| Gary Stevenson's channel 4 documentary 16:45 - Jul 6 with 15596 views | J2BLUE |
Being shown Wednesday at 9pm. For anyone who may not have seen anything about it.
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| Gary Stevenson's channel 4 documentary on 07:55 - Jul 9 with 1097 views | DJR |
| Gary Stevenson's channel 4 documentary on 21:35 - Jul 8 by nrb1985 |
Having had this misfortune of watching a number of his videos, humility and the avoidance of dogmatic certainty really aren’t what comes to mind.
See my above post where there was an “inevitable” crash coming which market participants like me were too dumb and/or young to see.
I understand entirely why people feel the way they do and have certain grievances. But I loathe those who prey on that vulnerability to further their own aims. |
I sensed from your earlier comment that you don't like him. 
I can't say I know anything about his work but am always happy to give a bit of leeway to a fellow Ipswich fan. |  | | |
| Gary Stevenson's channel 4 documentary on 08:07 - Jul 9 with 1047 views | lowhouseblue |
| Gary Stevenson's channel 4 documentary on 22:59 - Jul 8 by reusersfreekicks |
Lowhouse tells us all that inequality is not growing in the UK.
Who is correct |
what i've asked for, from those claiming that inequality is rising in the uk, is for evidence of that using conventional measures of inequality - ie, not anecdote, assertion, repetition of what 'everyone knows', or sweeping generalisations which don't actually capture measured inequality.
if you know a rise in inequality in the uk to be true you'll surely have the evidence at hand to prove it. |  |
| And so as the loose-bowelled pigeon of time swoops low over the unsuspecting tourist of destiny, and the flatulent skunk of fate wanders into the air-conditioning system of eternity, I notice it's the end of the show |
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| Gary Stevenson's channel 4 documentary on 08:18 - Jul 9 with 998 views | nrb1985 |
| Gary Stevenson's channel 4 documentary on 07:55 - Jul 9 by DJR |
I sensed from your earlier comment that you don't like him.
I can't say I know anything about his work but am always happy to give a bit of leeway to a fellow Ipswich fan. |
I also don’t like the fact he feels he can speak about markets, tell everyone with such authority what’s going to go up and what isn’t, without actually disclosing what he owns in his portfolio.
To my mind that makes him no better than any other talking head on YouTube. He’s supposedly a professor though so should hold himself to a higher standard.
Young Gary never discloses that either strangely… |  | | |
| Gary Stevenson's channel 4 documentary on 08:20 - Jul 9 with 990 views | itfcjoe |
| Gary Stevenson's channel 4 documentary on 08:18 - Jul 9 by nrb1985 |
I also don’t like the fact he feels he can speak about markets, tell everyone with such authority what’s going to go up and what isn’t, without actually disclosing what he owns in his portfolio.
To my mind that makes him no better than any other talking head on YouTube. He’s supposedly a professor though so should hold himself to a higher standard.
Young Gary never discloses that either strangely… |
Tbf to Gary, his first videos were explicitly saying areas to invest in because of what is happening with Covid funding and where that money will end up |  |
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| Gary Stevenson's channel 4 documentary on 08:29 - Jul 9 with 948 views | DanTheMan |
| Gary Stevenson's channel 4 documentary on 08:07 - Jul 9 by lowhouseblue |
what i've asked for, from those claiming that inequality is rising in the uk, is for evidence of that using conventional measures of inequality - ie, not anecdote, assertion, repetition of what 'everyone knows', or sweeping generalisations which don't actually capture measured inequality.
if you know a rise in inequality in the uk to be true you'll surely have the evidence at hand to prove it. |
https://academic.oup.com/ooec/
I don't have a dog in this fight, but I was interested in the discussion. If someone was to make the case, this paper is the best resource I could find on the topic. It essentially argues that the traditional indexes used for economic inequality are underplaying what is happening.
The biggest argument made is that the Thiel index has shown economic inequality increasing in a much larger way that the Gini one. |  |
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| Gary Stevenson's channel 4 documentary on 08:30 - Jul 9 with 947 views | nrb1985 |
| Gary Stevenson's channel 4 documentary on 08:20 - Jul 9 by itfcjoe |
Tbf to Gary, his first videos were explicitly saying areas to invest in because of what is happening with Covid funding and where that money will end up |
He still needs to disclose it Joe, otherwise how do you know what his motives are?
He could just be getting his million plus followers to bid up his existing positions for all you or I know otherwise.
On the rare ocassions I’ve done media or been asked for comment there’s a fairly lengthy doc that needs to be filled out ahead of time disclosing what I own and what the firm owns.
Gary and Richard to my mind are industry professionals and duty bound to do the same. | | | |
| Gary Stevenson's channel 4 documentary on 08:34 - Jul 9 with 927 views | nrb1985 |
| Gary Stevenson's channel 4 documentary on 08:29 - Jul 9 by DanTheMan |
https://academic.oup.com/ooec/
I don't have a dog in this fight, but I was interested in the discussion. If someone was to make the case, this paper is the best resource I could find on the topic. It essentially argues that the traditional indexes used for economic inequality are underplaying what is happening.
The biggest argument made is that the Thiel index has shown economic inequality increasing in a much larger way that the Gini one. |
Thanks for positing - will read, Dan.
I take the point about traditional measures given that lowhouse’s metrics have the avg person 5% + better off, while I don’t think there’s a single person on here who will say they feel better off now vs before Covid.
It’s hard for any traditional measure I would suggest to capture the fact that in the last 5 years we’ve had double digit inflation at points while asset values have increased by 14% pa.
EDIT: also strongly suspect they’re using core CPI or some other measure that likely discounts some volatile items from the inflation basket - might be wrong though.
[Post edited 9 Jul 8:48]
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| Gary Stevenson's channel 4 documentary on 08:52 - Jul 9 with 868 views | BanksterDebtSlave |
| Gary Stevenson's channel 4 documentary on 08:07 - Jul 9 by lowhouseblue |
what i've asked for, from those claiming that inequality is rising in the uk, is for evidence of that using conventional measures of inequality - ie, not anecdote, assertion, repetition of what 'everyone knows', or sweeping generalisations which don't actually capture measured inequality.
if you know a rise in inequality in the uk to be true you'll surely have the evidence at hand to prove it. |
Reassuringly, tractor production is up in the Urals. |  |
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| Gary Stevenson's channel 4 documentary on 08:54 - Jul 9 with 865 views | lowhouseblue |
| Gary Stevenson's channel 4 documentary on 08:29 - Jul 9 by DanTheMan |
https://academic.oup.com/ooec/
I don't have a dog in this fight, but I was interested in the discussion. If someone was to make the case, this paper is the best resource I could find on the topic. It essentially argues that the traditional indexes used for economic inequality are underplaying what is happening.
The biggest argument made is that the Thiel index has shown economic inequality increasing in a much larger way that the Gini one. |
how you measure inequality is obviously a matter of debate. there are lots of alternative stats. if you take a distribution and try to summarise it with a single headline measure then that drops out lots of information. there is an awful lot going on beneath something like a gini coefficient.
but even the thiel index doesn't show any systematic change since the mid 90s. it is now below where it was in 2000. we're broadly still where we were then. both measures show inequality rising in the 80s - but neither implies that is it rising in the recent period. the best you could say is that since the 80s / 90s there is absolutely no clear pattern. the problem with absolute measures has already been discussed in the thread - they can be distorted by changing prices.
yes, measuring inequality is open to serious debate, but if this article reflects the best effort to find rising inequality using the measures that are most likely to show it, it doesn't achieve that post the mid-1990s. there isn't evidence here, even with the best efforts to find it, that uk inequality us currently rising.
my point in the thread is that people confidently assert 'in the uk inequality is rising' almost as an article of faith, but that isn't backed up by evidence. it's politically what people want to see, rather than having any evidence base. it may be that people think the uk is just like the us, or it may just be confirmation bias of some sort. [Post edited 9 Jul 8:56]
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| And so as the loose-bowelled pigeon of time swoops low over the unsuspecting tourist of destiny, and the flatulent skunk of fate wanders into the air-conditioning system of eternity, I notice it's the end of the show |
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| Gary Stevenson's channel 4 documentary on 08:56 - Jul 9 with 854 views | lowhouseblue |
| Gary Stevenson's channel 4 documentary on 08:52 - Jul 9 by BanksterDebtSlave |
Reassuringly, tractor production is up in the Urals. |
and well done you for trying to join in. | |
| And so as the loose-bowelled pigeon of time swoops low over the unsuspecting tourist of destiny, and the flatulent skunk of fate wanders into the air-conditioning system of eternity, I notice it's the end of the show |
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| Gary Stevenson's channel 4 documentary on 09:04 - Jul 9 with 831 views | DanTheMan |
| Gary Stevenson's channel 4 documentary on 08:54 - Jul 9 by lowhouseblue |
how you measure inequality is obviously a matter of debate. there are lots of alternative stats. if you take a distribution and try to summarise it with a single headline measure then that drops out lots of information. there is an awful lot going on beneath something like a gini coefficient.
but even the thiel index doesn't show any systematic change since the mid 90s. it is now below where it was in 2000. we're broadly still where we were then. both measures show inequality rising in the 80s - but neither implies that is it rising in the recent period. the best you could say is that since the 80s / 90s there is absolutely no clear pattern. the problem with absolute measures has already been discussed in the thread - they can be distorted by changing prices.
yes, measuring inequality is open to serious debate, but if this article reflects the best effort to find rising inequality using the measures that are most likely to show it, it doesn't achieve that post the mid-1990s. there isn't evidence here, even with the best efforts to find it, that uk inequality us currently rising.
my point in the thread is that people confidently assert 'in the uk inequality is rising' almost as an article of faith, but that isn't backed up by evidence. it's politically what people want to see, rather than having any evidence base. it may be that people think the uk is just like the us, or it may just be confirmation bias of some sort. [Post edited 9 Jul 8:56]
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Taking directly from the source:
"According to the Theil index, inequality was 21% greater in 2018 than in 1990; according to the Gini, only 3% greater." | |
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| Gary Stevenson's channel 4 documentary on 09:15 - Jul 9 with 797 views | lowhouseblue |
| Gary Stevenson's channel 4 documentary on 09:04 - Jul 9 by DanTheMan |
Taking directly from the source:
"According to the Theil index, inequality was 21% greater in 2018 than in 1990; according to the Gini, only 3% greater." |
as i said, "even the thiel index doesn't show any systematic change since the mid 90s"
yes there was a big rise in the 80s, and the thiel index shows that going on longer and up to the mid-90s. but no systematic change since then.
all my posts have been about recent changes, not what happened in the 80s which isn't disputed. | |
| And so as the loose-bowelled pigeon of time swoops low over the unsuspecting tourist of destiny, and the flatulent skunk of fate wanders into the air-conditioning system of eternity, I notice it's the end of the show |
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| Gary Stevenson's channel 4 documentary on 09:23 - Jul 9 with 766 views | nrb1985 |
| Gary Stevenson's channel 4 documentary on 09:15 - Jul 9 by lowhouseblue |
as i said, "even the thiel index doesn't show any systematic change since the mid 90s"
yes there was a big rise in the 80s, and the thiel index shows that going on longer and up to the mid-90s. but no systematic change since then.
all my posts have been about recent changes, not what happened in the 80s which isn't disputed. |
Humour me because I’m being thick here no doubt.
But if you accept the top 10% own assets, the bottom 10% don’t but are very much exposed to real wage growth, then;
How on earth do you look at a graph of asset price inflation over the last 5 years vs stagnating real wages and conclude anything other than the top 10% have got wealthier and the bottom 10% have stood still at best?
By any sensible person’s measure, including pretty much every piece of investment bank research I’ve ever read on the topic, that equates to growing inequality.
I still don’t know what you’re not getting here? Or indeed what I’m not getting?! [Post edited 9 Jul 9:34]
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| Gary Stevenson's channel 4 documentary on 09:34 - Jul 9 with 747 views | lowhouseblue |
| Gary Stevenson's channel 4 documentary on 09:23 - Jul 9 by nrb1985 |
Humour me because I’m being thick here no doubt.
But if you accept the top 10% own assets, the bottom 10% don’t but are very much exposed to real wage growth, then;
How on earth do you look at a graph of asset price inflation over the last 5 years vs stagnating real wages and conclude anything other than the top 10% have got wealthier and the bottom 10% have stood still at best?
By any sensible person’s measure, including pretty much every piece of investment bank research I’ve ever read on the topic, that equates to growing inequality.
I still don’t know what you’re not getting here? Or indeed what I’m not getting?! [Post edited 9 Jul 9:34]
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there is no evidence to support what you are saying for the recent period in the uk. you can point to partial things, but the data does not show it.
we established that real wages have risen by 0.8% a year since 2020 (you thought it entirely plausible that they had fallen by a total 10% in that period!, so your instinct may not be spot on. i can't be bothered to look it up, but the real rise in the min wage in that period will exceed 0.8% pa.
in terms of asset prices, which of these two distributions is more unequal?
1, 4, 10, 15, 25, 45
or
2, 8, 20, 30, 50, 90
"any sensible person’s measure" sounds a bit like faragy "common sense".
in terms of "every piece of investment bank research" - share their data. | |
| And so as the loose-bowelled pigeon of time swoops low over the unsuspecting tourist of destiny, and the flatulent skunk of fate wanders into the air-conditioning system of eternity, I notice it's the end of the show |
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| Gary Stevenson's channel 4 documentary on 10:01 - Jul 9 with 697 views | DanTheMan |
| Gary Stevenson's channel 4 documentary on 09:15 - Jul 9 by lowhouseblue |
as i said, "even the thiel index doesn't show any systematic change since the mid 90s"
yes there was a big rise in the 80s, and the thiel index shows that going on longer and up to the mid-90s. but no systematic change since then.
all my posts have been about recent changes, not what happened in the 80s which isn't disputed. |
I'm not following, looking at the graph there is a pretty obvious increase, and I wouldn't say 20%+ difference from the early 90s to 2018 a non-systemic change.
And that doesn't even take into account the very large increase of asset prices since 2018.
The conclusion to the paper even says are much:
"I have shown that UK income inequality levels are higher than conventionally assumed, and the conclusion that income inequality in the UK has changed little over the last 30 years is sensitive to the choice of inequality index used or inequality conceptualization (‘relative’ vs ‘absolute’). Using a more top-sensitive inequality index than the Gini coefficient, or an absolute index rather than relative index, you are more likely to conclude that income inequality has definitely risen over this period."
You essentially seem to be saying the paper agrees with you when as far as I can tell, it does not. | |
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| Gary Stevenson's channel 4 documentary on 10:04 - Jul 9 with 676 views | nrb1985 |
| Gary Stevenson's channel 4 documentary on 10:01 - Jul 9 by DanTheMan |
I'm not following, looking at the graph there is a pretty obvious increase, and I wouldn't say 20%+ difference from the early 90s to 2018 a non-systemic change.
And that doesn't even take into account the very large increase of asset prices since 2018.
The conclusion to the paper even says are much:
"I have shown that UK income inequality levels are higher than conventionally assumed, and the conclusion that income inequality in the UK has changed little over the last 30 years is sensitive to the choice of inequality index used or inequality conceptualization (‘relative’ vs ‘absolute’). Using a more top-sensitive inequality index than the Gini coefficient, or an absolute index rather than relative index, you are more likely to conclude that income inequality has definitely risen over this period."
You essentially seem to be saying the paper agrees with you when as far as I can tell, it does not. |
He also posted a graph on page 1 of this thread that shows since the GFC the share of assets owned in the UK by the top 1% has gone up in aggregate while simultaneously denying that's what's happened.
I'm not sure he knows his @rse from his elbow tbh. [Post edited 9 Jul 10:05]
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| Gary Stevenson's channel 4 documentary on 10:11 - Jul 9 with 640 views | lowhouseblue |
| Gary Stevenson's channel 4 documentary on 10:01 - Jul 9 by DanTheMan |
I'm not following, looking at the graph there is a pretty obvious increase, and I wouldn't say 20%+ difference from the early 90s to 2018 a non-systemic change.
And that doesn't even take into account the very large increase of asset prices since 2018.
The conclusion to the paper even says are much:
"I have shown that UK income inequality levels are higher than conventionally assumed, and the conclusion that income inequality in the UK has changed little over the last 30 years is sensitive to the choice of inequality index used or inequality conceptualization (‘relative’ vs ‘absolute’). Using a more top-sensitive inequality index than the Gini coefficient, or an absolute index rather than relative index, you are more likely to conclude that income inequality has definitely risen over this period."
You essentially seem to be saying the paper agrees with you when as far as I can tell, it does not. |
there is no pattern whatsoever after 2000. i've said all along that i'm discussing recent changes. there is no evidence of recent rises in uk inequality. look at figure 1.
so the usual lazy assumption that SINCE, say, for the sake of argument, 2010 and the tory government and 'austerity' and the explosion of us billionaires etc etc, uk inequality has risen is false. even using the measures which are most suited to showing a rise - no rise is shown in that period.
again no one is disputing that inequality rose in the 1980s, or that the thiel index extends that rise into the 1990s.
i've been posting about recent patterns and the false claims people make abiout what is happening now - so pointing out what happened in the 90s doesn't change that. | |
| And so as the loose-bowelled pigeon of time swoops low over the unsuspecting tourist of destiny, and the flatulent skunk of fate wanders into the air-conditioning system of eternity, I notice it's the end of the show |
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| Gary Stevenson's channel 4 documentary on 10:12 - Jul 9 with 630 views | nrb1985 |
| Gary Stevenson's channel 4 documentary on 09:34 - Jul 9 by lowhouseblue |
there is no evidence to support what you are saying for the recent period in the uk. you can point to partial things, but the data does not show it.
we established that real wages have risen by 0.8% a year since 2020 (you thought it entirely plausible that they had fallen by a total 10% in that period!, so your instinct may not be spot on. i can't be bothered to look it up, but the real rise in the min wage in that period will exceed 0.8% pa.
in terms of asset prices, which of these two distributions is more unequal?
1, 4, 10, 15, 25, 45
or
2, 8, 20, 30, 50, 90
"any sensible person’s measure" sounds a bit like faragy "common sense".
in terms of "every piece of investment bank research" - share their data. |
The data does show it because you posted a graph showing it on page 1 you melt.
Massive rise in share of wealth owned by the top 1% post GFC, when we had zero interest rates which only started to come down after the Brexit vote - which probably only reflects stagnating UK house prices reducing aggregate returns from financial assets. Which is meaningless as I assume not everyone will have sold their house and realised any losses. Even factoring that in, the graph is still trending up.
The difference between our measures of real wage growth is simply explained by the fact I took a 5 yr average, you took rolling quarterly in the same time - I suspect my measure reflects better what's happened given how volatile inflation has been - and there is not a single sod on here that's going to tell you they have 5% more in their bank after monthly expenses than they did in 2019. I'm not even sure we're using the same measure of CPI FYI.
As for the IB research, can't share as it's restricted info that can't be shared with non professional investors and it has a watermark with my name and firm on.
GS did however make public their recent paper on UK social mobility which touches on many of themes in this thread. You can download it here:
https://www.goldmansachs.com/i [Post edited 9 Jul 10:14]
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| Gary Stevenson's channel 4 documentary on 10:19 - Jul 9 with 596 views | nrb1985 |
| Gary Stevenson's channel 4 documentary on 10:11 - Jul 9 by lowhouseblue |
there is no pattern whatsoever after 2000. i've said all along that i'm discussing recent changes. there is no evidence of recent rises in uk inequality. look at figure 1.
so the usual lazy assumption that SINCE, say, for the sake of argument, 2010 and the tory government and 'austerity' and the explosion of us billionaires etc etc, uk inequality has risen is false. even using the measures which are most suited to showing a rise - no rise is shown in that period.
again no one is disputing that inequality rose in the 1980s, or that the thiel index extends that rise into the 1990s.
i've been posting about recent patterns and the false claims people make abiout what is happening now - so pointing out what happened in the 90s doesn't change that. |
It's not lazy, 2010 is broadly when interest rates went to zero post GFC which caused asset prices to balloon.
Have a look at an MSCI World chart and see that the line pretty much goes vertical in 2010.
https://uk.finance.yahoo.com/q
Not sure you have as good a grasp on all this as you think. | | | |
| Gary Stevenson's channel 4 documentary on 10:21 - Jul 9 with 592 views | lowhouseblue |
| Gary Stevenson's channel 4 documentary on 10:12 - Jul 9 by nrb1985 |
The data does show it because you posted a graph showing it on page 1 you melt.
Massive rise in share of wealth owned by the top 1% post GFC, when we had zero interest rates which only started to come down after the Brexit vote - which probably only reflects stagnating UK house prices reducing aggregate returns from financial assets. Which is meaningless as I assume not everyone will have sold their house and realised any losses. Even factoring that in, the graph is still trending up.
The difference between our measures of real wage growth is simply explained by the fact I took a 5 yr average, you took rolling quarterly in the same time - I suspect my measure reflects better what's happened given how volatile inflation has been - and there is not a single sod on here that's going to tell you they have 5% more in their bank after monthly expenses than they did in 2019. I'm not even sure we're using the same measure of CPI FYI.
As for the IB research, can't share as it's restricted info that can't be shared with non professional investors and it has a watermark with my name and firm on.
GS did however make public their recent paper on UK social mobility which touches on many of themes in this thread. You can download it here:
https://www.goldmansachs.com/i [Post edited 9 Jul 10:14]
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with the graph on page 1 you are looking at the us. the uk is not the us! the pattern in the us not the issue here.
the goldman sachs stuff seems to be about social mobility not inequality. they are different aspects. in terms of uk inequality it seems to rely on assertion NOT data.
there's an element of posting vaguely connected links to defend a prior assumption here.
to repeat - there is no data to show rising inequality in the uk post 2000 or post 2010.
and unless someone posts real data to counter that, i give up. | |
| And so as the loose-bowelled pigeon of time swoops low over the unsuspecting tourist of destiny, and the flatulent skunk of fate wanders into the air-conditioning system of eternity, I notice it's the end of the show |
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| Gary Stevenson's channel 4 documentary on 10:26 - Jul 9 with 575 views | DanTheMan |
| Gary Stevenson's channel 4 documentary on 10:11 - Jul 9 by lowhouseblue |
there is no pattern whatsoever after 2000. i've said all along that i'm discussing recent changes. there is no evidence of recent rises in uk inequality. look at figure 1.
so the usual lazy assumption that SINCE, say, for the sake of argument, 2010 and the tory government and 'austerity' and the explosion of us billionaires etc etc, uk inequality has risen is false. even using the measures which are most suited to showing a rise - no rise is shown in that period.
again no one is disputing that inequality rose in the 1980s, or that the thiel index extends that rise into the 1990s.
i've been posting about recent patterns and the false claims people make abiout what is happening now - so pointing out what happened in the 90s doesn't change that. |
Figure 1 is not the whole paper, the entire paper is arguing that even with the Thiel index example that the way that the data is captured and the way in which you can choose to use these indexes underplays what is actually happening.
Otherwise the conclusion would make no sense, they are quite literally saying inequality in the past 30 years has increased.
Read the paper or don't. You asked for something showing it, there it is. Feel free to argue with the author. | |
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| Gary Stevenson's channel 4 documentary on 10:31 - Jul 9 with 560 views | nrb1985 |
| Gary Stevenson's channel 4 documentary on 10:21 - Jul 9 by lowhouseblue |
with the graph on page 1 you are looking at the us. the uk is not the us! the pattern in the us not the issue here.
the goldman sachs stuff seems to be about social mobility not inequality. they are different aspects. in terms of uk inequality it seems to rely on assertion NOT data.
there's an element of posting vaguely connected links to defend a prior assumption here.
to repeat - there is no data to show rising inequality in the uk post 2000 or post 2010.
and unless someone posts real data to counter that, i give up. |
You're an absolute mentalist!
The graph on page 1, that YOU posted, has the UK on the bottom, with a line trending up post GFC.
For the sake of this board and protecting our own IQs, I think it is probably best you give up as you say.
At last something we can agree on. | | | |
| Gary Stevenson's channel 4 documentary on 10:34 - Jul 9 with 555 views | lowhouseblue |
| Gary Stevenson's channel 4 documentary on 10:26 - Jul 9 by DanTheMan |
Figure 1 is not the whole paper, the entire paper is arguing that even with the Thiel index example that the way that the data is captured and the way in which you can choose to use these indexes underplays what is actually happening.
Otherwise the conclusion would make no sense, they are quite literally saying inequality in the past 30 years has increased.
Read the paper or don't. You asked for something showing it, there it is. Feel free to argue with the author. |
great. i've been talking about recent changes. i've said post 2000 or post 2010. politically that is now where people are focused and it is that recent period that people make false claims about
rather than engage with that point you post about the 'past 30 years' which includes the whole of the 90s where we all know big changes occurred. again, i'm not disputing that but, it's not my poiny. you're making a different point and not responding to the point i've made.
"ipswich haven't won the fa cup since the mid-90s" - "no you're wrong they've won it in the last 50 years"
I give up. | |
| And so as the loose-bowelled pigeon of time swoops low over the unsuspecting tourist of destiny, and the flatulent skunk of fate wanders into the air-conditioning system of eternity, I notice it's the end of the show |
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| Gary Stevenson's channel 4 documentary on 10:53 - Jul 9 with 520 views | _CliveBaker_ |
| Gary Stevenson's channel 4 documentary on 10:21 - Jul 9 by lowhouseblue |
with the graph on page 1 you are looking at the us. the uk is not the us! the pattern in the us not the issue here.
the goldman sachs stuff seems to be about social mobility not inequality. they are different aspects. in terms of uk inequality it seems to rely on assertion NOT data.
there's an element of posting vaguely connected links to defend a prior assumption here.
to repeat - there is no data to show rising inequality in the uk post 2000 or post 2010.
and unless someone posts real data to counter that, i give up. |
This might be overly simplistic (I'm a chartered accountant by trade, not an economist), but compounded cumulative inflation in the UK since 2020 is in the region of 30% - 35%. In certain areas that impact typical households, such as food, energy bills, fuel and accommodation costs, it's higher. For simplicity, if we work off average inflation, £1.30 today buys what £1 bought in 2020. I don't know many jobs that are paying 30% - 35% more than they were in 2020 on a like for like basis.
Average teacher take home in 2020 vs. 2026 is +21%.
Average nurse take home in 2020 vs. 2026 is +18%. My wife is a nurse, hers is marginally higher than that but includes a promotion. It's still not in increased in line with inflation despite more responsibility.
Total Average salary: +18%.
All things being equal, if costs have risen by 30% and take home has risen by 20%, your average Brit is spending a higher share of their income on basic consumption.
While that doesn't necessarily equate directly to immediate increasing wealth inequality, surely its an almost inevitable outcome when the cost of living rises faster than the ability of ordinary households to accumulate assets. It stands to reason that existing owners would benefit disproportionately, because they already possess the assets that increase in value.
The top 10% of households in the UK hold 40% of the wealth. The bottom 50% holds <10%. I wouldn't be at all surprised to see that gap increase over the next 10 years. |  | | |
| Gary Stevenson's channel 4 documentary on 10:56 - Jul 9 with 512 views | nrb1985 |
| Gary Stevenson's channel 4 documentary on 10:53 - Jul 9 by _CliveBaker_ |
This might be overly simplistic (I'm a chartered accountant by trade, not an economist), but compounded cumulative inflation in the UK since 2020 is in the region of 30% - 35%. In certain areas that impact typical households, such as food, energy bills, fuel and accommodation costs, it's higher. For simplicity, if we work off average inflation, £1.30 today buys what £1 bought in 2020. I don't know many jobs that are paying 30% - 35% more than they were in 2020 on a like for like basis.
Average teacher take home in 2020 vs. 2026 is +21%.
Average nurse take home in 2020 vs. 2026 is +18%. My wife is a nurse, hers is marginally higher than that but includes a promotion. It's still not in increased in line with inflation despite more responsibility.
Total Average salary: +18%.
All things being equal, if costs have risen by 30% and take home has risen by 20%, your average Brit is spending a higher share of their income on basic consumption.
While that doesn't necessarily equate directly to immediate increasing wealth inequality, surely its an almost inevitable outcome when the cost of living rises faster than the ability of ordinary households to accumulate assets. It stands to reason that existing owners would benefit disproportionately, because they already possess the assets that increase in value.
The top 10% of households in the UK hold 40% of the wealth. The bottom 50% holds <10%. I wouldn't be at all surprised to see that gap increase over the next 10 years. |
No mate, you've got that wrong.
We are all 5% better off than we were in 2019 apparently. | | | |
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