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Such a horrible story with lots of confusing unknowns. Something that always makes me feel incredibly uncomfortable about this is the picture of the back of one of the girls' head. It's all very unnerving.
"Never argue with an idiot. They will drag you down to their level and beat you with experience."
I dread to think what those girls went through on 22:15 - Jun 5 by MerseyBlue
Such a horrible story with lots of confusing unknowns. Something that always makes me feel incredibly uncomfortable about this is the picture of the back of one of the girls' head. It's all very unnerving.
Yes, it all seems very sinister when the evidence is put together. They certainly didn't drown while taking a dip to cool off, as was the official finding.
Awful and a strange story indeed, if there was foul play why were multiple calls made made to emergency services over a span of days ? Also all belongings were found.
However the finding of the bag and the remains would indicate other parties, the photos are certainly chilling and the one deleted photo leaves a lot of questions.
I dread to think what those girls went through on 11:35 - Jun 6 by Lord_Lucan
I have never heard of this case, is it a well known incident outside of Holland?
Is the video a full sort of story? My mrs likes to watch real life mystery murder things - from an interest point of view and not a gory thing.
Not sure how to ask this without it sounding a bit crass - but is it worth a watch?
Yes it is. I've just watched it.
My only caveat is that the guy doing it looks and sound like he spends too much time stumbling around haunted buildings and reading copies of the Fortean Times.
I dread to think what those girls went through on 11:35 - Jun 6 by Lord_Lucan
I have never heard of this case, is it a well known incident outside of Holland?
Is the video a full sort of story? My mrs likes to watch real life mystery murder things - from an interest point of view and not a gory thing.
Not sure how to ask this without it sounding a bit crass - but is it worth a watch?
Not really. There’s no evidence of foul play.
It’s likely that one of the girls had an accident and died sometime after it, and the other struggled on and eventually died too. (The attempted emergency calls and wrong phone password indicate this).
Horrible to think that one of them was probably lost on her own for over a week after her friend had already died, but there’s no real mystery to this case.
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I dread to think what those girls went through on 13:11 - Jun 6 with 2782 views
I dread to think what those girls went through on 11:27 - Jun 6 by Blue_Order
The most likely scenario is also the most boring; they got lost in the jungle and starved/succumbed to the elements.
The night time photos are taken by the last surviving girl trying to get the attention of the search party with the camera flash, in my opinion.
My daughter loves true crime and mysteries and had told me about this case. She's only 13 .... Cheerful huh!
In a different video on YouTube a detective asks if they just got lost why they didn't use the phone to leave a video/film/message to be found to let their families know what had happened? They were intelligent girls and when things seemed hopeless would have made sense. The fact they didn't and the missing photo would indicate foul play I reckon.
I dread to think what those girls went through on 13:08 - Jun 6 by Blue_Order
Not really. There’s no evidence of foul play.
It’s likely that one of the girls had an accident and died sometime after it, and the other struggled on and eventually died too. (The attempted emergency calls and wrong phone password indicate this).
Horrible to think that one of them was probably lost on her own for over a week after her friend had already died, but there’s no real mystery to this case.
There kind of is, albeit circumstantial. The backpack, skin and the neatly folded shorts alone are good evidence of foul play. She struggled on for days in the buff I suppose?.
I dread to think what those girls went through on 13:08 - Jun 6 by Blue_Order
Not really. There’s no evidence of foul play.
It’s likely that one of the girls had an accident and died sometime after it, and the other struggled on and eventually died too. (The attempted emergency calls and wrong phone password indicate this).
Horrible to think that one of them was probably lost on her own for over a week after her friend had already died, but there’s no real mystery to this case.
There's quite a lot of evidence that suggests something amiss.
A deleted photo, clothes found neatly packaged in backpacks that showed no sign of wear and tear despite being in a jungle for months, a failed attempt to enter phone password, no sign of gnawing on any of the Bones found, injuries not common to the type of accident suggested, the police not being contacted earlier and the guide being left alone in the girls' abode before the police were contacted.
Who knows what went on but there are a lot of strange details that don't add up.
"Never argue with an idiot. They will drag you down to their level and beat you with experience."
I dread to think what those girls went through on 13:11 - Jun 6 by urbanblue
My daughter loves true crime and mysteries and had told me about this case. She's only 13 .... Cheerful huh!
In a different video on YouTube a detective asks if they just got lost why they didn't use the phone to leave a video/film/message to be found to let their families know what had happened? They were intelligent girls and when things seemed hopeless would have made sense. The fact they didn't and the missing photo would indicate foul play I reckon.
It's very eerie and bizarre story.
Perhaps, but I’d imagine the top priority in that situation would be to preserve battery life on the phone. Makes sense to me with the attempted emergency calls at the same(ish) time every day.
If they were abducted/murdered, how would they have continually made those calls? First thing you’d do is take their phones off them to stop that happening?
There’s some weird parts to it all, but an accident/getting stuck or lost seems far more likely to me.
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I dread to think what those girls went through on 13:57 - Jun 6 with 2637 views
I dread to think what those girls went through on 13:32 - Jun 6 by Blue_Order
Perhaps, but I’d imagine the top priority in that situation would be to preserve battery life on the phone. Makes sense to me with the attempted emergency calls at the same(ish) time every day.
If they were abducted/murdered, how would they have continually made those calls? First thing you’d do is take their phones off them to stop that happening?
There’s some weird parts to it all, but an accident/getting stuck or lost seems far more likely to me.
Who deleted the photo? Possibly the police but why? And why would they make up a story about the girls drowning?
I dread to think what those girls went through on 13:18 - Jun 6 by MerseyBlue
There's quite a lot of evidence that suggests something amiss.
A deleted photo, clothes found neatly packaged in backpacks that showed no sign of wear and tear despite being in a jungle for months, a failed attempt to enter phone password, no sign of gnawing on any of the Bones found, injuries not common to the type of accident suggested, the police not being contacted earlier and the guide being left alone in the girls' abode before the police were contacted.
Who knows what went on but there are a lot of strange details that don't add up.
If one girl died first or was unconscious and the other didn’t know the passcode to her phone, that would explain the failed attempts to unlock it?
I think the bag was found and kept by someone else who then put it back once they realised the significance of it. IIRC the lady that found it said it definitely wasn’t there the day before when she was in the same spot.
The deleted photo is a bit of a red herring imo. Why would a killer only delete that one photo and then leave the camera to be found? More likely imo that one of the girls took the photo and deleted it for whatever reason - it showed her in a state she didn’t want her parents to eventually see? Could explain the photo of the back of her head later on, to time stamp her death without showing how badly injured she was?
I agree that some things don’t add up, but they don’t point to murder in my opinion.
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I dread to think what those girls went through on 14:13 - Jun 6 with 2594 views
I dread to think what those girls went through on 13:32 - Jun 6 by Blue_Order
Perhaps, but I’d imagine the top priority in that situation would be to preserve battery life on the phone. Makes sense to me with the attempted emergency calls at the same(ish) time every day.
If they were abducted/murdered, how would they have continually made those calls? First thing you’d do is take their phones off them to stop that happening?
There’s some weird parts to it all, but an accident/getting stuck or lost seems far more likely to me.
One of the ideas the guy in the video put forward was that they may have realised they were being followed and panicked, leading to them running deeper into the jungle and subsequently becoming lost. That's pretty plausible, especially as at least two men knew when and where they were. Where his theory lost something for me was the idea that someone stalked them through the jungle for a week or so without that raising any suspicions.
I suspect the truth of it is probably a combination of events; they realised they were being followed, panicked and pushed deeper into the jungle, became fatigued or possibly sustained injuries before being captured by an individual.
The taxi driver and the guide F don't really seem to have been given a particularly thorough investigation. Whether or not they were guilty of anything they should absolutely have been treated as key suspects.
"Never argue with an idiot. They will drag you down to their level and beat you with experience."
I dread to think what those girls went through on 14:11 - Jun 6 by Blue_Order
If one girl died first or was unconscious and the other didn’t know the passcode to her phone, that would explain the failed attempts to unlock it?
I think the bag was found and kept by someone else who then put it back once they realised the significance of it. IIRC the lady that found it said it definitely wasn’t there the day before when she was in the same spot.
The deleted photo is a bit of a red herring imo. Why would a killer only delete that one photo and then leave the camera to be found? More likely imo that one of the girls took the photo and deleted it for whatever reason - it showed her in a state she didn’t want her parents to eventually see? Could explain the photo of the back of her head later on, to time stamp her death without showing how badly injured she was?
I agree that some things don’t add up, but they don’t point to murder in my opinion.
If one of the girls deleted the photo, it could have been retrieved.
I dread to think what those girls went through on 14:13 - Jun 6 by MerseyBlue
One of the ideas the guy in the video put forward was that they may have realised they were being followed and panicked, leading to them running deeper into the jungle and subsequently becoming lost. That's pretty plausible, especially as at least two men knew when and where they were. Where his theory lost something for me was the idea that someone stalked them through the jungle for a week or so without that raising any suspicions.
I suspect the truth of it is probably a combination of events; they realised they were being followed, panicked and pushed deeper into the jungle, became fatigued or possibly sustained injuries before being captured by an individual.
The taxi driver and the guide F don't really seem to have been given a particularly thorough investigation. Whether or not they were guilty of anything they should absolutely have been treated as key suspects.
That’s plausible yeah, but so is the dog that was with them. It might have run off and they tried to follow it (if someone else’s dog had accompanied me up there, I’d feel a responsibility to make sure I brought it back).
They followed it deeper into the jungle and then one of them fell or whatever and the other was then on her own, lost, and just struggled on for however long she did?
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I dread to think what those girls went through on 14:25 - Jun 6 with 2546 views
I dread to think what those girls went through on 14:15 - Jun 6 by noggin
If one of the girls deleted the photo, it could have been retrieved.
There was a claim that it had to have been deleted via a computer, but I’m not sure that was ever actually proven?
Would any potential murderer have known that also? Them going to the effort of taking it home, hooking it up to a computer, deleting only that one image and then putting it back in the bag and placing it back in the jungle seems far fetched to me.
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I dread to think what those girls went through on 14:48 - Jun 6 with 2512 views
I dread to think what those girls went through on 14:19 - Jun 6 by Blue_Order
That’s plausible yeah, but so is the dog that was with them. It might have run off and they tried to follow it (if someone else’s dog had accompanied me up there, I’d feel a responsibility to make sure I brought it back).
They followed it deeper into the jungle and then one of them fell or whatever and the other was then on her own, lost, and just struggled on for however long she did?
Yeah that's true, we'll never really know what went on but I think it's fair to say that the Panamanian police have at best been negligent and at worst been corrupt. I'd err on the side of negligence myself but who knows.
That certainly sounds plausible as well, I guess my biggest query with the whole thing is about the neatly packed backpack. Someone went to the trouble to neatly fold their underwear up which just seems off to me. I don't know, it's easy to let the mind run wild but some of the small details are just bizarre.
"Never argue with an idiot. They will drag you down to their level and beat you with experience."
I dread to think what those girls went through on 14:25 - Jun 6 by Blue_Order
There was a claim that it had to have been deleted via a computer, but I’m not sure that was ever actually proven?
Would any potential murderer have known that also? Them going to the effort of taking it home, hooking it up to a computer, deleting only that one image and then putting it back in the bag and placing it back in the jungle seems far fetched to me.
Speaking as someone who deals with Images all day every day, most images deleted 'in camera' can be recovered more often than not. However, its not outside the realms of possibility, that it would prove impossible to recover.
The guy in this video is wrong about the camera, returning to #509 if it was deleted in camera too, it would depend on how the camera is set up, we always set our cameras to sequential numbering, with that, even if an image is deleted, it would still follow the next in the sequence so take 509, then delete it, the next image is still 510 not back to 509.
But, and to reference my point from earlier, the backpack, skin and the neatly folded shorts alone are good evidence of foul play, shorts and a backpack turning up in an area that has already been extensively searched, with no trace.
You've suggested that one may have died in a fall and the other continued on, so unless she is a contortionist, taking photos of the back of her own head, whilst wearing no bra and naked from the waist down, there's something odd going on that doesn't fit with 'accident' isn't there?
I dread to think what those girls went through on 14:51 - Jun 6 by Cheltenham_Blue
Speaking as someone who deals with Images all day every day, most images deleted 'in camera' can be recovered more often than not. However, its not outside the realms of possibility, that it would prove impossible to recover.
The guy in this video is wrong about the camera, returning to #509 if it was deleted in camera too, it would depend on how the camera is set up, we always set our cameras to sequential numbering, with that, even if an image is deleted, it would still follow the next in the sequence so take 509, then delete it, the next image is still 510 not back to 509.
But, and to reference my point from earlier, the backpack, skin and the neatly folded shorts alone are good evidence of foul play, shorts and a backpack turning up in an area that has already been extensively searched, with no trace.
You've suggested that one may have died in a fall and the other continued on, so unless she is a contortionist, taking photos of the back of her own head, whilst wearing no bra and naked from the waist down, there's something odd going on that doesn't fit with 'accident' isn't there?
I didn’t say she took a photo of the back of her own head, I said the other girl might have taken it.
The shorts being found ‘neatly folded’ was a rumour which I think was disproved. Even if they were, that doesn’t really say much. I also don’t see anything weird about them taking their bras off in a sweaty jungle. If they were murdered, it’s much less likely they’d have been found untouched in the bag.
Dehydration, head injuries, desperation etc can quickly make people make strange and bad decisions anyway.
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I dread to think what those girls went through on 18:31 - Jun 6 with 2289 views
I dread to think what those girls went through on 16:45 - Jun 6 by Blue_Order
I didn’t say she took a photo of the back of her own head, I said the other girl might have taken it.
The shorts being found ‘neatly folded’ was a rumour which I think was disproved. Even if they were, that doesn’t really say much. I also don’t see anything weird about them taking their bras off in a sweaty jungle. If they were murdered, it’s much less likely they’d have been found untouched in the bag.
Dehydration, head injuries, desperation etc can quickly make people make strange and bad decisions anyway.
"The shorts being found ‘neatly folded’ was a rumour which I think was disproved. "
I dread to think what those girls went through on 18:31 - Jun 6 by noggin
"The shorts being found ‘neatly folded’ was a rumour which I think was disproved. "
When and by who?
“When investigators found Kris’s denim shorts, they were discovered caught in a tree that was partially submerged in a waterfall on the Serpent River. Contrary to a common misconception, the shorts were not found to be folded. They were found caught in a small waterfall, as any other debris would be caught. The official reports stated that the jean shorts had no trace of bodily fluid, nor skin cells of any type. Furthermore, the shorts did have some dirt on them”
I dread to think what those girls went through on 19:28 - Jun 6 by Blue_Order
“When investigators found Kris’s denim shorts, they were discovered caught in a tree that was partially submerged in a waterfall on the Serpent River. Contrary to a common misconception, the shorts were not found to be folded. They were found caught in a small waterfall, as any other debris would be caught. The official reports stated that the jean shorts had no trace of bodily fluid, nor skin cells of any type. Furthermore, the shorts did have some dirt on them”
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