| Delap & PSR 11:06 - May 27 with 1546 views | LA_Tractor_Boy |
Obviously from a footballing perspective, it will be good if Delap's future is sorted asap.
But from a PSR perspective, does anyone know if it's better that he signs for Chelsea before or after 30th June?
For all the negative comments about how much we've spent, I guess it's actually possible that (excl. money spent on infrastructure) we make a PSR profit in 2024/25 if Delap leaves in June. |  | | |  |
| Delap & PSR on 11:28 - May 27 with 1415 views | C_HealyIsAPleasure |
Unless we’ve overstretched and need the cash to make this years calculation stack up (which by all accounts we don’t) then it would surely be better for us if it’s after the deadline?
Individual year results don’t matter for PSR, just the cumulative 3 year result. Once this year is done, the next 2 years will have both 2024/25 and 2025/26 in them (so irrelevant which year the Delap sale is in). Crucially though 3 years from now 2024/25 will drop off - meaning that if the profit from Delap is banked in 2025/26 this will still be in the calculation, but not if it is completed before then
Of course, Chelsea may have different needs and depending on exactly how the contract clause works we may not have a choice
TLDR golden rule of PSR - if the money isn’t needed for this years calculation then it’s better to bank a profit after the deadline |  |
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| Delap & PSR on 11:28 - May 27 with 1406 views | Smoresy |
Providing you aren't in PSR trouble, it's always beneficial to record profit in the future and expenditure in the past (would allow us to spend more in 27/28). The buying club will control when the sale completes in this situation.
Very difficult to know what we've spent on wages this season. | | | |
| Delap & PSR on 12:18 - May 27 with 1173 views | gsoly |
How are you making PSR profit stack up after our spending this season? |  | | |
| Delap & PSR (n/t) on 12:47 - May 27 with 1069 views | dowsie3 |
| Delap & PSR on 12:18 - May 27 by gsoly |
How are you making PSR profit stack up after our spending this season? |
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| Delap & PSR (n/t) on 12:53 - May 27 with 1014 views | dowsie3 |
| Delap & PSR (n/t) on 12:47 - May 27 by dowsie3 |
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All the money Town spent on transfer this season wouldn’t have been paid in one go so the money for Hutchison which was approximately 20 million town would probably paid 10 million and then 5 million this season and 5 the next so we spent roughly 120 million this season on transfer I would say only 60 million came out of this year’s budget. | | | |
| Delap & PSR on 12:56 - May 27 with 994 views | SuffolkPunchFC |
Most like we want the transaction to complete for next season's accounts.
Hmmm… by SuffolkPunchFC 24 May 10:43It only makes sense to complete the deal for this year's accounts if we need it to be FFP compliant, which looks unlikely. Otherwise we want the transaction to appear in next years accounts, to assist with future years' FFP compliance.
Hmmm… by SuffolkPunchFC 23 May 19:41I was about to say similar.
If we’re in good shape to work within FFP rules for 22/23 to 24/25 without the sale, then we’re better to have the transaction complete in the 25/26 season. More flexibility to sign players next year, and through to 27/28.
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| Delap & PSR on 13:00 - May 27 with 973 views | SuffolkPunchFC |
| Delap & PSR on 12:18 - May 27 by gsoly |
How are you making PSR profit stack up after our spending this season? |
Player trading amortisation for this year is ~£27-30M. I'm pretty sure Omari was also the previous year's accounts.
PSR should not be an issue for us this accounting cycle, 22/23 to 24/25 | | | |
| Delap & PSR on 13:01 - May 27 with 962 views | Jrm_72 |
Just posted this on another thread but assume Chelsea will want him for Club World Cup so will be pushing for it to be done 1-10th June window?
I wonder if some slight of hand accounting can be done to suit all parties whereby we loan him to Chelsea until say July then a sale is completed? | | | |
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| Delap & PSR (n/t) on 13:04 - May 27 with 947 views | SuffolkPunchFC |
| Delap & PSR (n/t) on 12:53 - May 27 by dowsie3 |
All the money Town spent on transfer this season wouldn’t have been paid in one go so the money for Hutchison which was approximately 20 million town would probably paid 10 million and then 5 million this season and 5 the next so we spent roughly 120 million this season on transfer I would say only 60 million came out of this year’s budget. |
The fee is amortised over the length of the contract for PSR, so Omari will be £4M/year over the 5 year contract. This will be the same for all contracts, hence why the ~£130M spent will be around £27-30M per season against PSR. | | | |
| Delap & PSR on 13:07 - May 27 with 925 views | Daninthecampo |
| Delap & PSR on 13:00 - May 27 by SuffolkPunchFC |
Player trading amortisation for this year is ~£27-30M. I'm pretty sure Omari was also the previous year's accounts.
PSR should not be an issue for us this accounting cycle, 22/23 to 24/25 |
If we've amortised delap 15m fee over 5 years so just 3m a year, if we then receive 30m upfront minus sell on fee, can we theoretically show this all as profit minus the annual 3m? Or not if the player/asset is sold? | | | |
| Delap & PSR on 13:10 - May 27 with 900 views | SuffolkPunchFC |
| Delap & PSR on 13:01 - May 27 by Jrm_72 |
Just posted this on another thread but assume Chelsea will want him for Club World Cup so will be pushing for it to be done 1-10th June window?
I wonder if some slight of hand accounting can be done to suit all parties whereby we loan him to Chelsea until say July then a sale is completed? |
I noted this comment in one of the reports too, and thought that it's not the best for our accounts.
It may be a way to 'negotiate' something on terms that mean we get more than the £30M in total, if they are really keen to have him available.
Also I guess the terms could be phased payments, so that we get paid a smaller amount on signing (£1), and something based on PL appearances, starting with ONE appearance (£29,999,999), and a contractual agreement that he plays on the first day of the season  | | | |
| Delap & PSR on 13:15 - May 27 with 867 views | Smoresy |
| Delap & PSR on 12:18 - May 27 by gsoly |
How are you making PSR profit stack up after our spending this season? |
Suffolk Punch already covered this well: transfer fee outlay this season of maybe £30m, for accounting purposes (research: amortization). That figure to include "transfer installments" for Hirst, Taylor, Broadhead and so on, even if in reality we paid in full on the date of purchase.
We'll hopefully receive north of £140m in turnover, while the biggest cost and biggest unknown is our wage bill. Little point checking the salary sites for a sneak preview of this figure because they are very unreliable for specific clubs, below the level at which players' salaries are verified (they had Hutchinson and Broadhead as two of our lowest earners last season, for instance!). This is especially true when a club is in transition like ours. | | | |
| Delap & PSR on 13:15 - May 27 with 864 views | SuffolkPunchFC |
| Delap & PSR on 13:07 - May 27 by Daninthecampo |
If we've amortised delap 15m fee over 5 years so just 3m a year, if we then receive 30m upfront minus sell on fee, can we theoretically show this all as profit minus the annual 3m? Or not if the player/asset is sold? |
Payment terms and PSR amortisation are two different things, so it gets really complicated at times. I wrote something about this a little while back, in a different context, but it relevant here.
Is everyone disappointed with the Delap 30m price? by SuffolkPunchFC 20 May 15:12We don't know the terms of the original deal, so we cannot really work out the exact financials. I tried to illustrate that in a previous post (although the context of the question was different)
https://www.twtd.co.uk/forum/607152/6067586/delap-to-arsenal-/#post6067586
We do not know our current outlay, or what was on terms. Nor do we know what the terms of any sale will be. It's extremely complicated, and though to work out where we are. The important part is that we will have a sh!tlaod of cash/credit to invest further.
Delap to Arsenal ? by SuffolkPunchFC 8 May 15:44We don't only get the profit as part of the transaction - we get the full amount paid for the player (eventually - read on for the nitty gritty of these types of transaction), and then have to pay City 20% of the profit.
Now, in all likelihood the transfer was done on instalments, so we may have only paid ManC a proportion of the agreed 15M - let's say we've paid 5M so far. So we're only 5M out of pocket. So we would owe ManC the 10M balance plus 20% sell-on fee from the profit.
If we receive a 30M offer, that means we have to hand over 13M to ManC, and retain 17M income (which is our initial 5M outlay back plus 12M profit).
Of course, this is only an example, and it's likely to be even more complicated than that, as whoever buys from us will probably negotiate paying in instalments, so we'll initially receive less in-hand cash, and the remainder over the instalment period - but still the full amount eventually, and anything owed to us on instalments is considered 'Receivables' for accounting, and can be used as security for loans to go against other player purchase.
[Post edited 27 May 13:16]
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| Delap & PSR on 13:37 - May 27 with 719 views | Daninthecampo |
| Delap & PSR on 13:15 - May 27 by SuffolkPunchFC |
Payment terms and PSR amortisation are two different things, so it gets really complicated at times. I wrote something about this a little while back, in a different context, but it relevant here.
Is everyone disappointed with the Delap 30m price? by SuffolkPunchFC 20 May 15:12We don't know the terms of the original deal, so we cannot really work out the exact financials. I tried to illustrate that in a previous post (although the context of the question was different)
https://www.twtd.co.uk/forum/607152/6067586/delap-to-arsenal-/#post6067586
We do not know our current outlay, or what was on terms. Nor do we know what the terms of any sale will be. It's extremely complicated, and though to work out where we are. The important part is that we will have a sh!tlaod of cash/credit to invest further.
Delap to Arsenal ? by SuffolkPunchFC 8 May 15:44We don't only get the profit as part of the transaction - we get the full amount paid for the player (eventually - read on for the nitty gritty of these types of transaction), and then have to pay City 20% of the profit.
Now, in all likelihood the transfer was done on instalments, so we may have only paid ManC a proportion of the agreed 15M - let's say we've paid 5M so far. So we're only 5M out of pocket. So we would owe ManC the 10M balance plus 20% sell-on fee from the profit.
If we receive a 30M offer, that means we have to hand over 13M to ManC, and retain 17M income (which is our initial 5M outlay back plus 12M profit).
Of course, this is only an example, and it's likely to be even more complicated than that, as whoever buys from us will probably negotiate paying in instalments, so we'll initially receive less in-hand cash, and the remainder over the instalment period - but still the full amount eventually, and anything owed to us on instalments is considered 'Receivables' for accounting, and can be used as security for loans to go against other player purchase.
[Post edited 27 May 13:16]
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Thanks for the explanation, footie finances is way above my knowledge of normal company accounts! | | | |
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