| What is it with Israel and the dark arts? on 09:27 - Feb 15 with 1619 views | Guthrum |
Probably derives from a situation where their neighbours were trying to crush them as a state from the moment of inception, following on from centuries of persecution and officially-sanctioned murder. That history is going to affect one's mindset. |  |
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| What is it with Israel and the dark arts? on 10:09 - Feb 15 with 1581 views | vilanovablue |
The Pegasus doc on BBC4 last night was thoroughly depressing on a similar note. |  | | |
| What is it with Israel and the dark arts? on 13:39 - Feb 15 with 1530 views | BanksterDebtSlave |
| What is it with Israel and the dark arts? on 10:09 - Feb 15 by vilanovablue |
The Pegasus doc on BBC4 last night was thoroughly depressing on a similar note. |
But at least we can rest assured that the Israeli state would have no truck with any dirty tricks should a pro Palestinian voice from the left in our, or any other, country get close to power. |  |
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| What is it with Israel and the dark arts? on 13:51 - Feb 15 with 1518 views | SuperKieranMcKenna |
| What is it with Israel and the dark arts? on 13:39 - Feb 15 by BanksterDebtSlave |
But at least we can rest assured that the Israeli state would have no truck with any dirty tricks should a pro Palestinian voice from the left in our, or any other, country get close to power. |
Indeed, especially if said candidate had done regular paid work for a neighbouring state who openly want to “wipe Israel from the map”. |  | | |
| What is it with Israel and the dark arts? on 14:35 - Feb 15 with 1495 views | BanksterDebtSlave |
| What is it with Israel and the dark arts? on 13:51 - Feb 15 by SuperKieranMcKenna |
Indeed, especially if said candidate had done regular paid work for a neighbouring state who openly want to “wipe Israel from the map”. |
Well yes of course, especially then. | |
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| What is it with Israel and the dark arts? on 15:19 - Feb 15 with 1466 views | Radlett_blue |
| What is it with Israel and the dark arts? on 09:27 - Feb 15 by Guthrum |
Probably derives from a situation where their neighbours were trying to crush them as a state from the moment of inception, following on from centuries of persecution and officially-sanctioned murder. That history is going to affect one's mindset. |
Exactly. Whatever the rights & wrongs of Israel/Palestine, the country (which isn't going to disappear btw) is surrounded by near sworn enemies so Israeil has been highly motivated to create one of the world's best security systems. |  |
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| What is it with Israel and the dark arts? on 18:15 - Feb 15 with 1332 views | factual_blue |
Goebbels would be so proud. |  |
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| What is it with Israel and the dark arts? on 18:47 - Feb 15 with 1312 views | Ryorry |
| What is it with Israel and the dark arts? on 09:27 - Feb 15 by Guthrum |
Probably derives from a situation where their neighbours were trying to crush them as a state from the moment of inception, following on from centuries of persecution and officially-sanctioned murder. That history is going to affect one's mindset. |
Having spent 7 months there in my yoof (working on 3 different kibbutzim deliberately to see what it was like on Golan Heights; + near Tel Aviv - if you ate a Ha Ogen melon in the spring of 1970, I may have planted, weeded or harvested it; - plus the Negev desert) - that was spot-on back then & I imagine hasn't changed much. Also spent a couple of weeks with non-kibbutz people in their Tel-Aviv flat.
I'd anticipated fear & a defensive mindset amongst Israelis, but found those things absolutely permeated & dominated all their lives on a daily basis to a degree I hadn't expected. It meant they were also chauvinistic to a degree I found hard to take - imagine being suddenly transplanted into The Den & living entirely amongst Millwall fans!
There was a 90min BBC4 docu on 'Pegasus' last night on BBC4 at 10pm called 'The Spy in your Mobile' -
https://www.bbc.co.uk/iplayer/episode/m001j638/storyville-the-spy-in-your-mobile
Edit: Apols Vilanova, hadn't spotted that you'd already mentioned the Pegasus docu. [Post edited 16 Feb 2023 12:34]
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| What is it with Israel and the dark arts? on 20:03 - Feb 15 with 1266 views | BanksterDebtSlave |
Nope the dark arts is social media manipulation, or is it only bad when the Russians do it? | |
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| What is it with Israel and the dark arts? on 20:29 - Feb 15 with 1235 views | GlasgowBlue |
Banksy seems to have a problem with the world’s only Jewish state. China is committing real genocide against the Uyghur Muslims? Not a peep. Russia removes a half a million Chechen Muslims in an act of ethnic cleansing? Banksy has no comment. Assad bombs a refugee camp killing more Palestinians in one hit than Israel had in five years? Wrong type of Palestinian mate.
Sounds very much like applying double standards by requiring of it a behavior not expected or demanded of any other democratic nation.
And you’re right. He’s straying into problematic language by suggesting the Israeli state were behind the allegations of antisemitism against Labour under Corbyn. |  |
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| What is it with Israel and the dark arts? on 20:37 - Feb 15 with 1227 views | MattinLondon |
| What is it with Israel and the dark arts? on 20:29 - Feb 15 by GlasgowBlue |
Banksy seems to have a problem with the world’s only Jewish state. China is committing real genocide against the Uyghur Muslims? Not a peep. Russia removes a half a million Chechen Muslims in an act of ethnic cleansing? Banksy has no comment. Assad bombs a refugee camp killing more Palestinians in one hit than Israel had in five years? Wrong type of Palestinian mate.
Sounds very much like applying double standards by requiring of it a behavior not expected or demanded of any other democratic nation.
And you’re right. He’s straying into problematic language by suggesting the Israeli state were behind the allegations of antisemitism against Labour under Corbyn. |
So are you saying that unless a poster is critical about all wrongs then that poster shouldn’t comment about one particular wrong? Maybe they simply know more about one particular issue than others. |  | | |
| What is it with Israel and the dark arts? on 20:42 - Feb 15 with 1208 views | GlasgowBlue |
| What is it with Israel and the dark arts? on 20:37 - Feb 15 by MattinLondon |
So are you saying that unless a poster is critical about all wrongs then that poster shouldn’t comment about one particular wrong? Maybe they simply know more about one particular issue than others. |
“ applying double standards by requiring of it a behavior not expected or demanded of any other democratic nation.”. | |
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| What is it with Israel and the dark arts? on 21:30 - Feb 15 with 1133 views | DJR |
| What is it with Israel and the dark arts? on 20:42 - Feb 15 by GlasgowBlue |
“ applying double standards by requiring of it a behavior not expected or demanded of any other democratic nation.”. |
The words you quote come from the IHRA definition of antisemitism but the key word is "democratic".
The examples you quoted in the earlier post are countries which are not democratic, and I think we are entitled to expect better behaviour of a democratic nation like Israel than the countries you list.
For what it is worth, I think Israel is entitled to a little leeway, given the history of persecution of the Jewish people, and the fact that Israel is surrounded by some hostile countries.
But I don't think they are entitled to too much leeway, so condemnation of things when they do things which do not accord with international law, which put in jeopardy the two-state solution or do not accord with the values of fellow democratic nations seems perfectly OK to me.
I might add that yesterday the US, Canada, Germany, Italy, France and the UK issued a joint statement condemning proposed Israeli settlements. I heard this on the World Service overnight, but as with much of the reporting of Israel, I can see nothing about this in the UK media.
https://www.reuters.com/world/middle-east/israels-ben-gvir-says-wants-more-settl [Post edited 16 Feb 2023 8:50]
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| What is it with Israel and the dark arts? on 21:41 - Feb 15 with 1084 views | BanksterDebtSlave |
| What is it with Israel and the dark arts? on 20:42 - Feb 15 by GlasgowBlue |
“ applying double standards by requiring of it a behavior not expected or demanded of any other democratic nation.”. |
Did you even read the op?
This is not behavior I would expect of any (democratic) state....
"Hanan appears to have run at least some of his disinformation operations through an Israeli company, Demoman International, which is registered on a website run by the Israeli Ministry of Defense to promote defence exports. The Israeli MoD did not respond to requests for comment."
Edit...and at least I didn't bring Hitler into it!!
Edit 2....and if you don't believe the Israeli state got involved in the Corbyn stuff (bearing in mind the linked article) then you are politically naive....but you aren't are you....so let's go with disingenuous. [Post edited 15 Feb 2023 21:45]
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| [Redacted] on 22:14 - Feb 15 with 1009 views | victorywilhappen |
| What is it with Israel and the dark arts? on 20:03 - Feb 15 by BanksterDebtSlave |
Nope the dark arts is social media manipulation, or is it only bad when the Russians do it? |
[Redacted] |  | | |
| What is it with Israel and the dark arts? on 00:04 - Feb 16 with 889 views | Bluespeed225 |
MATZOI, now they were they real deal! | | | |
| What is it with Israel and the dark arts? on 11:02 - Feb 16 with 750 views | Blueschev |
| What is it with Israel and the dark arts? on 20:42 - Feb 15 by GlasgowBlue |
“ applying double standards by requiring of it a behavior not expected or demanded of any other democratic nation.”. |
That sentence is just drivel. |  | | |
| What is it with Israel and the dark arts? on 11:17 - Feb 16 with 717 views | Nthsuffolkblue |
| What is it with Israel and the dark arts? on 09:27 - Feb 15 by Guthrum |
Probably derives from a situation where their neighbours were trying to crush them as a state from the moment of inception, following on from centuries of persecution and officially-sanctioned murder. That history is going to affect one's mindset. |
In many respects it is a pale comparison, but I guess those of us who can remember how the IRA bombing campaign affected the UK and our policies in policing Northern Ireland using the army would be relevant. However, the path to peace there did lie in proper negotiation and finding solutions. |  |
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