| We better be prepared for this to get a whole lot worse! 06:44 - Dec 8 with 4417 views | gordon |
Those players have been hung out to dry by the decision-making at the club - sacking the manager and the whole coaching staff and then replacing them with someone who they've basically met for an hour before a run of 3 difficult league games and cup embarrassment on TV.
And obviously, people in football with any interest in the job will see those scenes from Charlton, know that Paul Cook has a reputation for basically being a good manager at this level, see the investment and the smarmy CEO and won't touch this with a bargepole.
The idea that Warnock would come here and work with Ashton, or that Ashton would be willing to hire him is nonsensical, Warnock would have Ashton on toast - it's obviously going to be someone relatively inexperienced so that Ashton doesn't lose influence/power within the club. |  | | |  |
| We better be prepared for this to get a whole lot worse! on 08:24 - Dec 8 with 602 views | Herbivore |
| We better be prepared for this to get a whole lot worse! on 08:23 - Dec 8 by gordon |
There's absolutely no way were going to salvage something from this season. |
Unlikely in terms of promotion now but we may at least build some momentum. |  |
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| We better be prepared for this to get a whole lot worse! on 08:26 - Dec 8 with 604 views | gordon |
| We better be prepared for this to get a whole lot worse! on 08:22 - Dec 8 by Herbivore |
Yeah, not buying it personally. |
All of the signings will have been 'run by' Paul Cook, and he must've said OK yup I'll have Celina in my squad thanks - but it's nonsense to think that Paul Cook would have came up with the idea of signing Celina himself. This isn't about making excuses for Paul Cook or finding a scapegoat, it's just trying to be realistic about what's most likely to be the situation at ITFC now, because we're going to have to get used to it. | | | |
| We better be prepared for this to get a whole lot worse! on 08:26 - Dec 8 with 598 views | Wallingford_Boy |
Yes those poor, poor players.
Did you not see last nights game?! Total disgrace of a performance.
I don’t care who is in charge or what they’ve done in training, no excuse for that performance.
Half of them didn’t try!
No urgency, no effort, no tempo, no tackling....
Yes their confidence is shot and yes there is no creativity in that team and yes Bonne isolated, but please don’t make excuses for that performance. |  |
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| We better be prepared for this to get a whole lot worse! on 08:26 - Dec 8 with 597 views | hadleighboyblue |
| We better be prepared for this to get a whole lot worse! on 07:49 - Dec 8 by Herbivore |
The fans didn't sack him, stop being a bell. The board sacked him because he built this side and has failed to make a talented bunch of players any good as a collective. Performances under him lately had been poor, last night was a continuation of that trajectory. Thinking Cook is the answer is crazy based on what we've seen from him here. It's interesting that you are calling others impatient whilst losing your head over one game under a caretaker manager who only had a couple of hours to work with the players. Stupid, stupid impatient fans. |
Isn't it time we looked at the players performances , it's performances on the pitch that is the concern .
The squad on paper should be pretty strong for the 3rd tier , but that's no good if the players put in gutless performances like last night , regardless of who the manager is .
We are being outplayed by other teams , because they are willing to put in more effort .
Things feel so much worse ,because this new era promised better times ahead , but the reality is that we are blowing the chance .
Mick Mills reckoned coming here would be an attractive job for a new manager - he even thought it would be a good move for Lampard ! there is no way he would come here , we need to get real and stop living on past glories when players put 100% effort in for the club , those days are long gone. |  | | |
| We better be prepared for this to get a whole lot worse! on 08:28 - Dec 8 with 588 views | gordon |
| We better be prepared for this to get a whole lot worse! on 08:24 - Dec 8 by Herbivore |
Unlikely in terms of promotion now but we may at least build some momentum. |
Well, I would think we're more likely to make lots of panicky decisions in the transfer market in January in desperation, creating more upheaval and uncertainty for the players etc. | | | |
| We better be prepared for this to get a whole lot worse! on 08:30 - Dec 8 with 585 views | gordon |
| We better be prepared for this to get a whole lot worse! on 08:26 - Dec 8 by hadleighboyblue |
Isn't it time we looked at the players performances , it's performances on the pitch that is the concern .
The squad on paper should be pretty strong for the 3rd tier , but that's no good if the players put in gutless performances like last night , regardless of who the manager is .
We are being outplayed by other teams , because they are willing to put in more effort .
Things feel so much worse ,because this new era promised better times ahead , but the reality is that we are blowing the chance .
Mick Mills reckoned coming here would be an attractive job for a new manager - he even thought it would be a good move for Lampard ! there is no way he would come here , we need to get real and stop living on past glories when players put 100% effort in for the club , those days are long gone. |
The question we should be asking is how have ITFC created an environment in which a group of talented players (at this level) are unable to perform to anything like their capabilities. | | | |
| We better be prepared for this to get a whole lot worse! on 08:33 - Dec 8 with 571 views | Herbivore |
| We better be prepared for this to get a whole lot worse! on 08:26 - Dec 8 by gordon |
All of the signings will have been 'run by' Paul Cook, and he must've said OK yup I'll have Celina in my squad thanks - but it's nonsense to think that Paul Cook would have came up with the idea of signing Celina himself. This isn't about making excuses for Paul Cook or finding a scapegoat, it's just trying to be realistic about what's most likely to be the situation at ITFC now, because we're going to have to get used to it. |
But that is standard at any club. Dave Bowman identified players for Mick but he ultimately made the decision to sign them. I don't really see what the issue is. Several of our signings played for Cook previously, so it's clear that - as at basically every club in the land - he put forward some of the potential signings and others at the club suggested others. He would have green lit all of them so I don't really see why that's an issue all of a sudden. I also don't really buy the notion that the players somehow don't fit. The issue is that at no point really has Cook looked capable of putting a side together that is equal to let alone greater than the sum of its parts. He seemed confused that just having better players who were reasonably fit wasn't winning us games. | |
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| We better be prepared for this to get a whole lot worse! on 08:35 - Dec 8 with 565 views | Churchman |
| We better be prepared for this to get a whole lot worse! on 08:18 - Dec 8 by portmanking |
Cook will have - somewhat naively - thought he could mould whoever Ashton brought in to the club into his system. Plus, he was at a club saying all the right things about going places. He was hardly going to resign in protest was he? But I do think Cook's been hung out to dry. So few of the new faces fit his mould when you take a step back in the cold light of day. |
So because of what a Bristol City muppet has repeatedly said, we shift the blame to Ashton - with no evidence whatsoever. Tremendous.
If Cook comes out and says that’s how it’s done, people can pile in. Until then, it’s wrong to go down this route.
It always intrigues me how constantly repeating something turns it into fact whether it is or not. The classic of course is Goebbels slapping a nought on the end of the estimated deaths in Dresden after the USAAF/RAF raids of 1945. His figure became fact and is often repeated to this day. |  | | |
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| We better be prepared for this to get a whole lot worse! on 08:38 - Dec 8 with 552 views | portmanking |
| We better be prepared for this to get a whole lot worse! on 08:33 - Dec 8 by Herbivore |
But that is standard at any club. Dave Bowman identified players for Mick but he ultimately made the decision to sign them. I don't really see what the issue is. Several of our signings played for Cook previously, so it's clear that - as at basically every club in the land - he put forward some of the potential signings and others at the club suggested others. He would have green lit all of them so I don't really see why that's an issue all of a sudden. I also don't really buy the notion that the players somehow don't fit. The issue is that at no point really has Cook looked capable of putting a side together that is equal to let alone greater than the sum of its parts. He seemed confused that just having better players who were reasonably fit wasn't winning us games. |
Huge difference.
Dave Bowman had worked with McCarthy for the best part of a decade. By that point he knew full well the DNA of a typical Mick signing.
Ashton had been with Cook for five minutes before embarking on a recruitment drive.
Many of the players clearly didn't fit Cook's system. Why sign Burns, an out-and-out winger, for a 4-2-3-1 where Cook plays inside forwards in the '3' rather than touchline hugging wingers? Celina was never going to have the work ethic to play Cook's '10' which has heaps of defensive and attacking responsibilities.
Cook didn't look capable of putting a side together because he was trying to make it work with the faces he'd been given rather than playing round pegs in round holes. | | | |
| We better be prepared for this to get a whole lot worse! on 08:39 - Dec 8 with 548 views | gordon |
| We better be prepared for this to get a whole lot worse! on 08:35 - Dec 8 by Churchman |
So because of what a Bristol City muppet has repeatedly said, we shift the blame to Ashton - with no evidence whatsoever. Tremendous.
If Cook comes out and says that’s how it’s done, people can pile in. Until then, it’s wrong to go down this route.
It always intrigues me how constantly repeating something turns it into fact whether it is or not. The classic of course is Goebbels slapping a nought on the end of the estimated deaths in Dresden after the USAAF/RAF raids of 1945. His figure became fact and is often repeated to this day. |
Don't really understand why we find it so difficult to process the contempt that Bristol City fans have for Ashton, given that so far the trajectory and MO here meet their description perfectly. | | | |
| We better be prepared for this to get a whole lot worse! on 08:40 - Dec 8 with 539 views | gordon |
| We better be prepared for this to get a whole lot worse! on 08:38 - Dec 8 by portmanking |
Huge difference.
Dave Bowman had worked with McCarthy for the best part of a decade. By that point he knew full well the DNA of a typical Mick signing.
Ashton had been with Cook for five minutes before embarking on a recruitment drive.
Many of the players clearly didn't fit Cook's system. Why sign Burns, an out-and-out winger, for a 4-2-3-1 where Cook plays inside forwards in the '3' rather than touchline hugging wingers? Celina was never going to have the work ethic to play Cook's '10' which has heaps of defensive and attacking responsibilities.
Cook didn't look capable of putting a side together because he was trying to make it work with the faces he'd been given rather than playing round pegs in round holes. |
Yes - 'Bowman worked for McCarthy' is the important bit. Cook worked for Ashton here. | | | |
| We better be prepared for this to get a whole lot worse! on 08:41 - Dec 8 with 534 views | urbanblue |
I've often thought one of the main problems this season has been the signing of too many players giving Cook to many options and resulting in far too much tinkering.
Add to that the task of keeping players happy who were probably joined the club with the thought that they would be a vital part of the build. You will never convince me that players didn't get p1ssed off that they were in and out however they had played at times.
With a smaller squad players would have had time to consolidate their positions. I mean KYV started a bit rusty but with games under his belt he may well have consolidated to become again the player we know he can be. Penny started the season quite well but one mistake and we didn't see him for a while. We needed a bit of consistency of selection. Woolfie and Chaplin/Fraser in and out and don't start me on the treatment of Joe Pigott.
If we had stuck with KYV and Penny and the marauding full backs we so enjoyed in the early games we may not be here now. Yes, I know there were problems and Cook needed to sort out a few things but the basis of a good flair side was there. We didn't have the potential of Morsey then either. |  | | |
| We better be prepared for this to get a whole lot worse! on 08:42 - Dec 8 with 525 views | gordon |
| We better be prepared for this to get a whole lot worse! on 08:26 - Dec 8 by Wallingford_Boy |
Yes those poor, poor players.
Did you not see last nights game?! Total disgrace of a performance.
I don’t care who is in charge or what they’ve done in training, no excuse for that performance.
Half of them didn’t try!
No urgency, no effort, no tempo, no tackling....
Yes their confidence is shot and yes there is no creativity in that team and yes Bonne isolated, but please don’t make excuses for that performance. |
But what on earth is achieved by blaming the players, shouting abuse at the players etc - you really think the problem is that they aren't trying hard enough, and now after that they're going to try a bit harder and it's all going to be OK? | | | |
| We better be prepared for this to get a whole lot worse! on 08:44 - Dec 8 with 520 views | gordon |
| We better be prepared for this to get a whole lot worse! on 08:41 - Dec 8 by urbanblue |
I've often thought one of the main problems this season has been the signing of too many players giving Cook to many options and resulting in far too much tinkering.
Add to that the task of keeping players happy who were probably joined the club with the thought that they would be a vital part of the build. You will never convince me that players didn't get p1ssed off that they were in and out however they had played at times.
With a smaller squad players would have had time to consolidate their positions. I mean KYV started a bit rusty but with games under his belt he may well have consolidated to become again the player we know he can be. Penny started the season quite well but one mistake and we didn't see him for a while. We needed a bit of consistency of selection. Woolfie and Chaplin/Fraser in and out and don't start me on the treatment of Joe Pigott.
If we had stuck with KYV and Penny and the marauding full backs we so enjoyed in the early games we may not be here now. Yes, I know there were problems and Cook needed to sort out a few things but the basis of a good flair side was there. We didn't have the potential of Morsey then either. |
Definitely. I'd say that with e.g. Harper and El Mizouni playing CM all season at this level that'd be a really good partnership IF they were confident, encouraged, trusted, and supported by the club and coaching staff etc. | | | |
| We better be prepared for this to get a whole lot worse! on 08:48 - Dec 8 with 505 views | ElephantintheRoom |
As soon as Evans sold the club to a pension fund seeking to make money the situation became a whole lot worse. Whilst Town were being used as a money-making tool for Evans it was embarrassing - but arguably not terminal because the losses, alleged or real were owed only to him. Most Town fans dont seem to realise that their club has been laughingly referred to as a money-laundering club for over a decade, so far has it fallen.
Town now are owned by an institution commmitted to making large sums of money, managed by somebody in Ohio tasked with ruthlessly making that happen. They have no lnowledge of the club, no interest in the club, no knowledge of divisiion three football ... no knowledge of lil olde Englande - these are arrogant Americans from flyover states simply looking at the bottom line.
The long term project has lasted three months. The situation now is little sort of laughable it is so inept. An entire squad of Cook's players with no feel for the club, an office staffed by a cabal of chancers fronted by the smarmy man in the open neck shirt,, with O'Leary in the background all looking to make easy money and all now aware that the powerpoint presentation they have been touting around the world before the naieve debt pedallers bit is built on foundations of sand.
Town have been in decline for 40 years - and personally I think it dates back to the construction of the Pioneer Stand, combined with the loss of the Cobbolds. Debt and a loss of identity have fuelled the decline - and rather sadly the club now have more debt now than at any time in their history - and no identity whatsover as they are a franchise.that could be in gretna green just as easily as Ipswich.
So yes, it is already a whole lot worse - and will indeed get a whole lot worse under this posse of chancers and cowboys. But if they employ a half decent manager it could get a bit less embarrassing for a while | |
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| We better be prepared for this to get a whole lot worse! on 08:50 - Dec 8 with 506 views | Churchman |
| We better be prepared for this to get a whole lot worse! on 08:39 - Dec 8 by gordon |
Don't really understand why we find it so difficult to process the contempt that Bristol City fans have for Ashton, given that so far the trajectory and MO here meet their description perfectly. |
Because the view on Ashton by the local Bristol media differs from those of the obsessive Bristol City amoebas. The structure of Ipswich Town is also different to BC and there is no evidence bar the views of a BC poster that Ashton is doing what certain people are saying he’s doing. None whatsoever.
Two and two together = 7. It must be true because the bloke from Bristol says so. Bristol City - an L1/Championship club with a new ground, new facilities, structure and a good manager established in the Championship btw.
Ashton may be the spawn of Satan, but where’s the evidence? If people on here think he’s a liar, they should contact him and let us know what he has to say. | | | |
| We better be prepared for this to get a whole lot worse! on 09:01 - Dec 8 with 482 views | portmanking |
| We better be prepared for this to get a whole lot worse! on 08:50 - Dec 8 by Churchman |
Because the view on Ashton by the local Bristol media differs from those of the obsessive Bristol City amoebas. The structure of Ipswich Town is also different to BC and there is no evidence bar the views of a BC poster that Ashton is doing what certain people are saying he’s doing. None whatsoever.
Two and two together = 7. It must be true because the bloke from Bristol says so. Bristol City - an L1/Championship club with a new ground, new facilities, structure and a good manager established in the Championship btw.
Ashton may be the spawn of Satan, but where’s the evidence? If people on here think he’s a liar, they should contact him and let us know what he has to say. |
It's more based on the view that so many of the summer signings had close links to Ashton/O'Leary. Edwards and Harper clearly from their WBA connections. Ashton knew Burns since a teen. He even said that on 'Day 1' he wanted Celina in the door and knew his agent very well. I reckon there'll be some correlations on the agent front if someone has the time to dig deeper. | | | |
| We better be prepared for this to get a whole lot worse! on 09:04 - Dec 8 with 473 views | Herbivore |
| We better be prepared for this to get a whole lot worse! on 08:38 - Dec 8 by portmanking |
Huge difference.
Dave Bowman had worked with McCarthy for the best part of a decade. By that point he knew full well the DNA of a typical Mick signing.
Ashton had been with Cook for five minutes before embarking on a recruitment drive.
Many of the players clearly didn't fit Cook's system. Why sign Burns, an out-and-out winger, for a 4-2-3-1 where Cook plays inside forwards in the '3' rather than touchline hugging wingers? Celina was never going to have the work ethic to play Cook's '10' which has heaps of defensive and attacking responsibilities.
Cook didn't look capable of putting a side together because he was trying to make it work with the faces he'd been given rather than playing round pegs in round holes. |
Have to agree to disagree, you sound like Paul Cook's agent rather than a Town fan at this point. | |
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| We better be prepared for this to get a whole lot worse! on 09:09 - Dec 8 with 462 views | portmanking |
| We better be prepared for this to get a whole lot worse! on 09:04 - Dec 8 by Herbivore |
Have to agree to disagree, you sound like Paul Cook's agent rather than a Town fan at this point. |
I'm just looking at it objectively. Cook's gone, what's done is done. But I do think he was on a hiding to nothing because the recruitment was by no means a good fit for his way of playing. | | | |
| We better be prepared for this to get a whole lot worse! on 09:12 - Dec 8 with 455 views | Herbivore |
| We better be prepared for this to get a whole lot worse! on 09:09 - Dec 8 by portmanking |
I'm just looking at it objectively. Cook's gone, what's done is done. But I do think he was on a hiding to nothing because the recruitment was by no means a good fit for his way of playing. |
You're looking at it subjectively I would say, I mean that's the very nature of you expressing an opinion is that it's subjective. I disagree with your take on it. He's been well backed, the squad has ridiculous depth and a lot of quality, plenty of players with Cook connections too. That he couldn't get a tune out of them is on him and he can have no complaints about his dismissal. | |
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| We better be prepared for this to get a whole lot worse! on 09:13 - Dec 8 with 452 views | portmanking |
| We better be prepared for this to get a whole lot worse! on 09:12 - Dec 8 by Herbivore |
You're looking at it subjectively I would say, I mean that's the very nature of you expressing an opinion is that it's subjective. I disagree with your take on it. He's been well backed, the squad has ridiculous depth and a lot of quality, plenty of players with Cook connections too. That he couldn't get a tune out of them is on him and he can have no complaints about his dismissal. |
4 out of 19 with Cook connections doesn't scream 'plenty' to me.
I agree his dismissal is due to failure to get a tune out of them, but my objectivity is based on the fact that the signings didn't largely fit his mould. | | | |
| We better be prepared for this to get a whole lot worse! on 09:14 - Dec 8 with 448 views | BanksterDebtSlave |
| We better be prepared for this to get a whole lot worse! on 08:07 - Dec 8 by portmanking |
I do think we have to interrogate the summer's recruitment and decide whether it was Ashton or Cook pulling the strings in the transfer market. How many of the new faces could you actually say - hand on heart - were a perfect fit for Cook's system/style? Very few if the truth be told.
You do have to wonder if Ashton leant heavily on his agent chums without this so-called data dashboard in operation until next year. |
#ashtonsfootballmafia |  |
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| We better be prepared for this to get a whole lot worse! on 09:17 - Dec 8 with 439 views | Wallingford_Boy |
| We better be prepared for this to get a whole lot worse! on 08:42 - Dec 8 by gordon |
But what on earth is achieved by blaming the players, shouting abuse at the players etc - you really think the problem is that they aren't trying hard enough, and now after that they're going to try a bit harder and it's all going to be OK? |
Nope, but fans are entitled to vent their frustrations!!
Players have been signed on huge wages on long contracts and they can now sit back and relax.
Thats not who we want playing for ITFC.
They aren't fit to wear the shirt half of them and nothing wrong with being told that. As long as the abuse doesn't get personal or physical. | |
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| We better be prepared for this to get a whole lot worse! on 09:18 - Dec 8 with 439 views | Herbivore |
| We better be prepared for this to get a whole lot worse! on 09:13 - Dec 8 by portmanking |
4 out of 19 with Cook connections doesn't scream 'plenty' to me.
I agree his dismissal is due to failure to get a tune out of them, but my objectivity is based on the fact that the signings didn't largely fit his mould. |
That's still your opinion. All of it is your opinion. | |
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| We better be prepared for this to get a whole lot worse! on 09:23 - Dec 8 with 421 views | Churchman |
| We better be prepared for this to get a whole lot worse! on 09:01 - Dec 8 by portmanking |
It's more based on the view that so many of the summer signings had close links to Ashton/O'Leary. Edwards and Harper clearly from their WBA connections. Ashton knew Burns since a teen. He even said that on 'Day 1' he wanted Celina in the door and knew his agent very well. I reckon there'll be some correlations on the agent front if someone has the time to dig deeper. |
So no actual evidence then. Just putting two and two together. Well, it’s a view. If you are right, Ashton needs calling out for telling lies. He needs challenging and removing if proved. But until it’s proved, he gets an even break from me.
What I am unhappy about is that if Cook was their man they should have given him the January window and supported him, at least until The spring. If he really wasn’t their man, he should have gone at the end of last season before the wrecking ball was swung. A bit of a binary view, but that’s just my weirdness. | | | |
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