| Seen a few say we will probably “turn into a counter attacking team” 07:41 - Jun 5 with 2648 views | MancBlue86 |
We are already a counter attacking team. We were 2nd for high turnovers in our own half and 1st for that then resulting in a shot. We were middle of the road for possession/short passes/long passes. I imagine we will take the same approach against teams we have a decent chance against, albeit with much improved defensive reinforcements. The real test is the big boys, Kieran’s first huge test, can he set up defensively against the like of City, Arsenal, Liverpool etc |  |
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| Seen a few say we will probably “turn into a counter attacking team” on 07:59 - Jun 5 with 2542 views | Guthrum |
Absolutely. Perhaps counterattacking is not quite the right word, as that would imply sitting mostly on the defensive, which we didn't. More seeking to quickly regain control of the ball and then always looking to turn that into an attack. Possession-and-use football.
I think against those teams there won't be a lot of point in sitting back. It's not our strongest suit. We'll push forward and attempt to test their own defences. See if scoring goals can put them off their stride. |  |
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| Seen a few say we will probably “turn into a counter attacking team” on 08:02 - Jun 5 with 2521 views | surreyblue |
I think the difference is that this approach will become a more focal part of our game. While it has been great this year watching us invite, and then play through the press, it will be much harder for us to do that effectively in the prem and therefore I expect there to be a greater focus on attacking quickly whenever we win the ball back |  | | |
| Seen a few say we will probably “turn into a counter attacking team” on 08:09 - Jun 5 with 2482 views | Herbivore |
I read an analysis of us somewhere where they spoke about how we create chaos and other teams can't cope with it. Part of how we do that is winning the ball back quickly and high up the pitch, it gives teams no chance to settle into a defensive shape and it's why we've found it tougher against sides who sit deep and keep their shape. Anyone who tries to have a football match with us tends to struggle more. We'll need to continue doing that in the Prem, it'll be tough but that's got to be the aim. |  |
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| Seen a few say we will probably “turn into a counter attacking team” on 08:40 - Jun 5 with 2354 views | dirtyboy |
| Seen a few say we will probably “turn into a counter attacking team” on 08:09 - Jun 5 by Herbivore |
I read an analysis of us somewhere where they spoke about how we create chaos and other teams can't cope with it. Part of how we do that is winning the ball back quickly and high up the pitch, it gives teams no chance to settle into a defensive shape and it's why we've found it tougher against sides who sit deep and keep their shape. Anyone who tries to have a football match with us tends to struggle more. We'll need to continue doing that in the Prem, it'll be tough but that's got to be the aim. |
I think we'll be okay if we can add more pace in the middle.
That does mean one of Mass or Morsy making way, or a tweak set up with another box to box player (athlete - which we know is more and more important at the top level) and head towards a 4-3-3.
We could play the same way if we add enough additional quality (without upsetting dynamic).
Fact remains, we will need to be very effective when we do have the ball. |  | | |
| All about the press, aggressive in packs, and dogged defending deep on 08:43 - Jun 5 with 2307 views | unstableblue |
| Seen a few say we will probably “turn into a counter attacking team” on 08:09 - Jun 5 by Herbivore |
I read an analysis of us somewhere where they spoke about how we create chaos and other teams can't cope with it. Part of how we do that is winning the ball back quickly and high up the pitch, it gives teams no chance to settle into a defensive shape and it's why we've found it tougher against sides who sit deep and keep their shape. Anyone who tries to have a football match with us tends to struggle more. We'll need to continue doing that in the Prem, it'll be tough but that's got to be the aim. |
Lower level teams in the Premier League who get results against the big boys, tended to have lost a little fear, and pressed in packs and quickly to win ball when the bigger team have committed men forward. Those turnovers can lead to goals.
Brighton, Palace had joy with it.
Of course you also have to defend in two banks and suffocate the intricate passing into the box. This becomes more important when the lesser team tires after the early energy and pressing to break up the opposition. |  |
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| Seen a few say we will probably “turn into a counter attacking team” on 08:44 - Jun 5 with 2287 views | Herbivore |
| Seen a few say we will probably “turn into a counter attacking team” on 08:40 - Jun 5 by dirtyboy |
I think we'll be okay if we can add more pace in the middle.
That does mean one of Mass or Morsy making way, or a tweak set up with another box to box player (athlete - which we know is more and more important at the top level) and head towards a 4-3-3.
We could play the same way if we add enough additional quality (without upsetting dynamic).
Fact remains, we will need to be very effective when we do have the ball. |
We definitely need more legs in midfield. Morsy and Mass have been superb but part of the reason we get overran defensively at times, especially on the break, is that they don't have the legs to track opponents breaking on us and the defence gets exposed. It's also a feature of how we play, pushing men up to create overloads, by having some powerful runners in midfield will help us to be less exposed when we lose it high up the pitch. | |
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| Seen a few say we will probably “turn into a counter attacking team” on 08:46 - Jun 5 with 2277 views | Guthrum |
| Seen a few say we will probably “turn into a counter attacking team” on 08:40 - Jun 5 by dirtyboy |
I think we'll be okay if we can add more pace in the middle.
That does mean one of Mass or Morsy making way, or a tweak set up with another box to box player (athlete - which we know is more and more important at the top level) and head towards a 4-3-3.
We could play the same way if we add enough additional quality (without upsetting dynamic).
Fact remains, we will need to be very effective when we do have the ball. |
Our second-rank forwards ("No. 10s") already drop deep to progress the ball. Particularly Chaplin, who can often be found in what might be described as an advanced left-back position. So what you're describing will be more evolution than a revolution in our use of personnel. | |
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| Seen a few say we will probably “turn into a counter attacking team” on 08:59 - Jun 5 with 2211 views | Herbivore |
| Seen a few say we will probably “turn into a counter attacking team” on 08:46 - Jun 5 by Guthrum |
Our second-rank forwards ("No. 10s") already drop deep to progress the ball. Particularly Chaplin, who can often be found in what might be described as an advanced left-back position. So what you're describing will be more evolution than a revolution in our use of personnel. |
The way we play is so tactically progressive that it's really hard to pin us down as playing a particular formation. Other managers have commented on how at times Broadhead and Chaplin drop in to create a box four in midfield to overload the opposition. We use a hybrid back 3/4 depending on who has the ball and where they have it. Our ability to play with such flexibility and fluidity is what gives us a chance in the Prem. | |
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| Seen a few say we will probably “turn into a counter attacking team” on 09:09 - Jun 5 with 2160 views | Guthrum |
| Seen a few say we will probably “turn into a counter attacking team” on 08:59 - Jun 5 by Herbivore |
The way we play is so tactically progressive that it's really hard to pin us down as playing a particular formation. Other managers have commented on how at times Broadhead and Chaplin drop in to create a box four in midfield to overload the opposition. We use a hybrid back 3/4 depending on who has the ball and where they have it. Our ability to play with such flexibility and fluidity is what gives us a chance in the Prem. |
I've said it before, but the old-style tactical/formational notation does not adequately describe modern high-level play. It's all quite fluid and there are a variety of sub-structures and units for different phases of defence and attack.
For me, one of Cook's biggest problems was him being too wedded to a rigid formation. | |
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| Seen a few say we will probably “turn into a counter attacking team” on 09:47 - Jun 5 with 2040 views | DinDjarin |
| Seen a few say we will probably “turn into a counter attacking team” on 09:09 - Jun 5 by Guthrum |
I've said it before, but the old-style tactical/formational notation does not adequately describe modern high-level play. It's all quite fluid and there are a variety of sub-structures and units for different phases of defence and attack.
For me, one of Cook's biggest problems was him being too wedded to a rigid formation. |
I think Cooks starting formation was not too different to KM - 4231.
The problem with Cook as you say was it was rigid whereas KM evolves the formation and patterns of play in game to counter what is in front of him. |  | | |
| Seen a few say we will probably “turn into a counter attacking team” on 09:55 - Jun 5 with 1995 views | charlie1 |
Watching Prem highlights last season, it has surprised me just how much teams, from top to bottom, overload their own penalty area at every opportunity.
If they can slow down the counter and get numbers behind the ball they will. Sometimes 10 players in the box with just one midway toward the centre circle.
Shows me that there’s so much quality, all you can do is try to deny the space to get the shot away or hope you’ve got enough bodies in there to block or deflect the shot when it comes.
Also shows me the supreme fitness levels as teams are countering from deep in their own box, not the halfway line.
As many have said elsewhere, pace and stamina in the midfield will be critical if we are to have any success this season. | | | |
| Seen a few say we will probably “turn into a counter attacking team” on 10:32 - Jun 5 with 1900 views | Nomore4 |
| Seen a few say we will probably “turn into a counter attacking team” on 08:44 - Jun 5 by Herbivore |
We definitely need more legs in midfield. Morsy and Mass have been superb but part of the reason we get overran defensively at times, especially on the break, is that they don't have the legs to track opponents breaking on us and the defence gets exposed. It's also a feature of how we play, pushing men up to create overloads, by having some powerful runners in midfield will help us to be less exposed when we lose it high up the pitch. |
Really | | | |
| All about the press, aggressive in packs, and dogged defending deep on 10:53 - Jun 5 with 1842 views | _clive_baker_ |
| All about the press, aggressive in packs, and dogged defending deep on 08:43 - Jun 5 by unstableblue |
Lower level teams in the Premier League who get results against the big boys, tended to have lost a little fear, and pressed in packs and quickly to win ball when the bigger team have committed men forward. Those turnovers can lead to goals.
Brighton, Palace had joy with it.
Of course you also have to defend in two banks and suffocate the intricate passing into the box. This becomes more important when the lesser team tires after the early energy and pressing to break up the opposition. |
Palace is a really good example, that's our blue print IMO. The way they finished the season was so impressive.
They've got so much pace, quality and physicality, they press very aggressively high up the pitch. Wharton and Lerma in the middle, Eze and Olise advanced and a central focal point of Mateta or Edouard. Guehi at the back. That really looks like the spine of of a very good side I think, plus a lot of athleticism in wide areas, which we know we rely on largely through Burns and Davis.
Question is who becomes our 'central quartet' behind Hirst / a new #9? We won't get to Palace's level over the next few months, but that's where I think we'll see some activity in the market. Morsy almost certainly keeps his place, there's definitely a question mark around who partners him. Taylor's profile is right its just whether he's of that level which is still up for debate. Hutchinson is a very obvious candidate in one of the advanced roles. I'm a huge fan of both Broadhead and Chaplin but they're very different profiles in terms of pace and raw athleticism.
Certainly some work to do, but Omari would be a massive, massive step towards it. |  | | |
| Seen a few say we will probably “turn into a counter attacking team” on 11:09 - Jun 5 with 1787 views | textbackup |
I think the variety of ways we can play will surprise/confuse some teams.
Yes we can pass it around lovely, but then from nowhere burgess pings it down the line, Leif crosses, and we’ve scored.
By no means am I saying we’ll do this time after time and finish in the top 10, but I think we’ll hold our own and get a few massive results against some of the big boys. |  |
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| Seen a few say we will probably “turn into a counter attacking team” on 11:14 - Jun 5 with 1758 views | BiGDonnie |
| Seen a few say we will probably “turn into a counter attacking team” on 08:44 - Jun 5 by Herbivore |
We definitely need more legs in midfield. Morsy and Mass have been superb but part of the reason we get overran defensively at times, especially on the break, is that they don't have the legs to track opponents breaking on us and the defence gets exposed. It's also a feature of how we play, pushing men up to create overloads, by having some powerful runners in midfield will help us to be less exposed when we lose it high up the pitch. |
You think we'll see a change in formation with three central midfielders? Can see Morsy being a more traditional anchor man type, with two just ahead of him looking to be more box to box. |  |
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| Seen a few say we will probably “turn into a counter attacking team” on 12:07 - Jun 5 with 1663 views | Herbivore |
| Seen a few say we will probably “turn into a counter attacking team” on 10:32 - Jun 5 by Nomore4 |
Really |
Yes, really. | |
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| Seen a few say we will probably “turn into a counter attacking team” on 12:08 - Jun 5 with 1658 views | Herbivore |
| Seen a few say we will probably “turn into a counter attacking team” on 11:14 - Jun 5 by BiGDonnie |
You think we'll see a change in formation with three central midfielders? Can see Morsy being a more traditional anchor man type, with two just ahead of him looking to be more box to box. |
Think the shape will stay similar, most of the time at least. | |
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| All about the press, aggressive in packs, and dogged defending deep on 12:37 - Jun 5 with 1581 views | unstableblue |
| All about the press, aggressive in packs, and dogged defending deep on 10:53 - Jun 5 by _clive_baker_ |
Palace is a really good example, that's our blue print IMO. The way they finished the season was so impressive.
They've got so much pace, quality and physicality, they press very aggressively high up the pitch. Wharton and Lerma in the middle, Eze and Olise advanced and a central focal point of Mateta or Edouard. Guehi at the back. That really looks like the spine of of a very good side I think, plus a lot of athleticism in wide areas, which we know we rely on largely through Burns and Davis.
Question is who becomes our 'central quartet' behind Hirst / a new #9? We won't get to Palace's level over the next few months, but that's where I think we'll see some activity in the market. Morsy almost certainly keeps his place, there's definitely a question mark around who partners him. Taylor's profile is right its just whether he's of that level which is still up for debate. Hutchinson is a very obvious candidate in one of the advanced roles. I'm a huge fan of both Broadhead and Chaplin but they're very different profiles in terms of pace and raw athleticism.
Certainly some work to do, but Omari would be a massive, massive step towards it. |
Slight problem is that the Palace, and say Brighton squads. Are years ahead of us in quality. A squad of Omaris!
I still have faith that the likes of Davis, Burgess, Hirst, and Broadhead can find a whole new gear in the top tier. Maybe even The Wolf! | |
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| Seen a few say we will probably “turn into a counter attacking team” on 15:03 - Jun 5 with 1406 views | Radlett_blue |
Against the elite, if we play our "normal" game, we're going to ship goals a plenty. I'm sure Kieran will set us up differently next season & will be interesting if he changes our overall shape in the games where we're looking to try to win. |  |
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