| Looks like the Zionism is Racism motion has passed 15:37 - Oct 4 with 17666 views | giant_stow |
at the Green conference.
What a world. |  |
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| Looks like the Zionism is Racism motion has passed on 15:41 - Oct 4 with 6662 views | eirannach_gorm |
Excellent. |  | | |
| Looks like the Zionism is Racism motion has passed on 15:44 - Oct 4 with 6658 views | giant_stow |
| Looks like the Zionism is Racism motion has passed on 15:41 - Oct 4 by eirannach_gorm |
Excellent. |
we're regressing to a point where a political party all but banning jews is 'excellent'. Like i said, what a world. | |
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| Looks like the Zionism is Racism motion has passed on 15:54 - Oct 4 with 6603 views | DJR |
That is very sad. |  | | |
| Looks like the Zionism is Racism motion has passed on 15:54 - Oct 4 with 6594 views | Nthsuffolkblue |
| Looks like the Zionism is Racism motion has passed on 15:44 - Oct 4 by giant_stow |
we're regressing to a point where a political party all but banning jews is 'excellent'. Like i said, what a world. |
Do all Jews want Zionism then? How are you defining Zionism? Is it the same as the definition here https://uk.search.yahoo.com/se ?
Does that mean the genocide of Palestinians because it appears to read that way? Please explain how that definition can be read any other way.
Just to be absolutely clear, in case it needs stating, none of this in any way supports the terrorist actions of Hamas. |  |
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| Looks like the Zionism is Racism motion has passed on 16:05 - Oct 4 with 6514 views | Swansea_Blue |
I've always been super cautious around this topic as it's not a part of the world I've any experience of (except for getting horrendously sick at a wedding party that happened to be taking place in a hotel in Jordan I had an overnight stop at).
This on the face of it seems not so good. Isn't it possible to be critical of the actions of the Israeli government without resorting to indiscriminate silencing of Israeli voices? Do they not have a right to exist and have a home? I'm not really sure if I understand the full definition of Zionism though and suspect many people don't which is why the Greens are tying themselves up in knots over it. Everyone always seems to be talking at crossed purposes around this issue and it confuses the heck out of me tbh. |  |
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| Looks like the Zionism is Racism motion has passed on 16:13 - Oct 4 with 6468 views | Guthrum |
That must be a pretty tight and specific definition of Zionism, then. It is - and has been historically - a very broad and muti-stranded movement.
At its most basic level, is simply the desire for a Jewish homeland. |  |
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| Looks like the Zionism is Racism motion has passed on 16:16 - Oct 4 with 6446 views | DJR |
I didn't think Polanski's chances were high in the upcoming by-election but I would have thought this has put a nail in the coffin of his chances, coupled as it is with a more popular Labour leader.
Indeed, with a decision such as this, the Greens are in danger of going back into relative obscurity. | | | |
| Looks like the Zionism is Racism motion has passed on 16:17 - Oct 4 with 6433 views | DJR |
| Looks like the Zionism is Racism motion has passed on 16:13 - Oct 4 by Guthrum |
That must be a pretty tight and specific definition of Zionism, then. It is - and has been historically - a very broad and muti-stranded movement.
At its most basic level, is simply the desire for a Jewish homeland. |
And who can deny the Jews one given their history? | | | |
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| Looks like the Zionism is Racism motion has passed on 16:19 - Oct 4 with 6420 views | Guthrum |
| Looks like the Zionism is Racism motion has passed on 15:54 - Oct 4 by Nthsuffolkblue |
Do all Jews want Zionism then? How are you defining Zionism? Is it the same as the definition here https://uk.search.yahoo.com/se ?
Does that mean the genocide of Palestinians because it appears to read that way? Please explain how that definition can be read any other way.
Just to be absolutely clear, in case it needs stating, none of this in any way supports the terrorist actions of Hamas. |
I wouldn't say that definition involves the genocide of Palestinians. After all, there are many Arabs of Palestinian origin who are citizens of Israel. It was never meant to be exclusively Jewish (whatever some of the actually genocidal/ethnic cleansing things settler leaders say). | |
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| Looks like the Zionism is Racism motion has passed on 16:20 - Oct 4 with 6411 views | redrickstuhaart |
| Looks like the Zionism is Racism motion has passed on 16:13 - Oct 4 by Guthrum |
That must be a pretty tight and specific definition of Zionism, then. It is - and has been historically - a very broad and muti-stranded movement.
At its most basic level, is simply the desire for a Jewish homeland. |
Indeed- though there is one currently, so the more typical usage appears these days to be the desire to expand it. | |
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| Looks like the Zionism is Racism motion has passed on 16:21 - Oct 4 with 6401 views | baxterbasics |
Jews (after centuries of displacement and persecution):
Can we have our own space now please?
USSR and the Arab League clubbed together to label this racist via the UN in the 70s.
50 years later it’s now the official policy of a mainstream U.K. political party.
Shameful. |  |
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| Looks like the Zionism is Racism motion has passed on 16:23 - Oct 4 with 6379 views | DJR |
I got an email from Hope Not Hate saying today is the 90th anniversary of the Battle of Cable Street.
What a day to pass such a resolution, not that it should have been passed at all? [Post edited 4 Oct 22:07]
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| Looks like the Zionism is Racism motion has passed on 16:25 - Oct 4 with 6364 views | giant_stow |
| Looks like the Zionism is Racism motion has passed on 16:13 - Oct 4 by Guthrum |
That must be a pretty tight and specific definition of Zionism, then. It is - and has been historically - a very broad and muti-stranded movement.
At its most basic level, is simply the desire for a Jewish homeland. |
"At its most basic level, is simply the desire for a Jewish homeland."
That's how I see it. ...a completely separate thing to how the current leaders of that homeland are ruling (which is grim as) | |
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| Looks like the Zionism is Racism motion has passed on 16:25 - Oct 4 with 6361 views | J2BLUE |
It's just a reflection of where the Greens currently are.
Far too interested in making sure there are a set of pure approved beliefs rather than actually making themselves a realistic option for most of the country. |  | | |
| Looks like the Zionism is Racism motion has passed on 16:25 - Oct 4 with 6357 views | mellowblue |
| Looks like the Zionism is Racism motion has passed on 16:21 - Oct 4 by baxterbasics |
Jews (after centuries of displacement and persecution):
Can we have our own space now please?
USSR and the Arab League clubbed together to label this racist via the UN in the 70s.
50 years later it’s now the official policy of a mainstream U.K. political party.
Shameful. |
nailed it. | | | |
| Looks like the Zionism is Racism motion has passed on 16:30 - Oct 4 with 6295 views | Guthrum |
| Looks like the Zionism is Racism motion has passed on 16:20 - Oct 4 by redrickstuhaart |
Indeed- though there is one currently, so the more typical usage appears these days to be the desire to expand it. |
Tho tarring all Zionists with that brush would be much like saying the Khmer Rouge are representative of all socialist movements. | |
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| Looks like the Zionism is Racism motion has passed on 16:31 - Oct 4 with 6277 views | redrickstuhaart |
| Looks like the Zionism is Racism motion has passed on 16:30 - Oct 4 by Guthrum |
Tho tarring all Zionists with that brush would be much like saying the Khmer Rouge are representative of all socialist movements. |
Sure.
But I think we have to recognise that when people of Palestinian or nearby extraction hear the word Zionism or Zionist, they picture settlers. Same can probably be said for a hefty chunk of the islamic world. We used to get anti zionist protests at my uni 35 years ago based ont hat understanding. [Post edited 4 Oct 16:36]
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| Looks like the Zionism is Racism motion has passed on 16:42 - Oct 4 with 6219 views | Nthsuffolkblue |
| Looks like the Zionism is Racism motion has passed on 16:25 - Oct 4 by giant_stow |
"At its most basic level, is simply the desire for a Jewish homeland."
That's how I see it. ...a completely separate thing to how the current leaders of that homeland are ruling (which is grim as) |
Going back to the OP, then. Is it the existence of Israel which is being voted against by the Green Party? (I would be amazed if it is.) Or is it the desire to annex Palestine?
This is why the actual definition of ZIonism in the context matters absolutely. | |
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| Looks like the Zionism is Racism motion has passed on 16:44 - Oct 4 with 6209 views | NthQldITFC |
Depends entirely on the definition of Zionism, doesn't it?
This definition doesn't look like racism:
https://jewishcenterforjustice
'Does Zionism negate a Palestinian State?
Absolutely not. Zionism is not the opposite of Palestinian statehood. In fact, many believe that the full realization of Zionism may only be possible alongside a Palestinian state. Zionism is not about domination; it is about dignity, safety, and sovereignty for the Jewish people in their ancestral homeland. Its goal is peace.'
Whereas this one does:
https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/
Zionism[a] is an ethnic nationalist movement that emerged in late 19th-century Europe to establish and support a Jewish homeland through colonization in the region of Palestine,[1] which roughly corresponds to the Land of Israel in Judaism—itself central to Jewish history.[2] Zionists wanted to create a Jewish state in Palestine with as much land, as many Jews, and as few Palestinian Arabs as possible.
So it's a pretty stupid thing for the Green Party to have had a vote on, in my opinion, as a provisional supporter of the Green Party.
However, there's probably a Venn diagram to be drawn which looks more like a single circle than the Mastercard logo. |  |
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| Looks like the Zionism is Racism motion has passed on 16:45 - Oct 4 with 6199 views | Nthsuffolkblue |
| Looks like the Zionism is Racism motion has passed on 16:19 - Oct 4 by Guthrum |
I wouldn't say that definition involves the genocide of Palestinians. After all, there are many Arabs of Palestinian origin who are citizens of Israel. It was never meant to be exclusively Jewish (whatever some of the actually genocidal/ethnic cleansing things settler leaders say). |
I would say the bit on the right does and it is why (I think we are agreeing here) it matters entirely what definition you are using.
"Zionists wanted to create a Jewish state in Palestine with as much land, as many Jews, and as few Palestinian Arabs as possible." from the WIki bit on the right.
The whole situation is an utter mess and there are far too many people making it far worse. | |
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| Looks like the Zionism is Racism motion has passed on 16:46 - Oct 4 with 6195 views | J2BLUE |
| Looks like the Zionism is Racism motion has passed on 16:42 - Oct 4 by Nthsuffolkblue |
Going back to the OP, then. Is it the existence of Israel which is being voted against by the Green Party? (I would be amazed if it is.) Or is it the desire to annex Palestine?
This is why the actual definition of ZIonism in the context matters absolutely. |
Seems like it.
According to Sky it calls for a single state of Palestine and makes no mention of Israel existing. | | | |
| Looks like the Zionism is Racism motion has passed on 16:49 - Oct 4 with 6170 views | Nthsuffolkblue |
| Looks like the Zionism is Racism motion has passed on 16:46 - Oct 4 by J2BLUE |
Seems like it.
According to Sky it calls for a single state of Palestine and makes no mention of Israel existing. |
It would be very careless if that is what has been passed. Knowing the explosive nature of the issue, that is very poor if Sky's report is entirely accurate.
As I say above, there are far too many people making a terrible situation worse. | |
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| Looks like the Zionism is Racism motion has passed on 16:50 - Oct 4 with 6174 views | DJR |
The implication of this motion is that anyone who believes in a Jewish homeland is a racist. That makes my Jewish best friend a racist.
I am also a Zionist in the sense that I believe in a Jewish homeland, so that makes me a racist too.
And here's a statement I agree with.
"The Movement for Progressive Judaism condemns the Green Party’s adoption of the motion ‘Zionism is Racism’. The motion is antisemitic in its formulation and intention. By adopting it, the Green Party has made antisemitism party policy and become a racist party.
Jewish self-determination is a right. Declaring it racist is an attack on Jews. The Green party has chosen to brand Jews who hold this belief as racists and make their equal participation in the party conditional on renouncing it.
The Green party would not presume to tell other minorities what their identity means and then use that definition to exclude them. Jews are entitled to the same respect. The party cannot impose its own meaning on a central part of Jewish identity, declare it racist and demand that Jews renounce it." [Post edited 4 Oct 16:51]
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| Looks like the Zionism is Racism motion has passed on 17:01 - Oct 4 with 6105 views | NthQldITFC |
| Looks like the Zionism is Racism motion has passed on 16:50 - Oct 4 by DJR |
The implication of this motion is that anyone who believes in a Jewish homeland is a racist. That makes my Jewish best friend a racist.
I am also a Zionist in the sense that I believe in a Jewish homeland, so that makes me a racist too.
And here's a statement I agree with.
"The Movement for Progressive Judaism condemns the Green Party’s adoption of the motion ‘Zionism is Racism’. The motion is antisemitic in its formulation and intention. By adopting it, the Green Party has made antisemitism party policy and become a racist party.
Jewish self-determination is a right. Declaring it racist is an attack on Jews. The Green party has chosen to brand Jews who hold this belief as racists and make their equal participation in the party conditional on renouncing it.
The Green party would not presume to tell other minorities what their identity means and then use that definition to exclude them. Jews are entitled to the same respect. The party cannot impose its own meaning on a central part of Jewish identity, declare it racist and demand that Jews renounce it." [Post edited 4 Oct 16:51]
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Yup. As a green (note lower case 'g') fundamentalist and pro-Palestinian, I'd very much go along with that statement too. | |
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| Looks like the Zionism is Racism motion has passed on 17:09 - Oct 4 with 6079 views | BlueBadger |
| Looks like the Zionism is Racism motion has passed on 17:01 - Oct 4 by NthQldITFC |
Yup. As a green (note lower case 'g') fundamentalist and pro-Palestinian, I'd very much go along with that statement too. |
At this point, Zack Polanski is basically Jeremy Corbyn for the TikTok crowd. |  |
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