| Hillsborough - Leppings Lane End 14:57 - Mar 17 with 6344 views | Zx1988 |
Please do forgive me if this is an insensitive question, but some of the clips from Town in 5 got me wondering.
Given the history of the place, is it a strange feeling being sat in the Leppings Lane End at Hillsborough?
In hindsight, I guess I'm a little surprised that the stand wasn't torn down given the number of deaths associated with it. Although I suppose maybe it's a more recent trend to do away with places like that, associated with loss of life? |  |
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| Hillsborough - Leppings Lane End on 22:12 - Mar 18 with 471 views | ZedRodgers |
| Hillsborough - Leppings Lane End on 22:07 - Mar 18 by Zx1988 |
Where did you find it? I've been looking to try and find somewhere to watch it since I saw it mentioned here, but to no avail. |
I could only find it here with Spanish subtitles!
Part 1: https://www.dailymotion.com/vi
Part 2: https://www.dailymotion.com/vi |  |
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| Hillsborough - Leppings Lane End on 08:52 - Mar 19 with 350 views | Hugoagogo_Reborn |
| Hillsborough - Leppings Lane End on 08:57 - Mar 18 by bluelagos |
I'd challenge absolutely the way football has been sanitised as being for the better. The underlying assumption behind all seater stadiums, which were only legislated for football and not for Rugby or horse racing, is that football fans can not be trusted to behave.
And that assumption was at a time when a minority (and it was always a minority) did attach themselves to football as they looked for violence.
The approach was to remove terracing rather than to actually tackle those who were violent. Not just a sledgehammer to crack a nut but a catch all because football was struggling to address hooligans.
Rather than tackle the sh1t policing that had killed innocent fans far easier to target football fans as if they were the problem.
I don't for a minute want to return to the days when football violence was part of the game, but we have gone so far towards a sanitised experience it's barely recognisable any more. And it doesn't have to be like that. Go and watch a bundesliga match where fans stand safely, they sing, they create an atmosphere and all without violence.
The tone of your comments (and I am not criticising you) is that football was changed because of hooliganism. Partly true but I'd argue it changed because football and policing were incapable of dealing with it and chose to bring in sweeping changes that rippped the heart from the game... |
My tone? A tone is a difficult thing to judge on a forum post. The word I used was 'tribalism', not hooliganism. For good reason. This tragedy was not because of hooliganism, as you well know. I have read with interest and sympathy your accounts of that day at Hillsborough in the past, and mean no offence with my comments.
Tribalism, in big crowds with woefully inadequate safety is dangerous. Yes, I'd prefer a sanitised experience than a repeat of that day. So I will stand by my comment. |  |
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| Hillsborough - Leppings Lane End on 09:44 - Mar 19 with 309 views | glasso |
| Hillsborough - Leppings Lane End on 05:43 - Mar 18 by bluelagos |
Steph Jones, sister to Richard who died with his girlfriend Tracey Cox.
Steph and her mum Doreen and father Les were very prominent in the HFSG. Met Doreen a few times, a lovely lady who I had the privilege to buy a drink the evening the inquest jury exonerated all the fans.
Blogged about that day if anyone's interested.
"Doreen jokes she and her daughter Steph (another Survivor) have slipped their husbands and I insist on buying them a drink. Doreen is smiling, something I have never seen before. This lady who had her son stolen from her, who was cruelly refused the right to hug her dead son, inhumanely told “He is the property of the coroner”, this lady, for that is what she is, she is smiling. Not celebrating but smiling, still dignified in a way I could never be and in a way that brings shame onto everyone in the establishment who even suspected there was a cover up and yet did nothing to expose it."
https://ahillsboroughsurvivor. |
Bloody hell Lagos, I just read some of your blogs - the one about the actual match day and the one where the police tell you it was a "good day's work."
Absolutely incredible that you only got done for calling him scum. I think I'd be up for a much more serious charge in that situation.
I remember that day well (watching it at home on the news, I wasn't there...) and I went to Sheff Uni years later so know the area and stadium well. It all hits home reading such an emotional blog about it all.
Hope you managed to deal with some of those feelings of survivors guilt and PTSD.
It angers me an inordinate amount when I read other football fans getting tribal about that day (and that some still blame the fans or belittle scousers as 'always the victims' - including on this forum).
If ever there was a single issue that should unite every football fan regardless of their team, this should have been it. | | | |
| Hillsborough - Leppings Lane End on 15:35 - Mar 19 with 213 views | bluelagos |
| Hillsborough - Leppings Lane End on 08:52 - Mar 19 by Hugoagogo_Reborn |
My tone? A tone is a difficult thing to judge on a forum post. The word I used was 'tribalism', not hooliganism. For good reason. This tragedy was not because of hooliganism, as you well know. I have read with interest and sympathy your accounts of that day at Hillsborough in the past, and mean no offence with my comments.
Tribalism, in big crowds with woefully inadequate safety is dangerous. Yes, I'd prefer a sanitised experience than a repeat of that day. So I will stand by my comment. |
Wasn't meaning to have a pop. Apologies if that's how it came across.
The point I am trying to make is that the authorities presented their findings post Hillborough as "football fans can not be trusted therefore if we want to avoid another disaster we need all seater stadium". (I paraphrase)
I reject the underlying assumption that football fans can't be trusted. Some football fans are violent which for me means you target those fans, not everyone else.
We don't ban shops and force everyone to shop online because some people are shop lifters. We don't ban people from driving because.some people are speeders. Yet we do ban football fans from using terraces because some fans behave badly... |  |
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| Hillsborough - Leppings Lane End on 15:46 - Mar 19 with 187 views | bluelagos |
| Hillsborough - Leppings Lane End on 09:44 - Mar 19 by glasso |
Bloody hell Lagos, I just read some of your blogs - the one about the actual match day and the one where the police tell you it was a "good day's work."
Absolutely incredible that you only got done for calling him scum. I think I'd be up for a much more serious charge in that situation.
I remember that day well (watching it at home on the news, I wasn't there...) and I went to Sheff Uni years later so know the area and stadium well. It all hits home reading such an emotional blog about it all.
Hope you managed to deal with some of those feelings of survivors guilt and PTSD.
It angers me an inordinate amount when I read other football fans getting tribal about that day (and that some still blame the fans or belittle scousers as 'always the victims' - including on this forum).
If ever there was a single issue that should unite every football fan regardless of their team, this should have been it. |
Yeah, I blogged it cos it just seemed easier to point people to it than having to explain again and again what happened.
The South Yorks Police - some of them were absolutely scum, epitomised by that copper. Something I don't shy from pointing out.
Some people don't like me pointing that out, but such is life. | |
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| Hillsborough - Leppings Lane End on 16:00 - Mar 19 with 160 views | Hugoagogo_Reborn |
| Hillsborough - Leppings Lane End on 15:35 - Mar 19 by bluelagos |
Wasn't meaning to have a pop. Apologies if that's how it came across.
The point I am trying to make is that the authorities presented their findings post Hillborough as "football fans can not be trusted therefore if we want to avoid another disaster we need all seater stadium". (I paraphrase)
I reject the underlying assumption that football fans can't be trusted. Some football fans are violent which for me means you target those fans, not everyone else.
We don't ban shops and force everyone to shop online because some people are shop lifters. We don't ban people from driving because.some people are speeders. Yet we do ban football fans from using terraces because some fans behave badly... |
I don't disagree with the points you made at all. I would love us to have mixed crowds and standing, with beer permitted in view of the pitch, just like Germany.
The trouble is, it would be a huge stick to beat the FA with, if we went over to that model and something else happened. I simply can't see them having the balls to do it, sadly.
So we are probably going to be left with this 'black or white' mentality, because of the 70s/80s hooligans' legacy, and because we've had proof of catastrophic failings in crowd management and safety that will hang over the English game for a long while. [Post edited 19 Mar 16:53]
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