| Covid vaccine harm 06:24 - Feb 18 with 3608 views | gtsb1966 |
22,000 claims yet only a 1% pay out but at a cost of £50m to the tax payer. Covid, the disease that keeps on giving, for some.
https://www.bbc.co.uk/news/art |  | | |  |
| Covid vaccine harm on 21:36 - Feb 18 with 414 views | Nthsuffolkblue |
| Covid vaccine harm on 21:29 - Feb 18 by Cafe_Newman |
I asked you the following questions "Was everyone that died of Covid or needed hospital admission unvaccinated? Do you have figures that show covid deaths and hospitalisations for the vaccinated and unvaccinated?"
You send me a link to data for a very brief period of time in 2025. That doesn't appear to answer my question.
Additionally, the fact that you provide government data has no bearing on whether it can be trusted. It's a little naive to suggest that it does. Do you trust all government information, irrespective of the Political Party in power and the country? |
If your scientific knowledge is up to understanding it, the data is out there. https://pubmed.ncbi.nlm.nih.go
https://www.scientificamerican
https://factually.co/fact-chec
https://onlinelibrary.wiley.co |  |
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| Covid vaccine harm on 21:39 - Feb 18 with 410 views | Swansea_Blue |
| Covid vaccine harm on 21:29 - Feb 18 by Cafe_Newman |
I asked you the following questions "Was everyone that died of Covid or needed hospital admission unvaccinated? Do you have figures that show covid deaths and hospitalisations for the vaccinated and unvaccinated?"
You send me a link to data for a very brief period of time in 2025. That doesn't appear to answer my question.
Additionally, the fact that you provide government data has no bearing on whether it can be trusted. It's a little naive to suggest that it does. Do you trust all government information, irrespective of the Political Party in power and the country? |
Seriously? It's one of the most studied viruses on the planet. There were millions of hospitalisations. Of course there are studies using real patient data that compare the vaccinated and unvaccinated. Just search if you're interested. E.g.:
(A search dump, but you're more than welcome to verify them for yourself):
Recent Studies (2024–2025)
2024-2025 Updated Vaccine Effectiveness (NEJM, Oct 2025): A retrospective matched cohort study of nearly 300,000 US veterans (mean age 70.7) found that the 2024–2025 KP.2 COVID-19 vaccine provided significant protection against hospitalization.
Effectiveness against hospitalization: Roughly 40% (45% in those >65) over a 6-month period.
Effectiveness against death: 64%–65%.
2024-2025 Vaccine Effectiveness in Children (CDC, Dec 2025): A study found that the 2024–2025 vaccine provided added protection against COVID-19-associated emergency department/urgent care (ED/UC) visits, with a 76% reduction in children aged 9 months–4 years and 56% in those aged 5–17 years.
European EuroSAVE Network Studies (WHO, Dec 2025): Research from May 2023 to April 2024 found that only 3% of hospitalized COVID-19 patients had received a vaccine within the past 12 months. A study covering 2024-2025 showed that up-to-date vaccines (within 6 months) were 60% effective at preventing hospitalization.
2024-2025 Vaccine Effectiveness (JAMA, Feb 2026): A multi-center case-control study found that 2024-2025 vaccines showed a 40% reduction in hospitalizations and a 79% reduction in intensive care unit (ICU) admission or death.
JAMA
JAMA
+5
Key Systematic Reviews and Longitudinal Studies
Systematic Review and Meta-Analysis (Nov 2024): A meta-analysis of 50 studies published in Immunotherapy Advances found that both Pfizer/BioNTech and Moderna vaccines (2-dose or 3-dose) reported high effectiveness against hospitalization (84%–86% pooled).
AvonCAP Study (UK, 2021–2022): A study published in The Lancet found that BNT162b2 (Pfizer) was associated with 82.5% effectiveness against hospitalization during the Delta period, and 30.9%–72.6% (depending on specific endpoints) during the Omicron period.
Long-Term Protection in England (Gov.uk, 2024): Studies using SARI watch surveillance data showed high protection against hospitalization after 2 doses, with bivalent boosters providing a 50%–60% increase in protection for individuals whose last dose was >6 months prior.
Oxford Academic
Oxford Academic
+2
Earlier Foundational Studies (2021–2022)
EAVE II Project (Scotland, 2021): Early real-world data showed that a single dose of Pfizer/BioNTech or Oxford/AstraZeneca vaccines provided a substantial (over 80%) reduction in hospitalizations.
CDC Multi-state Study (June 2021): A study of adults ≥50 years found full mRNA vaccination (Pfizer/Moderna) was 89% effective against COVID-19 hospitalization.
UAE Inactivated/mRNA Study (2021–2022): A study during the Delta/Omicron outbreak found that full vaccination with Sinopharm or Pfizer was 90%–94% effective in reducing the rate of hospitalization.
National Institutes of Health (NIH) | (.gov)
National Institutes of Health (NIH) | (.gov)
+3 |  |
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| Covid vaccine harm on 21:46 - Feb 18 with 384 views | Swansea_Blue |
| Covid vaccine harm on 21:30 - Feb 18 by Axeldalai_lama |
I didn't assume that. I said your views seemed similar to anti Vax ones. You seem ridiculously well versed in certain arguments around the specifics of data around COVID and around very specific data models. I stand by my point that it was disingenuous to enter this with 'no skin in the game' as the first words in a debate where you clearly have both knowledge and opinion. |
There's doesn't appear to be any well-versed knowledge on display. Just challenging, reflection, a bit of shifting the goalposts. But you're right to be suspicious. It's not an argument in good faith or a genuine discussion and there's very obviously an agenda.
Although I'm quite disappointed that Nthsuffolkblue didn't have a detailed review of all data of all studies of all Covid patients ready to go. Standards are slipping on TWTD ;) | |
| |
| Covid vaccine harm on 21:48 - Feb 18 with 380 views | Nthsuffolkblue |
| Covid vaccine harm on 21:46 - Feb 18 by Swansea_Blue |
There's doesn't appear to be any well-versed knowledge on display. Just challenging, reflection, a bit of shifting the goalposts. But you're right to be suspicious. It's not an argument in good faith or a genuine discussion and there's very obviously an agenda.
Although I'm quite disappointed that Nthsuffolkblue didn't have a detailed review of all data of all studies of all Covid patients ready to go. Standards are slipping on TWTD ;) |
Thank you for stepping up where I failed. | |
| |
| Covid vaccine harm on 21:50 - Feb 18 with 381 views | Cafe_Newman |
| Covid vaccine harm on 21:30 - Feb 18 by Axeldalai_lama |
I didn't assume that. I said your views seemed similar to anti Vax ones. You seem ridiculously well versed in certain arguments around the specifics of data around COVID and around very specific data models. I stand by my point that it was disingenuous to enter this with 'no skin in the game' as the first words in a debate where you clearly have both knowledge and opinion. |
" You seem ridiculously well versed in certain arguments around the specifics of data around COVID and around very specific data models."
Probably the opposite actually. You don't need to be very bright to know what modelling is and that its reliability is entirely dependent on what values/info you feed into it in the first place. "Sh1t in : sh1t out" as they say.
The usefulness of models is only as good as how they are set up, therefore any assessment of a model as a useful tool requires knowing the information that it's fed with at the start.
Like I said, if you have that information, we could start to look at how useful as a model it can be.
If a general comment of this nature is being "ridiculously well versed in certain arguments around the specifics of data around COVID and around very specific data models", we have a very different understanding of the words ridiculous, well-versed, specifics and very. When we fail to agree of the meaning of such basic words, the whole point of conversation becomes pointless because we're really not speaking the same language. |  | | |
| Covid vaccine harm on 21:52 - Feb 18 with 372 views | Nthsuffolkblue |
| Covid vaccine harm on 21:50 - Feb 18 by Cafe_Newman |
" You seem ridiculously well versed in certain arguments around the specifics of data around COVID and around very specific data models."
Probably the opposite actually. You don't need to be very bright to know what modelling is and that its reliability is entirely dependent on what values/info you feed into it in the first place. "Sh1t in : sh1t out" as they say.
The usefulness of models is only as good as how they are set up, therefore any assessment of a model as a useful tool requires knowing the information that it's fed with at the start.
Like I said, if you have that information, we could start to look at how useful as a model it can be.
If a general comment of this nature is being "ridiculously well versed in certain arguments around the specifics of data around COVID and around very specific data models", we have a very different understanding of the words ridiculous, well-versed, specifics and very. When we fail to agree of the meaning of such basic words, the whole point of conversation becomes pointless because we're really not speaking the same language. |
The data provided by Swansea and by me is what you requested. An analysis of vaccinated vs unvaccinated hospitalisations and death rates. They consistently show the effectiveness of vaccination.
What is the purpose of your continued questioning of it? The data is clear. | |
| |
| Covid vaccine harm on 21:57 - Feb 18 with 347 views | Cafe_Newman |
You've obviously sent me those links because they contain the answers to my questions.
However, what you've done is equivalent to pointing at four haystacks and saying "if you're up to rummaging around in hay for the next month, the three needles you are looking for are in there!"
I appreciate the links; they're important, but if you know that the information actually answer my questions, why not copy and paste the relevant parts and then I can find them in the documents you link so I can read them in context? | | | |
| Covid vaccine harm on 22:00 - Feb 18 with 342 views | Swansea_Blue |
| Covid vaccine harm on 21:52 - Feb 18 by Nthsuffolkblue |
The data provided by Swansea and by me is what you requested. An analysis of vaccinated vs unvaccinated hospitalisations and death rates. They consistently show the effectiveness of vaccination.
What is the purpose of your continued questioning of it? The data is clear. |
And clear to people experienced in looking at these things and not just feckwits like us (no offence intended  ) | |
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| Covid vaccine harm on 22:02 - Feb 18 with 337 views | Axeldalai_lama |
| Covid vaccine harm on 21:50 - Feb 18 by Cafe_Newman |
" You seem ridiculously well versed in certain arguments around the specifics of data around COVID and around very specific data models."
Probably the opposite actually. You don't need to be very bright to know what modelling is and that its reliability is entirely dependent on what values/info you feed into it in the first place. "Sh1t in : sh1t out" as they say.
The usefulness of models is only as good as how they are set up, therefore any assessment of a model as a useful tool requires knowing the information that it's fed with at the start.
Like I said, if you have that information, we could start to look at how useful as a model it can be.
If a general comment of this nature is being "ridiculously well versed in certain arguments around the specifics of data around COVID and around very specific data models", we have a very different understanding of the words ridiculous, well-versed, specifics and very. When we fail to agree of the meaning of such basic words, the whole point of conversation becomes pointless because we're really not speaking the same language. |
I'm bowing out. Semantics and word soup about everything. This all doesn't pass the basic plausibility test. You're 'general comments' and batting away of any help received, whilst also being eager to learn and not against anything and just seeking answers, all just seems a well worn load of old.... Anyway, good luck to you and I hope you find the knowledge that you are, apparently, trying to seek.
Adios. |  | | |
| Covid vaccine harm on 22:06 - Feb 18 with 319 views | Cafe_Newman |
| Covid vaccine harm on 21:39 - Feb 18 by Swansea_Blue |
Seriously? It's one of the most studied viruses on the planet. There were millions of hospitalisations. Of course there are studies using real patient data that compare the vaccinated and unvaccinated. Just search if you're interested. E.g.:
(A search dump, but you're more than welcome to verify them for yourself):
Recent Studies (2024–2025)
2024-2025 Updated Vaccine Effectiveness (NEJM, Oct 2025): A retrospective matched cohort study of nearly 300,000 US veterans (mean age 70.7) found that the 2024–2025 KP.2 COVID-19 vaccine provided significant protection against hospitalization.
Effectiveness against hospitalization: Roughly 40% (45% in those >65) over a 6-month period.
Effectiveness against death: 64%–65%.
2024-2025 Vaccine Effectiveness in Children (CDC, Dec 2025): A study found that the 2024–2025 vaccine provided added protection against COVID-19-associated emergency department/urgent care (ED/UC) visits, with a 76% reduction in children aged 9 months–4 years and 56% in those aged 5–17 years.
European EuroSAVE Network Studies (WHO, Dec 2025): Research from May 2023 to April 2024 found that only 3% of hospitalized COVID-19 patients had received a vaccine within the past 12 months. A study covering 2024-2025 showed that up-to-date vaccines (within 6 months) were 60% effective at preventing hospitalization.
2024-2025 Vaccine Effectiveness (JAMA, Feb 2026): A multi-center case-control study found that 2024-2025 vaccines showed a 40% reduction in hospitalizations and a 79% reduction in intensive care unit (ICU) admission or death.
JAMA
JAMA
+5
Key Systematic Reviews and Longitudinal Studies
Systematic Review and Meta-Analysis (Nov 2024): A meta-analysis of 50 studies published in Immunotherapy Advances found that both Pfizer/BioNTech and Moderna vaccines (2-dose or 3-dose) reported high effectiveness against hospitalization (84%–86% pooled).
AvonCAP Study (UK, 2021–2022): A study published in The Lancet found that BNT162b2 (Pfizer) was associated with 82.5% effectiveness against hospitalization during the Delta period, and 30.9%–72.6% (depending on specific endpoints) during the Omicron period.
Long-Term Protection in England (Gov.uk, 2024): Studies using SARI watch surveillance data showed high protection against hospitalization after 2 doses, with bivalent boosters providing a 50%–60% increase in protection for individuals whose last dose was >6 months prior.
Oxford Academic
Oxford Academic
+2
Earlier Foundational Studies (2021–2022)
EAVE II Project (Scotland, 2021): Early real-world data showed that a single dose of Pfizer/BioNTech or Oxford/AstraZeneca vaccines provided a substantial (over 80%) reduction in hospitalizations.
CDC Multi-state Study (June 2021): A study of adults ≥50 years found full mRNA vaccination (Pfizer/Moderna) was 89% effective against COVID-19 hospitalization.
UAE Inactivated/mRNA Study (2021–2022): A study during the Delta/Omicron outbreak found that full vaccination with Sinopharm or Pfizer was 90%–94% effective in reducing the rate of hospitalization.
National Institutes of Health (NIH) | (.gov)
National Institutes of Health (NIH) | (.gov)
+3 |
Thanks, but I don't automatically accept the findings a report or study without looking at the methodology of the study. You know, all the stuff that makes the research valuable.
Perhaps link me to one of these studies, one that you think clearly scientifically sound in nature and I can read it. If I have doubts, we can talk about it and perhaps you can answer any questions I have.
I've written and read enough research papers in my life to know that quantity is normally a cover for quality. | | | |
| Covid vaccine harm on 22:11 - Feb 18 with 294 views | Cafe_Newman |
| Covid vaccine harm on 21:46 - Feb 18 by Swansea_Blue |
There's doesn't appear to be any well-versed knowledge on display. Just challenging, reflection, a bit of shifting the goalposts. But you're right to be suspicious. It's not an argument in good faith or a genuine discussion and there's very obviously an agenda.
Although I'm quite disappointed that Nthsuffolkblue didn't have a detailed review of all data of all studies of all Covid patients ready to go. Standards are slipping on TWTD ;) |
That's a bit of a contradiction. A minute ago you were saying there's so much information out there. Link me to just one that's good and highlight the area which answers by questions. If you can't, you're guilty of exactly the same obfuscation that you are accusing me of.
FWIW, I agree there's no "well-versed knowledge on display", exactly as I pointed out, just a basic comment on modelling in general. | | | |
| Covid vaccine harm on 23:12 - Feb 18 with 253 views | Cafe_Newman |
| Covid vaccine harm on 20:46 - Feb 18 by Nthsuffolkblue |
To answer your final paragraph, vaccinated people as well as unvaccinated were hospitalised. People died in both groups. The difference is that vaccination reduced the numbers of both compared with those who were unvaccinated.
Since this has been widely reported and discussed, I wonder why someone who seems to take a great deal of interest in it isn't already aware of that and asked a rather blunt black-and-white question suggesting that you think it wasn't the case. |
Thanks for this.
It seems that I've wound a few people up.
You'll forgive me for not seeing everybody's comments when four people are sending me links, cartoons, scientific, papers and "I'm not a medic but this is how I see it" type of comments.
The question I asked was in response to this comment : ""The big thing was that it (covid vaccination) hugely reduces your chances of getting very sick and needing admission to hospital."
You answered with this: "To answer ..., vaccinated people as well as unvaccinated were hospitalised. People died in both groups. The difference is that vaccination reduced the numbers of both compared with those who were unvaccinated."
That's great. Thanks. I'll conclude firstly that the claim during the covid years that the vaccines were "safe and effective" together with comments from leading politicians like Biden stating categorically that if you get the shot then you won't get covid were disingenuous to say the very least. I'm not interested in knowing whether vaccination has produced a lower death rate than non-vaccination. I was simply looking for evidence that people from both camps had died in order to dismiss the claim that the vaccines are effective. You will argue that vaccination is more effective than non-vaccination, of course, but I can argue that non-vaccination is also effective as I know people who were not vaccinated and didn't get covid at all and none of them died.
The greatest protection against covid illness and death was general good health, lack of other illnesses, and a well-functioning immune system.
I have consistently stated that I don't mind people getting vaccinated. Rather, that those wishing not to get vaccinated are allowed to do so without being pressurised or punished.
There are bags of reasons why people choose not to be vaccinated and some may be very poor reasons, others perfectly good: from honestly believing that Big Pharma is out to kill you, to responsible perfectly healthy people with good immune systems knowing the percentage infection and death risks and the state of their immune systems being enough to resist serious illness.
Branding all the unvaccinated as "anti-vaxxers" was very ugly pitch-fork waving hate which turned many people who were perfectly healthy and capable of withstanding the virus, into passionate sceptics, skeptical of well-meaning members of the medical profession.
And I'll add once more, I'm not anti-vax, but I respect the right of anyone to refuse vaccination because of the importance of bodily sovereignty. I am far less radical and more tolerant in my beliefs surrounding vaccination than those who believed (and still believe) that everyone should be vaccinated because the government, pharmaceutical industry or even the medical profession in general believe that it is the right thing to do.
Thanks for your input. | | | |
| Covid vaccine harm on 23:13 - Feb 18 with 254 views | reusersfreekicks |
| Covid vaccine harm on 10:59 - Feb 18 by darkhorse28 |
They were to do what the job of government and media is to do. Not to panic. Reduce issues through the prism of group think and echo chambers, and to have more open and honest discussions.
It quickly became and still is about vaccine efficacy overhaul, rather than a specific set of vaccines in this situation, which was a unique set of circumstances.
Yes the saved lives. But at what long term costs. Healthy people are suffering and in Scotland we’ve run covert heart checks of random samples of men, with zero discussions on why (entirely because of Covid vaccine concerns).
The amount of long term implications remains to be seen, but it certainly isn’t good…, the lack of open discussion, and treating people like village idiots due to fears of conflation to all vaccines is terrifying, it’s the media and state at its worst, putting health behind careers and agreed narrative.
The consequences are huge, and I suspect we’ll never get the true story.
Just look at the ‘follow the science’ John Hopkins who’s research we used did a meta analysis, and it destroyed the actions of our media and politicians after the first lockdown…, obviously hindsight is wonderful, but we followed the science, right up until it didn’t agree with media and politicians, then we ignored it entirely.
The same research. But the definitive end. It said our politicians and media got it badly wrong, no lives saved (statistically insignificant) due to lockdowns (not vaccines).
There’s an agreed narrative.
The heart conditions. Blood clotting. Strokes.., the numbers and increases since vaccination are terryfying.
We’ll never publish the causality, I doubt we’ll ever do the expanded research required.
ALL the funding comes from those parties that can’t afford it to ever happen.
So yes it was complicated and difficult.
But no. It’s not politicians and media’s jobs to put our health behind their careers. And the profits and sustainability of our pharmaceutical industry.
It was their job to protect and inform.
I worked for the Scottish Ambulance service, Covid testing, and it was heartbreaking…., but it’s worse watching the complete lack of scrutiny and frankly the what is a cover up that in many decades time I suspect we will be talking about.
I see research data (third hand) though a close friends wife who works for a drug research company…., she’s very pro vaccine obviously .., she had zero covid vaccines and the data in Canada and Scotland she has seen is horrific and can never get behind small samples, because it’s so bad.
She’s never seen results not get funding for bigger sample sizes, when the conflation of problems to those vaccinated is so strong.
She has now…, I think sadly it is what it is. A huge cover up.
And was it worth the two generational fertility compromise, time will tell, but the blood clotting is real, the heart issues are real, the numbers are staggering and it’s criminal, not that we made those decisions…, most people can empathise with the circumstances, and difficulty…, but the cover up and lack of integrity NOW and since.
I had 3 vaccines…, it was made a condition of my job, for NHS Scotland.
What do you think would happen if I’ve been forced as a very fit and healthy person to take 3 vaccines, that have placed my long term health in jeopardy.
Multiply that by billions across the globe, add in a risk of people losing faith in vaccines and you have you answer.
So no. I don’t think it’s ok politicians care more about money and big business, and their careers than our health!!
It’s woeful. Obviously hindsight but we should have educated fit and healthy people they not being vaccinated was an option.
Too difficult message to sell though wasn’t it. So panic it is .., and (not) deal with the consequences later.
Maybe all the heart issues in vaccinated populations are just a big old coincidence .., we did eat a lot of snacks. Sake. There is no mitigation for how we’ve responded to the failures, more panic and self interest.
Obviously not a party political point, it’s all politicians, all media, and nobody can still speak out without been drown out as anti vaccine …, that dogma is incredibly unhealthy …, when genuine discourse is reduced to dogma and tribal nonsense.
Vaccines are great. Not all vaccines are great. If only we couod do complexity, nuance, discourse as a society,, millions of people wouldn’t now be dropping dead of something with a higher mortality than Covid! .., the truth will out.
But it will be decades. Nobody wants that smoke. Even we don’t want to know if we are honest .., I’m sure you had multiple ones too.
Imagine the cost. The truth wouldn’t bankrupt corporations .., it could bankrupt nations, I’m guessing many NHS employees were told it was a vaccination or their job! .., not great is it. Plus th other billions would have a case their governments coerced them.
So we did have choices. Not panicking being the best…, wouldn’t be so bad if most of the world didn’t follow the singular narrative.
But some country’s have lower vaccination rates .., so you can research heart conditions and increased general mortality pre and post vaccinations.
I wouldn’t. It’s genuinely depressing. And research to prove causality, isn’t coming, very predictable. So we didn’t get it right, nobody did except maybe Sweden and a few others.
Time and light (eventually) will reveal all, hopefully this who continue to lose loved ones, will eventually get support.., lot of people more interested in their ego and validating their pro vaccination narrative than genuine empathy to those dying .., that’s not a functional society.
I don’t care either way. I want the truth. Not ego and self interest. |
Think I have met you waving a placard and selling a weird newspaper at traffic lights nearby.
Hope you also get the Microsoft chip out of your ear |  | | |
| Covid vaccine harm on 23:19 - Feb 18 with 236 views | reusersfreekicks |
| Covid vaccine harm on 19:12 - Feb 18 by Cafe_Newman |
None of my family or friends died of COVID irrespective of vaccination status. None of my family or friends can prove any cause between vaccination and subsequent illness. Therefore, I have no skin in the game.
I do have an interest in government overreach and I consider enforced or coerced vaccination an example of government overreach. I know that doesn't sit well with some people but if people think that the unvaccinated pose a risk to others, they can get vaccinated to protect themselves, after all, the vaccines are safe and EFFECTIVE. |
Ffs | | | |
| Covid vaccine harm on 23:20 - Feb 18 with 232 views | lowhouseblue |
| Covid vaccine harm on 23:12 - Feb 18 by Cafe_Newman |
Thanks for this.
It seems that I've wound a few people up.
You'll forgive me for not seeing everybody's comments when four people are sending me links, cartoons, scientific, papers and "I'm not a medic but this is how I see it" type of comments.
The question I asked was in response to this comment : ""The big thing was that it (covid vaccination) hugely reduces your chances of getting very sick and needing admission to hospital."
You answered with this: "To answer ..., vaccinated people as well as unvaccinated were hospitalised. People died in both groups. The difference is that vaccination reduced the numbers of both compared with those who were unvaccinated."
That's great. Thanks. I'll conclude firstly that the claim during the covid years that the vaccines were "safe and effective" together with comments from leading politicians like Biden stating categorically that if you get the shot then you won't get covid were disingenuous to say the very least. I'm not interested in knowing whether vaccination has produced a lower death rate than non-vaccination. I was simply looking for evidence that people from both camps had died in order to dismiss the claim that the vaccines are effective. You will argue that vaccination is more effective than non-vaccination, of course, but I can argue that non-vaccination is also effective as I know people who were not vaccinated and didn't get covid at all and none of them died.
The greatest protection against covid illness and death was general good health, lack of other illnesses, and a well-functioning immune system.
I have consistently stated that I don't mind people getting vaccinated. Rather, that those wishing not to get vaccinated are allowed to do so without being pressurised or punished.
There are bags of reasons why people choose not to be vaccinated and some may be very poor reasons, others perfectly good: from honestly believing that Big Pharma is out to kill you, to responsible perfectly healthy people with good immune systems knowing the percentage infection and death risks and the state of their immune systems being enough to resist serious illness.
Branding all the unvaccinated as "anti-vaxxers" was very ugly pitch-fork waving hate which turned many people who were perfectly healthy and capable of withstanding the virus, into passionate sceptics, skeptical of well-meaning members of the medical profession.
And I'll add once more, I'm not anti-vax, but I respect the right of anyone to refuse vaccination because of the importance of bodily sovereignty. I am far less radical and more tolerant in my beliefs surrounding vaccination than those who believed (and still believe) that everyone should be vaccinated because the government, pharmaceutical industry or even the medical profession in general believe that it is the right thing to do.
Thanks for your input. |
does being vaccinated reduce the risk of transmitting the virus to others? if so, should people take that into account when making their choice? |  |
| And so as the loose-bowelled pigeon of time swoops low over the unsuspecting tourist of destiny, and the flatulent skunk of fate wanders into the air-conditioning system of eternity, I notice it's the end of the show |
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| Covid vaccine harm on 23:29 - Feb 18 with 203 views | Cafe_Newman |
| Covid vaccine harm on 23:20 - Feb 18 by lowhouseblue |
does being vaccinated reduce the risk of transmitting the virus to others? if so, should people take that into account when making their choice? |
I think it was Pfizer who stated very publicly that their covid vaccination did not affect transmission.
Regardless of that, do you think that poor food, lack of exercise, alcohol consumption and going to bed late should be banned? Because unfit people who go out on a bender until the small hours and get very little restorative sleep are far more likely to sneeze in public the following day, spread colds and therefore put the life of my elderly mother in danger. [Post edited 18 Feb 23:32]
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| Covid vaccine harm on 23:34 - Feb 18 with 183 views | lowhouseblue |
| Covid vaccine harm on 23:29 - Feb 18 by Cafe_Newman |
I think it was Pfizer who stated very publicly that their covid vaccination did not affect transmission.
Regardless of that, do you think that poor food, lack of exercise, alcohol consumption and going to bed late should be banned? Because unfit people who go out on a bender until the small hours and get very little restorative sleep are far more likely to sneeze in public the following day, spread colds and therefore put the life of my elderly mother in danger. [Post edited 18 Feb 23:32]
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i think the things you list might affect the severity of the disease but i don't think it's been claimed that they affect transmission. the link between vaccination and transmission, and other things and transmission, seems the key issue - i don't know overall what current research says.
clearly transmission through being out on a bender was controlled by lockdowns. | |
| And so as the loose-bowelled pigeon of time swoops low over the unsuspecting tourist of destiny, and the flatulent skunk of fate wanders into the air-conditioning system of eternity, I notice it's the end of the show |
| |
| Covid vaccine harm on 23:39 - Feb 18 with 164 views | Cafe_Newman |
| Covid vaccine harm on 23:34 - Feb 18 by lowhouseblue |
i think the things you list might affect the severity of the disease but i don't think it's been claimed that they affect transmission. the link between vaccination and transmission, and other things and transmission, seems the key issue - i don't know overall what current research says.
clearly transmission through being out on a bender was controlled by lockdowns. |
Then you appear to be suggesting that in order to protect all of our aging parents and grandparents, we should all be under permanent lockdown because flu and colds are the biggest single killers of the elderly at this time of year. | | | |
| Covid vaccine harm on 23:43 - Feb 18 with 144 views | lowhouseblue |
| Covid vaccine harm on 23:39 - Feb 18 by Cafe_Newman |
Then you appear to be suggesting that in order to protect all of our aging parents and grandparents, we should all be under permanent lockdown because flu and colds are the biggest single killers of the elderly at this time of year. |
no, that's a very silly reading. i'm saying that in considering whether to be vaccinated against a disease with high infectivity and high fatality we should consider how our vaccination alters the risk of us infecting others. i'll leave you to it. | |
| And so as the loose-bowelled pigeon of time swoops low over the unsuspecting tourist of destiny, and the flatulent skunk of fate wanders into the air-conditioning system of eternity, I notice it's the end of the show |
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| Covid vaccine harm on 23:49 - Feb 18 with 120 views | Cafe_Newman |
| Covid vaccine harm on 23:43 - Feb 18 by lowhouseblue |
no, that's a very silly reading. i'm saying that in considering whether to be vaccinated against a disease with high infectivity and high fatality we should consider how our vaccination alters the risk of us infecting others. i'll leave you to it. |
Sneezing spreads air-borne viruses, right? With that in mind, people should consider how they live their lives in order not to spread highly infectious diseases. Have you forgotten about non-symptomatic Covid and how that can be spread? | | | |
| Covid vaccine harm on 23:53 - Feb 18 with 114 views | StokieBlue |
| Covid vaccine harm on 23:49 - Feb 18 by Cafe_Newman |
Sneezing spreads air-borne viruses, right? With that in mind, people should consider how they live their lives in order not to spread highly infectious diseases. Have you forgotten about non-symptomatic Covid and how that can be spread? |
You're attempting to create a false equivalence between COVID and the common cold when there clearly wasn't one with regards to mortality rates at the time of the vaccines.
SB |  | | |
| Covid vaccine harm on 23:53 - Feb 18 with 113 views | eirannach_gorm |
| Covid vaccine harm on 23:39 - Feb 18 by Cafe_Newman |
Then you appear to be suggesting that in order to protect all of our aging parents and grandparents, we should all be under permanent lockdown because flu and colds are the biggest single killers of the elderly at this time of year. |
Thats probably why there's a free flu vaccine for the over 65s. |  | | |
| Covid vaccine harm on 23:56 - Feb 18 with 109 views | Cafe_Newman |
| Covid vaccine harm on 23:53 - Feb 18 by StokieBlue |
You're attempting to create a false equivalence between COVID and the common cold when there clearly wasn't one with regards to mortality rates at the time of the vaccines.
SB |
No, I'm not. I'm making a point about where you draw the line when it comes to other people's health.
I believe if there is a bout of covid going round, healthy people should not be vaccinated or locked up. | | | |
| Covid vaccine harm on 00:02 - Feb 19 with 100 views | Cafe_Newman |
| Covid vaccine harm on 23:53 - Feb 18 by eirannach_gorm |
Thats probably why there's a free flu vaccine for the over 65s. |
My dad took those flu vaccines for the last 10 years of his life. He also got flu every winter. One could argue that the flu vaccines were utterly useless. Others might argue that if he hadn't taken those flu vaccines, he might have suffered much harsher flu symptoms and may have died earlier.
I personally think that he would have been better getting another dog at the age of 65 and got outside more instead of watching all the fear porn on the TV. | | | |
| Covid vaccine harm on 00:05 - Feb 19 with 95 views | reusersfreekicks |
| Covid vaccine harm on 23:56 - Feb 18 by Cafe_Newman |
No, I'm not. I'm making a point about where you draw the line when it comes to other people's health.
I believe if there is a bout of covid going round, healthy people should not be vaccinated or locked up. |
You do know that a lot of previously healthy people died during covid?
How would you have felt as an exhausted nurse or doctor tending to a previously proud anti vaxer now very ill and begging, all to late for the vaccine?
By your logic maybe they shouldn't have been able to access health care.
Or was that fake government and big pharma propaganda.
People still pushing anti vaccine conspiracy nonsense is tedious and offensive | | | |
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