| Hard Brexit won't cost lives... on 10:12 - Oct 7 with 1344 views | hampstead_blue |
What a pile of crud.
It's as bad as the Daily Mail with their hysterical headlines.
No-one will die! The Gov flew back loads of tourists....what's to make you think they would do that and then leave poorly people to rot......
Really? The Guardian should know better. |  |
| Assumption is to make an ass out of you and me.
Those who assume they know you, when they don't are just guessing.
Those who assume and insist they know are daft and in denial.
Those who assume, insist, and deny the truth are plain stupid.
Those who assume, insist, deny the truth and tell YOU they know you (when they don't) have an IQ in the range of 35-49.
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| Hard Brexit won't cost lives... on 10:14 - Oct 7 with 1343 views | factual_blue |
The lesson here is make sure you properly risk assess a massive lifestyle change like moving abroad.
Too many people over the past 20-30 years have done this to make their pension go a bit further (ie the cost of living in Spain/Portugal was a lot lower).
During the credit crunch when the pound was suffering, pensioners who'd retired to Spain were moaning so much about the deteriorating value of their pensions to the UK government that the DWP Perm Sec was despatched to Spain to speak to pensioners' groups.
The message they got? 'Tough luck. You made your bed, now lie in it.'
They'll have to sort themselves out. They won't be 'rescued'. [Post edited 7 Oct 2019 10:16]
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| Hard Brexit won't cost lives... on 10:23 - Oct 7 with 1315 views | Swansea_Blue |
Typical health tourists wanting to come over here and put extra strain on our NHS  |  |
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| Hard Brexit won't cost lives... on 10:23 - Oct 7 with 1318 views | giant_stow |
| Hard Brexit won't cost lives... on 10:12 - Oct 7 by hampstead_blue |
What a pile of crud.
It's as bad as the Daily Mail with their hysterical headlines.
No-one will die! The Gov flew back loads of tourists....what's to make you think they would do that and then leave poorly people to rot......
Really? The Guardian should know better. |
If only the people in that article could read your reasurring words, I'm sure they'd feel much better. Who cares what the current position on this is hey? |  |
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| Hard Brexit won't cost lives... on 10:24 - Oct 7 with 1314 views | giant_stow |
| Hard Brexit won't cost lives... on 10:14 - Oct 7 by factual_blue |
The lesson here is make sure you properly risk assess a massive lifestyle change like moving abroad.
Too many people over the past 20-30 years have done this to make their pension go a bit further (ie the cost of living in Spain/Portugal was a lot lower).
During the credit crunch when the pound was suffering, pensioners who'd retired to Spain were moaning so much about the deteriorating value of their pensions to the UK government that the DWP Perm Sec was despatched to Spain to speak to pensioners' groups.
The message they got? 'Tough luck. You made your bed, now lie in it.'
They'll have to sort themselves out. They won't be 'rescued'. [Post edited 7 Oct 2019 10:16]
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You're a hard man, factual! | |
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| Hard Brexit won't cost lives... on 10:29 - Oct 7 with 1301 views | hampstead_blue |
| Hard Brexit won't cost lives... on 10:14 - Oct 7 by factual_blue |
The lesson here is make sure you properly risk assess a massive lifestyle change like moving abroad.
Too many people over the past 20-30 years have done this to make their pension go a bit further (ie the cost of living in Spain/Portugal was a lot lower).
During the credit crunch when the pound was suffering, pensioners who'd retired to Spain were moaning so much about the deteriorating value of their pensions to the UK government that the DWP Perm Sec was despatched to Spain to speak to pensioners' groups.
The message they got? 'Tough luck. You made your bed, now lie in it.'
They'll have to sort themselves out. They won't be 'rescued'. [Post edited 7 Oct 2019 10:16]
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Really?
Governments will not underwrite currency fluctuations but will not leave them without health care.
Are you serious in your statement that this Gov will fly back people with Thomas Cook but won't support the heathcare of it's citizens?
If you are then you need a flush out. That's scare mongering at it's worst. | |
| Assumption is to make an ass out of you and me.
Those who assume they know you, when they don't are just guessing.
Those who assume and insist they know are daft and in denial.
Those who assume, insist, and deny the truth are plain stupid.
Those who assume, insist, deny the truth and tell YOU they know you (when they don't) have an IQ in the range of 35-49.
| | Poll: | Best Blackpool goal |
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| Hard Brexit won't cost lives... on 10:35 - Oct 7 with 1290 views | giant_stow |
| Hard Brexit won't cost lives... on 10:29 - Oct 7 by hampstead_blue |
Really?
Governments will not underwrite currency fluctuations but will not leave them without health care.
Are you serious in your statement that this Gov will fly back people with Thomas Cook but won't support the heathcare of it's citizens?
If you are then you need a flush out. That's scare mongering at it's worst. |
The govt were legally obliged to help the stranded tourists through the caa innit? If so, a very different situation when the govt is going out of its way to abandon current obligations. | |
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| Hard Brexit won't cost lives... on 10:35 - Oct 7 with 1290 views | Swansea_Blue |
| Hard Brexit won't cost lives... on 10:29 - Oct 7 by hampstead_blue |
Really?
Governments will not underwrite currency fluctuations but will not leave them without health care.
Are you serious in your statement that this Gov will fly back people with Thomas Cook but won't support the heathcare of it's citizens?
If you are then you need a flush out. That's scare mongering at it's worst. |
The Thomas Cook analogy is a completely different situation. Who's to say what the government will do here - they don't exactly have a good reputation for taking care of the vulnerable.
It's a bit odd to dismiss the concerns of these people without knowing anything about them. Maybe something will get sorted out for them, maybe not. Maybe they have to make a song and dance in the press to get the Government to even listen? Maybe their please will fall on deaf ears? We'll just have to wait and see.
All we've got here is another example of a (predictable) problem that wasn't communicated in the faux patriotic slogans. | |
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| Hard Brexit won't cost lives... on 10:43 - Oct 7 with 1271 views | J2BLUE |
I have no idea why people read the Guardian or the Mail at this point. Both are just propaganda echo chambers for their readers.
Edited or to for. [Post edited 7 Oct 2019 11:15]
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| Hard Brexit won't cost lives... on 10:45 - Oct 7 with 1256 views | giant_stow |
| Hard Brexit won't cost lives... on 10:43 - Oct 7 by J2BLUE |
I have no idea why people read the Guardian or the Mail at this point. Both are just propaganda echo chambers for their readers.
Edited or to for. [Post edited 7 Oct 2019 11:15]
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So fake news then? | |
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| Hard Brexit won't cost lives... on 10:47 - Oct 7 with 1251 views | footers |
| Hard Brexit won't cost lives... on 10:43 - Oct 7 by J2BLUE |
I have no idea why people read the Guardian or the Mail at this point. Both are just propaganda echo chambers for their readers.
Edited or to for. [Post edited 7 Oct 2019 11:15]
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Er, comparing the Graun to the Mail is quite a leap, J2. They're nothing alike. |  |
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| Hard Brexit won't cost lives... on 10:50 - Oct 7 with 1252 views | Guthrum |
| Hard Brexit won't cost lives... on 10:43 - Oct 7 by J2BLUE |
I have no idea why people read the Guardian or the Mail at this point. Both are just propaganda echo chambers for their readers.
Edited or to for. [Post edited 7 Oct 2019 11:15]
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All newspapers are.
And ever have been.
The trick is to read several in order to get a range of editorial perspectives. |  |
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| Hard Brexit won't cost lives... on 10:52 - Oct 7 with 1234 views | jeera |
| Hard Brexit won't cost lives... on 10:29 - Oct 7 by hampstead_blue |
Really?
Governments will not underwrite currency fluctuations but will not leave them without health care.
Are you serious in your statement that this Gov will fly back people with Thomas Cook but won't support the heathcare of it's citizens?
If you are then you need a flush out. That's scare mongering at it's worst. |
Really?
This government withhold care for many citizens living here so why on earth would you have difficulty believing they will not supply care for others living abroad.
This isn't scare-mongering. It's a fact of life.
Christ you are naive. [Post edited 7 Oct 2019 15:02]
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| Hard Brexit won't cost lives... on 10:52 - Oct 7 with 1234 views | giant_stow |
| Hard Brexit won't cost lives... on 10:50 - Oct 7 by Guthrum |
All newspapers are.
And ever have been.
The trick is to read several in order to get a range of editorial perspectives. |
naturally. The only problem is the Telegraph's paywall - I actually used to enjoy that paper - have had to switch to the Express. boo. | |
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| Hard Brexit won't cost lives... on 10:52 - Oct 7 with 1232 views | J2BLUE |
| Hard Brexit won't cost lives... on 10:45 - Oct 7 by giant_stow |
So fake news then? |
I didn't say that. My point is that the Guardian take every point and assume it will be the worst case scenario because they are opposed to Brexit. The Mail take every point and assume it will be the best case scenario because they are pro Brexit. The truth is probably somewhere in the middle (slightly nearer the Guardian side).
Do I think the government would let them go without healthcare? No. Even if they only act or propaganda purposes. Do I think everything will be plain sailing for UK citizens in the EU? No. | |
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| Hard Brexit won't cost lives... on 10:54 - Oct 7 with 1225 views | J2BLUE |
| Hard Brexit won't cost lives... on 10:50 - Oct 7 by Guthrum |
All newspapers are.
And ever have been.
The trick is to read several in order to get a range of editorial perspectives. |
I doubt many on here do that judging by the black and white responses we get most of the time. | |
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| Hard Brexit won't cost lives... on 10:54 - Oct 7 with 1221 views | chicoazul |
| Hard Brexit won't cost lives... on 10:43 - Oct 7 by J2BLUE |
I have no idea why people read the Guardian or the Mail at this point. Both are just propaganda echo chambers for their readers.
Edited or to for. [Post edited 7 Oct 2019 11:15]
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Quite right blud. We are basically now in a country where left and right have very little meaning, but someone standing behind either the Graun or the Mail can tell you more or less what someone thinks about more or less everything. |  |
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| Hard Brexit won't cost lives... on 10:57 - Oct 7 with 1211 views | giant_stow |
| Hard Brexit won't cost lives... on 10:52 - Oct 7 by J2BLUE |
I didn't say that. My point is that the Guardian take every point and assume it will be the worst case scenario because they are opposed to Brexit. The Mail take every point and assume it will be the best case scenario because they are pro Brexit. The truth is probably somewhere in the middle (slightly nearer the Guardian side).
Do I think the government would let them go without healthcare? No. Even if they only act or propaganda purposes. Do I think everything will be plain sailing for UK citizens in the EU? No. |
The Guardian are reporting the current situation (bare facts). Whether the Govt does something about this remains to be seen (opinion). | |
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| Hard Brexit won't cost lives... on 10:59 - Oct 7 with 1200 views | J2BLUE |
| Hard Brexit won't cost lives... on 10:57 - Oct 7 by giant_stow |
The Guardian are reporting the current situation (bare facts). Whether the Govt does something about this remains to be seen (opinion). |
Are you saying they haven't spun this story at all? | |
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| Hard Brexit won't cost lives... on 10:59 - Oct 7 with 1201 views | Swansea_Blue |
| Hard Brexit won't cost lives... on 10:52 - Oct 7 by J2BLUE |
I didn't say that. My point is that the Guardian take every point and assume it will be the worst case scenario because they are opposed to Brexit. The Mail take every point and assume it will be the best case scenario because they are pro Brexit. The truth is probably somewhere in the middle (slightly nearer the Guardian side).
Do I think the government would let them go without healthcare? No. Even if they only act or propaganda purposes. Do I think everything will be plain sailing for UK citizens in the EU? No. |
I've no idea how this would be resolved, but what duty of care do the government have to these people who've decided to move away and settle in another country? Providing, paying for or arranging access to routine health care for UK nationals overseas is well beyond the normal duty of care of the Foreign Office. If it was a unforeseen crisis that would be different, but the FO goes out of its way to say people should take responsibility for themselves. The government would likely say they do have access to healthcare (which they do, they just have to pay for it like a lot of people who live in other countries). | |
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| Hard Brexit won't cost lives... on 11:04 - Oct 7 with 1187 views | Guthrum |
| Hard Brexit won't cost lives... on 10:52 - Oct 7 by giant_stow |
naturally. The only problem is the Telegraph's paywall - I actually used to enjoy that paper - have had to switch to the Express. boo. |
I still have a Telegraph sub. Tho I'm enjoying it less and less nowadays. The pretence of serious journalism has mostly been abandoned for straight Faragist propaganda, interspersed with quasi-adverts for investment vehicles and extremely expensive holiday destinations.
The Matt cartoons and the obituaries are still good, tho. And the comments give a useful insight.
The paywall makes it most awkward to post article links, as nobody much can read them. Thus I end up having to rely on the Guardian. | |
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| Hard Brexit won't cost lives... on 11:04 - Oct 7 with 1183 views | J2BLUE |
| Hard Brexit won't cost lives... on 10:59 - Oct 7 by Swansea_Blue |
I've no idea how this would be resolved, but what duty of care do the government have to these people who've decided to move away and settle in another country? Providing, paying for or arranging access to routine health care for UK nationals overseas is well beyond the normal duty of care of the Foreign Office. If it was a unforeseen crisis that would be different, but the FO goes out of its way to say people should take responsibility for themselves. The government would likely say they do have access to healthcare (which they do, they just have to pay for it like a lot of people who live in other countries). |
You've just jumped to the conclusion which makes the Tories and Brexit look as bad as possible.
Look at it from the perspective of what serves the Tories best. Abandoning pensioners in the EU to their fate and facing the media fallout or helping them and giving them a nice bit of propaganda to use on their core voters. | |
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| Hard Brexit won't cost lives... on 11:04 - Oct 7 with 1183 views | giant_stow |
| Hard Brexit won't cost lives... on 10:59 - Oct 7 by J2BLUE |
Are you saying they haven't spun this story at all? |
Every story is spun by its author - there's no such thing as a bias-free person or publication. But you get into CiL territory if you dismiss every news item as worthless because of that.
Whatever you think about the Guardian, there's a news-worthy story about a group of 200,000 people that are facing a massive problem. I suggest it would be more biased to ignore that. | |
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| Hard Brexit won't cost lives... on 11:06 - Oct 7 with 1168 views | J2BLUE |
| Hard Brexit won't cost lives... on 11:04 - Oct 7 by giant_stow |
Every story is spun by its author - there's no such thing as a bias-free person or publication. But you get into CiL territory if you dismiss every news item as worthless because of that.
Whatever you think about the Guardian, there's a news-worthy story about a group of 200,000 people that are facing a massive problem. I suggest it would be more biased to ignore that. |
You are repeatedly deliberately missing the point to dismiss what i'm saying. I'll leave you to it. | |
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| Hard Brexit won't cost lives... on 11:09 - Oct 7 with 1157 views | giant_stow |
| Hard Brexit won't cost lives... on 11:06 - Oct 7 by J2BLUE |
You are repeatedly deliberately missing the point to dismiss what i'm saying. I'll leave you to it. |
I think I've dealt directly with your point, oddly. hey ho. | |
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