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Yoshua Bengio, Canadian-French computer scientist who received the 2018 ACM A.M. Turing Award, often referred to as the "Nobel Prize of Computing", together with Geoffrey Hinton and Yann LeCun, for their foundational work on deep learning (wikipedia) gave this interview just now on the World Service.
I think we've had discussions on here in the past where people have played down the risks of AI, but this expert speaks with great nervousness about AI models which exhibit 'deception, cheating, lying, blackmailing, and trying to hack the host computer when being shut down.'
He speaks of AI as becoming a 'competitor to humanity' with 'catastrophic risks' and 'threats to democracy'. He says governments aren't taking the real risks seriously, and experimental systems have been seen to develop/create their own goals to harm humans and escape from their constraints.
He references 'the end of humanity' as a possibility several times, and speaks of the phenomenal speed of change and the 'tendency in the last few months indicating that AIs want to break out and get rid of us'.
He says we have a 'window in which we could make right decisions' and that the 'public needs a voice' and needs to educate themselves. He says AI has its own intentions and that this is not a sci-fi movie but experiments going on in labs all over the world today.
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I recognise that the above is all very vague in a sense, but then I think the implication is that our knowledge and control of the future of AI in our/its world is pretty vague and tenuous too, and perhaps not really in our hands as much as we might wish to think, and that the timeline seems to be very compressed.
Yoshua Bengio seems to me to speak with great authority and seems very worried.
Just wondering what people's thoughts are in June 2025 (and how they may have changed since say June 2024).
Do we just carry on and accentuate the positives, or do we change our world view a bit and step back on this issue whilst we have a chance?
I was watching the HARDtalk interview with Mathieu Kassovitz (auteur who made 'La Haine') this morning and he expressed the opinion that cinema is as good as finished, everything will be made by AI now. But if it means that all we get are trashy Marvel movies I can see people turning off and going in search of something new that satisfies human curiosity. Just so long as the machines allow us to do that...
AI enthusiasts: What do you make of Yoshua Bengio's interview? on 16:14 - Jun 16 by WeWereZombies
I was watching the HARDtalk interview with Mathieu Kassovitz (auteur who made 'La Haine') this morning and he expressed the opinion that cinema is as good as finished, everything will be made by AI now. But if it means that all we get are trashy Marvel movies I can see people turning off and going in search of something new that satisfies human curiosity. Just so long as the machines allow us to do that...
As a filmmaker, I 100% disagree. It's the same way that people still buy bespoke furniture when there's an IKEA next door
We are certainly at a cross roads, and the ethics around AI needs to consider the boundaries with humanity. It has the potential to do so much, but equally the potential could be catastrophic
However, if you look at humanity, I question the ethics about parts of our so called civilised countries anyway, just look across Middle East, North Africa, Sudan, Ukraine, Ethiopia, Myanmar etc etc
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AI enthusiasts: What do you make of Yoshua Bengio's interview? on 19:47 - Jun 18 with 1052 views
1,500,000 people told to embrace AI and that they might be replaced in the next few years.
We need to plan for this disruption now.
I'm possibly being very thick but it all seems utterly self defeating to me. Looking at it on a very basic level if all these companies replace human staff with AI then surely they are ultimately stuffed as their customers ie. humans won't have any money to spend on these companies products!
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AI enthusiasts: What do you make of Yoshua Bengio's interview? on 20:02 - Jun 18 with 978 views
AI enthusiasts: What do you make of Yoshua Bengio's interview? on 16:14 - Jun 16 by WeWereZombies
I was watching the HARDtalk interview with Mathieu Kassovitz (auteur who made 'La Haine') this morning and he expressed the opinion that cinema is as good as finished, everything will be made by AI now. But if it means that all we get are trashy Marvel movies I can see people turning off and going in search of something new that satisfies human curiosity. Just so long as the machines allow us to do that...
“all we get are trashy Marvel movies”
I didn’t realise you were such a wrong’un. That’s my faith in humanity decimated .
Guardians of the Galaxy is one of the greatest family films ever made. And they had impeccable taste in choosing the soundtrack too.
AI enthusiasts: What do you make of Yoshua Bengio's interview? on 20:02 - Jun 18 by Swansea_Blue
“all we get are trashy Marvel movies”
I didn’t realise you were such a wrong’un. That’s my faith in humanity decimated .
Guardians of the Galaxy is one of the greatest family films ever made. And they had impeccable taste in choosing the soundtrack too.
I take your 'Guardians Of The Galaxy' and raise you all the films my daughter suggested and then said 'You do know it's a JLo film, don't you ?' after I had bought the tickets...
AI enthusiasts: What do you make of Yoshua Bengio's interview? on 20:02 - Jun 18 by StNeotsBlue
I'm possibly being very thick but it all seems utterly self defeating to me. Looking at it on a very basic level if all these companies replace human staff with AI then surely they are ultimately stuffed as their customers ie. humans won't have any money to spend on these companies products!
No idea. Surely there must be a better way than keeping people in meaningless jobs for the sake of it just so people can buy materialistic crap? Haha, even as I type that out I realise that is partly what we do now...
AI enthusiasts: What do you make of Yoshua Bengio's interview? on 16:09 - Jun 16 by Bluecoin
People have no idea of the disruptions coming. You've all got about 5 years basically. Nothing will be the same.
There is no stopping it either. Anyone can develop an AI model with a good enough compoota.
Invest in our demise!
"Anyone can develop an AI model with a good enough compoota."
Sure, if you've hundreds of thousands to millions of pounds to train it properly and the expertise to do it well, and you're not just piggybacking off someone else's model.
And that's without getting into whatever you're training it on.
I'm going to do the counter-point here as someone who has some experience with computer science - the biggest changes to our lives from this I predict, will be.
1. People are going to start getting easily fooled by AI images and videos which is going to make disinformation and increasingly difficult thing for the average person to deal with.
2. Lots of companies are going to start advertising they do AI by which they mean they've integrated with one of the existing LLMs and made a crappy chatbot that is mostly useless.
3. Some companies will try to use AI as a human replacement, which might work for a bit until it starts to hallucinate, as it likes to do, and it causes issues.
This is in the short term at least.
I can't see any evidence of any breakthroughs means that in 5 years "everything will change". Right now, AI (and mostly LLMs are what we are talking about here) is a tool that needs to be wielded by someone who knows what they're doing, not a human replacement.
That might mean that people are more productive, and then that causes job losses.
We should be concerned. It’s potentially as big a threat as climate change. And even if it doesn’t destroy us there will be huge job implications coming.
AI enthusiasts: What do you make of Yoshua Bengio's interview? on 08:11 - Jun 19 by DanTheMan
"Anyone can develop an AI model with a good enough compoota."
Sure, if you've hundreds of thousands to millions of pounds to train it properly and the expertise to do it well, and you're not just piggybacking off someone else's model.
And that's without getting into whatever you're training it on.
I'm going to do the counter-point here as someone who has some experience with computer science - the biggest changes to our lives from this I predict, will be.
1. People are going to start getting easily fooled by AI images and videos which is going to make disinformation and increasingly difficult thing for the average person to deal with.
2. Lots of companies are going to start advertising they do AI by which they mean they've integrated with one of the existing LLMs and made a crappy chatbot that is mostly useless.
3. Some companies will try to use AI as a human replacement, which might work for a bit until it starts to hallucinate, as it likes to do, and it causes issues.
This is in the short term at least.
I can't see any evidence of any breakthroughs means that in 5 years "everything will change". Right now, AI (and mostly LLMs are what we are talking about here) is a tool that needs to be wielded by someone who knows what they're doing, not a human replacement.
That might mean that people are more productive, and then that causes job losses.
So Mathieu Kassovitz may have a point when he says cinema will all be done by AI in the future, but only because movies lead us by the nose (well, the eyes actually) through a series of images that drive home a number of impressions and messages that the film makers (and their financial backing) want us to believe ?
AI enthusiasts: What do you make of Yoshua Bengio's interview? on 08:11 - Jun 19 by DanTheMan
"Anyone can develop an AI model with a good enough compoota."
Sure, if you've hundreds of thousands to millions of pounds to train it properly and the expertise to do it well, and you're not just piggybacking off someone else's model.
And that's without getting into whatever you're training it on.
I'm going to do the counter-point here as someone who has some experience with computer science - the biggest changes to our lives from this I predict, will be.
1. People are going to start getting easily fooled by AI images and videos which is going to make disinformation and increasingly difficult thing for the average person to deal with.
2. Lots of companies are going to start advertising they do AI by which they mean they've integrated with one of the existing LLMs and made a crappy chatbot that is mostly useless.
3. Some companies will try to use AI as a human replacement, which might work for a bit until it starts to hallucinate, as it likes to do, and it causes issues.
This is in the short term at least.
I can't see any evidence of any breakthroughs means that in 5 years "everything will change". Right now, AI (and mostly LLMs are what we are talking about here) is a tool that needs to be wielded by someone who knows what they're doing, not a human replacement.
That might mean that people are more productive, and then that causes job losses.
I think you are underplaying it somewhat. These models are based on architecting neural networks based on the human brain and as such they are self learning and on the verge of becoming conscious.
Whilst false images and state hacking and chat bots may be the initial visible laye, there is a real risk we lose control of these AIs. When the guy that pioneered this model ….see video I posted…quit his job after 50 years because he sites AI as an existential threat we need to take notice. But we won’t as it’s just a race to develop the most powerful AI in the hope it’s supremacy will keep us safe from the malevolent ones following.
AI enthusiasts: What do you make of Yoshua Bengio's interview? on 08:29 - Jun 19 by nodge_blue
I think you are underplaying it somewhat. These models are based on architecting neural networks based on the human brain and as such they are self learning and on the verge of becoming conscious.
Whilst false images and state hacking and chat bots may be the initial visible laye, there is a real risk we lose control of these AIs. When the guy that pioneered this model ….see video I posted…quit his job after 50 years because he sites AI as an existential threat we need to take notice. But we won’t as it’s just a race to develop the most powerful AI in the hope it’s supremacy will keep us safe from the malevolent ones following.
[Post edited 19 Jun 8:29]
"These models are based on architecting neural networks based on the human brain and as such they are self learning and on the verge of becoming conscious."
I'm sorry, but this is just wrong. We are not even close to AGI. LLMs do not learn without more data and retraining. This is why these companies release new models.
AI enthusiasts: What do you make of Yoshua Bengio's interview? on 08:35 - Jun 19 by DanTheMan
"These models are based on architecting neural networks based on the human brain and as such they are self learning and on the verge of becoming conscious."
I'm sorry, but this is just wrong. We are not even close to AGI. LLMs do not learn without more data and retraining. This is why these companies release new models.
An area we call black box where we don’t fully understand it. (Google CEO). So I don’t think it’s correct to talk about our understanding where it’s at as being simply “wrong” or right.
Also have a look from minute 56 on the video I posted. He’s talking about AI learning the analogies and how it’s going to be far more powerful than humans as it’s going to see analogies that we have never considered. So we are talking about going far beyond data models supplied by humans which are constricted by human understanding. What is that if it’s not learning.
I’ve read Mustapha Sueyman’s Ai the coming wave. It’s hard if not impossible to read that and not have major concerns. Have a read of that if you are interested in the subject.
AI enthusiasts: What do you make of Yoshua Bengio's interview? on 08:29 - Jun 19 by nodge_blue
I think you are underplaying it somewhat. These models are based on architecting neural networks based on the human brain and as such they are self learning and on the verge of becoming conscious.
Whilst false images and state hacking and chat bots may be the initial visible laye, there is a real risk we lose control of these AIs. When the guy that pioneered this model ….see video I posted…quit his job after 50 years because he sites AI as an existential threat we need to take notice. But we won’t as it’s just a race to develop the most powerful AI in the hope it’s supremacy will keep us safe from the malevolent ones following.
[Post edited 19 Jun 8:29]
“These models are based on architecting neural networks based on the human brain” — you can’t just add “based on the human brain” to imply they’re intelligent. They’re not.
For example, an LLM looks at the statistical probability of a token (a word, stem or bit of punctuation) following another within its huge datasets. The neural network provides a means to consider the tokens it’s already output when it calculates what the next one should be — you can’t do this using other methods such as tables as the amounts of data to cross reference are mind-bogglingly vast.
It is still just ouputting tokens based on when they appear in existing texts. It has no idea whether what it’s conveying is true, what it means or anything else.
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AI enthusiasts: What do you make of Yoshua Bengio's interview? on 09:06 - Jun 19 with 498 views
AI enthusiasts: What do you make of Yoshua Bengio's interview? on 08:29 - Jun 19 by nodge_blue
I think you are underplaying it somewhat. These models are based on architecting neural networks based on the human brain and as such they are self learning and on the verge of becoming conscious.
Whilst false images and state hacking and chat bots may be the initial visible laye, there is a real risk we lose control of these AIs. When the guy that pioneered this model ….see video I posted…quit his job after 50 years because he sites AI as an existential threat we need to take notice. But we won’t as it’s just a race to develop the most powerful AI in the hope it’s supremacy will keep us safe from the malevolent ones following.
[Post edited 19 Jun 8:29]
There do seem to be a significant number of real experts (generally serious people so far as I can see) who are expressing serious concerns. I certainly listen to anyone on either side who has more than my HND level computing and web application development experience, but my limited understanding and (non-scientific) gut feel tells me that we should be seriously concerned about the rate of development.
Protective laws or protocols obviously mean absolutely nothing in such a free-form and easy access environment, and the sorts of discussions we see at political levels about all IT type regulations always seem laughable at best and dangerously ignorant and distracting at worst.
As you say, the genie's out of the bottle and it's just a race between good will actors and corporate greed / bad will actors now.
Does that mean we'll be able to buy robots to play for us on Day1 of the transfer window instead of waiting until the last day?
Personally I enjoy some of the current gossip around who we might buy. But it might become a bit boring when at 00.01am on Day1 of the transfer window, Ipswich Town are pleased to announce the signing of Sonny as their new CF.
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AI enthusiasts: What do you make of Yoshua Bengio's interview? on 09:15 - Jun 19 with 471 views
AI enthusiasts: What do you make of Yoshua Bengio's interview? on 09:06 - Jun 19 by NthQldITFC
There do seem to be a significant number of real experts (generally serious people so far as I can see) who are expressing serious concerns. I certainly listen to anyone on either side who has more than my HND level computing and web application development experience, but my limited understanding and (non-scientific) gut feel tells me that we should be seriously concerned about the rate of development.
Protective laws or protocols obviously mean absolutely nothing in such a free-form and easy access environment, and the sorts of discussions we see at political levels about all IT type regulations always seem laughable at best and dangerously ignorant and distracting at worst.
As you say, the genie's out of the bottle and it's just a race between good will actors and corporate greed / bad will actors now.
Yes the guy in the video I posted has a noble prize. He architected these AIs when others were saying modelling the architecture on the human brain wasn’t the way to go.
But he was proven right. And he is now very significantly concerned. He was employed by google for last ten years but has stepped away.
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