| Trump bottles it on 10:19 - Jan 12 with 3372 views | noggin |
| Trump bottles it on 10:17 - Jan 12 by StokieBlue |
So because someone is less well known and not as much of a friend it's fine if they do horrible things?
I honestly don't see the logic in your position.
SB |
Not my position. |  |
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| Trump bottles it on 10:21 - Jan 12 with 3368 views | StokieBlue |
| Trump bottles it on 10:19 - Jan 12 by noggin |
Not my position. |
Fair enough.
Can you clarify your position then?
SB |  |
| Avatar - IC410 - Tadpoles Nebula |
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| Trump bottles it on 10:21 - Jan 12 with 3360 views | BackToRussia |
| Trump bottles it on 10:15 - Jan 12 by StokieBlue |
So you are saying the views of a single person in charge of a country are more important than the policies actually implemented by that person in that country? Furthermore you are saying the fact that the person is better known should effect how people think about a state visit?
I pretty much disagree entirely.
SB |
I think you're have very high expectations of the British public. Yes it would be great if we had a political awoken populace! We'd probably have a new government by tomorrow.
Its still different even if you focus on policy though. Trump, since becoming President, has already radically changed Americas immigration laws, putting a million people on a list of potential deportees. As an individual he is altering the state of the country.
China doesn't work like that, its a monolithic system that you probably know better than me has had policies running over many years and has been on a certain heading for a while now. The current leader, AFAIK, hasn't really done anything to alter that heading. |  |
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| Trump bottles it on 10:28 - Jan 12 with 3354 views | StokieBlue |
| Trump bottles it on 10:21 - Jan 12 by BackToRussia |
I think you're have very high expectations of the British public. Yes it would be great if we had a political awoken populace! We'd probably have a new government by tomorrow.
Its still different even if you focus on policy though. Trump, since becoming President, has already radically changed Americas immigration laws, putting a million people on a list of potential deportees. As an individual he is altering the state of the country.
China doesn't work like that, its a monolithic system that you probably know better than me has had policies running over many years and has been on a certain heading for a while now. The current leader, AFAIK, hasn't really done anything to alter that heading. |
Some very fair points there.
"China doesn't work like that, its a monolithic system that you probably know better than me has had policies running over many years and has been on a certain heading for a while now. The current leader, AFAIK, hasn't really done anything to alter that heading.
In the past this view would have been correct but it's not under Jinping. He's basically purged the party of all dissenters and is now acknowledged as the most powerful Chinese leader since Mao. He can literally do anything and what he says goes. He's changing policies all the time to create a legacy for himself.
You might be right about the political knowledge of the UK populace but that shouldn't hold for the media. Why are they so focused on stopping Trump but not a leader who authorises upwards of 2500 executions a year (actual number unknown) and persecutes all the minorities in his country?
I'm quite happy for Trump not to come, as I've said he's a total tool. The double-standards however in the media and thus by extension the public are quite stark to me.
SB | |
| Avatar - IC410 - Tadpoles Nebula |
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| Trump bottles it on 10:36 - Jan 12 with 3343 views | factual_blue |
| Trump bottles it on 10:00 - Jan 12 by ElderGrizzly |
And they didn’t own the embassy to sell. They leased it off the Duke of Westminster’s estate.
So basically, his whole tweet is false.
The Qataris took on the lease and it will be a new hotel |
Quite - the Westminster Estate never sells freeholds. |  |
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| Trump bottles it on 10:38 - Jan 12 with 3341 views | Ryorry |
| Trump bottles it on 09:43 - Jan 12 by StokieBlue |
Yet Xi Jinping was welcomed.
Whilst I agree that Trump is a total tool the double-standards shown by quite a few people seem rather strange.
SB |
Not to mention Pinochet. |  |
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| Trump bottles it on 10:40 - Jan 12 with 3335 views | StokieBlue |
| Trump bottles it on 10:38 - Jan 12 by Ryorry |
Not to mention Pinochet. |
To be fair that was 30 years ago!
SB | |
| Avatar - IC410 - Tadpoles Nebula |
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| Trump bottles it on 10:41 - Jan 12 with 3333 views | Ryorry |
| Trump bottles it on 10:40 - Jan 12 by StokieBlue |
To be fair that was 30 years ago!
SB |
Even so. | |
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| Trump bottles it on 10:47 - Jan 12 with 3316 views | BackToRussia |
| Trump bottles it on 10:28 - Jan 12 by StokieBlue |
Some very fair points there.
"China doesn't work like that, its a monolithic system that you probably know better than me has had policies running over many years and has been on a certain heading for a while now. The current leader, AFAIK, hasn't really done anything to alter that heading.
In the past this view would have been correct but it's not under Jinping. He's basically purged the party of all dissenters and is now acknowledged as the most powerful Chinese leader since Mao. He can literally do anything and what he says goes. He's changing policies all the time to create a legacy for himself.
You might be right about the political knowledge of the UK populace but that shouldn't hold for the media. Why are they so focused on stopping Trump but not a leader who authorises upwards of 2500 executions a year (actual number unknown) and persecutes all the minorities in his country?
I'm quite happy for Trump not to come, as I've said he's a total tool. The double-standards however in the media and thus by extension the public are quite stark to me.
SB |
I wouldn't like to guess the motivations of the British media! Far too disgusting, but you are right of course about the hypocrisy. Not exactly a new thing, would be all I can say about that. The mainstream media is usually pretty conformist to the state line on foreign policy, even if it means spinning positives about dictators. Having said that, you could probably find a lot written about China's human rights abuses written by the UK press - it just doesn't happen to be written with the same focus as Trump. We are historically very close to the US, whatever happens there we identify with quite strongly still.
You also have to consider that if the population are largely ignorant/not bothered about China's problems, they are less likely to be written about too. Just as we do not hear much about countries in the news that are essentially failed states.
There is even an imbalance in reporting Trump's actions - Trump says "sh1thole" (in a private meeting BTW) and it's wall-to-wall international coverage. News that he has given a million people a year to either apply for citizenship or be deported, barely see a story on it. | |
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| Trump bottles it on 10:48 - Jan 12 with 3307 views | BackToRussia |
| Trump bottles it on 10:38 - Jan 12 by Ryorry |
Not to mention Pinochet. |
Well just imagine how many dictators and tyrants the US and UK governments have kept in power over the years... = many embarrassing photos like this:
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| Trump bottles it on 10:50 - Jan 12 with 3308 views | noggin |
| Trump bottles it on 10:21 - Jan 12 by StokieBlue |
Fair enough.
Can you clarify your position then?
SB |
My position is, we shouldn’t welcome any dictator or leader with questionable human rights record. | |
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| Trump bottles it on 11:09 - Jan 12 with 3288 views | GlasgowBlue |
| Trump bottles it on 10:50 - Jan 12 by noggin |
My position is, we shouldn’t welcome any dictator or leader with questionable human rights record. |
Well that's about 90% of past state visits that wouldn't happen.
Does Trump have have a questionable human rights record? He certainly isn't a dictator.
I've seen you show support for Hamas in the past. Would you welcome their leader to the UK considering their record on executing homosexuals? |  |
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| Trump bottles it on 11:29 - Jan 12 with 3277 views | ElderGrizzly |
| Trump bottles it on 10:36 - Jan 12 by factual_blue |
Quite - the Westminster Estate never sells freeholds. |
I did like this today too. Feel sorry for the poo emoji tbh
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| Trump bottles it on 11:38 - Jan 12 with 3266 views | Lord_Lucan |
| Trump bottles it on 09:43 - Jan 12 by StokieBlue |
Yet Xi Jinping was welcomed.
Whilst I agree that Trump is a total tool the double-standards shown by quite a few people seem rather strange.
SB |
Mugabe
End. |  |
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| Trump bottles it on 11:45 - Jan 12 with 3254 views | GlasgowBlue |
| Trump bottles it on 11:38 - Jan 12 by Lord_Lucan |
Mugabe
End. |
Nicolae Ceaușescu FFS. | |
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| Trump bottles it on 11:51 - Jan 12 with 3250 views | No9 |
| Trump bottles it on 11:45 - Jan 12 by GlasgowBlue |
Nicolae Ceaușescu FFS. |
But giving sucour to Pinochet was OK? |  | | |
| Trump bottles it on 11:51 - Jan 12 with 3251 views | Lord_Lucan |
| Trump bottles it on 11:45 - Jan 12 by GlasgowBlue |
Nicolae Ceaușescu FFS. |
Say what you like about Nicky but he was extremely popular at home. He always got 100% of the vote. | |
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| Trump bottles it on 12:11 - Jan 12 with 3229 views | FrowsyArmLarry |
Can someone explain to me why people weren’t so vociferous when Xi Jinping came to visit. |  | | |
| Trump bottles it on 12:12 - Jan 12 with 3223 views | BackToRussia |
| Trump bottles it on 12:11 - Jan 12 by FrowsyArmLarry |
Can someone explain to me why people weren’t so vociferous when Xi Jinping came to visit. |
Interesting new direction you're trying to take this thread. | |
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| Trump bottles it on 12:14 - Jan 12 with 3214 views | FrowsyArmLarry |
| Trump bottles it on 12:12 - Jan 12 by BackToRussia |
Interesting new direction you're trying to take this thread. |
No I’m genuinely interested. Is it the Muslim thing?... because the Chinese government ‘disappear’ around 200 Muslims a year. And I don’t think trump has got to the point of clandestine executions yet [Post edited 12 Jan 2018 12:16]
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| Trump bottles it on 12:16 - Jan 12 with 3207 views | BackToRussia |
| Trump bottles it on 12:14 - Jan 12 by FrowsyArmLarry |
No I’m genuinely interested. Is it the Muslim thing?... because the Chinese government ‘disappear’ around 200 Muslims a year. And I don’t think trump has got to the point of clandestine executions yet [Post edited 12 Jan 2018 12:16]
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lol try reading the rest of the thread. | |
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| Trump bottles it on 12:21 - Jan 12 with 3188 views | FrowsyArmLarry |
| Trump bottles it on 12:16 - Jan 12 by BackToRussia |
lol try reading the rest of the thread. |
Ah!
Nobody’s really answered the point though. Trump might be the most unfit president I can imagine, but he doesn’t deserve the press he gets either IMO | | | |
| Trump bottles it on 12:24 - Jan 12 with 3181 views | Lord_Lucan |
| Trump bottles it on 12:21 - Jan 12 by FrowsyArmLarry |
Ah!
Nobody’s really answered the point though. Trump might be the most unfit president I can imagine, but he doesn’t deserve the press he gets either IMO |
I sort of agree - in a way.
Thing is though, as much as it pains me the USA are the biggest and strongest nation on the planet and they should be setting a better example. | |
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| Trump bottles it on 12:25 - Jan 12 with 3179 views | BackToRussia |
| Trump bottles it on 12:21 - Jan 12 by FrowsyArmLarry |
Ah!
Nobody’s really answered the point though. Trump might be the most unfit president I can imagine, but he doesn’t deserve the press he gets either IMO |
Nice doublethink. | |
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| Trump bottles it on 12:26 - Jan 12 with 3177 views | BackToRussia |
| Trump bottles it on 12:24 - Jan 12 by Lord_Lucan |
I sort of agree - in a way.
Thing is though, as much as it pains me the USA are the biggest and strongest nation on the planet and they should be setting a better example. |
Trump is a racist psychopath who has never worked a proper day in his life. On what level is he hard done by? | |
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