| Hypothetical Man City relegation 08:26 - Oct 20 with 1924 views | GeoffSentence |
If Man City were given a large points deduction, one that guaranteed relegation this year, there's a danger that would destroy the integrity of the Premier League this season. On the assumption that they knew they'd be going down anyway there'd be no incentive to compete in their remaining league games, perhaps concentrating on the Champion's league instead. That would put those teams who had already lost to them at a disadvantage. Naked self interest aside, that would not be a good thing for the league |  |
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| Hypothetical Man City relegation on 09:00 - Oct 20 with 1792 views | LandOfMickyStockwell |
An idea off the top of my head as I type:
How about the size of a second season points deduction dependent on the number of points amassed before deductions this season? Say, just for ease of maths, 100 points deduction this season. Then 100 points next season minus (say) the 80 points they amass before deductions this season (= 20 pts).
Change the actual points but = relegated to championship, but still have an interest in this season. Next season penalty is still significant to not skew the Championship (so much).
My true opinion is I care little, as it's just one less £1bn spending club skewing the Prem. |  | | |
| Hypothetical Man City relegation on 10:24 - Oct 20 with 1625 views | The_Major |
It's a minefield working out what to do, I suspect. One off points deduction, and yes they go down, but they'll be straight back by 28/29. Doing a Rangers, and busting them down to League Two, and there's a knock on effect with promotion relegation across the pyramid.
Maybe doing a multi season approach where say, they're deducted however many points are needed to guarantee relegation this season, and then for the following four they're deducted 40 points say, still gives them a chance of avoiding relegation again so they've got something to play for, but they won't get back to the Prem until that period is complete, or even longer if they drop lower. That's the only thing I can think of. |  | | |
| Hypothetical Man City relegation on 10:59 - Oct 20 with 1505 views | burnbudgiesburn |
From a purely ITFC perspective though - I think i'd trade them having one game at home v Hull City where they may not be as motivated for them taking up 1 of 3 relegation spots. |  | | |
| Hypothetical Man City relegation on 11:08 - Oct 20 with 1459 views | WeWereZombies |
In the 'financial damage' chart the BBC put in an article a few days ago I noticed that Nodge featured as one of the clubs hard done by, so to right that particular wrong I suggest that Donnarumma has to spend a season at Carrot Rud - where he upsets the rest of the squad and refuses to play when the weather gets a bit cold, by way of compensation Manchester City agree to play a pre-season friendly there at some unspecified date in the future... |  |
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| Hypothetical Man City relegation on 12:03 - Oct 20 with 1342 views | SamWhiteUK |
| Hypothetical Man City relegation on 10:24 - Oct 20 by The_Major |
It's a minefield working out what to do, I suspect. One off points deduction, and yes they go down, but they'll be straight back by 28/29. Doing a Rangers, and busting them down to League Two, and there's a knock on effect with promotion relegation across the pyramid.
Maybe doing a multi season approach where say, they're deducted however many points are needed to guarantee relegation this season, and then for the following four they're deducted 40 points say, still gives them a chance of avoiding relegation again so they've got something to play for, but they won't get back to the Prem until that period is complete, or even longer if they drop lower. That's the only thing I can think of. |
But surely the Premier League can't impose sanctions that affect a team in the EFL? They're separate entities. That's why Leicester (I think it was?) slipped through the cracks constantly, because one league couldn't punish in the other. |  | | |
| Hypothetical Man City relegation on 12:41 - Oct 20 with 1222 views | surreyblue |
| Hypothetical Man City relegation on 12:03 - Oct 20 by SamWhiteUK |
But surely the Premier League can't impose sanctions that affect a team in the EFL? They're separate entities. That's why Leicester (I think it was?) slipped through the cracks constantly, because one league couldn't punish in the other. |
I think since then the prem and efl have agreed to close that loophole, so sanctions can cross over.
I'd make part of the punishment a massive multi-year fine that goes against whatever FFP regime they are under. So not only do they need to pay a fine of 900m over a 10 year period, but each year their acceptable losses are reduced to "right" their cumulative overspend.
Lets see you get out of the championship while making a 60m profit. | | | |
| Hypothetical Man City relegation on 12:45 - Oct 20 with 1201 views | ITFC_Essex |
I'd say the integrity of the Premier League has been destroyed by the last decade plus of Manchester City cheating. |  |
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| Hypothetical Man City relegation on 12:49 - Oct 20 with 1184 views | MJallday |
sorry OP, i dont buy this as a reason or excuse not to punish them
"theres a danger that would destroy the integrity of the premier league this season"
they did the crime, are you seriously suggesting that they dont get punished? id argue that would destroy the integrity of the PL more
fine them points , fine them some more points, and when your finished fining them, do it a few more seasons
if i were everton (or one of the other PL clubs thats been deducted points recently) and they (man c) only got say, a 30 point deduction, id be lawyering up massively .
The PL have no other choice but to kick them out, or to ensure relegation and impose future sanctions. any other outcome would destroy the PL's integrity. |  |
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| Hypothetical Man City relegation on 13:24 - Oct 20 with 1017 views | ITFC_Forever |
It’ll be a 50p fine and they’ll be told to run along and play nicely. |  |
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| Hypothetical Man City relegation on 14:18 - Oct 20 with 917 views | BrayBlue |
Man City should be forced to pay back all 714pts they accrued between 2008-18, the period when they were guilty of cheating - and here’s how: next season they start on - 714pts. For the sake of easy maths, let’s say they earn 100pts, that would see them relegated on -614pts.
Here’s the crucial bit: the points deduction rolls over! So whenever they return to the PL they would start on -614pts, and so on until all 714pts have been repaid. It would take City a decade or so to wipe the slate clean, roughly the same amount of time they were cheating - seems fair to me?
Cheers,
JK | | | |
| Hypothetical Man City relegation on 14:49 - Oct 20 with 845 views | StokieBlue |
| Hypothetical Man City relegation on 10:24 - Oct 20 by The_Major |
It's a minefield working out what to do, I suspect. One off points deduction, and yes they go down, but they'll be straight back by 28/29. Doing a Rangers, and busting them down to League Two, and there's a knock on effect with promotion relegation across the pyramid.
Maybe doing a multi season approach where say, they're deducted however many points are needed to guarantee relegation this season, and then for the following four they're deducted 40 points say, still gives them a chance of avoiding relegation again so they've got something to play for, but they won't get back to the Prem until that period is complete, or even longer if they drop lower. That's the only thing I can think of. |
At that level of punishment, why wouldn't other teams chuck an extra 900m at creating a wonder squad, take a one season hit then win the league the next season?
It's no disincentive at all.
Hard to know what can in reality be done.
SB |  |
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| Hypothetical Man City relegation on 14:52 - Oct 20 with 841 views | squiz |
It has made a mockery of the season really.
Most of me won't care, but if we stay up only due to city being relegated this season it will feel a bit hollow. Just complete luck that the punishment for them cheating 8-17 years ago happens to get resolved while we are in a position to take advantage. |  | | |
| Hypothetical Man City relegation on 15:31 - Oct 20 with 762 views | Ralphinho |
| Hypothetical Man City relegation on 10:24 - Oct 20 by The_Major |
It's a minefield working out what to do, I suspect. One off points deduction, and yes they go down, but they'll be straight back by 28/29. Doing a Rangers, and busting them down to League Two, and there's a knock on effect with promotion relegation across the pyramid.
Maybe doing a multi season approach where say, they're deducted however many points are needed to guarantee relegation this season, and then for the following four they're deducted 40 points say, still gives them a chance of avoiding relegation again so they've got something to play for, but they won't get back to the Prem until that period is complete, or even longer if they drop lower. That's the only thing I can think of. |
A multi-season points deduction feels the most logical approach to me. I'd go with 100 points this season, 75 next season, 50 the season after and 25 the following season, with the deductions following them through the leagues. Transfer embargo - only allowed to sign homegrown talent from their academy (potentially great for young British players, assuming they didnt find a way to fiddle that..)
Total of 250pt deduction. 2.19pts per charge.
Forest and Everton both got deducted 4 points per charge. Would equate to 456 points, so the 250pts feels a reasonable compromise.
That would likely see them drop to League One and spend at least four seasons outside the Premier League, possibly longer.
A substantial punishment which still gives them a route back on sporting merit, which will be more difficult when the prem quality players leave and the fan revenue decreases. [Post edited 20 Oct 15:34]
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| Hypothetical Man City relegation on 15:44 - Oct 20 with 704 views | _CliveBaker_ |
I think its a fair point, but in the context of this issue its probably way down the list in terms of priority.
You could definitely argue Man City had more skin in the game in their opening 7 games than if they're playing matches in Feb still on -50 points. Hopefully they're on the beach and prepping for the CL final when we play them in May. They might even stick 2 fingers up to the PL and put the kids out. |  | | |
| Hypothetical Man City relegation on 15:46 - Oct 20 with 692 views | _CliveBaker_ |
| Hypothetical Man City relegation on 14:52 - Oct 20 by squiz |
It has made a mockery of the season really.
Most of me won't care, but if we stay up only due to city being relegated this season it will feel a bit hollow. Just complete luck that the punishment for them cheating 8-17 years ago happens to get resolved while we are in a position to take advantage. |
It'll feel better than going down with City, that's not a great place to be! | | | |
| Hypothetical Man City relegation on 22:22 - Oct 20 with 323 views | rgp1 |
| Hypothetical Man City relegation on 13:24 - Oct 20 by ITFC_Forever |
It’ll be a 50p fine and they’ll be told to run along and play nicely. |
I agree, nothing will happen other than possibly a big fine and possible suspension of points etc. Anything else won't happen because it won't be ripples it will be a tsunami. The Premier League not doubt will look at damage limitation. I'm not saying it's right but blood letting on a grand scale will just drag this on for years. [Post edited 20 Oct 22:24]
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