| France are having no luck. on 18:01 - Jul 18 with 697 views | monytowbray |
| France are having no luck. on 17:59 - Jul 18 by jeera |
He didn't miss any point.
He has beliefs that you and I don't share with him, but that doesn't mean he shouldn't be treated with some respect.
He is entitled to stand up for those beliefs without being belittled. |
His belief he’s pointing out is a million miles from the point being made, that was my point.
Organised religion. Religious belief. These are not interchangable. Understand that and it helps. |  |
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| France are having no luck. on 18:03 - Jul 18 with 696 views | Shawsey |
| France are having no luck. on 13:11 - Jul 18 by monytowbray |
Churches should be museums or destroyed.
Organised religion is a cancer (although I respect people’s right to believe in what they want if they don’t hurt others, but organised religion is arguably more corrupt than our current government. |
I am a bit confused by your comment. Surely people have a right to believe or not. Churches are a place of worship. To my limited knowledge on the subject, the French are a free society. As for all churches to be destroyed or change of use, I find that one baffling. Like I say,  |  | | |
| France are having no luck. on 18:04 - Jul 18 with 683 views | SpruceMoose |
| France are having no luck. on 17:59 - Jul 18 by jeera |
He didn't miss any point.
He has beliefs that you and I don't share with him, but that doesn't mean he shouldn't be treated with some respect.
He is entitled to stand up for those beliefs without being belittled. |
Aye. And it cuts both ways too.
It shouldn't be anymore complicated than:
'Be free to believe whatever you like, and live your life peacefully however you wish, right up to the point where you try to push those beliefs onto the people who don't share them. In return, I'll leave you the heck alone to go about your business too'.
Nobody should be knocking churches down. [Post edited 18 Jul 2020 18:08]
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| Pronouns: He/Him/His.
"Imagine being a heterosexual white male in Britain at this moment. How bad is that. Everything you say is racist, everything you say is homophobic. The Woke community have really f****d this country." | | Poll: | Selectamod |
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| France are having no luck. on 18:06 - Jul 18 with 678 views | monytowbray |
| France are having no luck. on 18:03 - Jul 18 by Shawsey |
I am a bit confused by your comment. Surely people have a right to believe or not. Churches are a place of worship. To my limited knowledge on the subject, the French are a free society. As for all churches to be destroyed or change of use, I find that one baffling. Like I say, |
I’ll make this very clear.
Organised religion is a power structure. Religious belief is what someone beliefs.
Opposing power structures is not oppression. The opposite in fact.
My comments are nothing to do with religious beliefs or anyone’s right to believe.
I did say that I respect people’s right to religious beliefs in the earlier post when I made the statement. | |
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| France are having no luck. on 18:07 - Jul 18 with 665 views | SpruceMoose |
| France are having no luck. on 18:06 - Jul 18 by monytowbray |
I’ll make this very clear.
Organised religion is a power structure. Religious belief is what someone beliefs.
Opposing power structures is not oppression. The opposite in fact.
My comments are nothing to do with religious beliefs or anyone’s right to believe.
I did say that I respect people’s right to religious beliefs in the earlier post when I made the statement. |
I agree with your general principle. I think this might have been one of those occasions where the delivery of said point might have needed a little tidying up, and a little less passion! [Post edited 18 Jul 2020 18:09]
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| Pronouns: He/Him/His.
"Imagine being a heterosexual white male in Britain at this moment. How bad is that. Everything you say is racist, everything you say is homophobic. The Woke community have really f****d this country." | | Poll: | Selectamod |
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| France are having no luck. on 18:08 - Jul 18 with 664 views | Shawsey |
| France are having no luck. on 18:06 - Jul 18 by monytowbray |
I’ll make this very clear.
Organised religion is a power structure. Religious belief is what someone beliefs.
Opposing power structures is not oppression. The opposite in fact.
My comments are nothing to do with religious beliefs or anyone’s right to believe.
I did say that I respect people’s right to religious beliefs in the earlier post when I made the statement. |
How are churches organised religion? | | | |
| France are having no luck. on 18:10 - Jul 18 with 648 views | monytowbray |
| France are having no luck. on 18:08 - Jul 18 by Shawsey |
How are churches organised religion? |
The same way offices are organised businesses my dude. | |
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| France are having no luck. on 18:11 - Jul 18 with 645 views | monytowbray |
| France are having no luck. on 18:07 - Jul 18 by SpruceMoose |
I agree with your general principle. I think this might have been one of those occasions where the delivery of said point might have needed a little tidying up, and a little less passion! [Post edited 18 Jul 2020 18:09]
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It’s hard not to be intense these days though. When the world’s curtain is lifted it’s like LOOK WHILST YOU CAN. | |
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| France are having no luck. on 18:13 - Jul 18 with 639 views | SpruceMoose |
| France are having no luck. on 18:10 - Jul 18 by monytowbray |
The same way offices are organised businesses my dude. |
Don't office buildings just tend to be where the activity of organised business takes place though?
An office space can be used for many things, business, charity, health services and in the same way a church can be used as a place of worship, a cultural hub or a community asset etc. | |
| Pronouns: He/Him/His.
"Imagine being a heterosexual white male in Britain at this moment. How bad is that. Everything you say is racist, everything you say is homophobic. The Woke community have really f****d this country." | | Poll: | Selectamod |
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| France are having no luck. on 18:14 - Jul 18 with 635 views | SpruceMoose |
| France are having no luck. on 18:11 - Jul 18 by monytowbray |
It’s hard not to be intense these days though. When the world’s curtain is lifted it’s like LOOK WHILST YOU CAN. |
Aye I get you. I have things that push my buttons too. I'm working on not letting that obscure any decent points I might have though. | |
| Pronouns: He/Him/His.
"Imagine being a heterosexual white male in Britain at this moment. How bad is that. Everything you say is racist, everything you say is homophobic. The Woke community have really f****d this country." | | Poll: | Selectamod |
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| France are having no luck. on 18:16 - Jul 18 with 629 views | Shawsey |
| France are having no luck. on 18:10 - Jul 18 by monytowbray |
The same way offices are organised businesses my dude. |
People are free to enter a church or not. People go to an office for work. I am either being very naïve here or I am missing the point completely. This was just a post about a cathedral on fire. | | | |
| France are having no luck. on 18:16 - Jul 18 with 628 views | monytowbray |
| France are having no luck. on 18:13 - Jul 18 by SpruceMoose |
Don't office buildings just tend to be where the activity of organised business takes place though?
An office space can be used for many things, business, charity, health services and in the same way a church can be used as a place of worship, a cultural hub or a community asset etc. |
Well a church can be that, but then so can a public space.
Charity is a failure of society after all, and often the financial inequality of organised religion is guilty of the “society” part.
I mean, it’s pretty easy to say “love thy neighbour” when you’re in an ivory tower without a financial worry in the world (in fact quite the opposite). | |
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| France are having no luck. on 18:17 - Jul 18 with 626 views | monytowbray |
| France are having no luck. on 18:16 - Jul 18 by Shawsey |
People are free to enter a church or not. People go to an office for work. I am either being very naïve here or I am missing the point completely. This was just a post about a cathedral on fire. |
This is going way over your head I’m afraid. Not to be rude, but we’re on different podiums. | |
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| France are having no luck. on 18:24 - Jul 18 with 616 views | Shawsey |
| France are having no luck. on 18:17 - Jul 18 by monytowbray |
This is going way over your head I’m afraid. Not to be rude, but we’re on different podiums. |
We certainly are, thankfully. You seem a little uptight about the world today. This was just a post about a cathedral on fire, not religion. I try not to get involved in religious matters. Religion is a very personal thing. I respect peoples right to believe in what they like. | | | |
| France are having no luck. on 18:29 - Jul 18 with 605 views | SpruceMoose |
| France are having no luck. on 18:16 - Jul 18 by monytowbray |
Well a church can be that, but then so can a public space.
Charity is a failure of society after all, and often the financial inequality of organised religion is guilty of the “society” part.
I mean, it’s pretty easy to say “love thy neighbour” when you’re in an ivory tower without a financial worry in the world (in fact quite the opposite). |
Is Christianity a huge driving force behind inequality in the UK these days though? Other than in Northern Ireland, does anyone give it much thought?
I can't recall ever feeling like Christianity directly impacted my day to day life in the slightest when I lived in England. Its kind of dying out isn't it? I would have said it was more political ideology that was behind our failing society in the main.
Anyhow, just be glad you don't live somewhere where religion has real clout! The Church of England are pussycats compared to some of the Evangelicals and Baptists out here! [Post edited 18 Jul 2020 18:30]
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| Pronouns: He/Him/His.
"Imagine being a heterosexual white male in Britain at this moment. How bad is that. Everything you say is racist, everything you say is homophobic. The Woke community have really f****d this country." | | Poll: | Selectamod |
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| France are having no luck. on 18:33 - Jul 18 with 598 views | monytowbray |
| France are having no luck. on 18:29 - Jul 18 by SpruceMoose |
Is Christianity a huge driving force behind inequality in the UK these days though? Other than in Northern Ireland, does anyone give it much thought?
I can't recall ever feeling like Christianity directly impacted my day to day life in the slightest when I lived in England. Its kind of dying out isn't it? I would have said it was more political ideology that was behind our failing society in the main.
Anyhow, just be glad you don't live somewhere where religion has real clout! The Church of England are pussycats compared to some of the Evangelicals and Baptists out here! [Post edited 18 Jul 2020 18:30]
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Depends really, I mean, you’d certainly pin a lot of Trump’s support on a warped view of Christianity. | |
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| France are having no luck. on 18:33 - Jul 18 with 595 views | monytowbray |
| France are having no luck. on 18:24 - Jul 18 by Shawsey |
We certainly are, thankfully. You seem a little uptight about the world today. This was just a post about a cathedral on fire, not religion. I try not to get involved in religious matters. Religion is a very personal thing. I respect peoples right to believe in what they like. |
Organised religion is not a “personal” thing. Religious belief is.
That’s the difference. | |
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| France are having no luck. on 18:35 - Jul 18 with 591 views | SpruceMoose |
| France are having no luck. on 18:33 - Jul 18 by monytowbray |
Depends really, I mean, you’d certainly pin a lot of Trump’s support on a warped view of Christianity. |
Yeah that's what I was getting at. Christianity doesn't seem to have anywhere near that level of clout in the UK.
I wouldn't be against knocking down some of the hate filled mega churches out in the Midwest mind you... Or at least taxing them correctly. | |
| Pronouns: He/Him/His.
"Imagine being a heterosexual white male in Britain at this moment. How bad is that. Everything you say is racist, everything you say is homophobic. The Woke community have really f****d this country." | | Poll: | Selectamod |
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| France are having no luck. on 18:35 - Jul 18 with 594 views | Shawsey |
| France are having no luck. on 18:33 - Jul 18 by monytowbray |
Organised religion is not a “personal” thing. Religious belief is.
That’s the difference. |
So how are churches organised religion? People are free to enter or not. Nothing organised about it. | | | |
| France are having no luck. on 18:39 - Jul 18 with 585 views | SpruceMoose |
| France are having no luck. on 18:35 - Jul 18 by Shawsey |
So how are churches organised religion? People are free to enter or not. Nothing organised about it. |
I imagine Callis means that, symbolically at least, churches are the physical manifestation of organised religion.
I can see why he'd think that, but personally I don't know if I agree with it considering Christianity's dwindling role in British life, and especially as so many churches are now used for things beyond religious worship. | |
| Pronouns: He/Him/His.
"Imagine being a heterosexual white male in Britain at this moment. How bad is that. Everything you say is racist, everything you say is homophobic. The Woke community have really f****d this country." | | Poll: | Selectamod |
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| France are having no luck. on 18:41 - Jul 18 with 586 views | Shawsey |
| France are having no luck. on 18:39 - Jul 18 by SpruceMoose |
I imagine Callis means that, symbolically at least, churches are the physical manifestation of organised religion.
I can see why he'd think that, but personally I don't know if I agree with it considering Christianity's dwindling role in British life, and especially as so many churches are now used for things beyond religious worship. |
He seems quite angry with life. Do you think he is alright? Maybe started on the shandy a bit early? | | | |
| France are having no luck. on 18:43 - Jul 18 with 576 views | SpruceMoose |
| France are having no luck. on 18:41 - Jul 18 by Shawsey |
He seems quite angry with life. Do you think he is alright? Maybe started on the shandy a bit early? |
I don't think it's that helpful to be so personal about it, considering that that's what you're criticising him for. [Post edited 18 Jul 2020 18:44]
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| Pronouns: He/Him/His.
"Imagine being a heterosexual white male in Britain at this moment. How bad is that. Everything you say is racist, everything you say is homophobic. The Woke community have really f****d this country." | | Poll: | Selectamod |
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| France are having no luck. on 18:46 - Jul 18 with 574 views | Shawsey |
| France are having no luck. on 18:43 - Jul 18 by SpruceMoose |
I don't think it's that helpful to be so personal about it, considering that that's what you're criticising him for. [Post edited 18 Jul 2020 18:44]
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I haven't been critical of anybody. I have just said that people are free to enter a church or not and to believe or not believe. I don't see how that is being critical of him. | | | |
| France are having no luck. on 18:48 - Jul 18 with 568 views | SpruceMoose |
| France are having no luck. on 18:46 - Jul 18 by Shawsey |
I haven't been critical of anybody. I have just said that people are free to enter a church or not and to believe or not believe. I don't see how that is being critical of him. |
I was referring to your dig about his mental state and whether he's been drinking. It was unnecessary. [Post edited 18 Jul 2020 18:49]
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| Pronouns: He/Him/His.
"Imagine being a heterosexual white male in Britain at this moment. How bad is that. Everything you say is racist, everything you say is homophobic. The Woke community have really f****d this country." | | Poll: | Selectamod |
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| France are having no luck. on 18:51 - Jul 18 with 559 views | monytowbray |
| France are having no luck. on 18:48 - Jul 18 by SpruceMoose |
I was referring to your dig about his mental state and whether he's been drinking. It was unnecessary. [Post edited 18 Jul 2020 18:49]
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Yeah I mean I don’t drink anymore either for MH reasons, bit of a low dig.
The issue here is he’s asking a question that isn’t relevant to the point. It’s not about if people are allowed in churches or not. It’s about the role organised religion plays in society. Not religious beliefs. What that has to do with my view on people entering churches has me stumped.
One day I hope we all get through the looking glass.
I also don’t understand how being critical of something so gross in my view (I mean, we could get into child rape cover ups if we want to really go so dark on a nice Saturday evening but I don’t have the emotional capacity ATM) automatically makes me an angry drunk. Perhaps the issue here is the fact more people aren’t angry? They would be if they paid attention. [Post edited 18 Jul 2020 18:53]
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