| Crazy squad takes 12:39 - Jul 29 with 1856 views | greyhound |
I may be in the minority but I don't understand the sentiment carried towards our current squad and I say that while being grateful for where they have taken us.
My point revolves around a few thoughts.
Our signings last time we went up did not have the ambition required to keep us up, our succesful players left and we haven't carried a pure prem player between layers like West ham plan to with bowen.
We did not blow the league away last year. We got over the line don't get me wrong but we need confidence in pace, physicality, and goal threat which we lack.
We have a new manager, I don't see him having loyalties, everyone has a fresh sheet and he knows the qualities needed at this level.
Now don't get me wrong we have delivered success last year, but I've seen people state we should keep Hirst, ogbene, Taylor, Johnson, furlong..
These are not player that will do the job we need. The situation is made worse by the compulsory purchase of kipre and akpom both of which can't be near the team in reality. If we are resigned to yo yo between the leagues this is fine but I feel the club ambition is higher and ultimately to hit the ambition we probably need to clear decks and rebuild in a new vision.
There's a host of players I've not even considered, aided by the fact we have stacks of wingers and Al hamadi still kicks about somewhere, but if many of these are still around GW 1 we will be likely looking at another long and difficult time in the prem where each week feels inevitable. I don't think that's the way it will play out but as fans I feel like the moment needs to dawn on us that the gap is enormous and those that are with us may straddle an awkward gap where they need further development before they are ready, or have hit a high championship ceiling, or in some cases are regretted purchases. |  | | |  |
| Crazy squad takes on 12:44 - Jul 29 with 1757 views | BlueNomad |
A new squad is being steadily put together. Sadly it doesn’t happen in a bolt of lightning. |  | | |
| Crazy squad takes on 12:54 - Jul 29 with 1693 views | SuffolkPunchFC |
There's so much I disagree with in this post, but will keep to one point.
"we haven't carried a pure prem player between layers like West ham plan to with bowen."
I am truly surprised that Bowen is staying- and staying in a team that I suspect will struggle to achieve automatic promotion once the summer window is complete. They have already started the fire sale - one that is needed to avoid a massive SCR breach.
Mateus Fernandes, Crysencio Summerville, Callum Wilson, Adama Traoré
All gone, with more to follow, and no notable signings to-date (because they are limited on what they can spend),
The grass isn't always greener... | | | |
| Crazy squad takes on 13:01 - Jul 29 with 1598 views | Dennyx4 |
| Crazy squad takes on 12:54 - Jul 29 by SuffolkPunchFC |
There's so much I disagree with in this post, but will keep to one point.
"we haven't carried a pure prem player between layers like West ham plan to with bowen."
I am truly surprised that Bowen is staying- and staying in a team that I suspect will struggle to achieve automatic promotion once the summer window is complete. They have already started the fire sale - one that is needed to avoid a massive SCR breach.
Mateus Fernandes, Crysencio Summerville, Callum Wilson, Adama Traoré
All gone, with more to follow, and no notable signings to-date (because they are limited on what they can spend),
The grass isn't always greener... |
I think West Ham will go back up comfortably, maybe you have a different take on fire sale to me, but selling two players for roughly £140m, that you bought for £70m is a very good bit of business. |  | | |
| Crazy squad takes on 13:08 - Jul 29 with 1537 views | Guthrum |
Again, just because we fell short in the top tier last time, does not mean that every Champ player is too weak to even sit on our bench. We're not going to hire 25 new men this window, of established Prem status. We couldn't afford it, even with our healthy finances. |  |
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| Crazy squad takes on 13:26 - Jul 29 with 1375 views | SuffolkPunchFC |
| Crazy squad takes on 13:01 - Jul 29 by Dennyx4 |
I think West Ham will go back up comfortably, maybe you have a different take on fire sale to me, but selling two players for roughly £140m, that you bought for £70m is a very good bit of business. |
Have you looked at their accounts, and likely massive non-compliance with SCR? I've posted details previously. They have a massive hole to fill, and will have to offload more, with little latitude to spend big on new arrivals.
Transfer prices are out of control by SuffolkPunchFC 22 Jul 7:10That £150M is down to about £70M profit, so yes a big number, but little or none of that will be available to improve the squad.
https://www.twtd.co.uk/forum/632793/6377290/the-championship-is-going-to-be-effing-brutal-next-season./#post6377290
They still need big savings elsewhere to stay SCR compliant for 26/27. I suspect we’ll see some more big sales before they bring in anyone new, and with a limited budget.
Edit : to add previous analysis. [Post edited 29 Jul 13:29]
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| Crazy squad takes on 13:29 - Jul 29 with 1328 views | Billywitch |
| Crazy squad takes on 12:54 - Jul 29 by SuffolkPunchFC |
There's so much I disagree with in this post, but will keep to one point.
"we haven't carried a pure prem player between layers like West ham plan to with bowen."
I am truly surprised that Bowen is staying- and staying in a team that I suspect will struggle to achieve automatic promotion once the summer window is complete. They have already started the fire sale - one that is needed to avoid a massive SCR breach.
Mateus Fernandes, Crysencio Summerville, Callum Wilson, Adama Traoré
All gone, with more to follow, and no notable signings to-date (because they are limited on what they can spend),
The grass isn't always greener... |
I suspect Bowen is there still for the family ties and the life he has away from the pitch for 90mins. More important things in life | | | |
| Crazy squad takes on 13:37 - Jul 29 with 1263 views | PioneerBlue |
I dont disagree with much of the sentiment in you OP but I do see it as unrealistic for champ level squad players be be shipped simply because they are not PL level. That is the build phase we are in over a few seasons because we couldnt or cant keep high level players between the layers. I also think it neglects to reflect that Hirst or Taylor or Furlong could not do a job covering in a game or two at a time, or finish a game up when resting other starters.
The challenge last time was the squad mix or balance, to many young inexperienced players, to few old stronger heads that could cope with the power of Fulham Everton Forest etc. Dropping them all in together would be a fail and lesson not learnt but using the lesser players one at a time would likely result in different / better outcomes compared to last time. [Post edited 29 Jul 13:46]
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| Crazy squad takes on 13:39 - Jul 29 with 1243 views | Zx1988 |
Interesting point on GON and loyalties.
I've no doubt that KMc would have been incredibly pragmatic, but could the clean break we've got with GON be what's needed to ensure that the squad is assessed on merit alone, and with no risk of sentimentality creeping in? | |
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| Crazy squad takes on 13:41 - Jul 29 with 1203 views | Dennyx4 |
| Crazy squad takes on 13:26 - Jul 29 by SuffolkPunchFC |
Have you looked at their accounts, and likely massive non-compliance with SCR? I've posted details previously. They have a massive hole to fill, and will have to offload more, with little latitude to spend big on new arrivals.
Transfer prices are out of control by SuffolkPunchFC 22 Jul 7:10That £150M is down to about £70M profit, so yes a big number, but little or none of that will be available to improve the squad.
https://www.twtd.co.uk/forum/632793/6377290/the-championship-is-going-to-be-effing-brutal-next-season./#post6377290
They still need big savings elsewhere to stay SCR compliant for 26/27. I suspect we’ll see some more big sales before they bring in anyone new, and with a limited budget.
Edit : to add previous analysis. [Post edited 29 Jul 13:29]
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No, haven’t looked at their accounts, however don’t remember WestHam being under any investigation for FFP last year, maybe wrong?
This year, they have sold two players for roughly £140m, which will cover the loss of Premier League payments, even before they receive Parachute Payments.
Either they have been lucky holding their nerve to get top dollar for two young first team players or other clubs don’t believe that they are in financial crisis? I can’t remember any low ball offers for their players.
They may sell further players, however do think they still have a decent squad, that can cope with the Championship. | | | |
| Crazy squad takes on 14:15 - Jul 29 with 1039 views | Smoresy |
I didn't sense a strong attachment for much of last season among your average fan, possibly borne out in how few player songs were heard. Goodwill picked up a great deal towards the end aha. On some calling to keep those names as core players, more a case of brave optimism maybe? Hirst is a sentimental OG but received loads of criticism himself last year.
Agree with you on how tough it will be and how enormous the jump is. | | | |
| Crazy squad takes on 14:48 - Jul 29 with 902 views | SuffolkPunchFC |
| Crazy squad takes on 13:41 - Jul 29 by Dennyx4 |
No, haven’t looked at their accounts, however don’t remember WestHam being under any investigation for FFP last year, maybe wrong?
This year, they have sold two players for roughly £140m, which will cover the loss of Premier League payments, even before they receive Parachute Payments.
Either they have been lucky holding their nerve to get top dollar for two young first team players or other clubs don’t believe that they are in financial crisis? I can’t remember any low ball offers for their players.
They may sell further players, however do think they still have a decent squad, that can cope with the Championship. |
Did you click through my detailed breakdown of where they are?
FFP is no more, and is replaced by SCR. This is the revenue : squad costs ratio. Should be 85% or less. West Ham were 183% last accounts. This has to drop massively, to be compliant on a significantly lower baseline revenue figure.
Only profit helps with revenue, so ~£70M. That covers the "difference" between PL distributions and the parachute payment, but doesn't help address getting the SCR ratio from 183% to below 85%.
It is a massive hole to stay compliant. They probably need to find another £30-50M in player trading "profit" to get where they need to be. For their existing squad costs (adjusted for the offloaded players), they need around £275M revenue to achieve an 85% costs : revenue ratio.
I may be way off the mark, but think their squad will look very different by Sept 1st. If you think any of my numbers are out, please feel free to show me where. | | | |
| Crazy squad takes on 14:56 - Jul 29 with 855 views | IPSWICHFANITFC |
I feel what people are sometimes forgetting is that it is the squad that McKenna built (excluding from the new additions this summer since GON has been in charge).
There will be players that GON will want to keep and some that he does not see in his plans moving forwards. This could be irrespective of whether they are good enough or not, I guess.
Take the Philogene news as a possible example. From a neutral perspective, the question would be why does he want to leave now? Or have internal conversations gone on between GON & player + agent to say Philogene does not sit in GON plans for this season, therefore, best solution is to sell the player, and the club brings in a decent fee to utilise towards improving the squad. |  |
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| Crazy squad takes on 15:18 - Jul 29 with 722 views | lurcher |
"Our signings last time we went up did not have the ambition required to keep us up"
Ability rather than ambition.
We were never staying up last time. This time we might scrape 17th. |  | | |
| Crazy squad takes on 15:58 - Jul 29 with 587 views | dirtyboy |
| Crazy squad takes on 15:18 - Jul 29 by lurcher |
"Our signings last time we went up did not have the ambition required to keep us up"
Ability rather than ambition.
We were never staying up last time. This time we might scrape 17th. |
You have to remember, whilst footballers are assets and can be traded, it doesn't make it an easy task to do.
Your so called lesser players (and I think that's a very harsh description of any professional player) still have contracts in place and you can't just 'get rid' as they have to have an offer to go elsewhere for at least the same money or why bother?
So whilst we're hunting for new players, you don't want to end up in a situation where there's 30+ players with a large swathe of them moping about as they're not part of the named squad.
My thoughts.
We're still a way short of where we'd ideally like to be, but, I have to believe that, Diop, Scherpen, Maeda, Matusiwa, Fatawu, Emersonn are better players in terms of what we had last time starting in the Prem.
We have to hope that J Clarke, Burns, McAteer, Hirst, Taylor, O'Shea, Davis, Greaves, Johnson are all better players from having had a year in the Prem previously and continued to improve.
You want to think that Nunez and Mehmeti will relish the opportunity and could prove themselves (just don't know)
I'm sure we'll see another striker in the door, probably another CB, LB and perhaps two in CM.
4 more players? Don't think we'll see the full squad together until later in the window and undoubtedly we'll have people moaning at Ashton for not getting our work done sooner.
Same old, same old.
Need a little hope, and unlike 24/25, I have some. That year, it was just "lets enjoy watching the other teams and if we sneak a win, all well and good"
This year, we know what to expect and no reason not to have a darn good go. |  | | |
| Crazy squad takes on 16:05 - Jul 29 with 548 views | lurcher |
| Crazy squad takes on 15:58 - Jul 29 by dirtyboy |
You have to remember, whilst footballers are assets and can be traded, it doesn't make it an easy task to do.
Your so called lesser players (and I think that's a very harsh description of any professional player) still have contracts in place and you can't just 'get rid' as they have to have an offer to go elsewhere for at least the same money or why bother?
So whilst we're hunting for new players, you don't want to end up in a situation where there's 30+ players with a large swathe of them moping about as they're not part of the named squad.
My thoughts.
We're still a way short of where we'd ideally like to be, but, I have to believe that, Diop, Scherpen, Maeda, Matusiwa, Fatawu, Emersonn are better players in terms of what we had last time starting in the Prem.
We have to hope that J Clarke, Burns, McAteer, Hirst, Taylor, O'Shea, Davis, Greaves, Johnson are all better players from having had a year in the Prem previously and continued to improve.
You want to think that Nunez and Mehmeti will relish the opportunity and could prove themselves (just don't know)
I'm sure we'll see another striker in the door, probably another CB, LB and perhaps two in CM.
4 more players? Don't think we'll see the full squad together until later in the window and undoubtedly we'll have people moaning at Ashton for not getting our work done sooner.
Same old, same old.
Need a little hope, and unlike 24/25, I have some. That year, it was just "lets enjoy watching the other teams and if we sneak a win, all well and good"
This year, we know what to expect and no reason not to have a darn good go. |
I agree with that.
I can see 1 possibly 2 CBs turning up, if we go 3 at the back.
We need 2 or 3 CMs if Taylor goes
A RB/RWB and LB/LWB
And another striker
But we are going to have to move players on by way of a loan or sale. | | | |
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