| Owen Garvan was a better player than Andre Dozzell 13:41 - Apr 18 with 1748 views | cbower |
in circa 240 appearances for Town and Palace he scored 23 times (almost 1 in 10), all at Championship level and whilst he had no pace, he influenced games far more consistently than Andre if my memory serves me well. He was young (only 33 now) just like Andre.
In comparison, in just under 80 games, Andre 2 goals (1 on his debut!) and I can barely remember him having a significant influence on any games at all.
I know, there is no real point to this but it was on my mind. |  |
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| Owen Garvan was a better player than Andre Dozzell on 13:58 - Apr 18 with 1648 views | J2BLUE |
This won't age well in ten years. |  |
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| Owen Garvan was a better player than Andre Dozzell on 14:09 - Apr 18 with 1612 views | Jermynblue |
I can see where you are coming from here. I think it is easy to forget at times that the whole point is to score more goals than you concede. This season Andre has had one assist and not scored. Defensively he is not great and therefore he is not picked on the basis of stopping goals but instead on creating. I also feel that unless he has a more physical player alongside him then we look vulnerable. At the present time we only have Downes that offers the athleticism and physicality. However, Downes, whilst recognising he has only played little more than a 1,000 minutes, has offered even less from an attacking point of view. Therefore if you play those two and then a hold up striker like Hawkins that does not score essentially you are relying very heavily on the three players that are not defenders to get the goals. Look at the lack of goals from midfielders in recent games. If we go into next season trying the same again with Andre and Downes in the middle they either need to offer a lot more in terms of goals and assists or we will end up with the same problem again. Both good players that are reasonably young and could go on to better things but not if they play like they did this season. |  | | |
| Owen Garvan was a better player than Andre Dozzell on 14:13 - Apr 18 with 1592 views | jayessess |
Owen Garvan was a mainstay Championship midfielder for a good decade (including one promotion), so obviously, yes he was better than every single player currently at Ipswich Town. |  |
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| Owen Garvan was a better player than Andre Dozzell on 14:27 - Apr 18 with 1523 views | Perublue |
I remember years ago jim Magilton when boss telling my dad at a club we all frequented (not the blue oyster) that Garvan was one of the most talented players he had seen.
Now...does anybody remember SBR really rated a player above any other....I think he was a jimmy ? ..... it just popped in my head now so apologies....but of course history shows it never happened. [Post edited 18 Apr 2021 14:28]
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| Owen Garvan was a better player than Andre Dozzell on 14:31 - Apr 18 with 1497 views | positivity |
at a comparable age, no doubt.
players mature at different speeds however, doz still has the potential to outstrip garvan in the future | |
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| Owen Garvan was a better player than Andre Dozzell on 15:00 - Apr 18 with 1411 views | clive_baker |
Better drinker too. |  |
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| Owen Garvan was a better player than Andre Dozzell on 15:57 - Apr 18 with 1299 views | Steve_M |
Garvan was a good footballer but he came into a side that was far more established, even in the rather poor 2005-06 season, and then had better players around him. I think around half of those goals came in 2008-09 when he seemed to go on a scoring run despite not looking quite as good as previously (Magilton making a mess of the midfield a clear factor).
This is still Andre’s first season where he has played consistently and I think people are too harsh to judge him. He’s improved his all round game but had looked jaded at times playing twice a week, also the mess around him clearly doesn’t help. He stands out a long way as one of the few players who isn’t scared of the ball, Downes and - sometimes - Bishop possibly the only others. You’ve missed a goal but he really should be scoring more, he was shooting from free kicks earlier in the season but no sign of that lately.
I still think the ceiling for Dozzell is high, although he does need to step up and prove it. I got he stays and plays in a balanced, progressive team next season. |  |
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| Owen Garvan was a better player than Andre Dozzell on 16:24 - Apr 18 with 1223 views | cbower |
| Owen Garvan was a better player than Andre Dozzell on 15:57 - Apr 18 by Steve_M |
Garvan was a good footballer but he came into a side that was far more established, even in the rather poor 2005-06 season, and then had better players around him. I think around half of those goals came in 2008-09 when he seemed to go on a scoring run despite not looking quite as good as previously (Magilton making a mess of the midfield a clear factor).
This is still Andre’s first season where he has played consistently and I think people are too harsh to judge him. He’s improved his all round game but had looked jaded at times playing twice a week, also the mess around him clearly doesn’t help. He stands out a long way as one of the few players who isn’t scared of the ball, Downes and - sometimes - Bishop possibly the only others. You’ve missed a goal but he really should be scoring more, he was shooting from free kicks earlier in the season but no sign of that lately.
I still think the ceiling for Dozzell is high, although he does need to step up and prove it. I got he stays and plays in a balanced, progressive team next season. |
I always feel that as individuals, Bishop, Downes and Dozzell all have significant attributes which in theory should provide a semblance of balance. Downes the aggression, tenacity and drive, Doz the passing ability and vision, Bishop the ability to carry the ball forwards and hurt the opposition. Sadly, as yet they provide no balance at all, just an incoherent mush. I like Nydam as a player too. He has a blend of on the ball technique and tigerish energy. Dobra has burgeoning attributes that we really ought to exploit. Let's not forget Lankester. Huws ought to have been a star in this division but sadly he is finished. Skuse has been a servant but his race is over too. Yet somehow with all this 'talent', there is something really lacking. Is it one proper enforcer - is that what we lack? Or should we look to move some of the young talent on and go for a more extensive rebuild in this area of the pitch? | |
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| Owen Garvan was a better player than Andre Dozzell on 16:24 - Apr 18 with 1221 views | Perublue |
| Owen Garvan was a better player than Andre Dozzell on 15:57 - Apr 18 by Steve_M |
Garvan was a good footballer but he came into a side that was far more established, even in the rather poor 2005-06 season, and then had better players around him. I think around half of those goals came in 2008-09 when he seemed to go on a scoring run despite not looking quite as good as previously (Magilton making a mess of the midfield a clear factor).
This is still Andre’s first season where he has played consistently and I think people are too harsh to judge him. He’s improved his all round game but had looked jaded at times playing twice a week, also the mess around him clearly doesn’t help. He stands out a long way as one of the few players who isn’t scared of the ball, Downes and - sometimes - Bishop possibly the only others. You’ve missed a goal but he really should be scoring more, he was shooting from free kicks earlier in the season but no sign of that lately.
I still think the ceiling for Dozzell is high, although he does need to step up and prove it. I got he stays and plays in a balanced, progressive team next season. |
The last time I saw Andre was just before I left the UK going on for 4 years ago...he was in nandos on crutches,and what struck me was how small he was,has he beefed or grown much since ? the reason I say it is that the thought of him in a lower league midfield is like putting a newborn on the front line of a battle....no chance. | |
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| Owen Garvan was a better player than Andre Dozzell on 17:01 - Apr 18 with 1142 views | Steve_M |
| Owen Garvan was a better player than Andre Dozzell on 16:24 - Apr 18 by Perublue |
The last time I saw Andre was just before I left the UK going on for 4 years ago...he was in nandos on crutches,and what struck me was how small he was,has he beefed or grown much since ? the reason I say it is that the thought of him in a lower league midfield is like putting a newborn on the front line of a battle....no chance. |
He’s definitely bulked up a bit since then. | |
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| Owen Garvan was a better player than Andre Dozzell on 17:07 - Apr 18 with 1119 views | Steve_M |
| Owen Garvan was a better player than Andre Dozzell on 16:24 - Apr 18 by cbower |
I always feel that as individuals, Bishop, Downes and Dozzell all have significant attributes which in theory should provide a semblance of balance. Downes the aggression, tenacity and drive, Doz the passing ability and vision, Bishop the ability to carry the ball forwards and hurt the opposition. Sadly, as yet they provide no balance at all, just an incoherent mush. I like Nydam as a player too. He has a blend of on the ball technique and tigerish energy. Dobra has burgeoning attributes that we really ought to exploit. Let's not forget Lankester. Huws ought to have been a star in this division but sadly he is finished. Skuse has been a servant but his race is over too. Yet somehow with all this 'talent', there is something really lacking. Is it one proper enforcer - is that what we lack? Or should we look to move some of the young talent on and go for a more extensive rebuild in this area of the pitch? |
Downes has played 12 league games this season plus another seven as a sub, some of that is his fault but not all. He certainly hasn’t built in his early promise either but still a stretch to expect him to consistently dominate games at his age - he was very good at Wimbledon, a bit wayward yesterday.
Lankester is the player in most concerned score this season, over 18 months out and only the goal at Sunderland made him look anything like the player who made his debut.
I also think that a midfielder with experience works add to the effectiveness of the whole team in the same way that Stephen Ward did at the start of the season. Lambert really didn’t get any part of the team working effectively after the first six weeks of the season and that shows for all players. | |
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| Owen Garvan was a better player than Andre Dozzell on 17:20 - Apr 18 with 1096 views | BlueBadger |
| Owen Garvan was a better player than Andre Dozzell on 14:09 - Apr 18 by Jermynblue |
I can see where you are coming from here. I think it is easy to forget at times that the whole point is to score more goals than you concede. This season Andre has had one assist and not scored. Defensively he is not great and therefore he is not picked on the basis of stopping goals but instead on creating. I also feel that unless he has a more physical player alongside him then we look vulnerable. At the present time we only have Downes that offers the athleticism and physicality. However, Downes, whilst recognising he has only played little more than a 1,000 minutes, has offered even less from an attacking point of view. Therefore if you play those two and then a hold up striker like Hawkins that does not score essentially you are relying very heavily on the three players that are not defenders to get the goals. Look at the lack of goals from midfielders in recent games. If we go into next season trying the same again with Andre and Downes in the middle they either need to offer a lot more in terms of goals and assists or we will end up with the same problem again. Both good players that are reasonably young and could go on to better things but not if they play like they did this season. |
In all fairness to Dozzell, his game is about picking the killer pass. You can't do that though, if no-one will make forward runs for you.
Garvan or Magilton himself would have looked similarly ineffective in this team. |  |
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| Owen Garvan was a better player than Andre Dozzell on 17:53 - Apr 18 with 1041 views | BlueBadger |
| Owen Garvan was a better player than Andre Dozzell on 16:24 - Apr 18 by cbower |
I always feel that as individuals, Bishop, Downes and Dozzell all have significant attributes which in theory should provide a semblance of balance. Downes the aggression, tenacity and drive, Doz the passing ability and vision, Bishop the ability to carry the ball forwards and hurt the opposition. Sadly, as yet they provide no balance at all, just an incoherent mush. I like Nydam as a player too. He has a blend of on the ball technique and tigerish energy. Dobra has burgeoning attributes that we really ought to exploit. Let's not forget Lankester. Huws ought to have been a star in this division but sadly he is finished. Skuse has been a servant but his race is over too. Yet somehow with all this 'talent', there is something really lacking. Is it one proper enforcer - is that what we lack? Or should we look to move some of the young talent on and go for a more extensive rebuild in this area of the pitch? |
What we're seeing in all three is an utter lack of any kind of coherent coaching or structure for them to flourish in.
Whenever they're done well since 2018 has been inspire of what's going on around them, rather than because of it. | |
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