| Restraint? 08:52 - Oct 13 with 5132 views | DJR |
The following advice from the Foreign Office indicates no attempts by the UK to restrain the Israeli government.
"The Israeli military announced on the morning of 13 October that the entire population of Gaza north of Wadi Gaza should relocate to southern Gaza within the next 24 hours. We advise following this advice issued by the Israeli authorities. We recognise this a fast-moving situation that poses significant risks."
And this despite the fact that the UN have issued this statement.
"The United Nations considers it impossible for such a movement to take place without devastating humanitarian consequences.
The United Nations strongly appeals for any such order, if confirmed, to be rescinded avoiding what could transform what is already a tragedy into a calamitous situation.”
I might add that the unique thing about this conflict, involving as it does a Western military power, is that we are seeing in the media both sides of the conflict on the ground, when, for example, we never saw the effect of Western air strikes on Iraq.
As a result, it does strike me that Israel is in danger of losing in the UK the hearts and mind it clearly won over following the terrible attacks by Hamas because people will begin to conclude that the Israelis are just going too far.
[Post edited 13 Oct 2023 9:04]
|  | | |  |
| Restraint? on 12:08 - Oct 13 with 1503 views | Blueschev |
| Restraint? on 11:10 - Oct 13 by DJR |
Leo Varadker is prepared to call it out, but he seems a lone voice.
https://www.independent.ie/irish-news/leo-varadkar-israel-breaching-internationa
Having said that, given the West was prepared to launch an attack on Iraq which according to a Lancet survey led to an estimated 654,965 excess deaths between March 2003 and June 2006, perhaps those countries in the West which took part can't be too critical of Israel. And in that case, there wasn't even the self defence justification. [Post edited 13 Oct 2023 11:19]
|
It would be completely hypocritical for the West to call out Israel for it's war crimes, just as it is for them to call out Russia's. That's why I find this rehabilitation of of Alistair Campbell particularly sickening. |  | | |
| Restraint? on 12:21 - Oct 13 with 1453 views | Bent_double |
| Restraint? on 11:53 - Oct 13 by Basuco |
Maybe they now see they had made a huge error in taking on Israel, who in retaliation look like they are going to ruthlessly hunt down every member of Hamas and take them out, with any collateral casualties considered to be just part of the operation. Hamas were stupid to give Israel an excuse to go at them with a very predictable inhuman full on response. The result of which is many innocent people on both sides killed or injured, which for me is the worst part. |
I'm not so sure, infact I think in some ways both sides have got exactly what they wanted:
Hamas got to massacre innocent Israeli citizens and solidiers, which is what their whole sick idealogy is based on, whilst bringing the continued plight of the Palestinian people to the worlds attention (if they even care about that). I'd even go as far as saying the what the terrorists did to the Israelis was very deliberate in order to provoke the maximum disgust and outrage to ensure soldiers were sent into Gaza, into a trap.
Israel have got an excuse to go into Gaza (and maybe the West Bank after) and wipe out the Hamas terrorists, and possibly go as far as weakening Hezbollah in the Lebanon at the same time, whilst not listening to any calls for restraint as they have in the past. This is their big opportunity to deal with Hamas once and for all, but unless it comes with guaranted peace talks and discussions over land and control, the hatred and mistrust will just start all over again. |  |
| |
| Restraint? on 12:45 - Oct 13 with 1402 views | DJR |
| Restraint? on 12:08 - Oct 13 by Blueschev |
It would be completely hypocritical for the West to call out Israel for it's war crimes, just as it is for them to call out Russia's. That's why I find this rehabilitation of of Alistair Campbell particularly sickening. |
Indeed, perhaps expecting Israel to behave in a proportionate way is straying into IHRA definition territory because it is
"Applying double standards by requiring of it a behaviour not expected or demanded of any other democratic nation."
Having said that, there will be many (including me but probably not the politicians themselves) who would expect or demand proportionate behaviour by other Western democratic nations in a war situation. [Post edited 13 Oct 2023 18:31]
| | | |
| Restraint? on 13:40 - Oct 13 with 1342 views | Plums |
| Restraint? on 08:57 - Oct 13 by BanksterDebtSlave |
According to a BBC report this morning it is so they can flatten the area to get to the tunnels. The tunnels where hostages are likely being held. This response makes no sense on any level. |
This makes no military sense whatsoever.
It's been recognised for a very long time that creating a sea of rubble in an urban area makes it far harder to clear and occupy. If you don't value the lives of the civilians (as neither Hamas nor Israel do), it's a defenders' dream. |  |
| |
| Restraint? on 15:46 - Oct 13 with 1210 views | Basuco |
| Restraint? on 12:21 - Oct 13 by Bent_double |
I'm not so sure, infact I think in some ways both sides have got exactly what they wanted:
Hamas got to massacre innocent Israeli citizens and solidiers, which is what their whole sick idealogy is based on, whilst bringing the continued plight of the Palestinian people to the worlds attention (if they even care about that). I'd even go as far as saying the what the terrorists did to the Israelis was very deliberate in order to provoke the maximum disgust and outrage to ensure soldiers were sent into Gaza, into a trap.
Israel have got an excuse to go into Gaza (and maybe the West Bank after) and wipe out the Hamas terrorists, and possibly go as far as weakening Hezbollah in the Lebanon at the same time, whilst not listening to any calls for restraint as they have in the past. This is their big opportunity to deal with Hamas once and for all, but unless it comes with guaranted peace talks and discussions over land and control, the hatred and mistrust will just start all over again. |
Sadly you could well be right, very sad for the ordinary citizens on both sides who as always suffer the most. |  | | |
| Restraint? on 02:52 - Oct 14 with 1074 views | JackNorthStand |
Agree regarding losing hearts and minds. What’s terrible is innocents are suffering on both sides.
From an outsiders perspective with limited knowledge on the situation, would initial air strikes not have been better followed with targeted special forces raids on Hamas, taking out key figures? I am assuming Israel has the intel and special forces needed to do this?
Would appreciate anyone’s input who does know more than me why Israel didn’t do this. As I said my knowledge is limited to me just seems more logical. |  | | |
| Restraint? on 08:09 - Oct 14 with 1030 views | BanksterDebtSlave |
| Restraint? on 02:52 - Oct 14 by JackNorthStand |
Agree regarding losing hearts and minds. What’s terrible is innocents are suffering on both sides.
From an outsiders perspective with limited knowledge on the situation, would initial air strikes not have been better followed with targeted special forces raids on Hamas, taking out key figures? I am assuming Israel has the intel and special forces needed to do this?
Would appreciate anyone’s input who does know more than me why Israel didn’t do this. As I said my knowledge is limited to me just seems more logical. |
It would appear that getting the hostages out alive isn't that high on Netanyahu's agenda. |  |
| |
Login to get fewer ads
| Restraint? on 09:21 - Oct 14 with 984 views | StevieH |
|  | | |
| Restraint? on 09:50 - Oct 14 with 938 views | Nthsuffolkblue |
| Restraint? on 09:21 - Oct 14 by StevieH |
|
Very well said. It is only through dialogue and recognition that "we all share the same pain" that peace can come. |  |
| |
| |
By continuing to use the site, you agree to our use of cookies and to abide by our Terms and Conditions.
