| Starmer & political instability 20:50 - May 11 with 1998 views | Zx1988 |
If Starmer does end up either resigning or being pushed, I presume Novgorod Nigel's handlers will be rubbing their hands with glee, at having caused even more political instability in the UK, no? |  |
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| Starmer & political instability on 08:56 - May 13 with 376 views | baxterbasics |
Prime minister at the next election by baxterbasics 13 May 8:54My opinion, - again, as no fan of Starmer - I think it would be better for the country if his MPs (and also the media) pipe down and let him get on with it. There's no obvious successor waiting in the wings (no quick route for Burnham) and all this speculation and infighting and instability at the top is not helpful. We need a period of stable boring governance, even if that means he's little more than a caretaker PM. We've had this nonsense from both sides pretty much since Cameron resigned. Stop deposing leaders mid-cycle.
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| Starmer & political instability on 08:57 - May 13 with 373 views | GlasgowBlue |
I’ve read this thread two or three times and thought about posting but had hoped someone would point out the bleedin’ obvious. For someone known for their hot takes this your hottest yet.
It’s not nasty Nigel’s fault that Starmer appointed Mandelson as US Ambassador, causing a chain of events that saw Labour break out into civil war a couple of months ago, with Andy Burnham’s failed bid to get back into Parliament via the Denton by election to stand against Starmer in a leadership election.
It’s not nasty Nigel’s fault that Wes Streeting and Angela Rayner have been on manoeuvres since then, openly courting support if Labour performed badly in the local elections.
It’s not nasty Nigel’s fault that Labour lost nearly 1500 council seats across England, Wales and Scotland, with 300 of those going to the Greens.
It’s not nasty Nigel’s fault that Labour lost wales to Plaid for the first time in over a century.
It is in the hands of Labour MP’s whether the country is plunged into more political instability. They have a choice whether to support their leader or not. Not nasty Nigel who seems to be very much in your head. |  |
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| Starmer & political instability on 09:26 - May 13 with 324 views | flykickingbybgunn |
| Starmer & political instability on 08:15 - May 13 by DJR |
The issue though, whether fair or not, is that an awful lot of people have a visceral hatred of Starmer and I can't see that ever changing.
Interestingly, John McTernan, former director of political operations for Blair and thus no lefty, believes that Labour got into the current mess by blocking Burnham which enabled the Greens to win the Gorton by-election and thus gain credibility and momentum which carried forward into the local elections.
His view is that the only hope for the Labour Party, and to defeat Reform, is Burnham, and that is a view I share.
And here's an extract from something he wrote yesterday.
"The size of Reform gains across England concealed a fundamental fact – the progressive bloc of voters is still by some way the largest in the UK. The BBC’s projected national share of the vote gives it 57 per cent of the vote compared to the combined 43 per cent of Reform and the Tories. That should mean the dominance of progressive parties and politics, yet the even split – 17 per cent Labour, 18 per cent Greens, 16 per cent Lib Dems [and 6 per cent others] – means they cannibalise each other’s support.
t’s not a case of Labour “moving to the left” – this is already a left wing government with its signature achievements coming from the soft left – Louise Haigh’s railway nationalization, Angela Rayner’s workers’ rights and renters rights, and Ed Miliband’s green transition. It’s more the need – to adapt the words of James Brown – “say it loud, we’re soft left and we’re proud!”
In the thirties, bank robber Willie Sutton made an important observation. Quizzed by the FBI about why he had robbed so many banks, he replied “That’s where the money is!” Labour need to obey “Sutton’s Law” – go where the votes are! Only two per cent of Reform voters say that they would be willing to listen to the Labour party again. The ones who used to be Labour have been on a decade’s long journey that started with the Brexit referendum. Voters who have gone Green have just switched but Scotland has shown that a change can become a habit.
To win a game, you need your best playmaker on the field. After two years in government Labour needs a Cabinet member who is listened to when he speaks. In pubs, at football matches, when he is spotted Andy Burnham is asked for selfies by fans. That is the regular expression of the fact he has positive approval ratings.
Time to bring Andy back. Now!" [Post edited 13 May 8:30]
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Well said DJR and Glasgow.
I could not agree more. |  | | |
| Starmer & political instability on 09:39 - May 13 with 292 views | Benters |
| Starmer & political instability on 08:57 - May 13 by GlasgowBlue |
I’ve read this thread two or three times and thought about posting but had hoped someone would point out the bleedin’ obvious. For someone known for their hot takes this your hottest yet.
It’s not nasty Nigel’s fault that Starmer appointed Mandelson as US Ambassador, causing a chain of events that saw Labour break out into civil war a couple of months ago, with Andy Burnham’s failed bid to get back into Parliament via the Denton by election to stand against Starmer in a leadership election.
It’s not nasty Nigel’s fault that Wes Streeting and Angela Rayner have been on manoeuvres since then, openly courting support if Labour performed badly in the local elections.
It’s not nasty Nigel’s fault that Labour lost nearly 1500 council seats across England, Wales and Scotland, with 300 of those going to the Greens.
It’s not nasty Nigel’s fault that Labour lost wales to Plaid for the first time in over a century.
It is in the hands of Labour MP’s whether the country is plunged into more political instability. They have a choice whether to support their leader or not. Not nasty Nigel who seems to be very much in your head. |
Excellent work   |  |
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| Starmer & political instability on 11:01 - May 13 with 226 views | FoghornGleghorn |
| Starmer & political instability on 09:39 - May 13 by Benters |
Excellent work |
Usual doomed effort to engage: is it that you don’t trust anyone and are happy to gamble, or do you actually think Farage is trustworthy? If so, why do you? | | | |
| Starmer & political instability on 11:13 - May 13 with 192 views | WeWereZombies |
| Starmer & political instability on 08:15 - May 13 by DJR |
The issue though, whether fair or not, is that an awful lot of people have a visceral hatred of Starmer and I can't see that ever changing.
Interestingly, John McTernan, former director of political operations for Blair and thus no lefty, believes that Labour got into the current mess by blocking Burnham which enabled the Greens to win the Gorton by-election and thus gain credibility and momentum which carried forward into the local elections.
His view is that the only hope for the Labour Party, and to defeat Reform, is Burnham, and that is a view I share.
And here's an extract from something he wrote yesterday.
"The size of Reform gains across England concealed a fundamental fact – the progressive bloc of voters is still by some way the largest in the UK. The BBC’s projected national share of the vote gives it 57 per cent of the vote compared to the combined 43 per cent of Reform and the Tories. That should mean the dominance of progressive parties and politics, yet the even split – 17 per cent Labour, 18 per cent Greens, 16 per cent Lib Dems [and 6 per cent others] – means they cannibalise each other’s support.
t’s not a case of Labour “moving to the left” – this is already a left wing government with its signature achievements coming from the soft left – Louise Haigh’s railway nationalization, Angela Rayner’s workers’ rights and renters rights, and Ed Miliband’s green transition. It’s more the need – to adapt the words of James Brown – “say it loud, we’re soft left and we’re proud!”
In the thirties, bank robber Willie Sutton made an important observation. Quizzed by the FBI about why he had robbed so many banks, he replied “That’s where the money is!” Labour need to obey “Sutton’s Law” – go where the votes are! Only two per cent of Reform voters say that they would be willing to listen to the Labour party again. The ones who used to be Labour have been on a decade’s long journey that started with the Brexit referendum. Voters who have gone Green have just switched but Scotland has shown that a change can become a habit.
To win a game, you need your best playmaker on the field. After two years in government Labour needs a Cabinet member who is listened to when he speaks. In pubs, at football matches, when he is spotted Andy Burnham is asked for selfies by fans. That is the regular expression of the fact he has positive approval ratings.
Time to bring Andy back. Now!" [Post edited 13 May 8:30]
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A tacit and managed procedure to see if the majority of the party wanted Burnham (and that being a Burnham who demonstrated a willingness to lead through a set of policies that would become the manifesto for the next election) would be the most constructive change of leader our state has seen since the Glorious Revolution of 1688. |  |
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| Starmer & political instability on 12:40 - May 13 with 129 views | J2BLUE |
| Starmer & political instability on 08:56 - May 13 by baxterbasics |
Prime minister at the next election by baxterbasics 13 May 8:54My opinion, - again, as no fan of Starmer - I think it would be better for the country if his MPs (and also the media) pipe down and let him get on with it. There's no obvious successor waiting in the wings (no quick route for Burnham) and all this speculation and infighting and instability at the top is not helpful. We need a period of stable boring governance, even if that means he's little more than a caretaker PM. We've had this nonsense from both sides pretty much since Cameron resigned. Stop deposing leaders mid-cycle.
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This. I am becoming increasingly convinced that Reform are going to be the next government. The PM job for the two main parties is almost an impossible task these days with multiple factions. The Greens and Reform at least have a united front. Labour should have planned behind the scenes for Burnham to replace Starmer 12-18 months before the next election.
Our political system is so broken. It's purely party first politics from every single party these days. As soon as another PM comes in there will be plotting against them.
As for Streeting, he seems like another Jenrick to me. Not with ideology but being another bland uncharismatic man who isn't going to inspire anyone. As sad as it is, it's probably personality that counts more than policies in the battle with Farage.
Time for people to start preparing for a Reform government and taking any measures necessary to protect themselves. |  | | |
| Starmer & political instability on 12:42 - May 13 with 114 views | DJR |
| Starmer & political instability on 12:40 - May 13 by J2BLUE |
This. I am becoming increasingly convinced that Reform are going to be the next government. The PM job for the two main parties is almost an impossible task these days with multiple factions. The Greens and Reform at least have a united front. Labour should have planned behind the scenes for Burnham to replace Starmer 12-18 months before the next election.
Our political system is so broken. It's purely party first politics from every single party these days. As soon as another PM comes in there will be plotting against them.
As for Streeting, he seems like another Jenrick to me. Not with ideology but being another bland uncharismatic man who isn't going to inspire anyone. As sad as it is, it's probably personality that counts more than policies in the battle with Farage.
Time for people to start preparing for a Reform government and taking any measures necessary to protect themselves. |
I certainly agree that Streeting is not the answer not least because he is so tied up with the current direction of the party. And he is yet another London MP which ain't going to cut it in the north.
I also fear like you that we are sleepwalking into a Reform government. [Post edited 13 May 12:43]
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| Starmer & political instability on 13:47 - May 13 with 61 views | leitrimblue |
| Starmer & political instability on 12:42 - May 13 by DJR |
I certainly agree that Streeting is not the answer not least because he is so tied up with the current direction of the party. And he is yet another London MP which ain't going to cut it in the north.
I also fear like you that we are sleepwalking into a Reform government. [Post edited 13 May 12:43]
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I'd suggest we've been slowly sleepwalking into a Reform government from before Reform was even formed. The failure of both the 2 main parties to understand, represent or even be able to relate to large swathes of the UK as left an enormous vacuum that Nig as filled.
Don't get me wrong, public schoolboy banker Nig couldn't give a toss if these people live or die. But he as managed to convince many of them that he understands and is willing to represent them. Something the big 2 parties have chose not to do [Post edited 13 May 13:54]
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