| Andre Dozzell 00:59 - Apr 3 with 8877 views | reusersfreekicks |
Is a good player and we should support him. He has stayed fit and played loads of games while skuse, downes, huws and Nolan have mised loads of games or been ineffective. He has carried quite a burden and has done ok imo. With the right support he will be a major asset |  | | |  |
| Andre Dozzell on 11:34 - Apr 3 with 2693 views | reusersfreekicks |
| Andre Dozzell on 10:49 - Apr 3 by Herbivore |
He is a good player who is struggling a little bit at the moment. That's understandable, although he broke through years ago now this is really his first season playing as a first team regular. He's had a major injury in between his debut and now as well. He's clearly got a lot of ability on the ball and the defensive side of his game has improved a lot this season. He's been more or less ever present and has had to play different roles at different times, some of which haven't entirely suited him. He'd benefit from a couple of games off to recharge his batteries. Playing week in, week out in midfield is a tough gig especially in a side that's not exactly a joy to play in. He's done fine this season, the stick he gets is mental. |
Perfectly put | | | |
| Andre Dozzell on 11:35 - Apr 3 with 2693 views | jayessess |
| Andre Dozzell on 11:22 - Apr 3 by Nthsuffolkblue |
Indeed. If there were any truth in the ridiculous assertion Harry Wright would be in goal and Charlie Sheringham would be in our midfield. Whatever happened to Sheringham?
EDIT: Just checked and apparently he is at Dartford. https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Charlie_Sheringham [Post edited 3 Apr 2021 11:23]
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Think there's always some who assume kids with a famous father get special treatment. There's a very famous video clip of Harry Redknapp telling some idiot at a West Ham fan forum in 1995 that Frank Lampard wasn't just getting by on his name. |  |
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| Andre Dozzell on 11:39 - Apr 3 with 2681 views | Nthsuffolkblue |
| Andre Dozzell on 11:35 - Apr 3 by jayessess |
Think there's always some who assume kids with a famous father get special treatment. There's a very famous video clip of Harry Redknapp telling some idiot at a West Ham fan forum in 1995 that Frank Lampard wasn't just getting by on his name. |
The one who probably had it worst was Alex Bruce when he was playing under his Dad, not least because Alex was a very much chalk or cheese player. You either liked his robust defending or thought he was hopeless for mistiming his challenges far too often. |  |
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| Andre Dozzell on 11:57 - Apr 3 with 2664 views | ArnieM |
| Andre Dozzell on 10:33 - Apr 3 by jayessess |
This is pure Frank Lampard Syndrome.
Paul Cook doesn't care who his Dad is. He picks him every week because he rates him. |
But maybe he should pick the players based on how they actually perform ? There so many in this team that simply do not perform. Some still get picked , some don’t, why the differential treatment? |  |
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| Andre Dozzell on 11:58 - Apr 3 with 2660 views | pointofblue |
| Andre Dozzell on 11:57 - Apr 3 by ArnieM |
But maybe he should pick the players based on how they actually perform ? There so many in this team that simply do not perform. Some still get picked , some don’t, why the differential treatment? |
Straight question - out of the players available to Cook, who would you put in the side ahead of Dozzell? |  |
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| Andre Dozzell on 12:02 - Apr 3 with 2659 views | ArnieM |
| Andre Dozzell on 11:58 - Apr 3 by pointofblue |
Straight question - out of the players available to Cook, who would you put in the side ahead of Dozzell? |
As I’ve said earlier to another on here, that’s the problem...there is no one else fit and available , hence, I suggest is why he, and a few others still get picked. There is no one else available to PC .
If the Club are moving towards a data / performance analysis for players recruitment and I suspect being picked for the first team ... the stats on Dozzell this season are ..
Dozzell 34 apps 0 goals 1 assist
Guess it’ll be an interesting time at this Club going forwards. No place for players to hide any longer. Long overdue in my mind. [Post edited 3 Apr 2021 12:03]
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| Andre Dozzell on 12:06 - Apr 3 with 2652 views | Nthsuffolkblue |
| Andre Dozzell on 12:02 - Apr 3 by ArnieM |
As I’ve said earlier to another on here, that’s the problem...there is no one else fit and available , hence, I suggest is why he, and a few others still get picked. There is no one else available to PC .
If the Club are moving towards a data / performance analysis for players recruitment and I suspect being picked for the first team ... the stats on Dozzell this season are ..
Dozzell 34 apps 0 goals 1 assist
Guess it’ll be an interesting time at this Club going forwards. No place for players to hide any longer. Long overdue in my mind. [Post edited 3 Apr 2021 12:03]
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So he is not getting picked on his name.
The data needs to be far more nuanced than appearances and goals. As I have already stated, the same player in different teams will have widely different statistics and this needs to be factored into the analysis. | |
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| Andre Dozzell on 12:42 - Apr 3 with 2623 views | jayessess |
| Andre Dozzell on 11:57 - Apr 3 by ArnieM |
But maybe he should pick the players based on how they actually perform ? There so many in this team that simply do not perform. Some still get picked , some don’t, why the differential treatment? |
There's no differential treatment. Dozzell gets picked every week because he's performing best out of the midfielders. | |
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| Andre Dozzell on 14:11 - Apr 3 with 2611 views | billlm |
| Andre Dozzell on 12:42 - Apr 3 by jayessess |
There's no differential treatment. Dozzell gets picked every week because he's performing best out of the midfielders. |
That's why we're rubbish every week if he's one of the best, jeez |  | | |
| Andre Dozzell on 14:17 - Apr 3 with 2609 views | billlm |
| Andre Dozzell on 10:33 - Apr 3 by jayessess |
This is pure Frank Lampard Syndrome.
Paul Cook doesn't care who his Dad is. He picks him every week because he rates him. |
Think he probably picks him because as bad as he is we haven't anyone else atm, nolan and downes are injured and skuse is not back to full fitness, | | | |
| Andre Dozzell on 14:33 - Apr 3 with 2598 views | jayessess |
| Andre Dozzell on 14:17 - Apr 3 by billlm |
Think he probably picks him because as bad as he is we haven't anyone else atm, nolan and downes are injured and skuse is not back to full fitness, |
He's started every single game for Cook, even when Downes was available. Called him a "smashing young player" and said that "he's going to be a very good player". He rates him. He's still going to be a regular starter come August. | |
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| Andre Dozzell on 14:48 - Apr 3 with 2592 views | billlm |
| Andre Dozzell on 14:33 - Apr 3 by jayessess |
He's started every single game for Cook, even when Downes was available. Called him a "smashing young player" and said that "he's going to be a very good player". He rates him. He's still going to be a regular starter come August. |
He won't be not in the position he is today, | | | |
| Andre Dozzell on 15:07 - Apr 3 with 2585 views | unstableblue |
| Andre Dozzell on 10:49 - Apr 3 by Herbivore |
He is a good player who is struggling a little bit at the moment. That's understandable, although he broke through years ago now this is really his first season playing as a first team regular. He's had a major injury in between his debut and now as well. He's clearly got a lot of ability on the ball and the defensive side of his game has improved a lot this season. He's been more or less ever present and has had to play different roles at different times, some of which haven't entirely suited him. He'd benefit from a couple of games off to recharge his batteries. Playing week in, week out in midfield is a tough gig especially in a side that's not exactly a joy to play in. He's done fine this season, the stick he gets is mental. |
Agree with all that Herbivore.
Key is that this really is his first full season, he only made 15 appearances last term, and also with Downes injured, Huws and Skuse not able to fill in, he's not really playing in his best role. Whilst he should be defending, he should be advanced of Downes and having a little more space to breathe and distribute.
What strikes me is that he is only 21 (22 in May) and this is his first real season. I'd expect Cook seems him as a keeper. And to put people around him. Lee Evans is more in the Downes, defensive midfielder role.
Hopefully Dozzell can rest after Bank Holiday ahead of MK Dons, and then a nutty set of Tues/Sat fixtures... hopefully with Downes back in the fold. Fortunately that nutty run is in and around London/East Anglia.
Rochdale is a BIG game for the team. They need a win AND a performance. Confidence is shot and needs building and momentum. And fans need to back what is a low odds drive for play-offs, that would be a bonus. |  |
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| Andre Dozzell on 18:56 - Apr 3 with 2510 views | Keaneish |
| Andre Dozzell on 11:21 - Apr 3 by jayessess |
There are some positions that take a bit more experience to master, I think?
21 is young for a tempo-setting, deep-lying playmaker, not so young for a ball-winning, box-to-box midfielder. One role is all about reading the game, the other much more about physicality. |
It’s immaterial. The old cliche is, “if you’re good enough, you’re old enough”. It makes no difference where you play. Any position at professional is tough and each game is different. The best are more distinguishable than the others, and those aren’t noticeable, disappear into mediocrity. That’s the same at any level of football not just League One. |  |
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| Andre Dozzell on 21:01 - Apr 3 with 2486 views | jayessess |
| Andre Dozzell on 18:56 - Apr 3 by Keaneish |
It’s immaterial. The old cliche is, “if you’re good enough, you’re old enough”. It makes no difference where you play. Any position at professional is tough and each game is different. The best are more distinguishable than the others, and those aren’t noticeable, disappear into mediocrity. That’s the same at any level of football not just League One. |
Not sure what your point is here, really. We all know footballers continue developing, they don't peak at 21. We all know there are positions where experience tends to be more important (cf. all the commentary on McGuinness and Woolfenden not working as a partnership).
If we're just going to say "this lad is 21 but is still flawed, cut our losses" every time, we might as well shutter the academy right now. | |
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| Andre Dozzell on 21:34 - Apr 3 with 2482 views | Keaneish |
| Andre Dozzell on 21:01 - Apr 3 by jayessess |
Not sure what your point is here, really. We all know footballers continue developing, they don't peak at 21. We all know there are positions where experience tends to be more important (cf. all the commentary on McGuinness and Woolfenden not working as a partnership).
If we're just going to say "this lad is 21 but is still flawed, cut our losses" every time, we might as well shutter the academy right now. |
The point is you don’t need to “master” a position to be the automatic choice. Downes is an automatic choice not because he’s mastered it but because he’s the stand out player in the squad with the stand out attributes to play that position because he’s made it his own, not because he’s more experienced. Dozzell has had as many opportunities to make that position his own but he hasn’t.
The debate is about the present and the value they offer now, not on what they might become based on future development. In my opinion, one position doesn’t get a special dispensation because it’s perceived to be more difficult compared to another; Dozzell’s role is no more difficult than Downes’; Downes is just much more superior than Dozzell.
Experience is important no matter the position. The argument isn’t whether Dozzell should get more chances, far from it. It’s more that how many more chances do we need to give Dozzell before he takes it or before we exhaust it. | |
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| Andre Dozzell on 22:43 - Apr 3 with 2465 views | LancsBlue |
Dozzell will look better the higher he plays. He is not a rough and ready, roll your sleeves up League 1 player. Anyone fitting that description, whilst they might be useful to us now, are not going beyond that. Dozzell was very highly thought of in the England pathway until his horrendous injury. Big clubs were keeping tabs on him. He makes mistakes, rash challenges and lapses in concentration, but that can be worked on and coached out of him. However, his ability to spot and execute a pass is pure natural ability. With quality players in front of and around him, making runs, creating spaces and moving defenders, he would come into his own. Hopefully Cook will bring in those kind of players in the summer. Currently even DeBruyne would struggle to feed our lacklustre lot. Dozzell is a quality player but he needs players of equal quality around him. |  |
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| Andre Dozzell on 10:18 - Apr 4 with 2407 views | jayessess |
| Andre Dozzell on 21:34 - Apr 3 by Keaneish |
The point is you don’t need to “master” a position to be the automatic choice. Downes is an automatic choice not because he’s mastered it but because he’s the stand out player in the squad with the stand out attributes to play that position because he’s made it his own, not because he’s more experienced. Dozzell has had as many opportunities to make that position his own but he hasn’t.
The debate is about the present and the value they offer now, not on what they might become based on future development. In my opinion, one position doesn’t get a special dispensation because it’s perceived to be more difficult compared to another; Dozzell’s role is no more difficult than Downes’; Downes is just much more superior than Dozzell.
Experience is important no matter the position. The argument isn’t whether Dozzell should get more chances, far from it. It’s more that how many more chances do we need to give Dozzell before he takes it or before we exhaust it. |
To be clear, I don't think Dozzell needs "more chances", he's already one of our better midfielders and he's had a far better season than Downes has. If we're talking present value, Dozzell's been inconsistent, but he's contributed far more than pretty much anyone else in the squad.
The debate isn't just about the value offered now, is it? We're always saying that we need to give opportunities to young players to develop. That involves judging what sort of player they're going to be when they're 23-25, not just what they are now.
And it's not about the difficulty of the role, it's about when players typically develop certain attributes. Look around the division (or any division!), how many 21-year-olds are playing Dozzell's role? Plenty of young midfielders around, almost all playing further forward, where they've less responsibility to control the game and where they're freer to take risks. | |
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