| Forde Report: Anti-Semitism used as 'factional weapon' in Labour party on 06:43 - Jul 20 with 654 views | jayceee |
| Forde Report: Anti-Semitism used as 'factional weapon' in Labour party on 06:08 - Jul 20 by solomon |
What does exist in the uk is blatant racism, unfortunately antisemitism is rife within certain sections of society, the rise of social media platforms has emboldened them immensely. No one should have to endure any form of racism or racial abuse anywhere. |
Whilst I agree that racism / antisemitism is a problem and needs to be tackled wherever it is found, it's wrong to weaponize it as was blatantly obvious under Corbyn's Labour. |  | |  |
| Forde Report: Anti-Semitism used as 'factional weapon' in Labour party on 07:24 - Jul 20 with 610 views | solomon |
| Forde Report: Anti-Semitism used as 'factional weapon' in Labour party on 06:43 - Jul 20 by jayceee |
Whilst I agree that racism / antisemitism is a problem and needs to be tackled wherever it is found, it's wrong to weaponize it as was blatantly obvious under Corbyn's Labour. |
I’m sorry I don’t believe that for one moment , it’s your opinion and some would say you are entitled to it, however this was an issue of discrimination, blatant discrimination which JC (who I don’t believe is an anti-semite) failed to tackle, saying how terrible it was then doing nothing was a statement of indifference. I appreciate for the vast majority of people don’t care about it as it doesn’t affect them but for others this is a very emotive subject, |  | | |
| Forde Report: Anti-Semitism used as 'factional weapon' in Labour party on 07:31 - Jul 20 with 603 views | BanksterDebtSlave |
| Forde Report: Anti-Semitism used as 'factional weapon' in Labour party on 06:08 - Jul 20 by solomon |
What does exist in the uk is blatant racism, unfortunately antisemitism is rife within certain sections of society, the rise of social media platforms has emboldened them immensely. No one should have to endure any form of racism or racial abuse anywhere. |
And a responsible media and political class should not fan the flames of a few virtual voices for political ends in order to rule out a meaningful alternative to the status quo. |  |
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| Forde Report: Anti-Semitism used as 'factional weapon' in Labour party on 07:32 - Jul 20 with 599 views | GlasgowBlue |
| Forde Report: Anti-Semitism used as 'factional weapon' in Labour party on 06:43 - Jul 20 by jayceee |
Whilst I agree that racism / antisemitism is a problem and needs to be tackled wherever it is found, it's wrong to weaponize it as was blatantly obvious under Corbyn's Labour. |
You seem more concerned that the widespread racial prejudice against Jewish members of the Labour party was ‘weaponised’ rather than the actual racial prejudice itself.
Why couldn’t Jewish members just keep quiet, accept being racially abused and discriminated against in order we could all be saved by Saint Jeremy?
And what the hell does “weaponised” mean anyway? Boris Johnson is a racist who has made several several racist and homophobic statements. When his political opponents attack him for this are they weaponising his racism and homophobia or highlighting his racism and homophobia to demonstrate how wholly unsuitable he is to lead the country.
You appear to be happy to throw the British Jewish community under to the bus for what you perceive to be the greater good.
So Forde concludes that Corbyn's Labour Party did indeed have a real and serious antisemitism problem , something the Jewish Labour Movement, the Board of Deputies, the three main British Jewish newspapers, Jewish Labour members and the wider British Jewish community raised concerns about and were abused as being agents if Israel and smearing Corbyn and the Labour Party. But opponents of Corbyn weaponised it against him.
So answer me this: how is it possible to weaponise a real and serious problem against the person responsible for it?
“We, the jury, find the defendant guilty as charged, your honour - and we also note the prosecution weaponised his guilt to make him look guilty." [Post edited 20 Jul 2022 7:45]
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| Forde Report: Anti-Semitism used as 'factional weapon' in Labour party on 07:38 - Jul 20 with 596 views | SuperKieranMcKenna |
| Forde Report: Anti-Semitism used as 'factional weapon' in Labour party on 06:43 - Jul 20 by jayceee |
Whilst I agree that racism / antisemitism is a problem and needs to be tackled wherever it is found, it's wrong to weaponize it as was blatantly obvious under Corbyn's Labour. |
“racism / antisemitism is a problem and needs to be tackled wherever it is found”
And therein lies the problem, it wasn’t. The incompetent posh bloke failed miserably to tackle it:
“a culture within the Party which, at best, did not do enough to prevent antisemitism and, at worst, could be seen to accept it”
Buck stops with the (dear) leader I’m afraid.
If it was weaponised then that’s wrong BUT so would be brushing it under the carpet. The EHRC report confirms that the party did little to tackle antisemitism or turned a blind eye. Something that Darth has spent much effort in denying. |  | | |
| Forde Report: Anti-Semitism used as 'factional weapon' in Labour party on 07:40 - Jul 20 with 588 views | Darth_Koont |
| Forde Report: Anti-Semitism used as 'factional weapon' in Labour party on 06:08 - Jul 20 by solomon |
What does exist in the uk is blatant racism, unfortunately antisemitism is rife within certain sections of society, the rise of social media platforms has emboldened them immensely. No one should have to endure any form of racism or racial abuse anywhere. |
You are right that antisemitism is still a problem in the UK. And that’s on the left too.
But turning that into a Labour and a Corbyn problem specifically was a massively political move. There just isn’t the evidence to support singling out either to the degree that it then dominated the discussion.
I don’t think anyone should be looking the other way on racism. But selective and politicised anti-racism certainly doesn’t help. |  |
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| Forde Report: Anti-Semitism used as 'factional weapon' in Labour party on 07:40 - Jul 20 with 592 views | solomon |
| Forde Report: Anti-Semitism used as 'factional weapon' in Labour party on 07:31 - Jul 20 by BanksterDebtSlave |
And a responsible media and political class should not fan the flames of a few virtual voices for political ends in order to rule out a meaningful alternative to the status quo. |
Antisemitism has nothing to do with the status quo (I know lots of racists believe the opposite) this was pure and simple discrimination within the Labour Party. | | | |
| Forde Report: Anti-Semitism used as 'factional weapon' in Labour party on 07:42 - Jul 20 with 584 views | GlasgowBlue |
| Forde Report: Anti-Semitism used as 'factional weapon' in Labour party on 07:31 - Jul 20 by BanksterDebtSlave |
And a responsible media and political class should not fan the flames of a few virtual voices for political ends in order to rule out a meaningful alternative to the status quo. |
A few virtual voices? Have you read either the EHRC or Forde reports?
From the Forde report:
experiences of “widespread existence” of discrimination based on religion, race, gender and sexual orientation
provided “with a wealth of evidence” documenting discrimination.
profoundly serious issue of anti-Semitism in the party
Stop downplaying racism banksy. | |
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| Forde Report: Anti-Semitism used as 'factional weapon' in Labour party on 07:45 - Jul 20 with 557 views | solomon |
| Forde Report: Anti-Semitism used as 'factional weapon' in Labour party on 07:32 - Jul 20 by GlasgowBlue |
You seem more concerned that the widespread racial prejudice against Jewish members of the Labour party was ‘weaponised’ rather than the actual racial prejudice itself.
Why couldn’t Jewish members just keep quiet, accept being racially abused and discriminated against in order we could all be saved by Saint Jeremy?
And what the hell does “weaponised” mean anyway? Boris Johnson is a racist who has made several several racist and homophobic statements. When his political opponents attack him for this are they weaponising his racism and homophobia or highlighting his racism and homophobia to demonstrate how wholly unsuitable he is to lead the country.
You appear to be happy to throw the British Jewish community under to the bus for what you perceive to be the greater good.
So Forde concludes that Corbyn's Labour Party did indeed have a real and serious antisemitism problem , something the Jewish Labour Movement, the Board of Deputies, the three main British Jewish newspapers, Jewish Labour members and the wider British Jewish community raised concerns about and were abused as being agents if Israel and smearing Corbyn and the Labour Party. But opponents of Corbyn weaponised it against him.
So answer me this: how is it possible to weaponise a real and serious problem against the person responsible for it?
“We, the jury, find the defendant guilty as charged, your honour - and we also note the prosecution weaponised his guilt to make him look guilty." [Post edited 20 Jul 2022 7:45]
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This whole issue has emboldened some to spout some pretty awful stuff , its crazy that it seems acceptable to be able to do this so openly, healthy debate is one thing but dismissing discrimination as smears is a very dangerous place to go. | | | |
| Forde Report: Anti-Semitism used as 'factional weapon' in Labour party on 07:52 - Jul 20 with 513 views | GlasgowBlue |
| Forde Report: Anti-Semitism used as 'factional weapon' in Labour party on 07:45 - Jul 20 by solomon |
This whole issue has emboldened some to spout some pretty awful stuff , its crazy that it seems acceptable to be able to do this so openly, healthy debate is one thing but dismissing discrimination as smears is a very dangerous place to go. |
Indeed. Those continuing to use the word “smear” or continue to insist the issue was overplayed, should crawl back under their rocks in shame.
[Post edited 20 Jul 2022 7:53]
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| Forde Report: Anti-Semitism used as 'factional weapon' in Labour party on 07:55 - Jul 20 with 506 views | BanksterDebtSlave |
| Forde Report: Anti-Semitism used as 'factional weapon' in Labour party on 07:32 - Jul 20 by GlasgowBlue |
You seem more concerned that the widespread racial prejudice against Jewish members of the Labour party was ‘weaponised’ rather than the actual racial prejudice itself.
Why couldn’t Jewish members just keep quiet, accept being racially abused and discriminated against in order we could all be saved by Saint Jeremy?
And what the hell does “weaponised” mean anyway? Boris Johnson is a racist who has made several several racist and homophobic statements. When his political opponents attack him for this are they weaponising his racism and homophobia or highlighting his racism and homophobia to demonstrate how wholly unsuitable he is to lead the country.
You appear to be happy to throw the British Jewish community under to the bus for what you perceive to be the greater good.
So Forde concludes that Corbyn's Labour Party did indeed have a real and serious antisemitism problem , something the Jewish Labour Movement, the Board of Deputies, the three main British Jewish newspapers, Jewish Labour members and the wider British Jewish community raised concerns about and were abused as being agents if Israel and smearing Corbyn and the Labour Party. But opponents of Corbyn weaponised it against him.
So answer me this: how is it possible to weaponise a real and serious problem against the person responsible for it?
“We, the jury, find the defendant guilty as charged, your honour - and we also note the prosecution weaponised his guilt to make him look guilty." [Post edited 20 Jul 2022 7:45]
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Strangely enough, with Johnson a wing of his party and swathes of the media do not jump on board to facilitate (exaggerating as they go) the weaponisation. See how it works? | |
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| (No subject) (n/t) on 08:03 - Jul 20 with 476 views | SuperKieranMcKenna |
| Forde Report: Anti-Semitism used as 'factional weapon' in Labour party on 07:55 - Jul 20 by BanksterDebtSlave |
Strangely enough, with Johnson a wing of his party and swathes of the media do not jump on board to facilitate (exaggerating as they go) the weaponisation. See how it works? |
The report confirms that claims of antisemitism were not overstated.
So no, it wasn’t exaggerated. [Post edited 20 Jul 2022 8:04]
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| Forde Report: Anti-Semitism used as 'factional weapon' in Labour party on 08:03 - Jul 20 with 476 views | BanksterDebtSlave |
| Forde Report: Anti-Semitism used as 'factional weapon' in Labour party on 07:42 - Jul 20 by GlasgowBlue |
A few virtual voices? Have you read either the EHRC or Forde reports?
From the Forde report:
experiences of “widespread existence” of discrimination based on religion, race, gender and sexual orientation
provided “with a wealth of evidence” documenting discrimination.
profoundly serious issue of anti-Semitism in the party
Stop downplaying racism banksy. |
What was the total membership under Corbyn and how many individual members had antisemitic sentiments confirmed?
Just so I can see how widespread this issue was. Does the Tory party have a wing dedicated to trailing through its members social media utterings? | |
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| Forde Report: Anti-Semitism used as 'factional weapon' in Labour party on 08:05 - Jul 20 with 464 views | solomon |
| Forde Report: Anti-Semitism used as 'factional weapon' in Labour party on 07:52 - Jul 20 by GlasgowBlue |
Indeed. Those continuing to use the word “smear” or continue to insist the issue was overplayed, should crawl back under their rocks in shame.
[Post edited 20 Jul 2022 7:53]
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Unfortunately antisemitism has been emboldened by a society that has failed to break this form of racism, yiu don’t have to look far to see where it’s being tolerated. | | | |
| Forde Report: Anti-Semitism used as 'factional weapon' in Labour party on 08:05 - Jul 20 with 460 views | GlasgowBlue |
| Forde Report: Anti-Semitism used as 'factional weapon' in Labour party on 08:03 - Jul 20 by BanksterDebtSlave |
What was the total membership under Corbyn and how many individual members had antisemitic sentiments confirmed?
Just so I can see how widespread this issue was. Does the Tory party have a wing dedicated to trailing through its members social media utterings? |
Sigh.
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| Forde Report: Anti-Semitism used as 'factional weapon' in Labour party on 08:06 - Jul 20 with 458 views | Darth_Koont |
| Forde Report: Anti-Semitism used as 'factional weapon' in Labour party on 07:38 - Jul 20 by SuperKieranMcKenna |
“racism / antisemitism is a problem and needs to be tackled wherever it is found”
And therein lies the problem, it wasn’t. The incompetent posh bloke failed miserably to tackle it:
“a culture within the Party which, at best, did not do enough to prevent antisemitism and, at worst, could be seen to accept it”
Buck stops with the (dear) leader I’m afraid.
If it was weaponised then that’s wrong BUT so would be brushing it under the carpet. The EHRC report confirms that the party did little to tackle antisemitism or turned a blind eye. Something that Darth has spent much effort in denying. |
As more of this comes out, most of which I’ve been talking about already, then it seems you’ll increasingly be rewriting history and misrepresenting the situation.
No-one in the Corbyn team was brushing it under the carpet. From the Chakrabarti report to being censured by the EHRC for NOT staying out of the process and trying to speed up complaints. But that was ignored by you and others to score the cheapest and smeariest political points.
Antisemitism and particularly how it could be connected to Corbyn and the left was exaggerated and weaponised. You need to accept that. In the same way that anybody who is saying it was ALL a smear needs to understand that antisemitism is a problem and threat in UK society even on the left. | |
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| Forde Report: Anti-Semitism used as 'factional weapon' in Labour party on 08:08 - Jul 20 with 457 views | Churchman |
Thank you for posting this.
They key for me is the the last line of one of Solomon’s posts ‘No one should have to endure any form of racism or racial abuse anywhere’. All add in any other form of ‘ism’ to that such as sexism and ageism.
Has progress been made on battling racism in this country over the years? I believe so. Evidence? Just how I see it really, having lived a longish life and seen so much change. But boy is there a helluva long way to go. It has to be continually battled; stamped on. With regard to the article, I particularly noticed:
‘hundreds of private WhatsApp messages from named staff members using deeply offensive language.’
‘party staff blocked the submission and it was eventually leaked to journalists.’
‘The report dismissed the complaint by Labour staff that derogatory messages were “cherrypicked and selectively edited” in the leaked report.’
To move this forward, it has to be brought out in the open. It’s electoral chances will be damaged far more if it does the old ‘ahh well’’it isn’t really a problem’ brush it under the carpet for the sake of image routine.
I don’t know - if I was Starmer I’d want copies of those WhatsApp messages and where the evidence was clear, I’d want them out of the party, whoever they were. There is no room for it. None. |  | | |
| Forde Report: Anti-Semitism used as 'factional weapon' in Labour party on 08:09 - Jul 20 with 452 views | BanksterDebtSlave |
| Forde Report: Anti-Semitism used as 'factional weapon' in Labour party on 08:05 - Jul 20 by GlasgowBlue |
Sigh.
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Try again. | |
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| Forde Report: Anti-Semitism used as 'factional weapon' in Labour party on 08:13 - Jul 20 with 447 views | Darth_Koont |
| Forde Report: Anti-Semitism used as 'factional weapon' in Labour party on 08:05 - Jul 20 by GlasgowBlue |
Sigh.
|
It clearly was exaggerated as a uniquely Corbyn issue and as your own screenshots show many claims had nothing to do with the Labour Party.
Dave Rich knows this as he was part of leading the charge.
The Forde report accepts that it was politicised and weaponised and beyond the Labour Party and the remit of the Forde Report it was much, much worse. | |
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| Forde Report: Anti-Semitism used as 'factional weapon' in Labour party on 08:14 - Jul 20 with 442 views | solomon |
| Forde Report: Anti-Semitism used as 'factional weapon' in Labour party on 08:03 - Jul 20 by BanksterDebtSlave |
What was the total membership under Corbyn and how many individual members had antisemitic sentiments confirmed?
Just so I can see how widespread this issue was. Does the Tory party have a wing dedicated to trailing through its members social media utterings? |
You’re better than this, I have hope you are. | | | |
| Forde Report: Anti-Semitism used as 'factional weapon' in Labour party on 08:16 - Jul 20 with 424 views | Darth_Koont |
| Forde Report: Anti-Semitism used as 'factional weapon' in Labour party on 08:08 - Jul 20 by Churchman |
Thank you for posting this.
They key for me is the the last line of one of Solomon’s posts ‘No one should have to endure any form of racism or racial abuse anywhere’. All add in any other form of ‘ism’ to that such as sexism and ageism.
Has progress been made on battling racism in this country over the years? I believe so. Evidence? Just how I see it really, having lived a longish life and seen so much change. But boy is there a helluva long way to go. It has to be continually battled; stamped on. With regard to the article, I particularly noticed:
‘hundreds of private WhatsApp messages from named staff members using deeply offensive language.’
‘party staff blocked the submission and it was eventually leaked to journalists.’
‘The report dismissed the complaint by Labour staff that derogatory messages were “cherrypicked and selectively edited” in the leaked report.’
To move this forward, it has to be brought out in the open. It’s electoral chances will be damaged far more if it does the old ‘ahh well’’it isn’t really a problem’ brush it under the carpet for the sake of image routine.
I don’t know - if I was Starmer I’d want copies of those WhatsApp messages and where the evidence was clear, I’d want them out of the party, whoever they were. There is no room for it. None. |
Starmer et al knew all about those messages over 2 years ago. The Labour leaks document laid them out.
I quite agree that they were/are unacceptable but this was the Labour establishment so of course ranks were closed. | |
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| (No subject) (n/t) on 08:23 - Jul 20 with 391 views | BanksterDebtSlave |
| (No subject) (n/t) on 08:03 - Jul 20 by SuperKieranMcKenna |
The report confirms that claims of antisemitism were not overstated.
So no, it wasn’t exaggerated. [Post edited 20 Jul 2022 8:04]
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That merely confirms that cases of antisemitism existed and nothing about the extent (which was exaggerated for political purposes.)
So how many members were ultimately expelled....I am sure the info must be out there? Oh I'll look then....
https://en.m.wikipedia.org/wiki/Antisemitism_in_the_UK_Labour_Party
"In February and July 2019, Labour issued information on investigations into complaints of antisemitism against individuals, with around 350 members resigning, being expelled or receiving formal warnings."Â
Membership...
Circa 500,000
https://blogs.lse.ac.uk/politicsandpolicy/explaining-the-pro-corbyn-surge-in-lab
Percentage.... 0.07
So I wonder how those flames got blown? | |
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| (No subject) (n/t) on 08:26 - Jul 20 with 373 views | Darth_Koont |
| (No subject) (n/t) on 08:03 - Jul 20 by SuperKieranMcKenna |
The report confirms that claims of antisemitism were not overstated.
So no, it wasn’t exaggerated. [Post edited 20 Jul 2022 8:04]
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You’re conflating stuff here.
The claims of antisemitism within Labour were real although many claims were admitted to not having anything to do with Labour members. So it’s important to state that actual incidents of antisemitism involving Labour weren’t fabricated or exaggerated. Find me anyone stating otherwise.
But beyond the remit of the Forde Report any old bogus accusations were being used (Corbyn as an “existential threat to British Jews” etc.) as well as no indication of the numbers involved. It was massively exaggerated and politicised in the media and on here. | |
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| (No subject) (n/t) on 08:27 - Jul 20 with 364 views | Darth_Koont |
James is being disingenuous. | |
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| (No subject) (n/t) on 08:27 - Jul 20 with 364 views | solomon |
0.07 % is 0.07% too much in any civilised society, good grief man.
Is it ok to have a small percentage of racists within any organisation, is this what you are saying? | | | |
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