| Did Reform field AI candidates? 17:03 - Jul 8 with 11572 views | Zx1988 |
Just came across this on Twitter, and it certainly poses some interesting questions:
Some interesting responses to the original Tweet, alleging similar concerns about other Reform candidates in other constituencies.
With regards to "Mark Matlock" he didn't even attend his count because, apparently, he had pneumonia. |  |
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| Did Reform field AI candidates? on 14:25 - Jul 10 with 885 views | Ewan_Oozami |
| Did Reform field AI candidates? on 13:50 - Jul 10 by Pencilpete |
But thats my point - if everyone just stopped calling them racists and let them 'join in' then they'd very quickly be exposed.
Years ago at my work the manager left and a few of us went for the job including this sales guy who literally had no clue about the operational side of things but could talk a really good game so after a few weeks of squabbling i decided to withdraw my application and so did one of the other people going for it just leaving him and one other person
he got the job and lasted barely 6 months before he was acked because he couldn't do the job and was a disater at it, his sales BS didn't work on operational people and he got found out very quickly
same as reform - if they've only got one policy and farage then - don't argue with them, let them in and they'll soon be exposed and their lack of depth will be totally exposed. |
Exposed to whom? Not their supporters, because that's part of the appeal - it's always someone elses fault, never theirs - it might be blindingly obvious to us, but not to Reform's supporters.. |  |
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| Did Reform field AI candidates? on 14:44 - Jul 10 with 848 views | Pencilpete |
| Did Reform field AI candidates? on 14:19 - Jul 10 by PassionNotAnger |
For someone that repeatedly says they aren’t a reform voter you seem to spend a considerable percentage of your posts on here defending them (or at least rebuffing some of the accusations against them).
Also noticeable that you try liken the the overt racism and misogyny from some of their candidates to broad examples within Labour, Greens and Lib Dem but no mention of the Tories (who’s recent, perhaps current, numerous examples of Islamophobia are a concern for many who aren’t of a far-right persuasion)
Fed up with so many apologists coming out of the woodwork with apparently new concerns about FPTP results, media stitch ups, wokery etc but all pretend that they don’t support the racist enabling, dog whistling, division stoking, grifters of Farage and pathetic Reform party.
Different badge of many who have gone before, BNP, UKIP and certain factions within the Conservatives. Ignore the smoke and mirrors, they are a far-right party and many who vote for them (not necessarily everyone) are racists [Post edited 10 Jul 2024 14:21]
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I literally couldn't give a flying sh1t what you think of me - if I was a Reform voter I'd fcuking tell you so don't worry about that ! ..... I contributed to many posts on here about the election I don't need to lie about it, I openly said I agreed with Farage that immigration is too high, but i'd rather reduce it than stop it altogether like him and if you're asking me did I consider voting for them then yes I did and I make absolutely no apologies for it either .... but ultimately i voted for Starmer - theres also a thread where I put my reasoning behind that too if you're that interested enough to find it ......
I just think if they're as bad as everyone is saying then Channel 4 wouldn't need to plant someone in their canvassing team and the BBC wouldn't need to plant people in their question time audience to expose them. | | | |
| Did Reform field AI candidates? on 14:49 - Jul 10 with 831 views | Zx1988 |
| Did Reform field AI candidates? on 14:44 - Jul 10 by Pencilpete |
I literally couldn't give a flying sh1t what you think of me - if I was a Reform voter I'd fcuking tell you so don't worry about that ! ..... I contributed to many posts on here about the election I don't need to lie about it, I openly said I agreed with Farage that immigration is too high, but i'd rather reduce it than stop it altogether like him and if you're asking me did I consider voting for them then yes I did and I make absolutely no apologies for it either .... but ultimately i voted for Starmer - theres also a thread where I put my reasoning behind that too if you're that interested enough to find it ......
I just think if they're as bad as everyone is saying then Channel 4 wouldn't need to plant someone in their canvassing team and the BBC wouldn't need to plant people in their question time audience to expose them. |
What proof do you have that C4 planted someone in the campaign team, and that the BBC have planted people in the QT audience?
The fact that the chap was an actor is not proof, nor are Führage's claims. | |
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| Did Reform field AI candidates? on 14:52 - Jul 10 with 823 views | PassionNotAnger |
| Did Reform field AI candidates? on 14:44 - Jul 10 by Pencilpete |
I literally couldn't give a flying sh1t what you think of me - if I was a Reform voter I'd fcuking tell you so don't worry about that ! ..... I contributed to many posts on here about the election I don't need to lie about it, I openly said I agreed with Farage that immigration is too high, but i'd rather reduce it than stop it altogether like him and if you're asking me did I consider voting for them then yes I did and I make absolutely no apologies for it either .... but ultimately i voted for Starmer - theres also a thread where I put my reasoning behind that too if you're that interested enough to find it ......
I just think if they're as bad as everyone is saying then Channel 4 wouldn't need to plant someone in their canvassing team and the BBC wouldn't need to plant people in their question time audience to expose them. |
Touched a raw nerve!?
I don’t care who you vote for. I just don’t like people (not just you or just on this forum) who keep trying to defend and deflect Reform who, in my opinion, are an abhorrent far right party run by very rich, self absorbed egomaniacs who are manipulating people with dog whistling racist crap causing the continued division in the country that has been nurtured by the right leaning press that ultimately led to the Brexit vote which has deepened divisions way beyond anything remotely healthy.
I don’t set out to offend you or offend you on a personal level but I hate all that Reform pretend to stand for and don’t like this attempt to shift the narrative on them | | | |
| Did Reform field AI candidates? on 15:04 - Jul 10 with 775 views | Pencilpete |
| Did Reform field AI candidates? on 14:49 - Jul 10 by Zx1988 |
What proof do you have that C4 planted someone in the campaign team, and that the BBC have planted people in the QT audience?
The fact that the chap was an actor is not proof, nor are Führage's claims. |
I've already been through the Channel 4 thing - everyone accepts the guy was an actor who has worked for Channel 4 .... and as i've said the chances of him being the canvasser the undercover Channel 4 team just happened to be put with are remote.
I watched the question time (I watched all of them) and the BBC always say that the audience is made up from broad range of voters .... Farage didn't say one thing that got applause from anyone in the entire half hour .... now speaking logically and mathematically if that audience really was a random selection and Reform got 14% of the vote you'd expect in an audience of around 100 for somewhere between 10 and 20 to be Reform voters ... but NOBODY ever applauded or agreed with him ??
Again i'd say that was either a stitch up OR yet another ridiculous set of coincidences and if you believe in either of them i suggest you go buy a lottery ticket - because if i gave you 1000 balls in a giant bag and 860 of them were red and 140 were blue and asked you to pick 100 of them at random i'd say the chances of you picking an entirely red selection would be minimal .......... | | | |
| Did Reform field AI candidates? on 15:05 - Jul 10 with 762 views | Zx1988 |
| Did Reform field AI candidates? on 15:04 - Jul 10 by Pencilpete |
I've already been through the Channel 4 thing - everyone accepts the guy was an actor who has worked for Channel 4 .... and as i've said the chances of him being the canvasser the undercover Channel 4 team just happened to be put with are remote.
I watched the question time (I watched all of them) and the BBC always say that the audience is made up from broad range of voters .... Farage didn't say one thing that got applause from anyone in the entire half hour .... now speaking logically and mathematically if that audience really was a random selection and Reform got 14% of the vote you'd expect in an audience of around 100 for somewhere between 10 and 20 to be Reform voters ... but NOBODY ever applauded or agreed with him ??
Again i'd say that was either a stitch up OR yet another ridiculous set of coincidences and if you believe in either of them i suggest you go buy a lottery ticket - because if i gave you 1000 balls in a giant bag and 860 of them were red and 140 were blue and asked you to pick 100 of them at random i'd say the chances of you picking an entirely red selection would be minimal .......... |
That's f***ing weak logic, even by some of the standards exhibited on here at times.
As others have pointed out, you're incredibly keen to come to the defence of the multi-millionaire racist for someone who claims not to particularly support the limited company for which he grifts. | |
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| Did Reform field AI candidates? on 15:12 - Jul 10 with 749 views | Pencilpete |
| Did Reform field AI candidates? on 14:52 - Jul 10 by PassionNotAnger |
Touched a raw nerve!?
I don’t care who you vote for. I just don’t like people (not just you or just on this forum) who keep trying to defend and deflect Reform who, in my opinion, are an abhorrent far right party run by very rich, self absorbed egomaniacs who are manipulating people with dog whistling racist crap causing the continued division in the country that has been nurtured by the right leaning press that ultimately led to the Brexit vote which has deepened divisions way beyond anything remotely healthy.
I don’t set out to offend you or offend you on a personal level but I hate all that Reform pretend to stand for and don’t like this attempt to shift the narrative on them |
i have no issue with anyone who wants to attack anyone be it Reform, Labour, Tories, liberals because we all have different opinions and the world would be a very boring place if we all thought the same about everything.
but fight a fair fight ..... I might not have 'proof' cos i don't work for M15 but if you REALLY think that Channel 4 bloke wasn't a plant and that the BBC question time audience wasn't rigged then i've got 5 magic beans for sale that you can buy for £1000 each ........
The whole point of a democracy is that everyone gets a fair chance to air their views and then we, the voters pick which one we agree with ..... Reform (wether you like them or not, agree with them or not) didn't get that chance ..... Farage got half an hour on question time and because of the C4 plant spent 20 minutes of it telling everyone he wasnt a racist .... if he'd been given half an hour to actually talk baout his policies then people might have realised they had no substance and were ridiculous and unachieveable ..... | | | |
| Did Reform field AI candidates? on 15:18 - Jul 10 with 732 views | Pencilpete |
| Did Reform field AI candidates? on 15:05 - Jul 10 by Zx1988 |
That's f***ing weak logic, even by some of the standards exhibited on here at times.
As others have pointed out, you're incredibly keen to come to the defence of the multi-millionaire racist for someone who claims not to particularly support the limited company for which he grifts. |
How is it weak logic ?
Your logic is that in a room full of canvessers that the undercover Channel 4 crew COULD have gone with that they just happened to go with him ?
and your logic is also that a party that has 14% of the vote, couldn't even get 1% of a 'randomly selected' audience ?
Finally ... as i already said i honestly couldn't care less wether you think i'm a Reform voter, a labour voter or a monster raving loony voter ......
You may have seen on other threads i'm an autistic so i generally see things in black and white with no grey areas and for me planting people to get a story and picking a hostile audience .... is wrong wether you like them or not | | | |
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| Did Reform field AI candidates? on 16:47 - Jul 10 with 667 views | bluelagos |
| Did Reform field AI candidates? on 15:18 - Jul 10 by Pencilpete |
How is it weak logic ?
Your logic is that in a room full of canvessers that the undercover Channel 4 crew COULD have gone with that they just happened to go with him ?
and your logic is also that a party that has 14% of the vote, couldn't even get 1% of a 'randomly selected' audience ?
Finally ... as i already said i honestly couldn't care less wether you think i'm a Reform voter, a labour voter or a monster raving loony voter ......
You may have seen on other threads i'm an autistic so i generally see things in black and white with no grey areas and for me planting people to get a story and picking a hostile audience .... is wrong wether you like them or not |
In terms of the audience selection I think you are barking up the wrong tree.
They select an audience based on how they voted at the previous election. If in future QTs you get an absence of Reform voters your point would stand, but not for ones before the election. |  |
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| Did Reform field AI candidates? on 16:55 - Jul 10 with 626 views | bluelagos |
| Did Reform field AI candidates? on 15:18 - Jul 10 by Pencilpete |
How is it weak logic ?
Your logic is that in a room full of canvessers that the undercover Channel 4 crew COULD have gone with that they just happened to go with him ?
and your logic is also that a party that has 14% of the vote, couldn't even get 1% of a 'randomly selected' audience ?
Finally ... as i already said i honestly couldn't care less wether you think i'm a Reform voter, a labour voter or a monster raving loony voter ......
You may have seen on other threads i'm an autistic so i generally see things in black and white with no grey areas and for me planting people to get a story and picking a hostile audience .... is wrong wether you like them or not |
Ref the fact that C4 undercover guy ended up with the guy he did....
If we assume a fair chunk of Reform volunteers, people who have traveled miles at their own expense, are highly motivated Reform supporters, it's not exactly unlikely that they would stumble on a deeply unpleasant racist.
If would be wrong to label all Reform voters or supporters as racists, but I think racists are attracted to them due to their strong anti migrant rhetoric.
C4 guys ending up with a racist is only a massive shock if you believe most of their campaigners are not racist. I don't believe that for a minute.
They clearly attract some deeply objectionable people. Denying that rather than accepting it and acting on it is simply denial imho as Farage and Tice are doing
Far better to accept it and address it. | |
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| Did Reform field AI candidates? on 17:05 - Jul 10 with 598 views | PhilTWTD |
| Did Reform field AI candidates? on 15:04 - Jul 10 by Pencilpete |
I've already been through the Channel 4 thing - everyone accepts the guy was an actor who has worked for Channel 4 .... and as i've said the chances of him being the canvasser the undercover Channel 4 team just happened to be put with are remote.
I watched the question time (I watched all of them) and the BBC always say that the audience is made up from broad range of voters .... Farage didn't say one thing that got applause from anyone in the entire half hour .... now speaking logically and mathematically if that audience really was a random selection and Reform got 14% of the vote you'd expect in an audience of around 100 for somewhere between 10 and 20 to be Reform voters ... but NOBODY ever applauded or agreed with him ??
Again i'd say that was either a stitch up OR yet another ridiculous set of coincidences and if you believe in either of them i suggest you go buy a lottery ticket - because if i gave you 1000 balls in a giant bag and 860 of them were red and 140 were blue and asked you to pick 100 of them at random i'd say the chances of you picking an entirely red selection would be minimal .......... |
"...everyone accepts the guy was an actor who has worked for Channel 4 .... and as i've said the chances of him being the canvasser the undercover Channel 4 team just happened to be put with are remote."
Channel Four's shows are made by independent producers, including the news which is made by ITN. Appearing on one show made by one company really can't be used as a logical step that he was being paid by another even if both were on Channel Four. |  | | |
| Did Reform field AI candidates? on 17:11 - Jul 10 with 578 views | bluelagos |
| Did Reform field AI candidates? on 17:05 - Jul 10 by PhilTWTD |
"...everyone accepts the guy was an actor who has worked for Channel 4 .... and as i've said the chances of him being the canvasser the undercover Channel 4 team just happened to be put with are remote."
Channel Four's shows are made by independent producers, including the news which is made by ITN. Appearing on one show made by one company really can't be used as a logical step that he was being paid by another even if both were on Channel Four. |
And a number of complaints were made to Ofcom who rejected them
The conspiracy theory (which is what it is) that C4 set up reform doesn't stand up to scrutiny. Indeed if it were a set up how was it that the guy got allocated to C4 undercover guy? Did C4 also infiltrate Reform workers too?
And the racist guy was one of many. Other staff made deeply homophobic comments also shown
Farage and Tice shouting "fake news" rather than addressing the issues is straight from the Trump playbook albeit some will fall for it... | |
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| Did Reform field AI candidates? on 17:17 - Jul 10 with 563 views | Pencilpete |
| Did Reform field AI candidates? on 17:05 - Jul 10 by PhilTWTD |
"...everyone accepts the guy was an actor who has worked for Channel 4 .... and as i've said the chances of him being the canvasser the undercover Channel 4 team just happened to be put with are remote."
Channel Four's shows are made by independent producers, including the news which is made by ITN. Appearing on one show made by one company really can't be used as a logical step that he was being paid by another even if both were on Channel Four. |
I take your points Re: the Question time audience - i'd still say even if they were a mixed bag of voters from a previous election you'd still be hard pressed not to at least have a couple of people in it who were at least thinking of voting reform ....
The other thing about the Channel 4 bloke ... and i haven't said this so far because i haven't seen it so can't 'prove it' as i am so often asked ....... but he is apparantly a quite well spoken man but on his performance reels on his website he has a certain character he plays who is the persona he was portraying on channel 4 - now assuming that is the case why would he not be himself and be in this character unless he was indeed an actor who was playing a part for the cameras ?
As i've said before there are ALOT of coincidences and yes i agree it could be a remarkable coincidence but it's not very likely nor is it likely that the BBC could select a random audience or 100 without a single reform supporter in it | | | |
| Did Reform field AI candidates? on 17:26 - Jul 10 with 551 views | PassionNotAnger |
| Did Reform field AI candidates? on 17:17 - Jul 10 by Pencilpete |
I take your points Re: the Question time audience - i'd still say even if they were a mixed bag of voters from a previous election you'd still be hard pressed not to at least have a couple of people in it who were at least thinking of voting reform ....
The other thing about the Channel 4 bloke ... and i haven't said this so far because i haven't seen it so can't 'prove it' as i am so often asked ....... but he is apparantly a quite well spoken man but on his performance reels on his website he has a certain character he plays who is the persona he was portraying on channel 4 - now assuming that is the case why would he not be himself and be in this character unless he was indeed an actor who was playing a part for the cameras ?
As i've said before there are ALOT of coincidences and yes i agree it could be a remarkable coincidence but it's not very likely nor is it likely that the BBC could select a random audience or 100 without a single reform supporter in it |
Seriously just stop for a second and look at the facts
You’ve just admitted you haven’t even seen the Channel 4 footage (and you just said about his voice characteristics) so you’ve listened to him in acting roles but not in the documentary that you are claiming is a stitch-up!? You are becoming less credible with every post.
Perhaps you are frequenting other groups or forums that are discussing this and and then presenting it as your arguement on here for some reason but clearly you are being fed this guff and repeating it without critical assessment.
If you cared that deeply (enough to post repeatedly on here that it’s a stitch up) at least watch the documentary ffs (you would have seen it wasn’t just one person making comments) | | | |
| Did Reform field AI candidates? on 17:27 - Jul 10 with 545 views | Zx1988 |
| Did Reform field AI candidates? on 17:17 - Jul 10 by Pencilpete |
I take your points Re: the Question time audience - i'd still say even if they were a mixed bag of voters from a previous election you'd still be hard pressed not to at least have a couple of people in it who were at least thinking of voting reform ....
The other thing about the Channel 4 bloke ... and i haven't said this so far because i haven't seen it so can't 'prove it' as i am so often asked ....... but he is apparantly a quite well spoken man but on his performance reels on his website he has a certain character he plays who is the persona he was portraying on channel 4 - now assuming that is the case why would he not be himself and be in this character unless he was indeed an actor who was playing a part for the cameras ?
As i've said before there are ALOT of coincidences and yes i agree it could be a remarkable coincidence but it's not very likely nor is it likely that the BBC could select a random audience or 100 without a single reform supporter in it |
Why are you so desperate to concoct ever-more tenuous explanations as to why Führage and co. were set up, rather than just accepting that a limited company which expresses the sorts of views that are likely to appeal to the absolute dregs of the human race does, in fact, attract a lot of racists/homophobes etc., to its ranks? | |
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