| Bartosz... 21:40 - Jul 14 with 3981 views | portmanking |
I know it's important not to read too much into these games but... Bart's still clearly lost his confidence. Friendly or not, that error was car crash stuff. I don't know whether his head is all over the place re. Millwall or he's just not the keeper he was. On current showing, high wage or not, we should be giving Holy a fair crack of the whip. |  | | |  |
| Bartosz... on 22:07 - Jul 14 with 3499 views | ArnieM |
I don’t think Bart is going to deal with real competition for the #1 shirt. I think Holy will be our # 1 once he gets his feet at the Club.
I know Bart is many people’s fav, and in his first season here is was outstanding , but I’ve always said that if you take away his reflex keeping out of his game, the rest of his goal keeping attributes are bang average . He’s a flapper and for me always has been. Many Town fans appear to hold him on a pedestal . Yes he won 3 POTY awards , big in truth after his first season here when was rightfully crowned POTY, I feel he prospered from the “ halo effect” by fans. For me Lawrence should have been POTY the 2nd and Waghorn the 3rd year.
I’m not intending to slight Bart , but merely state again what I’ve always maintained , that for some reason some sections of Town fans believe him to be far better than he really is. The simple truth is, no serious advances for Bart by better Clubs has occurred. If he really was as good as some Town fans believe he would have been gone long before now. There is no coincidence that he is still here. Problem is Town have given him a ridiculous deal , which we now can’t afford. |  |
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| Bartosz... on 23:08 - Jul 14 with 3325 views | itfcbam |
| Bartosz... on 22:07 - Jul 14 by ArnieM |
I don’t think Bart is going to deal with real competition for the #1 shirt. I think Holy will be our # 1 once he gets his feet at the Club.
I know Bart is many people’s fav, and in his first season here is was outstanding , but I’ve always said that if you take away his reflex keeping out of his game, the rest of his goal keeping attributes are bang average . He’s a flapper and for me always has been. Many Town fans appear to hold him on a pedestal . Yes he won 3 POTY awards , big in truth after his first season here when was rightfully crowned POTY, I feel he prospered from the “ halo effect” by fans. For me Lawrence should have been POTY the 2nd and Waghorn the 3rd year.
I’m not intending to slight Bart , but merely state again what I’ve always maintained , that for some reason some sections of Town fans believe him to be far better than he really is. The simple truth is, no serious advances for Bart by better Clubs has occurred. If he really was as good as some Town fans believe he would have been gone long before now. There is no coincidence that he is still here. Problem is Town have given him a ridiculous deal , which we now can’t afford. |
Absolutely bang on. Have said this a long time that we have an overinflated opinion of him that isn't necessarily matched away from the club. He is a good instinctive / reactive keeper, but his decision making is suspect at best, thus he makes mistakes (and it's not just last season). | | | |
| Bartosz... on 23:25 - Jul 14 with 3266 views | StNeotsBlue |
| Bartosz... on 22:07 - Jul 14 by ArnieM |
I don’t think Bart is going to deal with real competition for the #1 shirt. I think Holy will be our # 1 once he gets his feet at the Club.
I know Bart is many people’s fav, and in his first season here is was outstanding , but I’ve always said that if you take away his reflex keeping out of his game, the rest of his goal keeping attributes are bang average . He’s a flapper and for me always has been. Many Town fans appear to hold him on a pedestal . Yes he won 3 POTY awards , big in truth after his first season here when was rightfully crowned POTY, I feel he prospered from the “ halo effect” by fans. For me Lawrence should have been POTY the 2nd and Waghorn the 3rd year.
I’m not intending to slight Bart , but merely state again what I’ve always maintained , that for some reason some sections of Town fans believe him to be far better than he really is. The simple truth is, no serious advances for Bart by better Clubs has occurred. If he really was as good as some Town fans believe he would have been gone long before now. There is no coincidence that he is still here. Problem is Town have given him a ridiculous deal , which we now can’t afford. |
And I thought I was pissed. F@ckabout what a load of nonsense. |  | | |
| Bartosz... on 23:39 - Jul 14 with 3228 views | Vaughan8 |
"I've always said" & "I've said for a long time" that Bart is cr@p? Weren't saying it a couple of years ago.......or you were blind. Single handedly kept us in or won us games.
What are these people on about?
He won 3 POTY's in a row. And clearly was our best player.
He's gone of the boil recently yes. | | | |
| Bartosz... on 00:00 - Jul 15 with 3184 views | unstableblue |
I wrote a more emotive post on this topic.
We love Bart because he played so well for so long for Town. But he has to eradicate the errors, and soon. Other clubs fans would not be so patient with their highest wage player.
Come on BART! |  |
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| Bartosz... on 01:42 - Jul 15 with 3093 views | horsehollerer |
The difference in the composure of our defence between the first and second games today was like night and day. We went from calamitous to commanding.
I get that it's an unfair comparison... the games and the personnel were completely different, and clearly F95 are streets ahead of Meppen (and us) in terms of quality and threat.
But it felt like Bart's jitters were spreading to the back 4. Holy had very little to do against Meppen but you always felt he was in control. The one difficult cross they fired in, he landed a strong punch. Everything else he grabbed with ease. His distribution was decent too. I don't remember a single moment of panic or hesitation at the back.
We all love Bart and he was a sensational shot-stopper for 3 years straight. His acrobatics probably kept us up for at least one of those seasons. But I have lost all confidence in him and now every time he plays I expect him to cost us a goal. It's been happening regularly for the past year and it keeps happening.
With the quality we have in our squad, we don't really need a spectacular shot stopper to get out of league 1. Much more important IMO to have a consistent, reliable presence who commands his area, takes care of the basics flap-free, and can kick the ball to a blue shirt without it turning into an adventure (or a throw-in). All of these things affect the confidence and composure of the back 4, regardless of who's in our team or who we are playing against. |  |
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| Bartosz... on 07:40 - Jul 15 with 2872 views | christiand |
| Bartosz... on 22:07 - Jul 14 by ArnieM |
I don’t think Bart is going to deal with real competition for the #1 shirt. I think Holy will be our # 1 once he gets his feet at the Club.
I know Bart is many people’s fav, and in his first season here is was outstanding , but I’ve always said that if you take away his reflex keeping out of his game, the rest of his goal keeping attributes are bang average . He’s a flapper and for me always has been. Many Town fans appear to hold him on a pedestal . Yes he won 3 POTY awards , big in truth after his first season here when was rightfully crowned POTY, I feel he prospered from the “ halo effect” by fans. For me Lawrence should have been POTY the 2nd and Waghorn the 3rd year.
I’m not intending to slight Bart , but merely state again what I’ve always maintained , that for some reason some sections of Town fans believe him to be far better than he really is. The simple truth is, no serious advances for Bart by better Clubs has occurred. If he really was as good as some Town fans believe he would have been gone long before now. There is no coincidence that he is still here. Problem is Town have given him a ridiculous deal , which we now can’t afford. |
The club gave him a deal that he deserved due to his performances, which at times, kept us in games and earned us points to avoid relegation during those campaigns. None of us were complaining at the time, if anything we were relieved he was staying. Yes, last season wasn't his greatest campaign and that will certainly have impacted on his own confidence levels, but to write him off after a handling error in a meaningless game is just bizarre. Give the bloke a fighting chance, it just seems the slightest error he makes is constantly highlighted and we are quick to write him off. You might be surprised, but no keeper is faultless in games even the very top ones they still make mistakes, but they just make less of them. [Post edited 15 Jul 2019 7:43]
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| Bartosz... on 07:46 - Jul 15 with 2847 views | portmanking |
| Bartosz... on 01:42 - Jul 15 by horsehollerer |
The difference in the composure of our defence between the first and second games today was like night and day. We went from calamitous to commanding.
I get that it's an unfair comparison... the games and the personnel were completely different, and clearly F95 are streets ahead of Meppen (and us) in terms of quality and threat.
But it felt like Bart's jitters were spreading to the back 4. Holy had very little to do against Meppen but you always felt he was in control. The one difficult cross they fired in, he landed a strong punch. Everything else he grabbed with ease. His distribution was decent too. I don't remember a single moment of panic or hesitation at the back.
We all love Bart and he was a sensational shot-stopper for 3 years straight. His acrobatics probably kept us up for at least one of those seasons. But I have lost all confidence in him and now every time he plays I expect him to cost us a goal. It's been happening regularly for the past year and it keeps happening.
With the quality we have in our squad, we don't really need a spectacular shot stopper to get out of league 1. Much more important IMO to have a consistent, reliable presence who commands his area, takes care of the basics flap-free, and can kick the ball to a blue shirt without it turning into an adventure (or a throw-in). All of these things affect the confidence and composure of the back 4, regardless of who's in our team or who we are playing against. |
I hear you re. the jitters in defence. That error yesterday was worse than the gaffe he made at Nottingham Forest.
Whether it's a case of taking him out of the firing line and letting him regain his composure out of the limelight, who knows. But I refuse to see why Holy shouldn't be given a chance. Regardless of whether Bart's our top earner, we need consistency and stability in goal this year more than ever. | | | |
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| Bartosz... on 08:05 - Jul 15 with 2770 views | chicoazul |
| Bartosz... on 22:07 - Jul 14 by ArnieM |
I don’t think Bart is going to deal with real competition for the #1 shirt. I think Holy will be our # 1 once he gets his feet at the Club.
I know Bart is many people’s fav, and in his first season here is was outstanding , but I’ve always said that if you take away his reflex keeping out of his game, the rest of his goal keeping attributes are bang average . He’s a flapper and for me always has been. Many Town fans appear to hold him on a pedestal . Yes he won 3 POTY awards , big in truth after his first season here when was rightfully crowned POTY, I feel he prospered from the “ halo effect” by fans. For me Lawrence should have been POTY the 2nd and Waghorn the 3rd year.
I’m not intending to slight Bart , but merely state again what I’ve always maintained , that for some reason some sections of Town fans believe him to be far better than he really is. The simple truth is, no serious advances for Bart by better Clubs has occurred. If he really was as good as some Town fans believe he would have been gone long before now. There is no coincidence that he is still here. Problem is Town have given him a ridiculous deal , which we now can’t afford. |
He literally was at a better club in the division above us a couple of weeks ago for a transfer.
He dealt with plenty of competition from Gerken for his first couple of seasons with us. Given that we have recouped something close to 3m in fees so far and spent none of it, we can afford him for at least another season, and his wages will have dropped same as everyone elses. |  |
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| Bartosz... on 08:09 - Jul 15 with 2753 views | DanTheMan |
| Bartosz... on 08:05 - Jul 15 by chicoazul |
He literally was at a better club in the division above us a couple of weeks ago for a transfer.
He dealt with plenty of competition from Gerken for his first couple of seasons with us. Given that we have recouped something close to 3m in fees so far and spent none of it, we can afford him for at least another season, and his wages will have dropped same as everyone elses. |
Agreed.
We know he has the skill as well. We saw it for 3 years, that's more than just some good form.
It's up to Lambert to get him back playing to his best. |  |
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| Bartosz... on 08:14 - Jul 15 with 2740 views | portmanking |
| Bartosz... on 08:09 - Jul 15 by DanTheMan |
Agreed.
We know he has the skill as well. We saw it for 3 years, that's more than just some good form.
It's up to Lambert to get him back playing to his best. |
I'm just not sure if Bart's face fits with Lambert's style of play though?
If we're wanting someone that's got reliable distribution from both hands and feet and capable of organising/dominating the 6-yard box, Bart's not really your man is he?
Bart's always been someone that's preferred to 'get rid' to halfway than build via the full backs. Furthermore, he acts more in instinct when it comes to organising and saving. Just feel like perhaps it's best for both parties that he moves on. | | | |
| Bartosz... on 08:16 - Jul 15 with 2730 views | DanTheMan |
| Bartosz... on 08:14 - Jul 15 by portmanking |
I'm just not sure if Bart's face fits with Lambert's style of play though?
If we're wanting someone that's got reliable distribution from both hands and feet and capable of organising/dominating the 6-yard box, Bart's not really your man is he?
Bart's always been someone that's preferred to 'get rid' to halfway than build via the full backs. Furthermore, he acts more in instinct when it comes to organising and saving. Just feel like perhaps it's best for both parties that he moves on. |
Unless Holy happens to be that goalkeeper, we're very unlikely to be able to find or afford a someone like that in League One.
He's more than good enough for this league. | |
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| Bartosz... on 08:30 - Jul 15 with 2672 views | chicoazul |
| Bartosz... on 08:14 - Jul 15 by portmanking |
I'm just not sure if Bart's face fits with Lambert's style of play though?
If we're wanting someone that's got reliable distribution from both hands and feet and capable of organising/dominating the 6-yard box, Bart's not really your man is he?
Bart's always been someone that's preferred to 'get rid' to halfway than build via the full backs. Furthermore, he acts more in instinct when it comes to organising and saving. Just feel like perhaps it's best for both parties that he moves on. |
Do you really think it's amazingly hard for a professional footballer to roll the ball out underarm to players 15 yards in front of him? | |
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| Bartosz... on 08:32 - Jul 15 with 2665 views | portmanking |
| Bartosz... on 08:30 - Jul 15 by chicoazul |
Do you really think it's amazingly hard for a professional footballer to roll the ball out underarm to players 15 yards in front of him? |
Do you think Bart's distribution is good then? | | | |
| Bartosz... on 08:34 - Jul 15 with 2663 views | chicoazul |
| Bartosz... on 08:32 - Jul 15 by portmanking |
Do you think Bart's distribution is good then? |
It's fine! No, he isnt bloody Allisson or whoever, but it's perfectly fine. It's really not very hard to roll the ball out to a blue shirt. | |
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| Bartosz... on 08:37 - Jul 15 with 2646 views | portmanking |
| Bartosz... on 08:34 - Jul 15 by chicoazul |
It's fine! No, he isnt bloody Allisson or whoever, but it's perfectly fine. It's really not very hard to roll the ball out to a blue shirt. |
Not asking him to be Allisson. But I'm of the opinion that he DOES make it look difficult to find a blue shirt, more often than not. | | | |
| Bartosz... on 08:40 - Jul 15 with 2637 views | christiand |
| Bartosz... on 08:37 - Jul 15 by portmanking |
Not asking him to be Allisson. But I'm of the opinion that he DOES make it look difficult to find a blue shirt, more often than not. |
It's an aspect of his game that can be worked on. | |
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| Bartosz... on 08:43 - Jul 15 with 2627 views | portmanking |
| Bartosz... on 08:40 - Jul 15 by christiand |
It's an aspect of his game that can be worked on. |
He's 31, nearly 32, he's not going to realistically improve on it now. It's just one of those attributes that he lacks sadly, but the flaw was nowhere near as prominent when we were more direct under Mick.
I like Bart as a guy and as a shot-stopper. His reflexes are top-notch and some of the saves he's pulled off through the years have been other-worldly. However... we have to live in the now and look to the future. | | | |
| Bartosz... on 08:45 - Jul 15 with 2619 views | chicoazul |
| Bartosz... on 08:37 - Jul 15 by portmanking |
Not asking him to be Allisson. But I'm of the opinion that he DOES make it look difficult to find a blue shirt, more often than not. |
If you're hoofing it up to one of our diminutive forwards then yes, we all know he finds the dugout now and then. If he is now being asked to roll it out 10 yards more often than not then I think he'll be fine. | |
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| Bartosz... on 08:48 - Jul 15 with 2608 views | christiand |
| Bartosz... on 08:43 - Jul 15 by portmanking |
He's 31, nearly 32, he's not going to realistically improve on it now. It's just one of those attributes that he lacks sadly, but the flaw was nowhere near as prominent when we were more direct under Mick.
I like Bart as a guy and as a shot-stopper. His reflexes are top-notch and some of the saves he's pulled off through the years have been other-worldly. However... we have to live in the now and look to the future. |
If Holy proves the better option to start the season then so be it, but don't moan when other keepers make mistakes then because they will. It's an occupational hazard playing that position. | |
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| Bartosz... on 08:51 - Jul 15 with 2591 views | portmanking |
| Bartosz... on 08:48 - Jul 15 by christiand |
If Holy proves the better option to start the season then so be it, but don't moan when other keepers make mistakes then because they will. It's an occupational hazard playing that position. |
Oh come on. Bart's made more than his fair share of errors, which is why it's become a topic of debate. We can all excuse keepers of the odd inexplicable gaffe, but it's becoming all too often for Bart which is worrying and sad in equal measure. | | | |
| Bartosz... on 08:53 - Jul 15 with 2590 views | christiand |
That wasn't great, but you could argue that the pitch had a huge play in that. I remember when Tim Flowers bent down to collect a ball against Liverpool (mid 90s I think?!) and it hit a bobble and went over him, doesn't make him a dreadful keeper. These things happen, it's how he responds that's important, especially playing in his position. | |
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| Bartosz... on 08:55 - Jul 15 with 2575 views | christiand |
| Bartosz... on 08:51 - Jul 15 by portmanking |
Oh come on. Bart's made more than his fair share of errors, which is why it's become a topic of debate. We can all excuse keepers of the odd inexplicable gaffe, but it's becoming all too often for Bart which is worrying and sad in equal measure. |
Did he finish the season looking more confident and his old self? | |
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| Bartosz... on 08:57 - Jul 15 with 2565 views | portmanking |
| Bartosz... on 08:55 - Jul 15 by christiand |
Did he finish the season looking more confident and his old self? |
No I don't think so, do you? He hasn't been anywhere near the keeper he was since Webster left. Anyone can see that, surely? | | | |
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