| Past Refereeing v modern refereeing & VAR 11:29 - Sep 29 with 999 views | Overtheborderblue |
All Senior ITFC supporters still remember 1974 Clive Thomas FA semi final decision, but in the past we debated ref decisions over a pint after the game , maybe 30 secs from Jimmy Hill on match of the day and that was it!
Against modern day media dissecting of every single one , in the past we shrugged our shoulders and moved on.
What I am really trying to get to is ‘ Was football and club more important to a supporter in 1960’70 than a supporter in 2026? |  | | |  |
| Past Refereeing v modern refereeing & VAR on 11:58 - Sep 29 with 938 views | peterleeblue |
Most games weren't even televised.
Fans at the game had one look , same as the ref from much further away. Hardly unusual that in reality no one actually had a clue what had happened.
Watching Big Match Revisited - Refs took up some really strange position compared to today!! |  | | |
| Past Refereeing v modern refereeing & VAR on 12:23 - Sep 29 with 885 views | Basuco |
The big difference is that in the past referee's would cover much more of the pitch, they would go into both penalty area's and run a diagonal line to cover the parts of the pitch where there are no linesman. These days they run up and down the centre of the pitch rarely going past the edge of each penalty box D. Also the linesman would be much more proactive in in giving decisions in "their" quarter of the pitch, whereas these days the ref will give most if not all decisions all over the pitch, even when the assistants are much closer. The big problem with the modern referee' is how two VAR referee's watching repeated slow motion replay's still manage to make a large number of errors, I also think standards of refereeing have dropped significantly in the last few years at the top level. |  | | |
| Past Refereeing v modern refereeing & VAR on 12:28 - Sep 29 with 869 views | Overtheborderblue |
But who did it matter more to if anyone?
We listen and watch endless replays of all decisions including throw ins , debate , Expert pundits dissect in micro slo mo , radio phone ins go on for hours.
I do not believe VAR has made one scrap of difference to the live football supporter to their enjoyment of the game only destroyed their live in match enjoyment . At kick off at next live game we have moved on , forgotten living the moment and got on with our lives. | | | |
| Past Refereeing v modern refereeing & VAR on 12:44 - Sep 29 with 831 views | homer_123 |
| Past Refereeing v modern refereeing & VAR on 12:23 - Sep 29 by Basuco |
The big difference is that in the past referee's would cover much more of the pitch, they would go into both penalty area's and run a diagonal line to cover the parts of the pitch where there are no linesman. These days they run up and down the centre of the pitch rarely going past the edge of each penalty box D. Also the linesman would be much more proactive in in giving decisions in "their" quarter of the pitch, whereas these days the ref will give most if not all decisions all over the pitch, even when the assistants are much closer. The big problem with the modern referee' is how two VAR referee's watching repeated slow motion replay's still manage to make a large number of errors, I also think standards of refereeing have dropped significantly in the last few years at the top level. |
VAR was brought in on the pretence of reducing errors.
All it does it magnify and make worse those that are left. Moreover, it has ruined an integral part of the game and enjoyment/ frustration of it.
It needs to go - it would one of the single best things football could do right now. Get rid of VAR.
I was against it's introduction as it sucks the joy out of the game experience but also, decision errors are part and parcel of the game - every club has a Clive Thomas and these things 'bond' supporters. They are the water cooler moments, the moments that never leave. They actually make football what it is. |  |
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| Past Refereeing v modern refereeing & VAR on 12:51 - Sep 29 with 819 views | OldFart71 |
Yes I remember Thomas well. I went to Stamford Bridge that night. Personally I'd say a brown envelope was involved. It wasn't a pleasant experience having to get the tube back to Liverpool Street with a load of Hammers fans singing "I'm forever blowing bubbles".
But then VAR seems no better. It appears that whatever rules they can turn up to justify a decision gets used and a lot of it is still opinion and bias. | | | |
| Past Refereeing v modern refereeing & VAR on 12:59 - Sep 29 with 804 views | homer_123 |
| Past Refereeing v modern refereeing & VAR on 12:51 - Sep 29 by OldFart71 |
Yes I remember Thomas well. I went to Stamford Bridge that night. Personally I'd say a brown envelope was involved. It wasn't a pleasant experience having to get the tube back to Liverpool Street with a load of Hammers fans singing "I'm forever blowing bubbles".
But then VAR seems no better. It appears that whatever rules they can turn up to justify a decision gets used and a lot of it is still opinion and bias. |
So, better to just embrace them and have them become lore and part of your Clubs history and culture. IMO | |
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| Past Refereeing v modern refereeing & VAR on 14:17 - Sep 29 with 714 views | Overtheborderblue |
Even if VAR worked 100% and eliminated all errors I still do not believe it enhances the football supporter live game experience, its fantastic skills by our players, it’s errors made by the players , officials the fan next to me who call the player by the wrong name or no idea of the laws , the outpouring of emotion as the ball his the net that makes the game .
The disappointment when the Lino’s flag is raised , this is what the football experience is all about.
We then move on .
VAR does not add one little % to the football fans experience! | | | |
| Past Refereeing v modern refereeing & VAR on 14:28 - Sep 29 with 701 views | lowhouseblue |
| Past Refereeing v modern refereeing & VAR on 14:17 - Sep 29 by Overtheborderblue |
Even if VAR worked 100% and eliminated all errors I still do not believe it enhances the football supporter live game experience, its fantastic skills by our players, it’s errors made by the players , officials the fan next to me who call the player by the wrong name or no idea of the laws , the outpouring of emotion as the ball his the net that makes the game .
The disappointment when the Lino’s flag is raised , this is what the football experience is all about.
We then move on .
VAR does not add one little % to the football fans experience! |
also injustice is part of the experience. things like clive thomas become the stuff of myth and legand. every club has them. we're still talking about it 50+ years on. in the great scheme of things they didn't detract from the game they added to the excitement of it. |  |
| And so as the loose-bowelled pigeon of time swoops low over the unsuspecting tourist of destiny, and the flatulent skunk of fate wanders into the air-conditioning system of eternity, I notice it's the end of the show |
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| Past Refereeing v modern refereeing & VAR on 14:39 - Sep 29 with 681 views | Blueschev |
52 years later and my dad is yet to move on from that night! |  | | |
| Past Refereeing v modern refereeing & VAR on 14:46 - Sep 29 with 667 views | Churchman |
| Past Refereeing v modern refereeing & VAR on 14:17 - Sep 29 by Overtheborderblue |
Even if VAR worked 100% and eliminated all errors I still do not believe it enhances the football supporter live game experience, its fantastic skills by our players, it’s errors made by the players , officials the fan next to me who call the player by the wrong name or no idea of the laws , the outpouring of emotion as the ball his the net that makes the game .
The disappointment when the Lino’s flag is raised , this is what the football experience is all about.
We then move on .
VAR does not add one little % to the football fans experience! |
Agree with this. Football is about the rhythm of the game, it’s ebb and flow and ‘those’ moments like Wark’s third against West Brom etc. outpouring of emotion it’s about human error too. Always was.
Does the game mean more now than it did then? I don’t think so any more than the passion of say fans of a small club like Morecambe is any less than those who follow Newcastle.
I’d say that by and large, people were more tolerant if bad errors, bad tackle, rotten weather, rotting grounds and pitches like the Thames estuary at low tide. It was ‘the game’.
Where outrageous stuff happened like the Clive Thomas decisions in 1975, they hurt then and they do now. There were other contentious events like Leeds v WBA when they were going for the title and ‘the goal that never was’.
For those that don’t know it, Chelsea v Ipswich in about 1971. Ball is hit and looks like it’s gone in after hitting the metal stanchion supporting the goal post and coming out. The ball though as photo evidence proved went the other side of the goalpost before hitting the stanchion and coming out. Chelsea won 2-1. It made the papers, but no real fuss was made. It was deemed one of those things. Human error. |  | | |
| Past Refereeing v modern refereeing & VAR on 15:36 - Sep 29 with 604 views | oldburian |
I was a referee around the time of the Clive Thomas era and was at Stamford Bridge that night. Thomas would say to the linemen, as we were in those days, just tell me when the ball goes out of play and I will give everything else. If you look at the clip the lineman is running back to the centre and then turns back to stand in line. Clive Thomas did very well out of refereeing but lost his international earnings after a Brazil World Cup match when he whistled for time when a Brazil corner was in the air prior to Brazil ‘scoring’. He also upset West Ham in a League Cup final allowing a goal against them and West Brom in our semifinal in sending off one of them. He liked a bit on controversy. | | | |
| Past Refereeing v modern refereeing & VAR on 17:54 - Sep 29 with 537 views | Bluespeed225 |
| Past Refereeing v modern refereeing & VAR on 15:36 - Sep 29 by oldburian |
I was a referee around the time of the Clive Thomas era and was at Stamford Bridge that night. Thomas would say to the linemen, as we were in those days, just tell me when the ball goes out of play and I will give everything else. If you look at the clip the lineman is running back to the centre and then turns back to stand in line. Clive Thomas did very well out of refereeing but lost his international earnings after a Brazil World Cup match when he whistled for time when a Brazil corner was in the air prior to Brazil ‘scoring’. He also upset West Ham in a League Cup final allowing a goal against them and West Brom in our semifinal in sending off one of them. He liked a bit on controversy. |
Did for Everton in 77’ semi too! And the player involved….Bryan Hamilton, poor bloke! | | | |
| Past Refereeing v modern refereeing & VAR on 18:58 - Sep 29 with 502 views | armchaircritic59 |
| Past Refereeing v modern refereeing & VAR on 12:44 - Sep 29 by homer_123 |
VAR was brought in on the pretence of reducing errors.
All it does it magnify and make worse those that are left. Moreover, it has ruined an integral part of the game and enjoyment/ frustration of it.
It needs to go - it would one of the single best things football could do right now. Get rid of VAR.
I was against it's introduction as it sucks the joy out of the game experience but also, decision errors are part and parcel of the game - every club has a Clive Thomas and these things 'bond' supporters. They are the water cooler moments, the moments that never leave. They actually make football what it is. |
Great post. I'm most definitely not a luddite, I welcome technology when it genuinely improves things and makes life easier ( in football and life ), VAR however does not. It just adds another team of " officials " to the team that is already out on the pitch. Yep, bin it, ASAP. |  | | |
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