| Anyone know how the mileage road tax charge will work on EV's? 13:25 - Nov 26 with 3354 views | MrPotatoHead |
3p per mile seems a lot. I do 20k annually in mine, I'll be on the hook for £600! |  | | |  |
| Anyone know how the mileage road tax charge will work on EV's? on 09:17 - Nov 27 with 320 views | DJR |
| Anyone know how the mileage road tax charge will work on EV's? on 08:57 - Nov 27 by soupytwist |
Was it you interviewed on the BBC news yesterday? They spoke to a couple who drive an EV and the bloke said that they do about 20,000 miles in their EV per year.
This thread is interesting, once you get past the cheap shot at the typo in the details that have been published. The situation where the mileage payment already made (whether over or under what's due) remains with a car seems unnecessarily complicated.
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Here's a link to the consultation for anyone interested.
https://assets.publishing.service.gov.uk/media/69260d23aca6213a492dd0a2/Consulta |  | | |
| Anyone know how the mileage road tax charge will work on EV's? on 09:42 - Nov 27 with 278 views | Swansea_Blue |
| Anyone know how the mileage road tax charge will work on EV's? on 13:54 - Nov 26 by baxterbasics |
At least my EV will be paid off by the time this kicks in so I can switch back to a dirty diesel.
£650 extra per year just so I can get to work and back.
Am curious about how they intend to track and enforce it though. |
I was curious about how mileage pricing would affect affordability, so had a look at some figures using your £650 additional cost. Only for running costs, so not factoring in car depreciation, etc. All rough, with average assumptions taken from Google searches.
It seems Diesel would still be significantly more expensive to run (up to 3x if someone is using an off-peak home charger). Obviously solar panels + battery would drop the electricity cost further to zero or close to zero depending on weather! (excluding capital costs).
The taxman would get ca. 2.5x more tax from the diesel owner too (my expectation is that they will ramp these mileage charges up massively over time to recoup taxes lost as more people switch to EV).
EV:
£650 @ 3p/m = 21,667 miles
- Average standard tariff home charging cost ~8p/ml. Average off peak tariff for home charging ~2p/ml.
Therefore, electricity price guide (home charging only):
Cost of electricity standard tariff (8p/ml) = 21667*£0.08=£1,733.36
Cost of electricity off peak tariff (2p/ml) = 21,667*£0.02=£433.34
Electricity plus new per mile pricing £650 = total cost to owner of £1,083.34 to £2,383.36
Of which taxes:
- New electric price per mile = £650
- Plus domestic VAT on standard tariff £1,733.36*0.05=£86.67
- OR on off peak tariff £433.34*0.05=£21.67
= taxman’s share is £671.67 to £736.67
DIESEL
- Average real-world MPG for a diesel is 45 mpg.
21,667/45 = 481.489 gallons = 2,188.89 litres
- Average price per litre diesel (RAC UK-wide) = 146.23p
- Of the 146.23p per litre price for diesel, approximately 77.72p is tax (fuel duty & VAT) which accounts for about 53% of the total cost.
2,188.89 ltrs * £1.4623 = £3,200.814 fuel cost to owner
Of which taxes: 2188.89 * £0.7772 = taxman’s share is £1,701.205 [Post edited 27 Nov 9:47]
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| Anyone know how the mileage road tax charge will work on EV's? on 10:56 - Nov 27 with 244 views | mellowblue |
| Anyone know how the mileage road tax charge will work on EV's? on 09:42 - Nov 27 by Swansea_Blue |
I was curious about how mileage pricing would affect affordability, so had a look at some figures using your £650 additional cost. Only for running costs, so not factoring in car depreciation, etc. All rough, with average assumptions taken from Google searches.
It seems Diesel would still be significantly more expensive to run (up to 3x if someone is using an off-peak home charger). Obviously solar panels + battery would drop the electricity cost further to zero or close to zero depending on weather! (excluding capital costs).
The taxman would get ca. 2.5x more tax from the diesel owner too (my expectation is that they will ramp these mileage charges up massively over time to recoup taxes lost as more people switch to EV).
EV:
£650 @ 3p/m = 21,667 miles
- Average standard tariff home charging cost ~8p/ml. Average off peak tariff for home charging ~2p/ml.
Therefore, electricity price guide (home charging only):
Cost of electricity standard tariff (8p/ml) = 21667*£0.08=£1,733.36
Cost of electricity off peak tariff (2p/ml) = 21,667*£0.02=£433.34
Electricity plus new per mile pricing £650 = total cost to owner of £1,083.34 to £2,383.36
Of which taxes:
- New electric price per mile = £650
- Plus domestic VAT on standard tariff £1,733.36*0.05=£86.67
- OR on off peak tariff £433.34*0.05=£21.67
= taxman’s share is £671.67 to £736.67
DIESEL
- Average real-world MPG for a diesel is 45 mpg.
21,667/45 = 481.489 gallons = 2,188.89 litres
- Average price per litre diesel (RAC UK-wide) = 146.23p
- Of the 146.23p per litre price for diesel, approximately 77.72p is tax (fuel duty & VAT) which accounts for about 53% of the total cost.
2,188.89 ltrs * £1.4623 = £3,200.814 fuel cost to owner
Of which taxes: 2188.89 * £0.7772 = taxman’s share is £1,701.205 [Post edited 27 Nov 9:47]
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impressive piece of work. You can see why Reeves is squeezing EV. Be interesting to know how the lease cost or purchase, depreciation and service outgoings impact. |  | | |
| Anyone know how the mileage road tax charge will work on EV's? on 11:11 - Nov 27 with 220 views | soupytwist |
| Anyone know how the mileage road tax charge will work on EV's? on 10:56 - Nov 27 by mellowblue |
impressive piece of work. You can see why Reeves is squeezing EV. Be interesting to know how the lease cost or purchase, depreciation and service outgoings impact. |
EV servicing costs are generally lower due to comparative simplicity of EV mechanicals compared to their combustion engine counterparts. Also, an EV gets through far fewer consumable brake parts (disks and pads) because regenerative braking means that the actual brakes are used a lot less.
Anecdotally suspension parts can need replacing more often due to the fact that for any given size of car, the EV will be heavier because those batteries do weigh quite a bit. Also, again anecdotally, tyres for EVs can cost more. And some manufacturers seem to have issues with the 12v battery systems.
So, some swings and roundabouts stuff as far as servicing goes but EVs probably work out cheaper. There will obviously be some instances where bad design or engineering decisions by manufacturers of EVs result in failure of important parts on specific models but in mitigation, combustion engine cars aren't immune from those either despite the fact we've been making them for over 100 years. Ford/Stellantis wet belts, early Mazda diesels, Honda Jazz CVT gearboxes are cases in point.
I did a direct comparison of leasing costs for a vehicle that has EV and petrol versions earlier in the thread. EV was cheaper but probably not a statistically valid sample. [Post edited 27 Nov 11:13]
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| Anyone know how the mileage road tax charge will work on EV's? on 14:17 - Nov 27 with 157 views | DJR |
| Anyone know how the mileage road tax charge will work on EV's? on 13:28 - Nov 26 by BloomBlue |
Not coming in until 2028, so I guess more details will arrive.
More of a question for me is, if I drive my car in France do those miles count towards UK per mile charge? |
This from the consultation document I linked above suggest the answer will be yes.
"As noted above, the government has ruled out charging tax
based on when or where people drive, to protect motorists’ privacy. This
means mileage driven overseas by UK registered cars will fall into scope
of eVED, as with fuel duty, which does not vary on basis of where a car is
driven.13 Since the proportion of UK registered cars driving abroad each
year is a small proportion of total cars14, it is proportionate to prioritise
privacy and simplicity over a system of checks to deduct non-UK
mileage." | | | |
| Anyone know how the mileage road tax charge will work on EV's? on 14:21 - Nov 27 with 154 views | DJR |
| Anyone know how the mileage road tax charge will work on EV's? on 08:08 - Nov 27 by DJR |
With a decline in the number of petrol cars, something has to be done to make up for the loss of fuel duty, so this is an opportunity to put in place, and test, a system when there are a relatively limited number of EV/plug-in-hybrid cars.
The advantage with fuel duty is that it is pay-as-you-go, so I assume they will have to put in place a weekly or monthly payment on account option to prevent someone having to find the whole year's amount in one go.
The sale or return of a car will also have to be built into the equation. [Post edited 27 Nov 8:10]
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The consultation document says the following about the point I mention in the second paragraph.
"Alongside paying their VED each year, under eVED motorists will
estimate their mileage for the year ahead, pay an upfront charge based
on their estimate or spread their payment across the year, and then
submit their actual mileage at the end of the year to trigger a
reconciliation."
It gives the following example.
"Example for a motorist who pays eVED monthly:
Estimated mileage: 5,000 miles
Rate: 3p per mile
Total annual tax: 5,000 x 3p = £150
Monthly eVED liability: £12.50"
There is also this about the sale of a car.
"Vehicle changes ownership: The mileage already paid for will
remain with the vehicle. This mileage – which may be either more or
less than the actual mileage accrued at that point, as per the vehicle
odometer – will be made visible via DVLA online to the new owner (i.e.
the buyer). The government expects the eVED status of the vehicle
(whether it is sold with pre-paid mileage or a mileage deficit) to be
reflected in the sale price of the vehicle." [Post edited 27 Nov 14:23]
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| Anyone know how the mileage road tax charge will work on EV's? on 15:12 - Nov 27 with 138 views | Swansea_Blue |
Now we’re talking! | |
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| Anyone know how the mileage road tax charge will work on EV's? on 15:13 - Nov 27 with 137 views | Swansea_Blue |
| Anyone know how the mileage road tax charge will work on EV's? on 14:21 - Nov 27 by DJR |
The consultation document says the following about the point I mention in the second paragraph.
"Alongside paying their VED each year, under eVED motorists will
estimate their mileage for the year ahead, pay an upfront charge based
on their estimate or spread their payment across the year, and then
submit their actual mileage at the end of the year to trigger a
reconciliation."
It gives the following example.
"Example for a motorist who pays eVED monthly:
Estimated mileage: 5,000 miles
Rate: 3p per mile
Total annual tax: 5,000 x 3p = £150
Monthly eVED liability: £12.50"
There is also this about the sale of a car.
"Vehicle changes ownership: The mileage already paid for will
remain with the vehicle. This mileage – which may be either more or
less than the actual mileage accrued at that point, as per the vehicle
odometer – will be made visible via DVLA online to the new owner (i.e.
the buyer). The government expects the eVED status of the vehicle
(whether it is sold with pre-paid mileage or a mileage deficit) to be
reflected in the sale price of the vehicle." [Post edited 27 Nov 14:23]
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Sounds unnecessarily complicated | |
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| Anyone know how the mileage road tax charge will work on EV's? on 15:41 - Nov 27 with 111 views | soupytwist |
| Anyone know how the mileage road tax charge will work on EV's? on 14:17 - Nov 27 by DJR |
This from the consultation document I linked above suggest the answer will be yes.
"As noted above, the government has ruled out charging tax
based on when or where people drive, to protect motorists’ privacy. This
means mileage driven overseas by UK registered cars will fall into scope
of eVED, as with fuel duty, which does not vary on basis of where a car is
driven.13 Since the proportion of UK registered cars driving abroad each
year is a small proportion of total cars14, it is proportionate to prioritise
privacy and simplicity over a system of checks to deduct non-UK
mileage." |
Except that UK fuel duty payment does vary on the basis of where a car is driven. Unless you leave the UK with a tank of petrol paid for in the UK and manage to drive everywhere you want to outside the UK on that tank of fuel without buying more in the abroad bit.
I suppose that's a fairly common scenario in Northern Ireland but relatively few people are going through the Channel Tunnel and coming back without buying some petrol or diesel in Europe.
They're not prioritising privacy, they're making sure they get the maximum amount of money possible. | | | |
| Anyone know how the mileage road tax charge will work on EV's? on 15:41 - Nov 27 with 109 views | baxterbasics |
| Anyone know how the mileage road tax charge will work on EV's? on 15:13 - Nov 27 by Swansea_Blue |
Sounds unnecessarily complicated |
Still time for it to be scrapped before it's implemented, once they realise it's impractical and unpopular. So much simpler to just increase the flat rate car tax a little if they are worried about plugging the gap with ICE cars. |  |
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| Anyone know how the mileage road tax charge will work on EV's? on 15:50 - Nov 27 with 93 views | DJR |
| Anyone know how the mileage road tax charge will work on EV's? on 15:13 - Nov 27 by Swansea_Blue |
Sounds unnecessarily complicated |
It doesn't seem that complicated to me because it will be built into the existing VED system, and it will be up to people whether they want to haggle about the price when a car is sold.
And people normally have to estimate mileage when taking out insurance (and I believe leasing a car), so this will be much the same. [Post edited 27 Nov 16:01]
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| Anyone know how the mileage road tax charge will work on EV's? on 15:57 - Nov 27 with 78 views | DJR |
| Anyone know how the mileage road tax charge will work on EV's? on 15:41 - Nov 27 by soupytwist |
Except that UK fuel duty payment does vary on the basis of where a car is driven. Unless you leave the UK with a tank of petrol paid for in the UK and manage to drive everywhere you want to outside the UK on that tank of fuel without buying more in the abroad bit.
I suppose that's a fairly common scenario in Northern Ireland but relatively few people are going through the Channel Tunnel and coming back without buying some petrol or diesel in Europe.
They're not prioritising privacy, they're making sure they get the maximum amount of money possible. |
It strikes me that simplicity trumps privacy given we are probably not talking about vast sums, but this is what is said about privacy.
"there will be no requirement to report where and when miles are
driven, so there is no need for trackers in cars." [Post edited 27 Nov 15:59]
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| Anyone know how the mileage road tax charge will work on EV's? on 19:32 - Nov 27 with 43 views | stonojnr |
| Anyone know how the mileage road tax charge will work on EV's? on 15:41 - Nov 27 by baxterbasics |
Still time for it to be scrapped before it's implemented, once they realise it's impractical and unpopular. So much simpler to just increase the flat rate car tax a little if they are worried about plugging the gap with ICE cars. |
Yeah well they're spending 1.8billion on digital id cards...just think how much child poverty that could eliminate...so the concept of doing stupid unpopular things is not unbeknown to this government.
And they cant scrap the eVeD because they need the money, ooh the irony, to pay to lift children out of poverty and fill the funding gap that forcing everyone to got with EV cars creates. | | | |
| Anyone know how the mileage road tax charge will work on EV's? on 20:43 - Nov 27 with 25 views | Pinewoodblue |
| Anyone know how the mileage road tax charge will work on EV's? on 14:21 - Nov 27 by DJR |
The consultation document says the following about the point I mention in the second paragraph.
"Alongside paying their VED each year, under eVED motorists will
estimate their mileage for the year ahead, pay an upfront charge based
on their estimate or spread their payment across the year, and then
submit their actual mileage at the end of the year to trigger a
reconciliation."
It gives the following example.
"Example for a motorist who pays eVED monthly:
Estimated mileage: 5,000 miles
Rate: 3p per mile
Total annual tax: 5,000 x 3p = £150
Monthly eVED liability: £12.50"
There is also this about the sale of a car.
"Vehicle changes ownership: The mileage already paid for will
remain with the vehicle. This mileage – which may be either more or
less than the actual mileage accrued at that point, as per the vehicle
odometer – will be made visible via DVLA online to the new owner (i.e.
the buyer). The government expects the eVED status of the vehicle
(whether it is sold with pre-paid mileage or a mileage deficit) to be
reflected in the sale price of the vehicle." [Post edited 27 Nov 14:23]
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Since most will be leased leave it to leasing company to collect based on the mileage permitted on the lease before extra costs per mile added.
10,000 Millie’s p.a 10,000/x3p payable in advance. No adjustment if you cover less mileage.,Simples. |  |
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