| Petition for Starmer to incorporate PR in manifesto after conference vote on 21:39 - Sep 26 with 711 views | Swansea_Blue |
I was looking for the PR thread earlier, but couldn’t find it. I’m sure I posted something pointless on it earlier today, but there’s no sign now.
Anyhow, I was going to post this and mention that we may see a u turn incoming from Starmer, maybe.
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| Petition for Starmer to incorporate PR in manifesto after conference vote on 22:25 - Sep 26 with 682 views | factual_blue |
Is this a first past the post petition? |  |
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| Petition for Starmer to incorporate PR in manifesto after conference vote on 22:48 - Sep 26 with 667 views | tractordownsouth |
There are lots of proportional and hybrid systems. Part of the reason the PR campaign fails is because advocates argue amongst themselves over what is best and there is never an agreed system for them to all get behind. |  |
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| Petition for Starmer to incorporate PR in manifesto after conference vote on 23:22 - Sep 26 with 631 views | eireblue |
| Petition for Starmer to incorporate PR in manifesto after conference vote on 22:48 - Sep 26 by tractordownsouth |
There are lots of proportional and hybrid systems. Part of the reason the PR campaign fails is because advocates argue amongst themselves over what is best and there is never an agreed system for them to all get behind. |
Pffftt that’s just silly. They should take lessons from TWTD.
For example, Pablo vs Shefki could have been something that was constantly debated and left unresolved. Luckily rational minds sorted that one, and we all know the correct answer on that.
So humans should be able to resolve these things. |  | | |
| Petition for Starmer to incorporate PR in manifesto after conference vote on 10:41 - Sep 27 with 547 views | ArnoldMoorhen |
| Petition for Starmer to incorporate PR in manifesto after conference vote on 22:48 - Sep 26 by tractordownsouth |
There are lots of proportional and hybrid systems. Part of the reason the PR campaign fails is because advocates argue amongst themselves over what is best and there is never an agreed system for them to all get behind. |
Yes, that was true of the past.
However we now have two functioning Parliaments in UK nations which use forms of Proportional Representation that allow for every vote to count whilst preserving Constituency Representation. So plenty of senior Labour figures in both Scotland and Wales have plenty of experience of it working in practice.
The devolved powers in Health meant that the Scottish and Welsh Governments were responsible for the Pandemic response in their nations, and so one of the fears of those opposed to Proportional Representation, that a higher likelihood of Coalition or Minority Governments leads to paralysis or weakness in times of crisis, can also be demonstrated to be unfounded. Instead, the need to build a more consensual style of politics in more normal times facilitated a unified and non-adversarial response to the Pandemic in Scotland, whilst robust questions have still been put. |  | | |
| Petition for Starmer to incorporate PR in manifesto after conference vote on 11:05 - Sep 27 with 530 views | HARRY10 |
| Petition for Starmer to incorporate PR in manifesto after conference vote on 10:41 - Sep 27 by ArnoldMoorhen |
Yes, that was true of the past.
However we now have two functioning Parliaments in UK nations which use forms of Proportional Representation that allow for every vote to count whilst preserving Constituency Representation. So plenty of senior Labour figures in both Scotland and Wales have plenty of experience of it working in practice.
The devolved powers in Health meant that the Scottish and Welsh Governments were responsible for the Pandemic response in their nations, and so one of the fears of those opposed to Proportional Representation, that a higher likelihood of Coalition or Minority Governments leads to paralysis or weakness in times of crisis, can also be demonstrated to be unfounded. Instead, the need to build a more consensual style of politics in more normal times facilitated a unified and non-adversarial response to the Pandemic in Scotland, whilst robust questions have still been put. |
Incorrect.
the opposition to PR is not fear, but a total lack of information of what it entails
Firstly not every vote counts. That is absurd at the most basic and shows how, like Brexit, misinformation is not only believed but spread.
What is needed is a comprehensive explanation of how the current system works, how it can be improved, and what changes could be made. However, as is well understood by politicians it is not the system so much as the sheer ignorance of voters (as above).
Much of that stems from most having never had how the political, or judiciary systems work. So headlines describing the judiciary defending the sovereignty of Parliament as 'enemies of the people' by rags that endlessly bleat (wrongly) about the EU blocking UK sovereignty are accepted.
And it is worth noting that PR would still have given us an incompetent serial liar as PM in 2019. Does that not point to where the real problem lies ? | | | |
| Petition for Starmer to incorporate PR in manifesto after conference vote on 22:16 - Sep 27 with 472 views | tractordownsouth |
| Petition for Starmer to incorporate PR in manifesto after conference vote on 10:41 - Sep 27 by ArnoldMoorhen |
Yes, that was true of the past.
However we now have two functioning Parliaments in UK nations which use forms of Proportional Representation that allow for every vote to count whilst preserving Constituency Representation. So plenty of senior Labour figures in both Scotland and Wales have plenty of experience of it working in practice.
The devolved powers in Health meant that the Scottish and Welsh Governments were responsible for the Pandemic response in their nations, and so one of the fears of those opposed to Proportional Representation, that a higher likelihood of Coalition or Minority Governments leads to paralysis or weakness in times of crisis, can also be demonstrated to be unfounded. Instead, the need to build a more consensual style of politics in more normal times facilitated a unified and non-adversarial response to the Pandemic in Scotland, whilst robust questions have still been put. |
I think the AMS they use in Wales and Scotland is the best way of doing it. Although it's worth noting Wales is moving to another system. | |
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