| This FB post is absolutely spot on IMO 19:26 - Feb 1 with 1905 views | ArnieM |
Regarding the transfer window, I honestly wonder how some people think it works?
I've seen posts blaming Mick for us not getting players in. Not quite sure how that is the case? Don't get me wrong, he's been at fault for a lot this season, but we can't blame him for players not being brought in.
Do we think he actually phones round other teams asking about players and offering money for them? It's not the 50's and 60's anymore. The days when a manager would deal with contracts and signing players doesn't exist today.
From the interviews I've seen over the past year or so where Mick has been asked about it, I've sort of managed to put together a picture of how it works, and I think it goes something like this;
Mick identifies areas of the squad that need strengthening, and puts together a list of targets based on what he, his coaches and his scouts have seen. He'll have chosen them based on the belief that they can do a job, and that they're realistic targets for the club.
This list is then handed to Milne, who, in conjunction with Evans, is in charge of the money. It's then Milne's job to look at the list and contact the players clubs to make an inquiry.
While this negotiation is going on at boardroom level Mick is taking care of his own responsibilities, such as scouting opposition, taking training, dealing with injured players, and generally being a football manager.
He'll contact Milne to see what's happening regularly, probably being told that "bids are in" and it's a process. That's why Mick's answer to the media asking him about possible signings is usually "as far as I'm aware there are bids in for players"
There'll be a general consensus as to how much a player is worth, but at this stage everyone and their granny knows that the transfer market in England is insane, and that players rarely sell for what they're worth. You either pay it, or you don't get the player you want.
When Milne is told that the player Mick wants will cost X amount it is then down to him and Evans to make a decision. Do they pay the money to get the player that their manager has identified? Or do they say "no thanks" and go elsewhere?
While this is going on other clubs are buying and selling players as well, meaning the market is ever changing.
My guess is that more often than not Evans and and Milne's reaction is to say "no thanks" and look elsewhere, probably with the help of a small group of players agents that they work with and rely on (general rule of thumb is that managers dislike agents, whilst many are actually on good terms with owners and chairmen, receiving tidy kickbacks for identifying talent for them) to get them players that may vaguely fit the bill for what their manager originally asked for.
Mick asked for player X, but is told that the club couldn't get him, and instead is told to give player Y a shot, he comes highly recommended by so and so etc.
This will be why, if you listen to Micks interviews last night, today and this week his answers to questions about what any of the new guys can bring to the team will be pretty generic. Answers like "solid player at this level", "got a decent amount of games under his belt" and "has been around long enough to know..." will be the order of the day. Nothing really specific.
He answers in this way because these aren't the players he identified and that his scouts told him about.
I mean seriously, we've brought in a full back that Mick is on record as having said wasn't good enough when he was on trial here not that long ago! Why would Mick actively want that player?
The recent debacle over Chamber's situation tells us that Mick has virtually zero say in contract negotiations either. We all know what he thinks of Chambers. Fans may not like him, but he's Mick's man in the dressing room, the captain, the first name on the team sheet.
The very fact that the club said on social media last night that Chambers wasn't sold to Forest not because the manager didn't want to sell, but because there wasn't enough time left to get the deal done speaks volumes.
Then Mick answered a question about Chambers contract being up in the summer by saying he "doesn't know" what's going to happen with regards to him being extended another year.
Open your eyes folks, the lack of quality signings, the bringing in of £10,000 non league players and guys who failed trials here previously aren't the result of the choices made by a manager who's been operating for twenty odd years at the top of the English game.
These are choices being made by people further up the chain of command who probably know a fair bit less about football than Mick does.
And for those who say "well, why doesn't Mick just walk then?" I'd ask if you'd walk away from a severance payment from your job? Would you waive a payment you're due under the terms of your contract?
I wouldn't.
This whole thing stinks in my opinion. And the stench is coming from the sh*t that is rolling downhill, not from the managers office.
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| This FB post is absolutely spot on IMO on 19:33 - Feb 1 with 1835 views | ElderGrizzly |
Simply the Facebook post is factually wrong on a number of the points and makes a number of claims which have been disproven in articles on here by Phil.
Every single player brought in or out is at the direction of Mick and Dave Bowman. Simple as that. Not a single one crosses the line wothout his say so. Phil will confirm this too.
Mick has tremendous influence here and does influence values offered both for wages and fees. He's admitted it before, as has Evans. He has too much influence and our boardroom has very little football knowledge, so it's all on Mick and Dave
Evans then does need to decide, with the manager and DoF, if we are going beyond the reasonable values previously given and that is where it falls down right now.
On contracts it's wrong too. Mick again decides who he wants to keep and then Evans takes that on. However, Chambers wanted to leave.
This problem comes from Evans stalling on a contract until the manager situation is known. That's his own doing and he should either back or sack him. Indecision is destroying us
Fault on both sides, but this window just proves Evans is no longer prepared to back Mick in the bigger deals and will see him leave in the summer
Out of interest, can you link to the original FB post? [Post edited 1 Feb 2017 19:43]
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| This FB post is absolutely spot on IMO on 19:33 - Feb 1 with 1827 views | J2BLUE |
That's news is it? I think that is the general consensus rather than some sort of enlightening eye opener.
Edit: I mean MM identifying players and the higher ups deciding the financial side. [Post edited 1 Feb 2017 19:36]
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| This FB post is absolutely spot on IMO on 19:36 - Feb 1 with 1797 views | Marshalls_Mullet |
Its a joint effort.
Doing the deals should be done above Micks head, but one attribute of a manager should be contacts within the game who Mick can speak to about who they might sell / release.
Of course hes not solely held to blame for the transfer window, but he shoulders some of the blame. |  |
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| This FB post is absolutely spot on IMO on 19:47 - Feb 1 with 1716 views | ElderGrizzly |
| This FB post is absolutely spot on IMO on 19:33 - Feb 1 by J2BLUE |
That's news is it? I think that is the general consensus rather than some sort of enlightening eye opener.
Edit: I mean MM identifying players and the higher ups deciding the financial side. [Post edited 1 Feb 2017 19:36]
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It's also wrong in a lot of places, so is quite an eye opener.
The fact it's a Facebook post should be the health warning anyone needs. Making news commenters look like Stephen Hawking in terms of intellect [Post edited 1 Feb 2017 19:48]
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| This FB post is absolutely spot on IMO on 23:10 - Feb 1 with 1402 views | GiveusaWave |
Very well written post but has quite a few factual errors in it, mainly pertaining to how much Mick is involved in the transfer process. |  |
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| This FB post is absolutely spot on IMO on 23:20 - Feb 1 with 1359 views | StNeotsBlue |
| This FB post is absolutely spot on IMO on 19:47 - Feb 1 by ElderGrizzly |
It's also wrong in a lot of places, so is quite an eye opener.
The fact it's a Facebook post should be the health warning anyone needs. Making news commenters look like Stephen Hawking in terms of intellect [Post edited 1 Feb 2017 19:48]
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Was the twitter comment from the club's account about the Chambers deal running out of time accurate or had the guy who does that sort of thing gone off message? |  | | |
| This FB post is absolutely spot on IMO on 08:38 - Feb 2 with 1110 views | chislehurstblue |
| This FB post is absolutely spot on IMO on 19:47 - Feb 1 by ElderGrizzly |
It's also wrong in a lot of places, so is quite an eye opener.
The fact it's a Facebook post should be the health warning anyone needs. Making news commenters look like Stephen Hawking in terms of intellect [Post edited 1 Feb 2017 19:48]
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You kept telling everyone that this happens and that happens, but how do you know? Are you ME? You constantly seem to look to Phil to back you up.
From what I hear from the people in the "know" at the club is that ME just doesnt want to spend money and the general fear is because MM does a decent enough job on no budget should he leave we wont be as lucky with a new manager that cant get the best out of a very cheap, generally poor group of players. |  | | |
| This FB post is absolutely spot on IMO on 08:39 - Feb 2 with 1110 views | GiveusaWave |
| This FB post is absolutely spot on IMO on 23:20 - Feb 1 by StNeotsBlue |
Was the twitter comment from the club's account about the Chambers deal running out of time accurate or had the guy who does that sort of thing gone off message? |
ArnieM
Is there a link somewhere to this message? | |
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| This FB post is absolutely spot on IMO on 08:46 - Feb 2 with 1066 views | ArnieM |
| This FB post is absolutely spot on IMO on 08:39 - Feb 2 by GiveusaWave |
ArnieM
Is there a link somewhere to this message? |
Really sorry guys , Ive tried to find this post again and havent been able too as yet. Its under one of the Ipswich Town fans group posts. You cant miss if yiou get the right thread , cos the post is long !! | |
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| This FB post is absolutely spot on IMO on 08:57 - Feb 2 with 1037 views | No9 |
I don't think that is half the story.
What really looks to be a problem is that players come in, look godd for the first few weeks then fade.
e.g Ward came in got a hat-trick in his first game looked to be the new messiah than flopped so only has scoed 5 to date. Similar story with Webster, looked the dog's at first but since the end of November he really hasn't been worth his place & that is only 2 |  | | |
| This FB post is absolutely spot on IMO on 09:18 - Feb 2 with 984 views | itfcjoe |
| This FB post is absolutely spot on IMO on 08:38 - Feb 2 by chislehurstblue |
You kept telling everyone that this happens and that happens, but how do you know? Are you ME? You constantly seem to look to Phil to back you up.
From what I hear from the people in the "know" at the club is that ME just doesnt want to spend money and the general fear is because MM does a decent enough job on no budget should he leave we wont be as lucky with a new manager that cant get the best out of a very cheap, generally poor group of players. |
Agree with this - Mick is being hung out to dry by a spending policy - whereas most fans seem to think Mick is 80% to blame for the failure this year and Evans 20% - I'd say it is the total opposite.
Mick is the only manager who has made Evans shambles of an ownership look half decent at any point |  |
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