| If we achieve our pre season objective of promotion 20:34 - Feb 12 with 3543 views | ashtonscoffeecup |
I don’t believe this is out of turn to discuss, but we’d see a huge influx of new players, resulting in bonding/settling time, learning what KM wants etc.
in my mind currently we would need to bring in, as a minimum;
GK
RB
CB
DCM
ACM X 2
ST x 2
is that a fair assessment? i can’t see many of this current squad making the step up (however hugely appreciated them for getting us there - if they do)
that’s a £150/200m of new player to come in. could be another busy summer |  | | |  |
| If we achieve our pre season objective of promotion on 13:29 - Feb 13 with 534 views | SuffolkPunchFC |
| If we achieve our pre season objective of promotion on 13:07 - Feb 13 by Joey_Joe_Joe_Junior |
It’s only Hume and Ballard from last year that play for them isn’t it?
I guess Le Fee who was an excellent loan signing from Roma counts as well, think he was got in last January with an obligation. |
Off the top of my head, Isidor (2024 loan), Mayenda, Mundle, maybe more. Rigg in half the PL games I think. All made a good number of appearances and starts. | | | |
| If we achieve our pre season objective of promotion on 13:32 - Feb 13 with 520 views | MK1 |
| If we achieve our pre season objective of promotion on 08:36 - Feb 13 by TRUE_BLUE123 |
4 or 5 seems very ambitious to me. At a push Leif and Matusiwa (in a midfield 3). I would want to say Philogene but for all his good work at home, away he has been a non factor so I dont think that bodes well for the prem. |
O'Shea, Davis, Matusiwa, J Clarke, Nunez? & Philogene was my thinking.
I think we need a new GK, RB, CB, LB, DCM, ACM and a CF as a minimum.
Won't be cheap, but if we want a better outcome, then the money will need to be spent.
If we stay down, I still think we need the above to come in. |  |
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| If we achieve our pre season objective of promotion on 14:22 - Feb 13 with 453 views | Joey_Joe_Joe_Junior |
| If we achieve our pre season objective of promotion on 13:29 - Feb 13 by SuffolkPunchFC |
Off the top of my head, Isidor (2024 loan), Mayenda, Mundle, maybe more. Rigg in half the PL games I think. All made a good number of appearances and starts. |
Most if not all those are subs who have made double digit appearances which is how I’d envisage a lot of our guys now. They have 8-9 new starters. |  |
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| If we achieve our pre season objective of promotion on 14:36 - Feb 13 with 443 views | BiGDonnie |
| If we achieve our pre season objective of promotion on 12:43 - Feb 13 by Joey_Joe_Joe_Junior |
You’re so far off the mark. |
Cheers Kieran. We'll see. |  |
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| If we achieve our pre season objective of promotion on 15:01 - Feb 13 with 424 views | SuffolkPunchFC |
| If we achieve our pre season objective of promotion on 14:22 - Feb 13 by Joey_Joe_Joe_Junior |
Most if not all those are subs who have made double digit appearances which is how I’d envisage a lot of our guys now. They have 8-9 new starters. |
Firstly, those have all had a reasonable number are starts too with - yes - a number off the bench also. Which is exactly what I see happening both with some of the players we keep and some of the new recruits. I just quicky checked Mayenda for example - looks to be 6 starts, and 14 appearances in the PL (not including cup).
I'm suggesting 6-7 that become immediate starters, which only 1-2 off where Sunderland are - plus, as I said, I see another handful (3-5) coming in for the bench / fringe / development. This is on the basis that of we reduce the number of current seniors from 34 to say 21, we're then not only going to recruit to the 25 squad size. We'll have some going out on loan (for development or just surplus to requirements in the short term), so will end up with 30+ seniors.
Your reaction seems to suggest that you think our expectation is miles apart. Is it really that far apart? Do you see us bringing in 9-11 new starters? I'd say that's completely off the mark too. [Post edited 13 Feb 15:32]
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| If we achieve our pre season objective of promotion on 16:50 - Feb 13 with 341 views | LankHenners |
| If we achieve our pre season objective of promotion on 15:01 - Feb 13 by SuffolkPunchFC |
Firstly, those have all had a reasonable number are starts too with - yes - a number off the bench also. Which is exactly what I see happening both with some of the players we keep and some of the new recruits. I just quicky checked Mayenda for example - looks to be 6 starts, and 14 appearances in the PL (not including cup).
I'm suggesting 6-7 that become immediate starters, which only 1-2 off where Sunderland are - plus, as I said, I see another handful (3-5) coming in for the bench / fringe / development. This is on the basis that of we reduce the number of current seniors from 34 to say 21, we're then not only going to recruit to the 25 squad size. We'll have some going out on loan (for development or just surplus to requirements in the short term), so will end up with 30+ seniors.
Your reaction seems to suggest that you think our expectation is miles apart. Is it really that far apart? Do you see us bringing in 9-11 new starters? I'd say that's completely off the mark too. [Post edited 13 Feb 15:32]
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Of the 13 Sunderland players to have played more than 1000 minutes (just under half the available minutes) in the league, only 4 of them were at the club last season in the Championship, and one of those is Le Fee who was a coup of a January loan who wouldn't have been there if it wasn't for an obligation to buy him upon promotion.
Keep going down the list and there are 3 more new signings in the way before you get to a player from last season, Mayenda, who's not even played 600 minutes so barely a quarter of the season's available playing time. Rigg and Mundle have only just about played 4 matches' worth of time which is hardly anything. Plus if you look at their first XI after the summer window closed they have 9 new faces starting which has stayed the case for most of the season and only disrupted by injuries and AFCON.
So really their 'most played' team is dominated by new signings with a lot of last season's players quickly demoted to 'fringe' status. |  |
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| If we achieve our pre season objective of promotion on 17:17 - Feb 13 with 299 views | ReusersTown |
| If we achieve our pre season objective of promotion on 10:23 - Feb 13 by TRUE_BLUE123 |
The fact that as a newly promoted Prem team we had a guy who bagged 12 goals was very impressive. As you say, it was what was around him that was the issue. |
The issue was that he wasn't really constructive to what the overall team needed and was in the main selfish. | | | |
| If we achieve our pre season objective of promotion on 17:24 - Feb 13 with 275 views | SuffolkPunchFC |
| If we achieve our pre season objective of promotion on 16:50 - Feb 13 by LankHenners |
Of the 13 Sunderland players to have played more than 1000 minutes (just under half the available minutes) in the league, only 4 of them were at the club last season in the Championship, and one of those is Le Fee who was a coup of a January loan who wouldn't have been there if it wasn't for an obligation to buy him upon promotion.
Keep going down the list and there are 3 more new signings in the way before you get to a player from last season, Mayenda, who's not even played 600 minutes so barely a quarter of the season's available playing time. Rigg and Mundle have only just about played 4 matches' worth of time which is hardly anything. Plus if you look at their first XI after the summer window closed they have 9 new faces starting which has stayed the case for most of the season and only disrupted by injuries and AFCON.
So really their 'most played' team is dominated by new signings with a lot of last season's players quickly demoted to 'fringe' status. |
No disagreement with those stats (1,000 minutes would be 11 out of 26 games though) - the original point is about how we shake up the team next season if we get promoted. and how many new starters we are likely to bring in.
6-7 who immediately start, and then 3-5 who come through as the season progresses feels about right to me. I'd suggest that we have 5 or 6 in the current squad who will make a big contribution. It also builds on and offers some continuity on what KmK's been building for the past 6 months. That level of change isn't too far away from what Sunderland did (and as right as Sunderland seem to have got it, it doesn't come without risk - and although I'm certain they stay up, they are on a downward trajectory right now - 4 losses in the last 6).
Keeping with Mayenda for a moment, this sort of illustrates my point. He's played a significant number of minutes (65-90) in 6 games, so it's possible to have players from your Championship season to help with your depth. We have a few who could be considered similarly.
Getting off to a good start, is what probably what matters most next season, if we're in the PL.
Anyway, I'm rambling a bit now. If we get promoted, we'll see what happens and who's predicted it most accurately. | | | |
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| If we achieve our pre season objective of promotion on 17:31 - Feb 13 with 266 views | Axeldalai_lama |
| If we achieve our pre season objective of promotion on 16:50 - Feb 13 by LankHenners |
Of the 13 Sunderland players to have played more than 1000 minutes (just under half the available minutes) in the league, only 4 of them were at the club last season in the Championship, and one of those is Le Fee who was a coup of a January loan who wouldn't have been there if it wasn't for an obligation to buy him upon promotion.
Keep going down the list and there are 3 more new signings in the way before you get to a player from last season, Mayenda, who's not even played 600 minutes so barely a quarter of the season's available playing time. Rigg and Mundle have only just about played 4 matches' worth of time which is hardly anything. Plus if you look at their first XI after the summer window closed they have 9 new faces starting which has stayed the case for most of the season and only disrupted by injuries and AFCON.
So really their 'most played' team is dominated by new signings with a lot of last season's players quickly demoted to 'fringe' status. |
That's some great stats and more what I thought when people said Sunderland hadn't been playing that many newbies. They clearly have and it has worked for them and not 'disrupted'. I think we'd be mad not to try similar. To me it's quite a straightforward equation. Go up with arguably the best squad in the league, spend the new money on another 10 or so aiming to better the promoted squad, drop off and or loan out 10 or so of the promoted squad and push on. What's the alternative? Pray that Nunez, egeli, furlong, azon, taylor, Clarke, Hirst, even Greaves and philogene step up and suddenly show a leap of improvement and can be counted on? Save the money for some reason and keep our fingers crossed? It's a no brainer, Shirley?! |  | | |
| If we achieve our pre season objective of promotion on 17:36 - Feb 13 with 248 views | TRUE_BLUE123 |
| If we achieve our pre season objective of promotion on 17:17 - Feb 13 by ReusersTown |
The issue was that he wasn't really constructive to what the overall team needed and was in the main selfish. |
I completely disagree.
He singlehandedly stopped us being relegated by about November. |  |
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| If we achieve our pre season objective of promotion on 17:41 - Feb 13 with 240 views | LankHenners |
| If we achieve our pre season objective of promotion on 17:24 - Feb 13 by SuffolkPunchFC |
No disagreement with those stats (1,000 minutes would be 11 out of 26 games though) - the original point is about how we shake up the team next season if we get promoted. and how many new starters we are likely to bring in.
6-7 who immediately start, and then 3-5 who come through as the season progresses feels about right to me. I'd suggest that we have 5 or 6 in the current squad who will make a big contribution. It also builds on and offers some continuity on what KmK's been building for the past 6 months. That level of change isn't too far away from what Sunderland did (and as right as Sunderland seem to have got it, it doesn't come without risk - and although I'm certain they stay up, they are on a downward trajectory right now - 4 losses in the last 6).
Keeping with Mayenda for a moment, this sort of illustrates my point. He's played a significant number of minutes (65-90) in 6 games, so it's possible to have players from your Championship season to help with your depth. We have a few who could be considered similarly.
Getting off to a good start, is what probably what matters most next season, if we're in the PL.
Anyway, I'm rambling a bit now. If we get promoted, we'll see what happens and who's predicted it most accurately. |
I can't really be bothered to go through it all but that does seem to be a different point to the one you started with but whatever. | |
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| If we achieve our pre season objective of promotion on 17:46 - Feb 13 with 222 views | SuffolkPunchFC |
| If we achieve our pre season objective of promotion on 17:41 - Feb 13 by LankHenners |
I can't really be bothered to go through it all but that does seem to be a different point to the one you started with but whatever. |
If we achieve our pre season objective of promotion by SuffolkPunchFC 13 Feb 11:55Of the 34 senior players (8 out on loan) we have on the books right now, I see 21 remaining, with the need to add 6-7 'starters' to the squad and a handful of new younger/ fringe/development players to fill out the senior squad (a few out on loan)
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| If we achieve our pre season objective of promotion on 17:47 - Feb 13 with 215 views | LankHenners |
| If we achieve our pre season objective of promotion on 17:46 - Feb 13 by SuffolkPunchFC |
If we achieve our pre season objective of promotion by SuffolkPunchFC 13 Feb 11:55Of the 34 senior players (8 out on loan) we have on the books right now, I see 21 remaining, with the need to add 6-7 'starters' to the squad and a handful of new younger/ fringe/development players to fill out the senior squad (a few out on loan)
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About Sunderland. | |
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| If we achieve our pre season objective of promotion on 17:48 - Feb 13 with 212 views | ReusersTown |
| If we achieve our pre season objective of promotion on 17:36 - Feb 13 by TRUE_BLUE123 |
I completely disagree.
He singlehandedly stopped us being relegated by about November. |
Don't get me wrong he started of as a significant contributor, but definitely got progressively more selfish, through I think believing his own hype, which was to the detriment of the team. Evidenced by us actually being better when Hirst was in the team. | | | |
| If we achieve our pre season objective of promotion on 17:53 - Feb 13 with 192 views | Axeldalai_lama |
| If we achieve our pre season objective of promotion on 17:24 - Feb 13 by SuffolkPunchFC |
No disagreement with those stats (1,000 minutes would be 11 out of 26 games though) - the original point is about how we shake up the team next season if we get promoted. and how many new starters we are likely to bring in.
6-7 who immediately start, and then 3-5 who come through as the season progresses feels about right to me. I'd suggest that we have 5 or 6 in the current squad who will make a big contribution. It also builds on and offers some continuity on what KmK's been building for the past 6 months. That level of change isn't too far away from what Sunderland did (and as right as Sunderland seem to have got it, it doesn't come without risk - and although I'm certain they stay up, they are on a downward trajectory right now - 4 losses in the last 6).
Keeping with Mayenda for a moment, this sort of illustrates my point. He's played a significant number of minutes (65-90) in 6 games, so it's possible to have players from your Championship season to help with your depth. We have a few who could be considered similarly.
Getting off to a good start, is what probably what matters most next season, if we're in the PL.
Anyway, I'm rambling a bit now. If we get promoted, we'll see what happens and who's predicted it most accurately. |
I don't really get the 6-7 to start and 3-5 who might later?! Surely we just buy the best 9-12 players we can get our hands on across the team and if they start they start. 10 first teamers will leave 15 'old' players from this season, that's still pretty decent, and that depth will be Nunez J Clarke Philogene Mehmeti greaves O Shea Matusiwa Davis Burns etc etc, some of those will start a few games no doubt and the majority of the squad will still be from the season. And they'll all be McKenna's players so I don't think it needs sentimentality on his behalf! | | | |
| If we achieve our pre season objective of promotion on 17:56 - Feb 13 with 174 views | SuffolkPunchFC |
| If we achieve our pre season objective of promotion on 17:47 - Feb 13 by LankHenners |
About Sunderland. |
Sunderland weren't mentioned in my original point, and you responded to my post bringing it back to the original point (as the discission, as is often the case, had veered off from where it started). [Post edited 13 Feb 18:06]
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| If we achieve our pre season objective of promotion on 18:06 - Feb 13 with 143 views | SuffolkPunchFC |
| If we achieve our pre season objective of promotion on 17:53 - Feb 13 by Axeldalai_lama |
I don't really get the 6-7 to start and 3-5 who might later?! Surely we just buy the best 9-12 players we can get our hands on across the team and if they start they start. 10 first teamers will leave 15 'old' players from this season, that's still pretty decent, and that depth will be Nunez J Clarke Philogene Mehmeti greaves O Shea Matusiwa Davis Burns etc etc, some of those will start a few games no doubt and the majority of the squad will still be from the season. And they'll all be McKenna's players so I don't think it needs sentimentality on his behalf! |
The thought process is that I don't think you get 12 PL ready players that are an immediate improvement on some that we already have, so we have to cut our cloth appropriately.
This means some of the new faces will likely need more time to develop / ease into the team. | | | |
| If we achieve our pre season objective of promotion on 18:10 - Feb 13 with 126 views | LankHenners |
| If we achieve our pre season objective of promotion on 17:56 - Feb 13 by SuffolkPunchFC |
Sunderland weren't mentioned in my original point, and you responded to my post bringing it back to the original point (as the discission, as is often the case, had veered off from where it started). [Post edited 13 Feb 18:06]
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You brought up Sunderland to back up your point but the reality of their situation actually argues against what you were saying. | |
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| If we achieve our pre season objective of promotion on 18:13 - Feb 13 with 118 views | SuffolkPunchFC |
| If we achieve our pre season objective of promotion on 18:10 - Feb 13 by LankHenners |
You brought up Sunderland to back up your point but the reality of their situation actually argues against what you were saying. |
LOL - it still wasn't the original point that I referred back to in the post you replied for.
Whatever, I don't really expect you to acknowledge that. | | | |
| If we achieve our pre season objective of promotion on 19:18 - Feb 13 with 62 views | Joey_Joe_Joe_Junior |
| If we achieve our pre season objective of promotion on 16:50 - Feb 13 by LankHenners |
Of the 13 Sunderland players to have played more than 1000 minutes (just under half the available minutes) in the league, only 4 of them were at the club last season in the Championship, and one of those is Le Fee who was a coup of a January loan who wouldn't have been there if it wasn't for an obligation to buy him upon promotion.
Keep going down the list and there are 3 more new signings in the way before you get to a player from last season, Mayenda, who's not even played 600 minutes so barely a quarter of the season's available playing time. Rigg and Mundle have only just about played 4 matches' worth of time which is hardly anything. Plus if you look at their first XI after the summer window closed they have 9 new faces starting which has stayed the case for most of the season and only disrupted by injuries and AFCON.
So really their 'most played' team is dominated by new signings with a lot of last season's players quickly demoted to 'fringe' status. |
Exactly. | |
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