivers a day who whilst they speed willingly would not consider walking into their local co-op and delivering a couple of bottles of Malbec
Are you saying all persistent offenders are victims of circumstance rather than choice?
I can see lack of moral compass due to poor upbringing to a certain extent, but persistent (possibly poorly constructed in my part, tried to finish before 9am) in my mind are the ones repeatedly caught for crimes, but because punishment "too lenient"?? Go on to repeat their crimes. o
At what point do you drop the notion of personal responsibility?
And if you do, does it then become a mental health issue? (Another under funded and resources service)
I have say in Magistrates Courts on a number of occasions, mainly as a professional witness. |
Re: your mental health point - this could account for about a quarter of people in prison at the moment - most of whom wouldn't be there if they had access to appropriate medication...
https://committees.parliament.uk/writtenevidence/36362/pdf/ |  |
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