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Wednesday and Plymouth in particularly are bigger and more physical teams than us
They're probably harder to sit deep against if they whip balls into the box, Wednesday particularly would be difficult to deal with in that regard
Bolton I would expect are more like us and in fairness, could still be behind us after our game in hand, over the course of the season, they haven't necessarily been that much better than us
Wednesday and Plymouth are perhaps better suited to the physical battles you often end up with in League One
[Post edited 15 Feb 2023 0:56]
Alcohol is the answer but I can't remember the question!
If virtually every team we play against has a low block... on 00:54 - Feb 15 by bournemouthblue
Wednesday and Plymouth in particularly are bigger and more physical teams than us
They're probably harder to sit deep against if they whip balls into the box, Wednesday particularly would be difficult to deal with in that regard
Bolton I would expect are more like us and in fairness, could still be behind us after our game in hand, over the course of the season, they haven't necessarily been that much better than us
Wednesday and Plymouth are perhaps better suited to the physical battles you often end up with in League One
[Post edited 15 Feb 2023 0:56]
I had a look at all the goals scored by these teams over the last couple of games. Seems to me that in most cases they are playing fast and direct, especially Plymouth. A number of their goals seemed to be counter attacks. Didn't see any of this side to side stuff although of course may not have been shown. Also a willingness to take on a defender and power towards goal, something we just don't seem to do although Broadhead shows signs of doing this.
Interestingly, many of Bolton's 10 goals in the last two games were from set pieces especially corners. A load of big brutes piling into the box and winning the headers.
We need to be brave. Attack the opposition defence. Take them on and head into the box as opposed to just playing side to side, rinse and repeat.
[Post edited 15 Feb 2023 5:12]
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If virtually every team we play against has a low block... on 05:38 - Feb 15 with 4332 views
If virtually every team we play against has a low block... on 00:54 - Feb 15 by bournemouthblue
Wednesday and Plymouth in particularly are bigger and more physical teams than us
They're probably harder to sit deep against if they whip balls into the box, Wednesday particularly would be difficult to deal with in that regard
Bolton I would expect are more like us and in fairness, could still be behind us after our game in hand, over the course of the season, they haven't necessarily been that much better than us
Wednesday and Plymouth are perhaps better suited to the physical battles you often end up with in League One
[Post edited 15 Feb 2023 0:56]
Agree about Wed, but the Plymouth team isn't materially more physical than us up top. They are just much more efficient in transition, willing to carry the ball, attack from all angles and take shots outside the box.
We are too focused on playing one-twos and small triangles on the wings following slow build up play which makes us predictable and allows their defence to reset. When we weren't trying this it was long balls, often over the top or out wide, which in most cases came to nothing as slow build up again meant it was telegraphed or the ball was mishit (although Woolf did nearly release Davis on one one occasion).
We need to find more angles to attack from. We clearly missed Chaplin and Broadhead in the first half, both in terms of their willingness to take players on and the positions they take on the edge of the box for a pull back or a second ball from a clearance.
We're also far too slow in the transitions. Whenever we had the opportunity to break it ended up forced backwards and along the back line.
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If virtually every team we play against has a low block... on 06:03 - Feb 15 with 4288 views
First I should say text book response to a low block is move the opposition side to side and look for gaps.
Teams at the top are bigger, more physical, direct and probably haven’t suffered quite the number of key injuries that we have this season. I’m not promoting their often longer ball style, only as others are saying we need greater variation in our play, willingness to pick a moment to move the ball quicker through the thirds, particularly by our ponderous midfield. It’s our midfield and 10s which are not unlocking the low block, it’s our 10s and striker not getting Smith esq headers when the ball is moved wide around the low block. Losing Evans at key times is massive, he was key to winning and countering from a transition moment in a way that Morsy and Humph have not been able to replicate.
I’m happy our possession football limits opportunities for opposition but we need to do more with the ball when we’ve got it. We lack the purpose and understanding of goal scoring in key games which is odd because we are high scorers in the league.
With our asymmetric fluid formation out and in possession, it’s a wonder we’ve not asked more questions of opposition by appearing as a 433 or 442 in-game (striker + a 10) or going more man to man to limit space and win more duels to set off attacks therefore allowing a change of approach for a time to see how opposition reacts. It would be a new thing for the opposition to concern themselves with, either way this will not mean top 2 in 2023.
If virtually every team we play against has a low block... on 06:03 - Feb 15 by PioneerBlue
First I should say text book response to a low block is move the opposition side to side and look for gaps.
Teams at the top are bigger, more physical, direct and probably haven’t suffered quite the number of key injuries that we have this season. I’m not promoting their often longer ball style, only as others are saying we need greater variation in our play, willingness to pick a moment to move the ball quicker through the thirds, particularly by our ponderous midfield. It’s our midfield and 10s which are not unlocking the low block, it’s our 10s and striker not getting Smith esq headers when the ball is moved wide around the low block. Losing Evans at key times is massive, he was key to winning and countering from a transition moment in a way that Morsy and Humph have not been able to replicate.
I’m happy our possession football limits opportunities for opposition but we need to do more with the ball when we’ve got it. We lack the purpose and understanding of goal scoring in key games which is odd because we are high scorers in the league.
With our asymmetric fluid formation out and in possession, it’s a wonder we’ve not asked more questions of opposition by appearing as a 433 or 442 in-game (striker + a 10) or going more man to man to limit space and win more duels to set off attacks therefore allowing a change of approach for a time to see how opposition reacts. It would be a new thing for the opposition to concern themselves with, either way this will not mean top 2 in 2023.
[Post edited 15 Feb 2023 6:09]
Early in the season Evans was very effective at switching the side of play, in particular playing diagonals to Davis. We've really missed that since as too often for us to switch wings it requires going all the way back across our back line and then forward again.
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If virtually every team we play against has a low block... on 10:33 - Feb 15 with 3754 views
If virtually every team we play against has a low block... on 05:38 - Feb 15 by X0Y0
Agree about Wed, but the Plymouth team isn't materially more physical than us up top. They are just much more efficient in transition, willing to carry the ball, attack from all angles and take shots outside the box.
We are too focused on playing one-twos and small triangles on the wings following slow build up play which makes us predictable and allows their defence to reset. When we weren't trying this it was long balls, often over the top or out wide, which in most cases came to nothing as slow build up again meant it was telegraphed or the ball was mishit (although Woolf did nearly release Davis on one one occasion).
We need to find more angles to attack from. We clearly missed Chaplin and Broadhead in the first half, both in terms of their willingness to take players on and the positions they take on the edge of the box for a pull back or a second ball from a clearance.
We're also far too slow in the transitions. Whenever we had the opportunity to break it ended up forced backwards and along the back line.
Plymouth can certainly play, I'm not saying they can't but the are a far more physically rugged side than us too, they were very athletic
I felt when we played them at Home Park, whilst they played decent football, they were slightly more direct and physical than us, with quick little knock downs and flicks with movement and pace which probably gets more out of League One quality players
It was fairly notable earlier in the season that their conversion rate of shots was far above ours, they were a lot more clinical in taking the chances
At the moment we are in a bit of a mess, teams have worked out how to play against us, the confidence has definitely dropped and good players, aren't making as good a decisions as they were earlier in the system when they attack
We very much need a plan B, more variety and another way of being effective
Alcohol is the answer but I can't remember the question!
It's a phrase that I think I've heard only recently, and given the way teams have set up against us in recent months, I assume it means playing deep and getting plenty of players behind the ball. On the other hand, Wednesday and Plymouth had a high press at times which stopped us playing out from the back. Is that a low block too?
[Post edited 15 Feb 2023 10:44]
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If virtually every team we play against has a low block... on 10:53 - Feb 15 with 3691 views
If virtually every team we play against has a low block... on 10:42 - Feb 15 by DJR
What does the expression low block mean?
It's a phrase that I think I've heard only recently, and given the way teams have set up against us in recent months, I assume it means playing deep and getting plenty of players behind the ball. On the other hand, Wednesday and Plymouth had a high press at times which stopped us playing out from the back. Is that a low block too?
[Post edited 15 Feb 2023 10:44]
I think I've found the answer in this video. It also shows how to overcome the low block, so all the team has to do is watch the video, and all our problems will be over.
If virtually every team we play against has a low block... on 00:54 - Feb 15 by bournemouthblue
Wednesday and Plymouth in particularly are bigger and more physical teams than us
They're probably harder to sit deep against if they whip balls into the box, Wednesday particularly would be difficult to deal with in that regard
Bolton I would expect are more like us and in fairness, could still be behind us after our game in hand, over the course of the season, they haven't necessarily been that much better than us
Wednesday and Plymouth are perhaps better suited to the physical battles you often end up with in League One
[Post edited 15 Feb 2023 0:56]
I would say we (Argyle) are more like you than either Wednesday or Bolton .
We find it harder to play against bigger physical teams, especially those with a good high press, but have adapted the squad so we can complete much better than say last season.
Where we are successful is that we score late goals....so on a good pitch we start fast and on a ploughed field we play on the break.
What we also have now is some depth...eight changes after the Wednesday game ( two enforced) and then a further four for Oxford, with a very different bench to the previous one.
It means we have effectively players who didn't even make the 18 in January like Earley and Butcher coming in and scoring goals/ making us competitive.
The one area I always felt you had the edge was in having that midfield nastiness we lacked in Morsy and Evans ( skill too but they can put a foot in) Matete and Butcher have recently given us that.
I look at our recruitment in January and all five have played and contributed something to our run already. Plus they changed the squad balance for the better.
I look at your recruitment and see a lot of duplication of what you already had that was working. I think Broadhead was a terrific signing, but the rest I don't think improved the strength of the herd that much...maybe Luongo if he were fit but so far he hasn't really appeared.
So are you out of it? Well obviously not because as any fool knows we always collapse at the end of the season :) But you have a tough run after the next couple, especially if Morsy doesn't time his suspension properly....
Sooner or later either we or Wednesday will hit a blip.....I think it might be Wednesday as, irony of irony, they seem to be picking up injuries and lack a bit of squad depth....
Bolton seem to be on a roll right now, more so than Derby, so with FGR and Burton to come up next six points would make a huge difference to your position.
I have posted on pasoti and Owlstalk that the table after March 11th will be the one that signals likely finishing positions in terms of who is autos and who is play offs....
Still hoping you can pip the Owls from their Entitle charge.
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If virtually every team we play against has a low block... on 12:59 - Feb 15 with 3344 views
If virtually every team we play against has a low block... on 11:24 - Feb 15 by pafcprogs
I would say we (Argyle) are more like you than either Wednesday or Bolton .
We find it harder to play against bigger physical teams, especially those with a good high press, but have adapted the squad so we can complete much better than say last season.
Where we are successful is that we score late goals....so on a good pitch we start fast and on a ploughed field we play on the break.
What we also have now is some depth...eight changes after the Wednesday game ( two enforced) and then a further four for Oxford, with a very different bench to the previous one.
It means we have effectively players who didn't even make the 18 in January like Earley and Butcher coming in and scoring goals/ making us competitive.
The one area I always felt you had the edge was in having that midfield nastiness we lacked in Morsy and Evans ( skill too but they can put a foot in) Matete and Butcher have recently given us that.
I look at our recruitment in January and all five have played and contributed something to our run already. Plus they changed the squad balance for the better.
I look at your recruitment and see a lot of duplication of what you already had that was working. I think Broadhead was a terrific signing, but the rest I don't think improved the strength of the herd that much...maybe Luongo if he were fit but so far he hasn't really appeared.
So are you out of it? Well obviously not because as any fool knows we always collapse at the end of the season :) But you have a tough run after the next couple, especially if Morsy doesn't time his suspension properly....
Sooner or later either we or Wednesday will hit a blip.....I think it might be Wednesday as, irony of irony, they seem to be picking up injuries and lack a bit of squad depth....
Bolton seem to be on a roll right now, more so than Derby, so with FGR and Burton to come up next six points would make a huge difference to your position.
I have posted on pasoti and Owlstalk that the table after March 11th will be the one that signals likely finishing positions in terms of who is autos and who is play offs....
Still hoping you can pip the Owls from their Entitle charge.
I think the main take from that is variety, I do think the Broadhead and Hirst signings have confused things
Broadhead will grow I am sure, there's promise for Hirst but he's still a bit raw, maybe a season too early for him
From what I saw of Collins for Rovers last night, he'd have probably been a smarter bet, he runs the channels and looks a handful, we don't really have a striker like that currently
Both yourselves and Wednesday are averaging over 2 points a game which is frightening pace really, compare it to the championship this season and bar Burnley, their playoff pack is well off the pace of League 1 this season
Alcohol is the answer but I can't remember the question!
This is what I was wondering. These teams that we are facing, are they playing the same way against the other big teams? Did we set our stall out early as one of the better passing teams and therefore teams are aiming to nullify that more than they would against Bolton or Wednesday?
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If virtually every team we play against has a low block... on 13:19 - Feb 15 with 3267 views
If virtually every team we play against has a low block... on 13:14 - Feb 15 by SamWhiteUK
This is what I was wondering. These teams that we are facing, are they playing the same way against the other big teams? Did we set our stall out early as one of the better passing teams and therefore teams are aiming to nullify that more than they would against Bolton or Wednesday?
All the happens is the other sides change the way they play so sitting deep doesn't hurt others like it does us. They just play differently themselves.
If virtually every team we play against has a low block... on 13:19 - Feb 15 by FrimleyBlue
All the happens is the other sides change the way they play so sitting deep doesn't hurt others like it does us. They just play differently themselves.
One of thing Schumacher insists upon is midfielders passing the ball forward.
It’s well known that he drops the players who play the safe sideways ball in midfield.
He knows we will often give the ball away but it does create a lot of chances.
I think they may be the difference.
We also score a lot of goals later in games as defenders get worn down by the constant movement of strikers. Watch out 3rd against Portsmouth….the centre half just gave up running.
Although, it wouldn’t surprise me if you won the next 10 straight…..
3
If virtually every team we play against has a low block... on 14:13 - Feb 15 with 3134 views
If virtually every team we play against has a low block... on 14:09 - Feb 15 by GreenArmy75
One of thing Schumacher insists upon is midfielders passing the ball forward.
It’s well known that he drops the players who play the safe sideways ball in midfield.
He knows we will often give the ball away but it does create a lot of chances.
I think they may be the difference.
We also score a lot of goals later in games as defenders get worn down by the constant movement of strikers. Watch out 3rd against Portsmouth….the centre half just gave up running.
Although, it wouldn’t surprise me if you won the next 10 straight…..
We have failed to win back to back games since October so that would be some turn around
Our chief playmaker from the middle is Evans who has a real injury problem now, Humphreys can create but it's certainly true that the two central midfielders tend to recycle the ball and retain it generally
Morsy will occasionally venture forward with the ball but attacking isn't really his game
Where I think we are falling down at the moment is the number 10's aren't making runs forward to support our strikers, certainly not in the way they were doing earlier in the season
Alcohol is the answer but I can't remember the question!
If virtually every team we play against has a low block... on 14:09 - Feb 15 by GreenArmy75
One of thing Schumacher insists upon is midfielders passing the ball forward.
It’s well known that he drops the players who play the safe sideways ball in midfield.
He knows we will often give the ball away but it does create a lot of chances.
I think they may be the difference.
We also score a lot of goals later in games as defenders get worn down by the constant movement of strikers. Watch out 3rd against Portsmouth….the centre half just gave up running.
Although, it wouldn’t surprise me if you won the next 10 straight…..
Must be nice seeing midfielders passing the ball forwards.
Our main playmaker has an incredible pass completion rate. But mainly because its 5 yards back to our CBs.
If virtually every team we play against has a low block... on 05:01 - Feb 15 by urbanblue
I had a look at all the goals scored by these teams over the last couple of games. Seems to me that in most cases they are playing fast and direct, especially Plymouth. A number of their goals seemed to be counter attacks. Didn't see any of this side to side stuff although of course may not have been shown. Also a willingness to take on a defender and power towards goal, something we just don't seem to do although Broadhead shows signs of doing this.
Interestingly, many of Bolton's 10 goals in the last two games were from set pieces especially corners. A load of big brutes piling into the box and winning the headers.
We need to be brave. Attack the opposition defence. Take them on and head into the box as opposed to just playing side to side, rinse and repeat.
[Post edited 15 Feb 2023 5:12]
Although as so many teams sit back agaisnt Town & don't commit too many players forward, our options for a counter attack are restricted. Yes, we have to move the ball more quickly, but it's not simple to do that without resorting to the dreaded long ball & we don't really have the personnel to play that way.
If virtually every team we play against has a low block... on 14:09 - Feb 15 by GreenArmy75
One of thing Schumacher insists upon is midfielders passing the ball forward.
It’s well known that he drops the players who play the safe sideways ball in midfield.
He knows we will often give the ball away but it does create a lot of chances.
I think they may be the difference.
We also score a lot of goals later in games as defenders get worn down by the constant movement of strikers. Watch out 3rd against Portsmouth….the centre half just gave up running.
Although, it wouldn’t surprise me if you won the next 10 straight…..
Yes you do score late ish in games which is something we don't do and haven't done to win games for years now, last night was yet another example, at 0-0 and pace from the bench on the pitch they should have been franticly forcing that winning goal right through injury time, if it means being more direct than so be it, really frustrates me..
2
If virtually every team we play against has a low block... on 17:52 - Feb 15 with 2743 views
If virtually every team we play against has a low block... on 05:01 - Feb 15 by urbanblue
I had a look at all the goals scored by these teams over the last couple of games. Seems to me that in most cases they are playing fast and direct, especially Plymouth. A number of their goals seemed to be counter attacks. Didn't see any of this side to side stuff although of course may not have been shown. Also a willingness to take on a defender and power towards goal, something we just don't seem to do although Broadhead shows signs of doing this.
Interestingly, many of Bolton's 10 goals in the last two games were from set pieces especially corners. A load of big brutes piling into the box and winning the headers.
We need to be brave. Attack the opposition defence. Take them on and head into the box as opposed to just playing side to side, rinse and repeat.
[Post edited 15 Feb 2023 5:12]
Given your obs of Bolton then, we’re in for a torrid time with our flaky defenders.
If virtually every team we play against has a low block... on 14:20 - Feb 15 by FrimleyBlue
Must be nice seeing midfielders passing the ball forwards.
Our main playmaker has an incredible pass completion rate. But mainly because its 5 yards back to our CBs.
I think it is about balance and game management with this too. If we play like this at 2 goals up we shouldn't concede that advantage. If we play like it at 0-0 and 0-1 down. we won't overturn the or create enough to win. This must be balanced against earlier in the season we were creating plenty and not scoring a lot of them.
If virtually every team we play against has a low block... on 12:59 - Feb 15 by bournemouthblue
I think the main take from that is variety, I do think the Broadhead and Hirst signings have confused things
Broadhead will grow I am sure, there's promise for Hirst but he's still a bit raw, maybe a season too early for him
From what I saw of Collins for Rovers last night, he'd have probably been a smarter bet, he runs the channels and looks a handful, we don't really have a striker like that currently
Both yourselves and Wednesday are averaging over 2 points a game which is frightening pace really, compare it to the championship this season and bar Burnley, their playoff pack is well off the pace of League 1 this season
You describe Hirst as "still a bit raw" but he's hardly a kid he's 24! Other than a brief period at Portsmouth hasn't torn up any trees anywhere and is yet to show much for us.
1
If virtually every team we play against has a low block... on 20:07 - Feb 15 with 2317 views
If virtually every team we play against has a low block... on 11:24 - Feb 15 by pafcprogs
I would say we (Argyle) are more like you than either Wednesday or Bolton .
We find it harder to play against bigger physical teams, especially those with a good high press, but have adapted the squad so we can complete much better than say last season.
Where we are successful is that we score late goals....so on a good pitch we start fast and on a ploughed field we play on the break.
What we also have now is some depth...eight changes after the Wednesday game ( two enforced) and then a further four for Oxford, with a very different bench to the previous one.
It means we have effectively players who didn't even make the 18 in January like Earley and Butcher coming in and scoring goals/ making us competitive.
The one area I always felt you had the edge was in having that midfield nastiness we lacked in Morsy and Evans ( skill too but they can put a foot in) Matete and Butcher have recently given us that.
I look at our recruitment in January and all five have played and contributed something to our run already. Plus they changed the squad balance for the better.
I look at your recruitment and see a lot of duplication of what you already had that was working. I think Broadhead was a terrific signing, but the rest I don't think improved the strength of the herd that much...maybe Luongo if he were fit but so far he hasn't really appeared.
So are you out of it? Well obviously not because as any fool knows we always collapse at the end of the season :) But you have a tough run after the next couple, especially if Morsy doesn't time his suspension properly....
Sooner or later either we or Wednesday will hit a blip.....I think it might be Wednesday as, irony of irony, they seem to be picking up injuries and lack a bit of squad depth....
Bolton seem to be on a roll right now, more so than Derby, so with FGR and Burton to come up next six points would make a huge difference to your position.
I have posted on pasoti and Owlstalk that the table after March 11th will be the one that signals likely finishing positions in terms of who is autos and who is play offs....
Still hoping you can pip the Owls from their Entitle charge.
Don't buy this Wednesday entitled tag, I have to follow football online these days so and use.social media alot and its you lot that have been giving it the big'un for some time, you have some very strange fans!
Us and Bolton for autos and Barnsley in the playoffs hopefully!
0
If virtually every team we play against has a low block... on 20:26 - Feb 15 with 2229 views
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