| Well done Ed Davey (n/t) 11:52 - Aug 27 with 1606 views | Keno |
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| Well done Ed Davey (n/t) on 11:55 - Aug 27 with 1371 views | tractordownsouth |
I'm closer to Moran on the political spectrum but I'm happy Davey has won. 18 of the 20 Lib Dem targets are Tory held so the people they need to win over to kick the Tories out are probably more likely to vote for a party led by Ed Davey. |  |
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| Well done Ed Davey (n/t) on 12:07 - Aug 27 with 1349 views | Keno |
| Well done Ed Davey (n/t) on 11:55 - Aug 27 by tractordownsouth |
I'm closer to Moran on the political spectrum but I'm happy Davey has won. 18 of the 20 Lib Dem targets are Tory held so the people they need to win over to kick the Tories out are probably more likely to vote for a party led by Ed Davey. |
It will be interesting to see how he gets on with Kier Starmner | |
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| Well done Ed Davey (n/t) on 12:14 - Aug 27 with 1342 views | GlasgowBlue |
| Well done Ed Davey (n/t) on 11:55 - Aug 27 by tractordownsouth |
I'm closer to Moran on the political spectrum but I'm happy Davey has won. 18 of the 20 Lib Dem targets are Tory held so the people they need to win over to kick the Tories out are probably more likely to vote for a party led by Ed Davey. |
Pale, stale and male.
Although I really liked Layla Moran I saw somebody comment, "Layla Moran was even took bonkers for the LibDems". |  |
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| Well done Ed Davey (n/t) on 12:19 - Aug 27 with 1325 views | Keno |
| Well done Ed Davey (n/t) on 12:14 - Aug 27 by GlasgowBlue |
Pale, stale and male.
Although I really liked Layla Moran I saw somebody comment, "Layla Moran was even took bonkers for the LibDems". |
well we've gone from the Paul Hurst of politics to someone I hope isnt Paul Lambert!!
Had Swinson not done so badly Moran may have had more chance | |
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| Well done Ed Davey (n/t) on 12:22 - Aug 27 with 1317 views | WeWereZombies |
| Well done Ed Davey (n/t) on 12:19 - Aug 27 by Keno |
well we've gone from the Paul Hurst of politics to someone I hope isnt Paul Lambert!!
Had Swinson not done so badly Moran may have had more chance |
I wonder if the last general election was held now, with all the history we have had in the last six months but the same party leaders, would Swinson have done so badly? |  |
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| Well done Ed Davey (n/t) on 12:25 - Aug 27 with 1311 views | Keno |
| Well done Ed Davey (n/t) on 12:22 - Aug 27 by WeWereZombies |
I wonder if the last general election was held now, with all the history we have had in the last six months but the same party leaders, would Swinson have done so badly? |
If she took the line she did then yes and rightly so.
Being the "not brexit' was a huge mistake. I said so at the time and stand by that. | |
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| Well done Ed Davey (n/t) on 12:30 - Aug 27 with 1299 views | WeWereZombies |
| Well done Ed Davey (n/t) on 12:25 - Aug 27 by Keno |
If she took the line she did then yes and rightly so.
Being the "not brexit' was a huge mistake. I said so at the time and stand by that. |
But it was an honest statement of the way her party felt, much more honest than either Johnson or Corbyn could manage. The nub of your position is to say that the United Kingdom does not appreciate honesty. | |
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| Well done Ed Davey (n/t) on 12:44 - Aug 27 with 1270 views | Enigma_Blue |
| Well done Ed Davey (n/t) on 12:30 - Aug 27 by WeWereZombies |
But it was an honest statement of the way her party felt, much more honest than either Johnson or Corbyn could manage. The nub of your position is to say that the United Kingdom does not appreciate honesty. |
They can't call themselves the Liberal Democrats then come out saying they want to stop Brexit by ignoring the result of the referendum which a majority voted for. There is nothing Democratic about that. |  | | |
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| Well done Ed Davey (n/t) on 12:47 - Aug 27 with 1258 views | Keno |
| Well done Ed Davey (n/t) on 12:30 - Aug 27 by WeWereZombies |
But it was an honest statement of the way her party felt, much more honest than either Johnson or Corbyn could manage. The nub of your position is to say that the United Kingdom does not appreciate honesty. |
It may have been an honest statement but the way it was put across was lets just say naive and the seemed as 'one policy' as the brexit party
We are supposed to be democrats and yet stood up on a singularly undemocratic platform which completely undermined everything else
Between us ands labour we gave the tories a free pass
The second referendum line would have been better. | |
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| Well done Ed Davey (n/t) on 12:52 - Aug 27 with 1242 views | Plums |
| Well done Ed Davey (n/t) on 12:47 - Aug 27 by Keno |
It may have been an honest statement but the way it was put across was lets just say naive and the seemed as 'one policy' as the brexit party
We are supposed to be democrats and yet stood up on a singularly undemocratic platform which completely undermined everything else
Between us ands labour we gave the tories a free pass
The second referendum line would have been better. |
Upvoted by mistake! I think the second referendum would have been an even bigger disaster. The line to take was legal and moral challenge to all the leave side did during the referendum. By constantly shining a light on that, there was a chance. By focussing on overturning the result, it was always going to look like sore losers.
I voted for Layla in the end but I like Ed, he’s an ordinary lad done well. It’s just a shame he has the coalition baggage to deal with but as was said earlier, he stands a good chanced in the Tory marginals. |  |
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| Well done Ed Davey (n/t) on 12:57 - Aug 27 with 1240 views | GlasgowBlue |
This hasn't gone down very well with a former Lib Dem candidate.
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| Well done Ed Davey (n/t) on 13:12 - Aug 27 with 1207 views | tractordownsouth |
| Well done Ed Davey (n/t) on 12:14 - Aug 27 by GlasgowBlue |
Pale, stale and male.
Although I really liked Layla Moran I saw somebody comment, "Layla Moran was even took bonkers for the LibDems". |
I agree he wasn't a great candidate but where would Moran have fitted on the political spectrum?
She would have crowded the space Labour have already moved into and split the vote when the Lib Dems need to win over moderate Tory voters in middle class areas | |
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| Well done Ed Davey (n/t) on 14:18 - Aug 27 with 1159 views | GlasgowBlue |
| Well done Ed Davey (n/t) on 13:12 - Aug 27 by tractordownsouth |
I agree he wasn't a great candidate but where would Moran have fitted on the political spectrum?
She would have crowded the space Labour have already moved into and split the vote when the Lib Dems need to win over moderate Tory voters in middle class areas |
As a Palestinian woman who has called out the rise in antisemitism, she'd have been an ideal choice to blindside Corbyn. With Starmer it's a completely different picture.
But I do get the feeling that Davey and Starmer will be seen as being too similar in style and presentation, if not so much on policy. | |
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| Well done Ed Davey (n/t) on 14:53 - Aug 27 with 1122 views | WeWereZombies |
| Well done Ed Davey (n/t) on 12:44 - Aug 27 by Enigma_Blue |
They can't call themselves the Liberal Democrats then come out saying they want to stop Brexit by ignoring the result of the referendum which a majority voted for. There is nothing Democratic about that. |
Perhaps you should take a look at the results of the 2016 EU referendum - less than 38% of the electorate voted to Leave the European Union. Since then we have blindsided, cajoled, bullied and generally mistreated by politicians and much of the media alike (with honourable exceptions including William Keegan in The Observer and Kenneth Clarke, once of the Conservative Party) to try and get us to accept a minority decision. Many still do not, it is part of the British character to stand up to bullies.
However, the United Kingdom's aspirations to be the World's leading light for representative democracy is now very tarnished, perhaps irreparably. Furthermore, when the dust has settled (I wonder who is making such an effort to keep the clouds of obfustication in the air), we could see the further break up of the United Kingdom. 23rd of June, 2016 may prove to be one of the darkest days in our history as a group of four nations. | |
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| Well done Ed Davey (n/t) on 15:02 - Aug 27 with 1117 views | GlasgowBlue |
| Well done Ed Davey (n/t) on 14:53 - Aug 27 by WeWereZombies |
Perhaps you should take a look at the results of the 2016 EU referendum - less than 38% of the electorate voted to Leave the European Union. Since then we have blindsided, cajoled, bullied and generally mistreated by politicians and much of the media alike (with honourable exceptions including William Keegan in The Observer and Kenneth Clarke, once of the Conservative Party) to try and get us to accept a minority decision. Many still do not, it is part of the British character to stand up to bullies.
However, the United Kingdom's aspirations to be the World's leading light for representative democracy is now very tarnished, perhaps irreparably. Furthermore, when the dust has settled (I wonder who is making such an effort to keep the clouds of obfustication in the air), we could see the further break up of the United Kingdom. 23rd of June, 2016 may prove to be one of the darkest days in our history as a group of four nations. |
If you are going to fall back on zombie logic then could you tell us what was the percentage of the electorate who voted to remain in the EU?
edit. I've just checked. Only 34.73% of the electorate voted to remain in the European Union.
Consign zombie logic to the dustbin mate. It's flawed. [Post edited 27 Aug 2020 15:03]
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| Well done Ed Davey (n/t) on 15:05 - Aug 27 with 1111 views | WeWereZombies |
| Well done Ed Davey (n/t) on 15:02 - Aug 27 by GlasgowBlue |
If you are going to fall back on zombie logic then could you tell us what was the percentage of the electorate who voted to remain in the EU?
edit. I've just checked. Only 34.73% of the electorate voted to remain in the European Union.
Consign zombie logic to the dustbin mate. It's flawed. [Post edited 27 Aug 2020 15:03]
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So less than 38% constitutes a majority in your book? | |
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| Well done Ed Davey (n/t) on 15:09 - Aug 27 with 1103 views | GlasgowBlue |
| Well done Ed Davey (n/t) on 15:05 - Aug 27 by WeWereZombies |
So less than 38% constitutes a majority in your book? |
A majority of those who bothered to vote, voted to leave. If you use zombie logic, a higher percentage of the electorate (38%) voted to leave the EU than those who voted to remain (34.73%)
This really is
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| Well done Ed Davey (n/t) on 15:13 - Aug 27 with 1097 views | J2BLUE |
| Well done Ed Davey (n/t) on 15:05 - Aug 27 by WeWereZombies |
So less than 38% constitutes a majority in your book? |
You know full well what he's saying. I find it quite a daft argument that you're making. If people had the right to vote and didn't bother take the issue up with them. |  |
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| Well done Ed Davey (n/t) on 15:24 - Aug 27 with 1076 views | WeWereZombies |
| Well done Ed Davey (n/t) on 15:13 - Aug 27 by J2BLUE |
You know full well what he's saying. I find it quite a daft argument that you're making. If people had the right to vote and didn't bother take the issue up with them. |
It was, without a shadow of a doubt, an inconclusive result - whichever way one voted or did not vote. So the question that has not been answered is - why has the referendum result been trumpeted as 'an overwhelming majority' or 'the will of the people' when it so clearly was not? | |
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| Well done Ed Davey (n/t) on 15:26 - Aug 27 with 1068 views | Plums |
| Well done Ed Davey (n/t) on 15:02 - Aug 27 by GlasgowBlue |
If you are going to fall back on zombie logic then could you tell us what was the percentage of the electorate who voted to remain in the EU?
edit. I've just checked. Only 34.73% of the electorate voted to remain in the European Union.
Consign zombie logic to the dustbin mate. It's flawed. [Post edited 27 Aug 2020 15:03]
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If the referendum had had any proper governance around it, the slim margin of 52-48 would not have been enough to see the resolution pass. Cameron failed to construct it correctly and we have stared into the abyss ever since. | |
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| Well done Ed Davey (n/t) on 15:34 - Aug 27 with 1050 views | GlasgowBlue |
| Well done Ed Davey (n/t) on 15:26 - Aug 27 by Plums |
If the referendum had had any proper governance around it, the slim margin of 52-48 would not have been enough to see the resolution pass. Cameron failed to construct it correctly and we have stared into the abyss ever since. |
Indeed. But it didn't and we played the game knowing the rules beforehand.
I think it was unfair when Ipswich finished 3rd, ten points above 6th placed West Ham but went out in the play offs. But there is little point in trying to fight a battle that has been lost under the rules we all agreed at the start. | |
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| Well done Ed Davey (n/t) on 15:37 - Aug 27 with 1040 views | Keno |
| Well done Ed Davey (n/t) on 15:34 - Aug 27 by GlasgowBlue |
Indeed. But it didn't and we played the game knowing the rules beforehand.
I think it was unfair when Ipswich finished 3rd, ten points above 6th placed West Ham but went out in the play offs. But there is little point in trying to fight a battle that has been lost under the rules we all agreed at the start. |
although you could argue in that anaiogy at least both teams did abide by the rules and conducted themselves with the law
can the same be said of the referundum? | |
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| Well done Ed Davey (n/t) on 15:40 - Aug 27 with 1032 views | J2BLUE |
| Well done Ed Davey (n/t) on 15:24 - Aug 27 by WeWereZombies |
It was, without a shadow of a doubt, an inconclusive result - whichever way one voted or did not vote. So the question that has not been answered is - why has the referendum result been trumpeted as 'an overwhelming majority' or 'the will of the people' when it so clearly was not? |
Propaganda. I don't think anyone is denying that. | |
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| Well done Ed Davey (n/t) on 15:59 - Aug 27 with 1001 views | tractordownsouth |
| Well done Ed Davey (n/t) on 15:05 - Aug 27 by WeWereZombies |
So less than 38% constitutes a majority in your book? |
There are all sorts of questionable aspects of the referendum with lies and potential foreign interference, but that 38% argument is a weak one. No government has ever won support of 50% of the electorate - it's about who turns out to vote. | |
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| Well done Ed Davey (n/t) on 16:13 - Aug 27 with 976 views | Plums |
| Well done Ed Davey (n/t) on 15:59 - Aug 27 by tractordownsouth |
There are all sorts of questionable aspects of the referendum with lies and potential foreign interference, but that 38% argument is a weak one. No government has ever won support of 50% of the electorate - it's about who turns out to vote. |
Great point on a Lib Dem thread. The system is fatally flawed and biased towards the maintenance of the status quo. | |
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