| Reflection to date 07:51 - Mar 11 with 1389 views | TownieRob |
I'm trying to stay balanced as I write this, having read plenty of both positive and negative reactions after Saturday and last night's game. It would be good to have a sensible conversation about where this season hasn't perhaps hit the heights we hoped. Clearly, the position we find ourselves in now means the season hasn't been a complete disaster from start to finish, bfar too often our performances have been indifferent and inconsistent. In fact, you could argue we’ve been consistently inconsistent within games.
We’ve won a fair few matches through moments of individual brilliance. However, there have been far fewer occasions where we've genuinely beaten teams because we were the better team collectively. At times it feels like we've simply had better individual players who have got us through games, rather than the team functioning as a cohesive unit.
I'll also openly admit that I've been critical at times this season, particularly around recruitment. A lot of that criticism came from what looked like a lack of squad balance and player profiles that didn’t quite seem to align with our 'philosophy'. Even now, I'm still not entirely sure what the intended recruitment profile actually was.
So a few questions worth discussing:
1. We’ve been blessed with KMc and the job he’s done in League One and the Championship was nothing short of magic. But it’s still fair to ask the question, could another manager have got more out of this current group of players? At times we look very structured, but perhaps a little rigid and lacking autonomy. Interestingly, we often look a better side when we move the ball quicker. That doesn’t always appear to be how we’re coached though, as we often seem to retain possession until the last moment, drawing players in and trying to move the opposition around to create gaps.
2. Looking back at the summer signings, did they actually play out how we expected? Did we sign the wrong profiles? Or has it simply not clicked yet, I could argue that if it hasn't yet, it's not going to now is it?
3. Should we have brought in another striker in January, it seemed glaringly obvious we needed one?
4. Is part of this mentality, player IQ (game managment being an example) or confidence?
5. There is an argument that the rotation has helped keep players fresher over the course of the season. However, all too often we look like a side that simply hasn’t played together enough. The cohesion and understanding just isn’t always there. You only have to look at the first half on Saturday and again last night, we looked like a group of individuals rather than a settled team.
I’m not trying to point fingers here but just genuinely interested in hearing different views on it. I suspect the truth probably sits somewhere in the middle of a lot of these things. [Post edited 11 Mar 8:04]
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| Reflection to date on 08:10 - Mar 11 with 1296 views | jasondozzell |
You can answer all of them with the following imo:
The club is a victim of its own rapid success after years in the doldrums. It's led to many supporters (some but not all of whom I think only game back post gamechanger) expecting continued glory and winning the league. Football doesn't work like that.
The club had a tree growing out of the roof. We then had to try and catch up on 20 years of neglect in every aspect including recruitment in an industry where things have changed beyond recognition because of finances.
We got to PL from Lg1 in KM's first 2 full seasons. That is extraordinary.
Competed in PL but incredibly tough to stay up
Recruitment has been mixed as you would expect from a club that is trying to get to grips with suddenly having money. But on the whole it's been positive.
Having that money obviously hugely helps us but it doesn't guarantee anything.
Relegation, huge turnover, late arrivals, trying to build a PL team whilst getting out of the championship, dealing with massive expectation. I think it's been KM's most challenging season.
You can see that he has to build a new side as we played in a ruthless league. You can see the progress.
4 points off second with 10 games to go means he has done a very good job believe it or not. Could easily be 2nd of refs knew what they were doing!
There can be no complaints whatever happens. Club is in good health and KM and players giving everything.
Long way to go yet. |  | | |
| Reflection to date on 08:18 - Mar 11 with 1251 views | peterleeblue |
I think your final point about it lying in the middle of all the points you suggest is probably correct and then it is the difficulty of running a football team / club.
I would add.
1. We are the parachute team that everyone wants to beat - compared to Southampton and Leicester we have stood up better to that.
2. Rotation - I think we have over rotated at times but the last 10 games and possible play offs will validate or not that policy
3. Momentum - Is everything at times in football. How much momentum would we now have had the 2 late decisions gone our way on Saturday and last night. Our players whilst expensive are human and will benefit from the confidence results bring like any other player.
4. I am at a loss to explain the inconsistency of performance over most 90 minutes. This controlled style of play always seems to have a rick in it. Preston at home was a good example. Controlled the game for the large part but we we looked vulnerable on the counter attack. If we are playing to be a more premiership styled team then then I can only see the the higher level exploiting us further if the likes of Preston can cause us issues.
Overall I still fully support McKenna. The last 2 seasons have been difficult for sure but I genuinely cant think of anyone else who could do a better job for us right now. |  | | |
| Reflection to date on 08:34 - Mar 11 with 1201 views | muccletonjoe |
There is something not right with our approach , I don't know what it is, maybe leadership on the field. Or it may be a game plan. Sometimes we genuinely don't seem to know what to do with the ball. I think man for man we really do have the best squad in this league, maybe the ability to adapt them to different games and styles has cost us alot of points, but I feel we haven't really done ourselves any favours with team selection at times. [Post edited 11 Mar 8:35]
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| Reflection to date on 08:37 - Mar 11 with 1159 views | FrimleyBlue |
Our issue seems to be that when games dont go to plan it takes a mckenna talk to be able to change things. We dont seem to have players who know how to play the gsme without the need for coaching.
We havent had loads of issues with games but In my view its because our plan A had been ok.
When weve come across issues its when teams appear to come out differently and maybe press more than we thought or sit deeper than we imagined and we dont as a team seem to be able to adjust what we do as players unless we get the guidance to do so.
Also
Town fans sang a massive loud chorus last night.
We pssed around passing the ball back and forth across our backline and them conceded too.
Usually that level of noise gets your driving towards the goal [Post edited 11 Mar 8:47]
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| Reflection to date on 09:37 - Mar 11 with 1039 views | RIPbobby |
| Reflection to date on 08:34 - Mar 11 by muccletonjoe |
There is something not right with our approach , I don't know what it is, maybe leadership on the field. Or it may be a game plan. Sometimes we genuinely don't seem to know what to do with the ball. I think man for man we really do have the best squad in this league, maybe the ability to adapt them to different games and styles has cost us alot of points, but I feel we haven't really done ourselves any favours with team selection at times. [Post edited 11 Mar 8:35]
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I think the first half last night was a classic us playing away. We had lots of possession around the midfield to edge of their box and it looked like we were trying to pick a hole in them. But periodically they would win the ball back, attack and get a shot on target and as it happened score two goals. Now it is clear that the wind had a big influence on the match and we almost got away with it, until the last 15 of the half. We are so frustrating to watch. Are our players being limited, by our coaching or structure? Something isn't right. We have been hard to watch all season. Yes we have been the hunted and are mostly playing against motivated players. It has been a tough season for us. You never know we might get something from it? A trip to wembley would be great. |  | | |
| Reflection to date on 12:02 - Mar 11 with 931 views | TVRBlue |
| Reflection to date on 08:10 - Mar 11 by jasondozzell |
You can answer all of them with the following imo:
The club is a victim of its own rapid success after years in the doldrums. It's led to many supporters (some but not all of whom I think only game back post gamechanger) expecting continued glory and winning the league. Football doesn't work like that.
The club had a tree growing out of the roof. We then had to try and catch up on 20 years of neglect in every aspect including recruitment in an industry where things have changed beyond recognition because of finances.
We got to PL from Lg1 in KM's first 2 full seasons. That is extraordinary.
Competed in PL but incredibly tough to stay up
Recruitment has been mixed as you would expect from a club that is trying to get to grips with suddenly having money. But on the whole it's been positive.
Having that money obviously hugely helps us but it doesn't guarantee anything.
Relegation, huge turnover, late arrivals, trying to build a PL team whilst getting out of the championship, dealing with massive expectation. I think it's been KM's most challenging season.
You can see that he has to build a new side as we played in a ruthless league. You can see the progress.
4 points off second with 10 games to go means he has done a very good job believe it or not. Could easily be 2nd of refs knew what they were doing!
There can be no complaints whatever happens. Club is in good health and KM and players giving everything.
Long way to go yet. |
Very good and balanced post.
Pretty much my view on ITFC. |  | | |
| Reflection to date on 12:21 - Mar 11 with 877 views | jasondozzell |
| Reflection to date on 12:02 - Mar 11 by TVRBlue |
Very good and balanced post.
Pretty much my view on ITFC. |
Thank you! It's good to know there are like-minded and similarly sane individuals out there! | | | |
| Reflection to date on 12:30 - Mar 11 with 830 views | dirtyboy |
All very balanced comments throughout this thread.
I would also add that we shouldn't underestimate the building work impacts and also the effort being put into the U21 team to bring that 'up to scratch'.
Statistically, we're the best team in the league, but we have had a little less fortune this season perhaps (amplified in last two games).
Always worth noting Leeds were like us the year we went up. Wouldn't be surprised to see us do much better next season. |  | | |
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| Reflection to date on 14:08 - Mar 11 with 697 views | Smoresy |
| Reflection to date on 12:21 - Mar 11 by jasondozzell |
Thank you! It's good to know there are like-minded and similarly sane individuals out there! |
I think you're great JD but you're also my answer to poster most likely to be involved in a cult. Sorry if that comes across as rude. I admire your unbridled positivity.
Plenty of your stuff I agree with: leaps ahead of where we were, pinch-yourself territory for the long-sufferers, McKenna's 2nd promotion a very rare and special event (and not simply from an ITFC perspective), some recruitment struggles were baked in.
You've repeatedly said this is McKenna's hardest brief yet. I'm curious to know why you believe it to be harder than last year, when many would agree he didn't have the squad to compete for survival. Is your verdict based simply on expectation, internal and external?
I think this has been his most difficult season yet, which is subtly different. Last year was almost a rite of passage, even for exceptional managers. Sometimes you're just dealt an irretrievable hand. This year though, he received a strong one. Or at least, no expense was spared in obtaining one. We only lost three players in the summer who we wanted to keep as first options: Axel, Hutch and Delap. Others we moved on, or they requested to leave for starting opportunities elsewhere. Their upgrades have mostly been available all season, and many have been with us for over 18 months. Regrettably, many reached greater heights elsewhere under different coaching, rather than showing their best selves now. McKenna will naturally be compared to contemporaries like Scott Parker, who has repeatedly shown his ability to manage this scenario.
If McKenna is performing at the level of a superior coach, it's hard not to allow the mind to wander elsewhere for the answer: why, with superior coaching and a much superior budget, are we not yet emulating successful parachute clubs of recent years? We are no less stable than Burnley last season, for instance. I'd wager we started the campaign with significantly less squad disruption, and more significantly, with the same manager of course. And one thing that cannot be faulted is our investment, almost peerless for our level. We're still in pinch-yourself territory yes, for fans, but investors must feel they have spent enough to hold a competitive advantage in this division, surely?
Superior manager, superior investment, superior players, superior stability, more than most at least, but as yet not a superior outcome. Something in that chain isn't meeting its description presently, if not some things. Hardly doom and gloom, with my fan hat on, but are we really in the realm of "very good" by objective measures? The brilliance of yesteryear has been banked, built on, with the intention of laying strong foundations. It isn't normal for this season's performance review to instead take the form of a time-travel exercise, to the penniless era before all this wondrous stuff happened. It is relevant to a manager- or CEO- change decision but that's not the same review. [Post edited 11 Mar 14:10]
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| Reflection to date on 19:24 - Mar 11 with 542 views | jasondozzell |
| Reflection to date on 14:08 - Mar 11 by Smoresy |
I think you're great JD but you're also my answer to poster most likely to be involved in a cult. Sorry if that comes across as rude. I admire your unbridled positivity.
Plenty of your stuff I agree with: leaps ahead of where we were, pinch-yourself territory for the long-sufferers, McKenna's 2nd promotion a very rare and special event (and not simply from an ITFC perspective), some recruitment struggles were baked in.
You've repeatedly said this is McKenna's hardest brief yet. I'm curious to know why you believe it to be harder than last year, when many would agree he didn't have the squad to compete for survival. Is your verdict based simply on expectation, internal and external?
I think this has been his most difficult season yet, which is subtly different. Last year was almost a rite of passage, even for exceptional managers. Sometimes you're just dealt an irretrievable hand. This year though, he received a strong one. Or at least, no expense was spared in obtaining one. We only lost three players in the summer who we wanted to keep as first options: Axel, Hutch and Delap. Others we moved on, or they requested to leave for starting opportunities elsewhere. Their upgrades have mostly been available all season, and many have been with us for over 18 months. Regrettably, many reached greater heights elsewhere under different coaching, rather than showing their best selves now. McKenna will naturally be compared to contemporaries like Scott Parker, who has repeatedly shown his ability to manage this scenario.
If McKenna is performing at the level of a superior coach, it's hard not to allow the mind to wander elsewhere for the answer: why, with superior coaching and a much superior budget, are we not yet emulating successful parachute clubs of recent years? We are no less stable than Burnley last season, for instance. I'd wager we started the campaign with significantly less squad disruption, and more significantly, with the same manager of course. And one thing that cannot be faulted is our investment, almost peerless for our level. We're still in pinch-yourself territory yes, for fans, but investors must feel they have spent enough to hold a competitive advantage in this division, surely?
Superior manager, superior investment, superior players, superior stability, more than most at least, but as yet not a superior outcome. Something in that chain isn't meeting its description presently, if not some things. Hardly doom and gloom, with my fan hat on, but are we really in the realm of "very good" by objective measures? The brilliance of yesteryear has been banked, built on, with the intention of laying strong foundations. It isn't normal for this season's performance review to instead take the form of a time-travel exercise, to the penniless era before all this wondrous stuff happened. It is relevant to a manager- or CEO- change decision but that's not the same review. [Post edited 11 Mar 14:10]
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Cheers, Smoresy.
Just stepped out of my KM shrine for a bit so I'll try and respond.
I can see what you're getting at and there's no doubt that it's been a difficult season for KM. It's easy to forget he's still a young manager, only in his fourth full season.
I don't agree that his hand this year was as strong as you say. Spending money, especially on player trading model type signings is no guarantee of immediate success or strength.
Yes we've spent money but I think the turnover, the profile of player and the lateness of our dealings in the summer made things tricky.
I just think there's a misunderstanding of what we should be doing this season. We are emulating successful parachute clubs of recent years. Saints and Leicester are the reference points for those who are not.
We're talking about a handful of points that separates total success from what us being perceived as poor. It's crazy. We are very unlucky not to be sitting equal on points with Boro.
Money is only part of the equation. Time and coaching are far more important. KM is a process manager, he's not Colin.
Superior outcome? Let's see come the end of this season. | | | |
| Reflection to date on 19:50 - Mar 11 with 491 views | waveneyblue |
| Reflection to date on 08:10 - Mar 11 by jasondozzell |
You can answer all of them with the following imo:
The club is a victim of its own rapid success after years in the doldrums. It's led to many supporters (some but not all of whom I think only game back post gamechanger) expecting continued glory and winning the league. Football doesn't work like that.
The club had a tree growing out of the roof. We then had to try and catch up on 20 years of neglect in every aspect including recruitment in an industry where things have changed beyond recognition because of finances.
We got to PL from Lg1 in KM's first 2 full seasons. That is extraordinary.
Competed in PL but incredibly tough to stay up
Recruitment has been mixed as you would expect from a club that is trying to get to grips with suddenly having money. But on the whole it's been positive.
Having that money obviously hugely helps us but it doesn't guarantee anything.
Relegation, huge turnover, late arrivals, trying to build a PL team whilst getting out of the championship, dealing with massive expectation. I think it's been KM's most challenging season.
You can see that he has to build a new side as we played in a ruthless league. You can see the progress.
4 points off second with 10 games to go means he has done a very good job believe it or not. Could easily be 2nd of refs knew what they were doing!
There can be no complaints whatever happens. Club is in good health and KM and players giving everything.
Long way to go yet. |
This is a great post and its difficult to put a constructive argument against of the points you make.
I totally believe we are a victim of our own success, the 23/24 Promotion season was bizarre and I don't think many of us thought it would actually happen until the final whistle in the Coventry match.
From there - the slow improvements, the build, the development had to take a completely different path. I work with businesses and time and time again, the worst thing that happens is suddent growth. They aren't prepared, they aren't ready and the infrastructure often collapses under the strain.
We are still in a great position, one we could've only dreamt about 5 years ago and the doom mongers and their ridiculous hot-takes, ridicule and moaning have really made this season feel like an utter slog.
Who knows what's going to happen, its certainly never dull now - unlike the Evans period which nearly always was |  | | |
| Reflection to date on 21:50 - Mar 11 with 376 views | jasondozzell |
| Reflection to date on 19:50 - Mar 11 by waveneyblue |
This is a great post and its difficult to put a constructive argument against of the points you make.
I totally believe we are a victim of our own success, the 23/24 Promotion season was bizarre and I don't think many of us thought it would actually happen until the final whistle in the Coventry match.
From there - the slow improvements, the build, the development had to take a completely different path. I work with businesses and time and time again, the worst thing that happens is suddent growth. They aren't prepared, they aren't ready and the infrastructure often collapses under the strain.
We are still in a great position, one we could've only dreamt about 5 years ago and the doom mongers and their ridiculous hot-takes, ridicule and moaning have really made this season feel like an utter slog.
Who knows what's going to happen, its certainly never dull now - unlike the Evans period which nearly always was |
Well said. Completely agree. It's a shame the boo boys and moaners have tainted the season - we should all just be enjoying this!
Boro result tonight another reminder of what this league is.
It's the complete opposite now of the apathy of the Evans years. It's exciting! Supporters would do well to remember that!
KM knows what he's doing. | | | |
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