| Looks like the Zionism is Racism motion has passed 15:37 - Oct 4 with 17553 views | giant_stow |
at the Green conference.
What a world. |  |
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| Looks like the Zionism is Racism motion has passed on 16:41 - Oct 8 with 1238 views | GlasgowBlue |
| Looks like the Zionism is Racism motion has passed on 15:44 - Oct 8 by DJR |
I just don't think such a motion, however Zionism is defined, is the appropriate way to go.
It also has to be seen in the following context (from Wikipedia).
"Greens for Palestine organised, supported and (through leading member Lubna Speitan) proposed the motion "Zionism is Racism"
"Greens for Palestine is a pro-Palestinian group that labelled anti-Zionism as its core belief. The group believes that Zionism is a form of racism, and supports a one-state solution to the Israel-Palestine conflict. Somewhat unusually for pro-Palestinian groups, they specifically reject a two-state solution unequivocably - a stance not held by any Palestinian political parties across the spectrum (although PNI leader Mustafa Barghouti has supported the idea in the past).[4] Greens for Palestine rejects the existence of Israel as a recognised state, considering the entire nation, not just the Palestinian Occupied Territories, a "settler colony"." |
We've seen a lot of people use Zionist or Zio as a code word for Jew. It would have been so much easier to pass a motion condemning the Israeli state's expansion into the West Bank and other Palestinian territory.
The Greens are basically parroting the National Front form 1988 which hasn't gone unnoticed.
The clear demonstration of the horseshoe theory.
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| Looks like the Zionism is Racism motion has passed on 16:42 - Oct 8 with 1249 views | Ryorry |
| Looks like the Zionism is Racism motion has passed on 15:44 - Oct 8 by DJR |
I just don't think such a motion, however Zionism is defined, is the appropriate way to go.
It also has to be seen in the following context (from Wikipedia).
"Greens for Palestine organised, supported and (through leading member Lubna Speitan) proposed the motion "Zionism is Racism"
"Greens for Palestine is a pro-Palestinian group that labelled anti-Zionism as its core belief. The group believes that Zionism is a form of racism, and supports a one-state solution to the Israel-Palestine conflict. Somewhat unusually for pro-Palestinian groups, they specifically reject a two-state solution unequivocably - a stance not held by any Palestinian political parties across the spectrum (although PNI leader Mustafa Barghouti has supported the idea in the past).[4] Greens for Palestine rejects the existence of Israel as a recognised state, considering the entire nation, not just the Palestinian Occupied Territories, a "settler colony"." |
Of course it isn't/wasn't the way to go. I've never said that, & I condemned the motion.
It was you yourself who said that if the motion had been to ostracize & condemn the illegal Israeli settlers, that wouldn't have been a problem. It is they who I (and I believe many others) would immediately think of as Zionists at that point (albeit the motion then went much considerably and unacceptably further as you said).
Hence the need to be precise. Several others have said the same on the thread. Maybe you & I are at cross purposes here?! |  |
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| Looks like the Zionism is Racism motion has passed on 17:19 - Oct 8 with 1167 views | DJR |
| Looks like the Zionism is Racism motion has passed on 16:42 - Oct 8 by Ryorry |
Of course it isn't/wasn't the way to go. I've never said that, & I condemned the motion.
It was you yourself who said that if the motion had been to ostracize & condemn the illegal Israeli settlers, that wouldn't have been a problem. It is they who I (and I believe many others) would immediately think of as Zionists at that point (albeit the motion then went much considerably and unacceptably further as you said).
Hence the need to be precise. Several others have said the same on the thread. Maybe you & I are at cross purposes here?! |
You may well be right. Indeed, I think we are often closer to the other's view than our interactions suggest.
I blame myself.  |  | | |
| Looks like the Zionism is Racism motion has passed on 17:37 - Oct 8 with 1134 views | giant_stow |
| Looks like the Zionism is Racism motion has passed on 16:41 - Oct 8 by GlasgowBlue |
We've seen a lot of people use Zionist or Zio as a code word for Jew. It would have been so much easier to pass a motion condemning the Israeli state's expansion into the West Bank and other Palestinian territory.
The Greens are basically parroting the National Front form 1988 which hasn't gone unnoticed.
The clear demonstration of the horseshoe theory.
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Its powerful Tweet that.
(you're absolutely right about what their motion could have said. The funny thing is, doing that would have been less controversial and more powerful for it) | |
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| Looks like the Zionism is Racism motion has passed on 19:21 - Oct 8 with 1044 views | Ryorry |
| Looks like the Zionism is Racism motion has passed on 17:19 - Oct 8 by DJR |
You may well be right. Indeed, I think we are often closer to the other's view than our interactions suggest.
I blame myself. |
I agree!
It's just the nature of internet comms tho, no-one's to blame  | |
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| Looks like the Zionism is Racism motion has passed on 17:55 - Oct 9 with 885 views | GlasgowBlue |
A powerful letter to the leader of Haringey council from Highgate Synagogue.
https://www.jewishnews.co.uk/s
The full text of the letter:
7 October
Dear Mark
Thank you for your emails to us. We take it from both the tone and the content of your email that you are deeply embarrassed with the decision taken by your party to not only brand Zionism as racism but to call for the eradication by any means necessary including violence, of the only Jewish state, the only practising democracy in the Middle East, and also home to half of the world's Jewish population.
We are not surprised you are embarrassed. The pollcv decision which has not Just been endorsed by but was publicly celebrated by the Haringey branch of the Green Party, of which we assume you are a member, Is thus aligning Itself with Hamas, a eenocldal, homophobic and mlsoeynistlc lslamlst terrorist oreanlsation not only responsible for the worst massacre of Jews since the Holocaust, but countless murders and torture of Its own people.
You may not be aware that members of our synagogue have close relatives and friends who perished In that pogrom of which today Is the third anniversary, not to mention other horrendous terrorist atrocities carried out In the name of the resistance that your party supports. We also adopted Emily Oamarl, a British Israeli hostage who was kidnapped by Hamas from her home at Kibbutz Kfar Aza, suffered terribly at the hands of her Hamas jailers and had to keep her sexual orientation secret from her kidnappers or else would have been murdered, along with 87 others including the Bibas children, four year old Arieh and nine month old Kfir who were killed in cold blood for the sole crime of being Jewish children born in their ancestral homeland.
Our synagogue atong with the majority of British synagogues recites weekly Sabbath prayers for both the Royal Family of the United Kingdom and the State of Israel and will continue to do so, irrespective of what you or other Green Party members think. Love of Zion and a hope to be able to return to live in our ancestral homeland is integral to all streams of Judaism, as, it so happens, stewardship of nature and respect for all life. During the appalling Middle Eastern war, we prayed every week for an end to hostilities and an end to all suffering, of Palestinians as well as Jews and for a full and lasting peace.
Earlier this year we hosted at Highgate Synagogue a noted Palestinian campaigner Ahmed Fouad AlKhatib who lost more than 30 family members in Gaza. He told a packed synagogue - and it was really packed -- how he as a Gazan and a Palestinian believed that Hamas had brought nothing but disaster on the Palestinian people, and that those keffiyeh wearing sympathizers in the West who cheer for Hamas are doing more harm them good. He was no shill for Israel or its Prime Minister, but he at least acknowledged the attachment of Jews to this land, and the fact that non-Jlews in Israel have rights that no-one, certainly not Jews or Christians, let alone Muslims can aspire to anywhere else in the Middle East.
So no, we don't accept your assurances that we are safe under your watch, You may see no connection between the ceaseless vilification of Israel, the blood libels that you and your party ree:ularly trot out, and the hostility to Jews in this country, but we do.
If this motion does not mean that Jews in Haringey who have family or friends in Israel, or who attend our synagogue, or who maybe aren't religious but believe that there is a place for a haven for the tattered remnant of the most persecuted race on earth, are considered by you and your party as racists and by Implication fair game for ostracism, Intimidation, violence or worse, please· explain to us what else it means. And if that is indeed what it means, and we are pretty sure that those who voted for It believe that is precisely what it means, how can we as Jews feel safe when the largest party of the borough we live In, entirely peacefully up to now, publicly align yourself with the most virulent jew hating racists of all, Hamas and the Nazis.
As It Is, despite living In one of the most peaceful and crime free parts of the borough, we have had as a synagogue to Invest substantial sums In building terrorism-proof fences round our premises, and employ both volunteers and professional security with stab vests to ensure we can continue to function not just as a place of worship but as a focus for our community.
In addition to our dally threat of the kind of lethal attacks we saw In Manchester and closer to home In Golders Green, we are hav"ing to cope with myriad, not so trivial, microaggressions such that our elderly are frightened to identify as Jewish when going Into an NHS hospital, parents are worried about sending their children to universities for fear of the abuse they are likely to receive. and young Jews starting their careers are hiding their identity in case it damages their prospects or leads to ostracism and abuse in the workplace.
That is a direct result of you and your comrades' obsessive and ignorantly one-sided view of one of the world's most intractable conflicts and your determination to bring that obsession into every facet of life here in Britain.
So your embarrassment Is not enough. If you really want us to feel you do not agree with the racist and genocidal implications of your party's policy, the least we can expect is for you to publicly resile yourself from that policy and commit yourself and your party colleagues to reverse that policy and to educate themselves about the realities of the Middle East conflict, and about Jewish life, before you pronounce on these matters with such unshakeable certainty again.
Yours sincerely
etc etc | |
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| Looks like the Zionism is Racism motion has passed on 08:00 - Oct 10 with 779 views | DJR |
| Looks like the Zionism is Racism motion has passed on 17:55 - Oct 9 by GlasgowBlue |
A powerful letter to the leader of Haringey council from Highgate Synagogue.
https://www.jewishnews.co.uk/s
The full text of the letter:
7 October
Dear Mark
Thank you for your emails to us. We take it from both the tone and the content of your email that you are deeply embarrassed with the decision taken by your party to not only brand Zionism as racism but to call for the eradication by any means necessary including violence, of the only Jewish state, the only practising democracy in the Middle East, and also home to half of the world's Jewish population.
We are not surprised you are embarrassed. The pollcv decision which has not Just been endorsed by but was publicly celebrated by the Haringey branch of the Green Party, of which we assume you are a member, Is thus aligning Itself with Hamas, a eenocldal, homophobic and mlsoeynistlc lslamlst terrorist oreanlsation not only responsible for the worst massacre of Jews since the Holocaust, but countless murders and torture of Its own people.
You may not be aware that members of our synagogue have close relatives and friends who perished In that pogrom of which today Is the third anniversary, not to mention other horrendous terrorist atrocities carried out In the name of the resistance that your party supports. We also adopted Emily Oamarl, a British Israeli hostage who was kidnapped by Hamas from her home at Kibbutz Kfar Aza, suffered terribly at the hands of her Hamas jailers and had to keep her sexual orientation secret from her kidnappers or else would have been murdered, along with 87 others including the Bibas children, four year old Arieh and nine month old Kfir who were killed in cold blood for the sole crime of being Jewish children born in their ancestral homeland.
Our synagogue atong with the majority of British synagogues recites weekly Sabbath prayers for both the Royal Family of the United Kingdom and the State of Israel and will continue to do so, irrespective of what you or other Green Party members think. Love of Zion and a hope to be able to return to live in our ancestral homeland is integral to all streams of Judaism, as, it so happens, stewardship of nature and respect for all life. During the appalling Middle Eastern war, we prayed every week for an end to hostilities and an end to all suffering, of Palestinians as well as Jews and for a full and lasting peace.
Earlier this year we hosted at Highgate Synagogue a noted Palestinian campaigner Ahmed Fouad AlKhatib who lost more than 30 family members in Gaza. He told a packed synagogue - and it was really packed -- how he as a Gazan and a Palestinian believed that Hamas had brought nothing but disaster on the Palestinian people, and that those keffiyeh wearing sympathizers in the West who cheer for Hamas are doing more harm them good. He was no shill for Israel or its Prime Minister, but he at least acknowledged the attachment of Jews to this land, and the fact that non-Jlews in Israel have rights that no-one, certainly not Jews or Christians, let alone Muslims can aspire to anywhere else in the Middle East.
So no, we don't accept your assurances that we are safe under your watch, You may see no connection between the ceaseless vilification of Israel, the blood libels that you and your party ree:ularly trot out, and the hostility to Jews in this country, but we do.
If this motion does not mean that Jews in Haringey who have family or friends in Israel, or who attend our synagogue, or who maybe aren't religious but believe that there is a place for a haven for the tattered remnant of the most persecuted race on earth, are considered by you and your party as racists and by Implication fair game for ostracism, Intimidation, violence or worse, please· explain to us what else it means. And if that is indeed what it means, and we are pretty sure that those who voted for It believe that is precisely what it means, how can we as Jews feel safe when the largest party of the borough we live In, entirely peacefully up to now, publicly align yourself with the most virulent jew hating racists of all, Hamas and the Nazis.
As It Is, despite living In one of the most peaceful and crime free parts of the borough, we have had as a synagogue to Invest substantial sums In building terrorism-proof fences round our premises, and employ both volunteers and professional security with stab vests to ensure we can continue to function not just as a place of worship but as a focus for our community.
In addition to our dally threat of the kind of lethal attacks we saw In Manchester and closer to home In Golders Green, we are hav"ing to cope with myriad, not so trivial, microaggressions such that our elderly are frightened to identify as Jewish when going Into an NHS hospital, parents are worried about sending their children to universities for fear of the abuse they are likely to receive. and young Jews starting their careers are hiding their identity in case it damages their prospects or leads to ostracism and abuse in the workplace.
That is a direct result of you and your comrades' obsessive and ignorantly one-sided view of one of the world's most intractable conflicts and your determination to bring that obsession into every facet of life here in Britain.
So your embarrassment Is not enough. If you really want us to feel you do not agree with the racist and genocidal implications of your party's policy, the least we can expect is for you to publicly resile yourself from that policy and commit yourself and your party colleagues to reverse that policy and to educate themselves about the realities of the Middle East conflict, and about Jewish life, before you pronounce on these matters with such unshakeable certainty again.
Yours sincerely
etc etc |
This is a good letter in the Guardian.
As ever, Jonathan Freedland is on the money in his article (The Green party’s anti-Zionism motion is yet another attempt to tell Jews how we should think, 3 October). As a non-religious Jew-ish Londoner, I am appalled at the passing of the motion to declare Zionism as a form of racism, and I am seriously considering leaving the Green party as a result.
While I condemn the Israeli government’s actions against the Palestinian people, and I am not a Zionist myself, Zionism as defined by the motion is only one political interpretation and completely ignores ancient religious and cultural definitions held by many Jews who also condemn the current Israeli government.
I have worked with Palestinians and Israelis on the West Bank and in Jerusalem in the cause of peace and reconciliation, and firmly believe in equal rights for everyone in Israel and the occupied territories. That cause will be set back by this decision, which will give fuel to antisemites who hide their racism under an anti-Zionist guise.
This decision is a shot in the foot for the Green party, risking the alienation of British Jews and others who, like me, support peace and reconciliation, believe in equal rights for Israelis and Palestinians, and strongly oppose the actions of the current Israeli government.
Simon Lawson
London | | | |
| Looks like the Zionism is Racism motion has passed on 09:49 - Oct 10 with 713 views | Ryorry |
Caroline Lucas on R4’s Any Questions last night condemned the motion and what has happened to the GPEW, calling out the ‘entryism’ factor of the large number of its new members who are pro-Palestine activists that joined the GP & were at the conference purely to get the motion passed. The proportion at conference who voted to pass it were 0.4% of the total membership.
About 5,000 new members joined the party in just 10 days, one month before their conference according to an AI stat I saw but can’t link. Growth had already rocketed between March - August 2026 by +30,000.
https://www.theguardian.com/po
(Sorry if linked before). | |
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| Looks like the Zionism is Racism motion has passed on 10:12 - Oct 10 with 678 views | lowhouseblue |
| Looks like the Zionism is Racism motion has passed on 09:49 - Oct 10 by Ryorry |
Caroline Lucas on R4’s Any Questions last night condemned the motion and what has happened to the GPEW, calling out the ‘entryism’ factor of the large number of its new members who are pro-Palestine activists that joined the GP & were at the conference purely to get the motion passed. The proportion at conference who voted to pass it were 0.4% of the total membership.
About 5,000 new members joined the party in just 10 days, one month before their conference according to an AI stat I saw but can’t link. Growth had already rocketed between March - August 2026 by +30,000.
https://www.theguardian.com/po
(Sorry if linked before). |
people have been warning the greens about entryism for a year. under polanski's "leadership" they choose to ignore it. from corbyn to your party to the greens the same people trudged from one to the next to push the exact same hate filled nonsense. so lucas discovering it now is a bit much. |  |
| And so as the loose-bowelled pigeon of time swoops low over the unsuspecting tourist of destiny, and the flatulent skunk of fate wanders into the air-conditioning system of eternity, I notice it's the end of the show |
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| Looks like the Zionism is Racism motion has passed on 10:13 - Oct 10 with 677 views | Ryorry |
| Looks like the Zionism is Racism motion has passed on 09:49 - Oct 10 by Ryorry |
Caroline Lucas on R4’s Any Questions last night condemned the motion and what has happened to the GPEW, calling out the ‘entryism’ factor of the large number of its new members who are pro-Palestine activists that joined the GP & were at the conference purely to get the motion passed. The proportion at conference who voted to pass it were 0.4% of the total membership.
About 5,000 new members joined the party in just 10 days, one month before their conference according to an AI stat I saw but can’t link. Growth had already rocketed between March - August 2026 by +30,000.
https://www.theguardian.com/po
(Sorry if linked before). |
A good, related article -
https://www.theguardian.com/co
“ …if you wanted to completely wreck the Greens’ successes in all those places, you would bin that approach and accelerate exactly what Polanski has facilitated: not just a politics of no-surrender and provocation, but the entry into the party of embittered former Jeremy Corbyn supporters and assorted ultra-leftists, bringing with them a flimsy, pious gesture politics.” | |
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| Looks like the Zionism is Racism motion has passed on 10:19 - Oct 10 with 650 views | Ryorry |
| Looks like the Zionism is Racism motion has passed on 10:12 - Oct 10 by lowhouseblue |
people have been warning the greens about entryism for a year. under polanski's "leadership" they choose to ignore it. from corbyn to your party to the greens the same people trudged from one to the next to push the exact same hate filled nonsense. so lucas discovering it now is a bit much. |
She chose to express it on a public platform now, no-one said she’s only just “discovered” it. | |
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| Looks like the Zionism is Racism motion has passed on 11:05 - Oct 10 with 611 views | lowhouseblue |
| Looks like the Zionism is Racism motion has passed on 10:19 - Oct 10 by Ryorry |
She chose to express it on a public platform now, no-one said she’s only just “discovered” it. |
strange thing to do nothing about then. she must have been waiting for it to become a public scandal? | |
| And so as the loose-bowelled pigeon of time swoops low over the unsuspecting tourist of destiny, and the flatulent skunk of fate wanders into the air-conditioning system of eternity, I notice it's the end of the show |
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| Looks like the Zionism is Racism motion has passed on 12:00 - Oct 10 with 555 views | J2BLUE |
| Looks like the Zionism is Racism motion has passed on 11:05 - Oct 10 by lowhouseblue |
strange thing to do nothing about then. she must have been waiting for it to become a public scandal? |
Agree. Everyone knew this was a risk. |  | | |
| Looks like the Zionism is Racism motion has passed on 14:07 - Oct 10 with 491 views | Ryorry |
| Looks like the Zionism is Racism motion has passed on 11:05 - Oct 10 by lowhouseblue |
strange thing to do nothing about then. she must have been waiting for it to become a public scandal? |
I imagine that as former Greens’ leader and MP, she didn’t want to be seen as ‘interfering’ with the current laeadership and policy, which is a standard enough stance for politicians who’ve chosen to step away. | |
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| Looks like the Zionism is Racism motion has passed on 15:00 - Oct 10 with 424 views | GlasgowBlue |
| Looks like the Zionism is Racism motion has passed on 10:12 - Oct 10 by lowhouseblue |
people have been warning the greens about entryism for a year. under polanski's "leadership" they choose to ignore it. from corbyn to your party to the greens the same people trudged from one to the next to push the exact same hate filled nonsense. so lucas discovering it now is a bit much. |
When I posted about the entryism earlier this year one poster said that a "certain cohort os circling the greens wagon". Another said hat I had "moved the smear wagon from Corbyn's Labour to the Greens".
Anyway, we are about to kick off now so less green and more blue. COYB!! | |
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| Looks like the Zionism is Racism motion has passed on 07:51 - Oct 11 with 290 views | DJR |
| Looks like the Zionism is Racism motion has passed on 10:12 - Oct 10 by lowhouseblue |
people have been warning the greens about entryism for a year. under polanski's "leadership" they choose to ignore it. from corbyn to your party to the greens the same people trudged from one to the next to push the exact same hate filled nonsense. so lucas discovering it now is a bit much. |
To be fair to Lucas and others such as the two who stood against him, they had misgivings about Polanski and what he would bring before he was elected.
This article from just after his election sets the position out well and presages what has happened.
https://www.theguardian.com/wo
"Polanski beat Adrian Ramsay and Ellie Chowns who were seen as the co-leaders of choice for party establishment types, including former leader Caroline Lucas. They promised to gradually keep winning more council and parliamentary seats."
"The Polanski wing of the Green party, on the other hand, is more aligned with Corbynism-style politics, saying he would be willing to cooperate in a leftwing alliance with Jeremy Corbyn and Zarah Sultana. This may appeal to younger, more urban voters but it could scare away older, rural, Tory and Lib Dem-leaning voters. Ramsay and Chowns warned that the Greens risked becoming “a Jeremy Corbyn support act”."
And Lucas spoke out against the motion back in June
https://www.jewishnews.co.uk/l
Having met her, and seen her speak at a Compass meeting, I imagine she must be horrified at all that has happened to the party she so carefully nurtured. And she is much more representative of the sort of people I know in the local Green Party than many attracted to the cause since Polanski. [Post edited 11 Oct 7:54]
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| Looks like the Zionism is Racism motion has passed on 09:21 - Oct 11 with 226 views | balcombeblue |
| Looks like the Zionism is Racism motion has passed on 07:51 - Oct 11 by DJR |
To be fair to Lucas and others such as the two who stood against him, they had misgivings about Polanski and what he would bring before he was elected.
This article from just after his election sets the position out well and presages what has happened.
https://www.theguardian.com/wo
"Polanski beat Adrian Ramsay and Ellie Chowns who were seen as the co-leaders of choice for party establishment types, including former leader Caroline Lucas. They promised to gradually keep winning more council and parliamentary seats."
"The Polanski wing of the Green party, on the other hand, is more aligned with Corbynism-style politics, saying he would be willing to cooperate in a leftwing alliance with Jeremy Corbyn and Zarah Sultana. This may appeal to younger, more urban voters but it could scare away older, rural, Tory and Lib Dem-leaning voters. Ramsay and Chowns warned that the Greens risked becoming “a Jeremy Corbyn support act”."
And Lucas spoke out against the motion back in June
https://www.jewishnews.co.uk/l
Having met her, and seen her speak at a Compass meeting, I imagine she must be horrified at all that has happened to the party she so carefully nurtured. And she is much more representative of the sort of people I know in the local Green Party than many attracted to the cause since Polanski. [Post edited 11 Oct 7:54]
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There is a new, long form interview, with OJ on the Triggernometry podcast. It's long, but well worth watching.
Also noticed how he dodges the question about whether Israel has the right to exist. [Post edited 11 Oct 9:22]
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