| I don't want to be insensitive 17:23 - Oct 28 with 6081 views | BrixtonBlue |
But why is it taking so long for it to be released as to who was in the Leicester helicopter crash? They must know who got on it and if anyone survived, surely? Victims of other disasters are usually named a lot quicker than this, aren't they? Must be awful for the Leicester supporters still not knowing. |  |
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| I don't want to be insensitive on 18:16 - Oct 28 with 1529 views | BrixtonBlue |
| I don't want to be insensitive on 17:37 - Oct 28 by J2BLUE |
Hasn't it been virtually confirmed that only their owner was on board from the club?
The question seems to be who from his family was there with the owner. They know his son wasn't. |
A source has told the BBC the owner was on it. That's it. A long way from a confirmation, nothing about anyone else. We're not far short of 24 hours later, so I'm amazed we still have no definite confirmation of anything. | |
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| I don't want to be insensitive on 18:18 - Oct 28 with 1524 views | BrixtonBlue |
| I don't want to be insensitive on 17:43 - Oct 28 by agentp |
Whoever was aboard that helicopter wouldn't have been recorded in any official capacity. I would imagine they want to be certain and the numbers of passengers are sketchy; consider someone may have arrived on it also.
[Post edited 28 Oct 2018 17:44]
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I'm surprised that even though it's a private flight it doesn't have official records, but could be an explanation for the delay. | |
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| I don't want to be insensitive on 18:18 - Oct 28 with 1523 views | ElderGrizzly |
| I don't want to be insensitive on 18:13 - Oct 28 by BrixtonBlue |
Perhaps. |
No perhaps about it. They need formal identification and his son left on a private jet last night from Thailand to do just that.
It’s a private issue, not a public one hence the delay. |  | | |
| I don't want to be insensitive on 18:20 - Oct 28 with 1511 views | ElderGrizzly |
| I don't want to be insensitive on 18:18 - Oct 28 by BrixtonBlue |
I'm surprised that even though it's a private flight it doesn't have official records, but could be an explanation for the delay. |
It does have official records. Every flight that uses UK airspace is recorded | | | |
| I don't want to be insensitive on 18:20 - Oct 28 with 1506 views | agentp |
| I don't want to be insensitive on 18:18 - Oct 28 by BrixtonBlue |
I'm surprised that even though it's a private flight it doesn't have official records, but could be an explanation for the delay. |
There is usually a log but it's not official; certainly not to speculate. It could have had a student pilot tagging along, another family member or a young lad from the airport being rewarded for cleaning it. |  |
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| I don't want to be insensitive on 18:21 - Oct 28 with 1497 views | BrixtonBlue |
| I don't want to be insensitive on 18:20 - Oct 28 by ElderGrizzly |
It does have official records. Every flight that uses UK airspace is recorded |
Yeah, like I say, I thought they would. | |
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| I don't want to be insensitive on 18:23 - Oct 28 with 1489 views | agentp |
| I don't want to be insensitive on 18:20 - Oct 28 by ElderGrizzly |
It does have official records. Every flight that uses UK airspace is recorded |
Correct in a way, but not as straight forward as you are suggesting. | |
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| I don't want to be insensitive on 18:25 - Oct 28 with 1478 views | BrixtonBlue |
| I don't want to be insensitive on 18:18 - Oct 28 by ElderGrizzly |
No perhaps about it. They need formal identification and his son left on a private jet last night from Thailand to do just that.
It’s a private issue, not a public one hence the delay. |
I've not heard that anywhere and I've been following things closely on all the news channels. Where did you hear that?
I'm sorry, but it's not strictly a private issue is it? Any other air crash and details of victims are released much quicker than this usually. | |
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| I don't want to be insensitive on 18:26 - Oct 28 with 1487 views | factual_blue |
Without being too ghoulish, I would imagine this is a dental records-based identification. It's possible at least some of those records have to come from Thailand. |  |
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| I don't want to be insensitive on 18:30 - Oct 28 with 1459 views | BrixtonBlue |
| I don't want to be insensitive on 18:26 - Oct 28 by factual_blue |
Without being too ghoulish, I would imagine this is a dental records-based identification. It's possible at least some of those records have to come from Thailand. |
Yes possibly... but I still feel there would be records of who was on board and plenty of eye-witnesses as to who got on, before we get to dental records. | |
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| I don't want to be insensitive on 18:31 - Oct 28 with 1454 views | ElderGrizzly |
| I don't want to be insensitive on 18:25 - Oct 28 by BrixtonBlue |
I've not heard that anywhere and I've been following things closely on all the news channels. Where did you hear that?
I'm sorry, but it's not strictly a private issue is it? Any other air crash and details of victims are released much quicker than this usually. |
Details aren’t released until the investigating authorities say so. That includes Police, Air Accident Investigation Branch etc.
If your relatives were killed in a car crash, would you like to find out in the newspaper/internet or to have official confirmation? There are processes that need to be followed and simply can’t be sped up because the media demand it.
Air crashes are more complex as more agencies involved. Even ‘big’ air crashes, there is never official confirmation until a long while later. Names are released to the media through agreement with the familes if nothing can be identified for example. | | | |
| I don't want to be insensitive on 18:32 - Oct 28 with 1451 views | J2BLUE |
| I don't want to be insensitive on 18:16 - Oct 28 by BrixtonBlue |
A source has told the BBC the owner was on it. That's it. A long way from a confirmation, nothing about anyone else. We're not far short of 24 hours later, so I'm amazed we still have no definite confirmation of anything. |
Sky were saying the owner's son and Rudkin weren't on board from early last night. Seems generally accepted.
BT Sport were filming the helicopter as it took off. They know exactly who was on there and are just going through whatever the process is for something this horrific. |  |
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| I don't want to be insensitive on 18:33 - Oct 28 with 1449 views | factual_blue |
| I don't want to be insensitive on 18:30 - Oct 28 by BrixtonBlue |
Yes possibly... but I still feel there would be records of who was on board and plenty of eye-witnesses as to who got on, before we get to dental records. |
There will have to be formal identification of the remains. Documents in wallets, or names on lists aren't deemed proof of identity, certainly in the case of death.
I speak from the personal experience of having to formally identify my father's dead body when I was seventeen. | |
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| I don't want to be insensitive on 18:33 - Oct 28 with 1449 views | ElderGrizzly |
| I don't want to be insensitive on 18:30 - Oct 28 by BrixtonBlue |
Yes possibly... but I still feel there would be records of who was on board and plenty of eye-witnesses as to who got on, before we get to dental records. |
Yes, but it is still ‘unofficial’. You simply can’t jump to conclusions in things like this, even when that conclusion is 99.9% certain.
It was reported in the Thai news yesterday evening his Son was on his way over to help in the process. | | | |
| I don't want to be insensitive on 18:34 - Oct 28 with 1445 views | factual_blue |
| I don't want to be insensitive on 18:20 - Oct 28 by ElderGrizzly |
It does have official records. Every flight that uses UK airspace is recorded |
Even if it's a flying car? | |
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| I don't want to be insensitive on 18:36 - Oct 28 with 1440 views | agentp |
| I don't want to be insensitive on 18:30 - Oct 28 by BrixtonBlue |
Yes possibly... but I still feel there would be records of who was on board and plenty of eye-witnesses as to who got on, before we get to dental records. |
The flight plan would be filed (official) but the way the flight is conducted will define what info is available and when.
The authorities will not reveal details off death without being absolutely certain. | |
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| I don't want to be insensitive on 18:40 - Oct 28 with 1429 views | BrixtonBlue |
| I don't want to be insensitive on 18:31 - Oct 28 by ElderGrizzly |
Details aren’t released until the investigating authorities say so. That includes Police, Air Accident Investigation Branch etc.
If your relatives were killed in a car crash, would you like to find out in the newspaper/internet or to have official confirmation? There are processes that need to be followed and simply can’t be sped up because the media demand it.
Air crashes are more complex as more agencies involved. Even ‘big’ air crashes, there is never official confirmation until a long while later. Names are released to the media through agreement with the familes if nothing can be identified for example. |
"If your relatives were killed in a car crash, would you like to find out in the newspaper/internet or to have official confirmation?"
Bit of a silly question to be honest.
I'm also not talking about the emotive "media demanding" as you word it. I'm talking about Leicester supporters wanting to know what's happened to their owner.
You and others are probably right, however. The delay is probably due to formal identification processes/informing families etc. or something along those lines. Awful situation whoever the victims are of course. I'd imagine no survivors or we'd have heard about that, at least, by now. | |
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| I don't want to be insensitive on 18:41 - Oct 28 with 1424 views | BrixtonBlue |
| I don't want to be insensitive on 18:32 - Oct 28 by J2BLUE |
Sky were saying the owner's son and Rudkin weren't on board from early last night. Seems generally accepted.
BT Sport were filming the helicopter as it took off. They know exactly who was on there and are just going through whatever the process is for something this horrific. |
Yes I know the first bit - but that's confirming who wasn't on it not who was. | |
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| I don't want to be insensitive on 18:43 - Oct 28 with 1419 views | BrixtonBlue |
| I don't want to be insensitive on 18:33 - Oct 28 by factual_blue |
There will have to be formal identification of the remains. Documents in wallets, or names on lists aren't deemed proof of identity, certainly in the case of death.
I speak from the personal experience of having to formally identify my father's dead body when I was seventeen. |
Blimey, that's horrible Facters. Sorry to hear that. | |
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| I don't want to be insensitive on 18:46 - Oct 28 with 1404 views | ElderGrizzly |
| I don't want to be insensitive on 18:40 - Oct 28 by BrixtonBlue |
"If your relatives were killed in a car crash, would you like to find out in the newspaper/internet or to have official confirmation?"
Bit of a silly question to be honest.
I'm also not talking about the emotive "media demanding" as you word it. I'm talking about Leicester supporters wanting to know what's happened to their owner.
You and others are probably right, however. The delay is probably due to formal identification processes/informing families etc. or something along those lines. Awful situation whoever the victims are of course. I'd imagine no survivors or we'd have heard about that, at least, by now. |
Not really a silly question, as the very same thing applies here. A family, in fact a number of families (pilots etc) wants certainty and authorities will want that before confirming anything.
Sometimes a family will come out ahead of the authorities official announcement and confirm things. You see that a lot with bigger air crashes for example.
The fact some football fans want to know is neither here nor there. They really won’t be the priority of anyone.
Everything points to no survivors, the images this morning of the tarpaulin over a certain part of the helicopter as good as confirms it. Plus there are no reports of local hospitals receiving casualties last night. | | | |
| I don't want to be insensitive on 18:48 - Oct 28 with 1392 views | agentp |
| I don't want to be insensitive on 18:33 - Oct 28 by ElderGrizzly |
Yes, but it is still ‘unofficial’. You simply can’t jump to conclusions in things like this, even when that conclusion is 99.9% certain.
It was reported in the Thai news yesterday evening his Son was on his way over to help in the process. |
Agree. It would though depend on the regulations that the flight is conducted under. If this was deemed a commercial flight then everyone would be logged.
If it was filed as a private flight just the number of persons would be notified, this is usually done over the radio and sometimes after take-off. There was much after take-off time here to be honest.
Contracted pilots are also often bullied into breaking some practices; not saying that happened here. | |
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| I don't want to be insensitive on 18:48 - Oct 28 with 1392 views | J2BLUE |
| I don't want to be insensitive on 18:41 - Oct 28 by BrixtonBlue |
Yes I know the first bit - but that's confirming who wasn't on it not who was. |
Yes but the point I was originally making is that it doesn't seem to be anyone else from the club but rather the owner's family if anyone. We've heard there were 8, then 3, then 5. Hopefully no one knows and it will end up being 3 as that seems to be the minimum possibility with two crew. | |
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| I don't want to be insensitive on 18:54 - Oct 28 with 1365 views | BrixtonBlue |
| I don't want to be insensitive on 18:46 - Oct 28 by ElderGrizzly |
Not really a silly question, as the very same thing applies here. A family, in fact a number of families (pilots etc) wants certainty and authorities will want that before confirming anything.
Sometimes a family will come out ahead of the authorities official announcement and confirm things. You see that a lot with bigger air crashes for example.
The fact some football fans want to know is neither here nor there. They really won’t be the priority of anyone.
Everything points to no survivors, the images this morning of the tarpaulin over a certain part of the helicopter as good as confirms it. Plus there are no reports of local hospitals receiving casualties last night. |
I meant it was silly to ask which I'd prefer. It's obvious I wouldn't want to find out about a relative dying through a newspaper. But all the relatives must know by now, surely?
Anyway, we'll leave it there. Just seems to me to be taking a lot longer than usual with these sorts of things. Like the company the pilot works for, for example, I'd have thought would've made some sort of statement about the loss of their colleague and friend by now as often is the case. | |
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| I don't want to be insensitive on 18:57 - Oct 28 with 1357 views | BrixtonBlue |
| I don't want to be insensitive on 18:48 - Oct 28 by J2BLUE |
Yes but the point I was originally making is that it doesn't seem to be anyone else from the club but rather the owner's family if anyone. We've heard there were 8, then 3, then 5. Hopefully no one knows and it will end up being 3 as that seems to be the minimum possibility with two crew. |
Indeed.
In a way it's lucky, and perhaps heroics by the pilot, that the helicopter didn't crash into people on the ground in such a busy location. | |
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