| O'Shea 10:09 - Aug 29 with 2576 views | DJR |
didn't look as tall to me as Woolfy, and according to Wikipedia he is 6 ft 1 inch.
Maybe that is part of the explanation for the two goals we conceded, the crosses for each of which just went over the head of Burgess.
We also didn't have the height of a Hirst or Moore to compensate.
As regards O'Shea's playing out from the back, it was difficult to judge because Wimbledon didn't really press us. [Post edited 29 Aug 2024 10:09]
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| O'Shea on 10:10 - Aug 29 with 2522 views | FrimleyBlue |
I don't think the height of one player suddenly made Burgess smaller. lol |  |
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| O'Shea on 10:12 - Aug 29 with 2478 views | smithy69 |
I thought he looked very good, quick and coukd ping a ball
Can’t fault him when others miss headers |  | | |
| O'Shea on 10:13 - Aug 29 with 2467 views | JammyDodgerrr |
I'd say both were Burgess' fault. Ball in his zone, and admittedly there was a little push on both, but he should've(and would've last season) won those headers. He was rusty though, so it happens. We know he is better than that. |  |
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| O'Shea on 10:13 - Aug 29 with 2459 views | BlueOura |
| O'Shea on 10:12 - Aug 29 by smithy69 |
I thought he looked very good, quick and coukd ping a ball
Can’t fault him when others miss headers |
Agreed, looked like an upgrade to me, Good on the ball and very quick. |  | | |
| O'Shea on 10:13 - Aug 29 with 2459 views | Nthsuffolkblue |
| O'Shea on 10:10 - Aug 29 by FrimleyBlue |
I don't think the height of one player suddenly made Burgess smaller. lol |
Indeed. For both goals, the issue was that the scorer was not marked (and the crosses were good crosses). The problem was picking up the players not the height. |  |
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| O'Shea on 10:15 - Aug 29 with 2407 views | FrimleyBlue |
| O'Shea on 10:13 - Aug 29 by JammyDodgerrr |
I'd say both were Burgess' fault. Ball in his zone, and admittedly there was a little push on both, but he should've(and would've last season) won those headers. He was rusty though, so it happens. We know he is better than that. |
I dont want this to come across controversial, as It would be quite understandable, but from all the 'old' players we've seen, his body language looked really off. I mean fairplay he's not had the game time like Wolfy has had before potentially being replaced, but I kinda felt like he was angry last night. | |
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| O'Shea on 10:18 - Aug 29 with 2348 views | Reus30 |
| O'Shea on 10:15 - Aug 29 by FrimleyBlue |
I dont want this to come across controversial, as It would be quite understandable, but from all the 'old' players we've seen, his body language looked really off. I mean fairplay he's not had the game time like Wolfy has had before potentially being replaced, but I kinda felt like he was angry last night. |
Well wouldn't you be?
I get from a fan point of view that it is great that we are spending money but these guys are humans and competitors. I would be annoyed but he didn't perform like the rock he was last year. He did just looked like he was trying to hard a bit (some forced passes etc). |  | | |
| O'Shea on 10:18 - Aug 29 with 2343 views | _clive_baker_ |
| O'Shea on 10:13 - Aug 29 by JammyDodgerrr |
I'd say both were Burgess' fault. Ball in his zone, and admittedly there was a little push on both, but he should've(and would've last season) won those headers. He was rusty though, so it happens. We know he is better than that. |
While that's true we shouldn't have given either of those free kicks away. Absolute basics, both such soft fouls in those areas against a team that were only likely going to pose any real threat from set pieces. |  | | |
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| O'Shea on 10:20 - Aug 29 with 2278 views | portmanking |
| O'Shea on 10:18 - Aug 29 by _clive_baker_ |
While that's true we shouldn't have given either of those free kicks away. Absolute basics, both such soft fouls in those areas against a team that were only likely going to pose any real threat from set pieces. |
Yup, I think Cajuste was guilty of one of them, a little to eager to dive in. | | | |
| O'Shea on 10:22 - Aug 29 with 2233 views | BloomBlue |
First goal was Burgess fault even though he felt he was pushed he should be stronger there.
Second goal is O'Shea's fault, the goal scorer comes in behind Burgess, Burgess is marking the player in front of him which is correct. Can not expect Burgess to have eyes in the front and back of his head O'Shea should be attacking that as the scorer is in front of him.
But some of that is caused by players, playing together for the first time.
But I was concerned O'Shea switched off in that second half, when he was fairly knocked off the ball and got lucky with getting a freekick when there was nothing wrong. As I said on another chat if that had been Woolfy numerous fans would be highlighting that as typical Woolf, switching off. If that's in the Prem, I'm sure the ref lets it go and when the player scores VAR checks and agrees no foul. You cannot switch off in the Prem even for a second |  | | |
| O'Shea on 10:23 - Aug 29 with 2192 views | FrimleyBlue |
| O'Shea on 10:22 - Aug 29 by BloomBlue |
First goal was Burgess fault even though he felt he was pushed he should be stronger there.
Second goal is O'Shea's fault, the goal scorer comes in behind Burgess, Burgess is marking the player in front of him which is correct. Can not expect Burgess to have eyes in the front and back of his head O'Shea should be attacking that as the scorer is in front of him.
But some of that is caused by players, playing together for the first time.
But I was concerned O'Shea switched off in that second half, when he was fairly knocked off the ball and got lucky with getting a freekick when there was nothing wrong. As I said on another chat if that had been Woolfy numerous fans would be highlighting that as typical Woolf, switching off. If that's in the Prem, I'm sure the ref lets it go and when the player scores VAR checks and agrees no foul. You cannot switch off in the Prem even for a second |
Is that correct?
In my view, the onus is on Burgess to head that ball as if Oshea comes across to beat the man infront of him, there's a big chance he could go through the back of the player and give a pen away.. | |
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| O'Shea on 10:37 - Aug 29 with 2066 views | BloomBlue |
| O'Shea on 10:23 - Aug 29 by FrimleyBlue |
Is that correct?
In my view, the onus is on Burgess to head that ball as if Oshea comes across to beat the man infront of him, there's a big chance he could go through the back of the player and give a pen away.. |
But the player is behind him for the second goal, the ball is over his head if he goes backwards too far and catches that player it is also a pen as the ref will view it as Burgess not looking at that player.
When a ball is knocked in like that players are taught to attack the ball by going towards it.
But as I said I think most of that is they've not played together before. O'Shea should be shouting to Burgess 'my ball' and that comes after you've played together more. Which is why KM often doesn't change the defence, building those relationships. | | | |
| O'Shea on 10:40 - Aug 29 with 2024 views | pointofblue |
| O'Shea on 10:15 - Aug 29 by FrimleyBlue |
I dont want this to come across controversial, as It would be quite understandable, but from all the 'old' players we've seen, his body language looked really off. I mean fairplay he's not had the game time like Wolfy has had before potentially being replaced, but I kinda felt like he was angry last night. |
Woolfenden and Burgess hadn't/haven't really done anything wrong yet one's already been moved aside and it looks like the other will be shortly. You can understand if they're hurt and angry by that. Burns, Broadhead and Hirst picked up injuries which resulted in them dropping out of the side. Chaplin hasn't been in his best form since the turn of the year. Luongo has tired quickly in games. Tuanzebe, Davis, Morsy and Hutchinson seem to be given a proper chance into the season proper. So, as you say, it's understandable if they (and Walton for that matter) are angry about it. Burgess then having a nightmare when given the opportunity is not going to help his mood.
It's down to McKenna to manage it, and I'm sure he will. | |
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| O'Shea on 10:41 - Aug 29 with 2000 views | FrimleyBlue |
| O'Shea on 10:37 - Aug 29 by BloomBlue |
But the player is behind him for the second goal, the ball is over his head if he goes backwards too far and catches that player it is also a pen as the ref will view it as Burgess not looking at that player.
When a ball is knocked in like that players are taught to attack the ball by going towards it.
But as I said I think most of that is they've not played together before. O'Shea should be shouting to Burgess 'my ball' and that comes after you've played together more. Which is why KM often doesn't change the defence, building those relationships. |
Difficult one, I think Burgess has to be looking at the ball not the player, if he's more interested in blocking the player then that's a pen. I think he just misjudges the flight of the ball, but that imo just comes down to rustiness and not many match minutes for him so far this season.
I suppose that's also the risk of Zonal Marking, if the ball goes into a specfic gap then there's always that risk. | |
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| O'Shea on 10:43 - Aug 29 with 1979 views | LankHenners |
| O'Shea on 10:20 - Aug 29 by portmanking |
Yup, I think Cajuste was guilty of one of them, a little to eager to dive in. |
Only thing he did wrong all night, a little too keen to win the ball back. Townsend was the other one which I thought was worse as there was no reason to make the challenge and he only did it because he didn't deal with the ball being lumped towards him very well in the first place, which wasn't the first time that had happened. |  |
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| O'Shea on 10:51 - Aug 29 with 1884 views | weepingx2018 |
I honestly would have taken Moore for this season. | | | |
| O'Shea on 10:51 - Aug 29 with 1879 views | Nthsuffolkblue |
| O'Shea on 10:37 - Aug 29 by BloomBlue |
But the player is behind him for the second goal, the ball is over his head if he goes backwards too far and catches that player it is also a pen as the ref will view it as Burgess not looking at that player.
When a ball is knocked in like that players are taught to attack the ball by going towards it.
But as I said I think most of that is they've not played together before. O'Shea should be shouting to Burgess 'my ball' and that comes after you've played together more. Which is why KM often doesn't change the defence, building those relationships. |
So the attacker has got between the defenders well and either it is a failing of zonal marking or someone has failed to mark him properly in the first place.
It will be a combination of individual errors and lack of communication/awareness between players. A lot of the success of teams depends on partnerships and understanding. We have a lot of players that need to develop those very quickly. | |
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| O'Shea on 11:14 - Aug 29 with 1710 views | DJR |
| O'Shea on 10:13 - Aug 29 by JammyDodgerrr |
I'd say both were Burgess' fault. Ball in his zone, and admittedly there was a little push on both, but he should've(and would've last season) won those headers. He was rusty though, so it happens. We know he is better than that. |
I think it's a bit harsh to put the blame on Burgess because there will always be occasions when the cross goes over the head of the nearest central defender.
Of course maybe it is just down to lack of practice/familiarity with the new players and our defensive system. But our zonal system has generally worked well with two players (Woolfy and Burgess) of roughly equal height because if one doesn't win it, the other generally does. [Post edited 29 Aug 2024 11:17]
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