| Gary Stevenson's channel 4 documentary 16:45 - Jul 6 with 12126 views | J2BLUE |
Being shown Wednesday at 9pm. For anyone who may not have seen anything about it.
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| Gary Stevenson's channel 4 documentary on 15:41 - Jul 7 with 1007 views | SuperKieranMcKenna |
The middle class aren’t being eaten, they have ridden the wave of asset prices in their property values. They sit on the highest household wealth of any of the five largest economies in Europe. |  | | |
| Gary Stevenson's channel 4 documentary on 15:43 - Jul 7 with 999 views | lowhouseblue |
we've done that one already - i've shown where the error is.
again, the quick internet search to find the first link which superficially seems to support what you're saying isn't evidence. |  |
| And so as the loose-bowelled pigeon of time swoops low over the unsuspecting tourist of destiny, and the flatulent skunk of fate wanders into the air-conditioning system of eternity, I notice it's the end of the show |
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| Gary Stevenson's channel 4 documentary on 15:44 - Jul 7 with 997 views | jasondozzell |
| Gary Stevenson's channel 4 documentary on 15:41 - Jul 7 by SuperKieranMcKenna |
The middle class aren’t being eaten, they have ridden the wave of asset prices in their property values. They sit on the highest household wealth of any of the five largest economies in Europe. |
They are eroding in US and here.
The boomers riding the asset inflation is correct but the middle class as an entity is in its most precarious position for a long time.
https://www.europeanfinancialr |  | | |
| Gary Stevenson's channel 4 documentary on 15:53 - Jul 7 with 975 views | SuperKieranMcKenna |
| Gary Stevenson's channel 4 documentary on 15:44 - Jul 7 by jasondozzell |
They are eroding in US and here.
The boomers riding the asset inflation is correct but the middle class as an entity is in its most precarious position for a long time.
https://www.europeanfinancialr |
Over 60pc of UK households own their property, all of which have risen far faster than either inflation or wages. That’s real wealth generated, faster than our peers ‘boomers own all property’ just shows you aren’t a serious person. Do you understand the concept of household wealth, if you own an increasing asset you aren’t getting poorer. The bottom 10pc ARE getting poorer relatively, but that isn’t what you said. | | | |
| Gary Stevenson's channel 4 documentary on 15:57 - Jul 7 with 958 views | nrb1985 |
Stop avoiding the question.
How and what has been taken? | | | |
| Gary Stevenson's channel 4 documentary on 15:59 - Jul 7 with 941 views | nrb1985 |
| Gary Stevenson's channel 4 documentary on 15:53 - Jul 7 by SuperKieranMcKenna |
Over 60pc of UK households own their property, all of which have risen far faster than either inflation or wages. That’s real wealth generated, faster than our peers ‘boomers own all property’ just shows you aren’t a serious person. Do you understand the concept of household wealth, if you own an increasing asset you aren’t getting poorer. The bottom 10pc ARE getting poorer relatively, but that isn’t what you said. |
Interesting.
So you’re saying that the things they already owned have shot up in value as opposed to them simply buying up hoarding assets so nobody else can have them 🤔
Interesting theory, I think Gary says otherwise though… | | | |
| Gary Stevenson's channel 4 documentary on 16:00 - Jul 7 with 939 views | balcombeblue |
| Gary Stevenson's channel 4 documentary on 15:06 - Jul 7 by leitrimblue |
The idea the plebs should shut the f4ck up cause they've never had it so good?
I mean they do own 0.01% of the country's wealth. What more do they feck1n want? |
I didn't argue anyone should shut up.
I was challenging the idea that inequality is bigger now than say 50 years ago. It isn't | | | |
| Gary Stevenson's channel 4 documentary on 16:11 - Jul 7 with 891 views | jasondozzell |
| Gary Stevenson's channel 4 documentary on 15:53 - Jul 7 by SuperKieranMcKenna |
Over 60pc of UK households own their property, all of which have risen far faster than either inflation or wages. That’s real wealth generated, faster than our peers ‘boomers own all property’ just shows you aren’t a serious person. Do you understand the concept of household wealth, if you own an increasing asset you aren’t getting poorer. The bottom 10pc ARE getting poorer relatively, but that isn’t what you said. |
Inflated housing market is not the same as material wealth. | | | |
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| Gary Stevenson's channel 4 documentary on 16:12 - Jul 7 with 890 views | jasondozzell |
| Gary Stevenson's channel 4 documentary on 15:43 - Jul 7 by lowhouseblue |
we've done that one already - i've shown where the error is.
again, the quick internet search to find the first link which superficially seems to support what you're saying isn't evidence. |
Where's the error? It's true. | | | |
| Gary Stevenson's channel 4 documentary on 16:12 - Jul 7 with 886 views | KrakenBlue |
| Gary Stevenson's channel 4 documentary on 14:56 - Jul 7 by lowhouseblue |
"Of course it has risen!"
then evidence for the uk will be easy to find. the fact that you believe it to be true doesn't make it true.
edit : the first chart here is clear evidence that uk wealth inequality hasn't changed.
https://fairnessfoundation.com [Post edited 7 Jul 14:59]
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presumably you clicked through all steps of the graph? while the total percentages of wealth by decile haven't hugely changed (the bottom 50% still losing 0.5% and the top gaining) you can see total wealth has rocketed.
Someone with 0.5% of a pie isn't going to notice the pie getting bigger, but those with 60% will and are hugely richer for it. just because that ratio isn't changing (and I understand you're using that to prove inequality hasn't risen) doesn't mean wealth inequality (the haves and the have nots) is getting more polarised. | | | |
| Gary Stevenson's channel 4 documentary on 16:13 - Jul 7 with 875 views | jasondozzell |
| Gary Stevenson's channel 4 documentary on 16:12 - Jul 7 by KrakenBlue |
presumably you clicked through all steps of the graph? while the total percentages of wealth by decile haven't hugely changed (the bottom 50% still losing 0.5% and the top gaining) you can see total wealth has rocketed.
Someone with 0.5% of a pie isn't going to notice the pie getting bigger, but those with 60% will and are hugely richer for it. just because that ratio isn't changing (and I understand you're using that to prove inequality hasn't risen) doesn't mean wealth inequality (the haves and the have nots) is getting more polarised. |
Thank you. | | | |
| Gary Stevenson's channel 4 documentary on 16:15 - Jul 7 with 869 views | SuperKieranMcKenna |
| Gary Stevenson's channel 4 documentary on 16:11 - Jul 7 by jasondozzell |
Inflated housing market is not the same as material wealth. |
Jesus wept, property equity is quite literally in the definition of material wealth…
Ridiculous at this point, I’m out. | | | |
| Gary Stevenson's channel 4 documentary on 16:20 - Jul 7 with 842 views | lowhouseblue |
| Gary Stevenson's channel 4 documentary on 16:12 - Jul 7 by KrakenBlue |
presumably you clicked through all steps of the graph? while the total percentages of wealth by decile haven't hugely changed (the bottom 50% still losing 0.5% and the top gaining) you can see total wealth has rocketed.
Someone with 0.5% of a pie isn't going to notice the pie getting bigger, but those with 60% will and are hugely richer for it. just because that ratio isn't changing (and I understand you're using that to prove inequality hasn't risen) doesn't mean wealth inequality (the haves and the have nots) is getting more polarised. |
yes, total wealth has risen but inequality hasn't changed. "the wealth gap" can't be a measure of inequality precisely because it varies with total wealth. it is someone inventing a measure because the standard measures don't show what they want them to show. | |
| And so as the loose-bowelled pigeon of time swoops low over the unsuspecting tourist of destiny, and the flatulent skunk of fate wanders into the air-conditioning system of eternity, I notice it's the end of the show |
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| Gary Stevenson's channel 4 documentary on 16:26 - Jul 7 with 821 views | nrb1985 |
| Gary Stevenson's channel 4 documentary on 16:11 - Jul 7 by jasondozzell |
Inflated housing market is not the same as material wealth. |
Eh?!
Think, we’ll leave it there for today. | | | |
| Gary Stevenson's channel 4 documentary on 17:22 - Jul 7 with 779 views | jasondozzell |
| Gary Stevenson's channel 4 documentary on 16:15 - Jul 7 by SuperKieranMcKenna |
Jesus wept, property equity is quite literally in the definition of material wealth…
Ridiculous at this point, I’m out. |
Nope it's not.
It's nominal.
Wealth depends on purchasing power. The bonkers housing market that is grossly inflated is also contingent on someone paying it.
This is the New Labour reckoning. We've all been led to believe that the inflating house prices were the answer to everything but it's been the opposite.
It's not tangible.
I mean for most people it's the care home fees. That's what it is. Not wealth in the tangible sense. | | | |
| Gary Stevenson's channel 4 documentary on 17:34 - Jul 7 with 751 views | SuperKieranMcKenna |
| Gary Stevenson's channel 4 documentary on 17:22 - Jul 7 by jasondozzell |
Nope it's not.
It's nominal.
Wealth depends on purchasing power. The bonkers housing market that is grossly inflated is also contingent on someone paying it.
This is the New Labour reckoning. We've all been led to believe that the inflating house prices were the answer to everything but it's been the opposite.
It's not tangible.
I mean for most people it's the care home fees. That's what it is. Not wealth in the tangible sense. |
Material wealth includes fixed assets. Also tangible means an asset is physical (e.g a property). It’s probably a good idea to do some reading rather than regurgitating nonsense from wherever you are getting this stuff.
is purchasing power, you can release equity, and borrow against it, those outside the middle class don’t have the luxury of. Far better than holding cash which is eroded by inflation, which is why assets have explloded in value as the middle class pump more money into the property market (as well as stocks, many of which are bedroom investors btw).
Many HNW hold most of their wealth in property, and borrow against it for their income, far more tax efficient than drawing a salary, and often the yields of renting them out are marginal. If someone has 2 dozen properties but is ‘cash poor’ are most certainly are wealthy. Someone who owns even one property (especially in the UK) is amongst the wealthiest 10% of the global population. | | | |
| Gary Stevenson's channel 4 documentary on 18:15 - Jul 7 with 703 views | Swansea_Blue |
| Gary Stevenson's channel 4 documentary on 15:06 - Jul 7 by leitrimblue |
The idea the plebs should shut the f4ck up cause they've never had it so good?
I mean they do own 0.01% of the country's wealth. What more do they feck1n want? |
Can you believe we even allow them an inside toilet these days and they STILL complain. The feckless tossers! |  |
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| Gary Stevenson's channel 4 documentary on 19:15 - Jul 7 with 629 views | nrb1985 |
“Doomslop that never comes true nor can ever be proved wrong”
This.
There’s another bloke who I think lectures at Sheffield Uni who spreads the same dog sh1t around the internet too who Polanski said he listens to. Shock.
Absolute helmets the lot of them. | | | |
| Gary Stevenson's channel 4 documentary on 19:26 - Jul 7 with 613 views | Swansea_Blue |
| Gary Stevenson's channel 4 documentary on 19:15 - Jul 7 by nrb1985 |
“Doomslop that never comes true nor can ever be proved wrong”
This.
There’s another bloke who I think lectures at Sheffield Uni who spreads the same dog sh1t around the internet too who Polanski said he listens to. Shock.
Absolute helmets the lot of them. |
Ah, that’ll be Richard Murphy. At least he’s a qualified accountant unlike Gary Stevenson and so more qualified to talk on accounting and the economy. His ideas make sense to the ignorant (like me), but I know he’s also had a bumpy ride with many people pushing back.
There’s something there in the need for fairer taxation and much of MMT does seem to explain how macroeconomics works. Whether that could be turned around and used as a tool to guide macroeconomic policy making I have no idea whatsoever. Sitting on the fence getting splinters in my arse on this thread. | |
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| Gary Stevenson's channel 4 documentary on 19:26 - Jul 7 with 609 views | jasondozzell |
| Gary Stevenson's channel 4 documentary on 19:15 - Jul 7 by nrb1985 |
“Doomslop that never comes true nor can ever be proved wrong”
This.
There’s another bloke who I think lectures at Sheffield Uni who spreads the same dog sh1t around the internet too who Polanski said he listens to. Shock.
Absolute helmets the lot of them. |
Let us continue with neoliberalism which is working so well.
No alternatives are permitted. | | | |
| Gary Stevenson's channel 4 documentary on 19:28 - Jul 7 with 600 views | lowhouseblue |
the style is annoying, but the argument is pretty spot on. | |
| And so as the loose-bowelled pigeon of time swoops low over the unsuspecting tourist of destiny, and the flatulent skunk of fate wanders into the air-conditioning system of eternity, I notice it's the end of the show |
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| Gary Stevenson's channel 4 documentary on 19:50 - Jul 7 with 556 views | CoachRob |
| Gary Stevenson's channel 4 documentary on 19:26 - Jul 7 by Swansea_Blue |
Ah, that’ll be Richard Murphy. At least he’s a qualified accountant unlike Gary Stevenson and so more qualified to talk on accounting and the economy. His ideas make sense to the ignorant (like me), but I know he’s also had a bumpy ride with many people pushing back.
There’s something there in the need for fairer taxation and much of MMT does seem to explain how macroeconomics works. Whether that could be turned around and used as a tool to guide macroeconomic policy making I have no idea whatsoever. Sitting on the fence getting splinters in my arse on this thread. |
It is quite interesting how these econ/fin types are coalescing around things like anglofuturism which is an anti net zero group that supports increased fossil fuels from the North Sea and fantasy levels of adaptation. There was a loon on here who didn't know the difference between mitigation and adaptation who was advocating this sort of nonsense.
As I see it we either accept there is a climate emergency and put the country on a war style economy to deal with that or face a very bleak future that adaptation will do little to alleviate.
Dreadful to see the left still wrapped up in this taxpayers' money stuff and silly piggy bank economics. You aren't going to touch the sides on climate change or social justice with that twaddle. |  |
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| Gary Stevenson's channel 4 documentary on 21:10 - Jul 7 with 502 views | Swansea_Blue |
| Gary Stevenson's channel 4 documentary on 19:50 - Jul 7 by CoachRob |
It is quite interesting how these econ/fin types are coalescing around things like anglofuturism which is an anti net zero group that supports increased fossil fuels from the North Sea and fantasy levels of adaptation. There was a loon on here who didn't know the difference between mitigation and adaptation who was advocating this sort of nonsense.
As I see it we either accept there is a climate emergency and put the country on a war style economy to deal with that or face a very bleak future that adaptation will do little to alleviate.
Dreadful to see the left still wrapped up in this taxpayers' money stuff and silly piggy bank economics. You aren't going to touch the sides on climate change or social justice with that twaddle. |
I’m fully behind your middle paragraph. I don’t really understand the rest when it comes to the economics, sorry. But I do know the difference between assessment (my old focus), mitigation and adaptation of CC (everyone should - we’ve been talking a bout these things for 40 years).
Economics and economists completely bamboozle me though. Very simplistically, I understand it as what we are currently doing doesn't work for the majority of the people or the environment. So we need something different with the people and environment at the centre (there’s a conflict right there of course). I’d put the environment as the higher priority, but I’m an antisocial old sod. Without a doubt, the cost of CC is going to dwarf everything else. | |
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| Gary Stevenson's channel 4 documentary on 21:39 - Jul 7 with 469 views | jasondozzell |
Bang on. | | | |
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