| How do we think KMcK would have done 16:15 - May 1 with 1397 views | GeoffSentence |
Without the backing of gamechanger?
With the likes of Piggot up front, maybe El Miz in place of Morsy, JD still at RB for instance.
I don't think we would have been near the autos, but given that he has shown he can improve players quite considerably, I'm pretty sure he would have got us into the play-offs. |  |
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| How do we think KMcK would have done on 16:23 - May 1 with 1319 views | pointofblue |
Pigott was signed after Gamechanger took over.
The line up prior to the take over was something like: Norris, Chambers, Ward, McGuinness, Wilson, Downes, Skuse, Bishop, Sears, Jackson, Norwood |  |
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| How do we think KMcK would have done on 16:26 - May 1 with 1288 views | Gogs |
A moot point, obviously, as I doubt anyone else but the gamechanger setup would have picked him as manager (certainly not the previous regime anyway), but I'm of a broadly similar view. Depends on who he could have brought in and the squad he'd have inherited, but I can't immediately think of anyone whose game doesn't look better under KMcK, so yeah, I think we'd still be very competitive. |  | | |
| How do we think KMcK would have done on 16:28 - May 1 with 1268 views | GeoffSentence |
| How do we think KMcK would have done on 16:23 - May 1 by pointofblue |
Pigott was signed after Gamechanger took over.
The line up prior to the take over was something like: Norris, Chambers, Ward, McGuinness, Wilson, Downes, Skuse, Bishop, Sears, Jackson, Norwood |
Wasn't sure about Piggott's signing, but it was an example of the quality of player he might have been working with if GC20 weren't here and he was.
Actually, looking at that squad list, I think he could have done something with it. Wilson isa regular in Plymouth's team and was decent for us, Norwood can score, Downes, Skuse and Bishop (free of injuries) could be decent, we know he likes Jackson. McGuinness is playing in the championship. Stll not autos, but he would have got something out of that lot. | |
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| How do we think KMcK would have done on 16:32 - May 1 with 1251 views | jayessess |
How far are we re-winding in this counter-factual?
Scenario (A): We hire him in December 2021 but GC20 pull out, no more cash injections and we have to live within our means from then on. I reckon we're still a good shout to compete at the top end of the league, but maybe we have to get by on frees, academy players, good loan players.
Scenario (B): We hire him instead of Cook in March 2021 and the takeover never happens. Well, part of me thinks he'd have managed to continue Matt Gill's trajectory and get enough performances out of Lambert's lot to make the play-offs. We had a very gentle run in, get the tactics and mentality right and we might have got there. We'd have lost, because we weren't good enough to compete with the other teams up there. Summer 2021, there's a big clear out and after that is a massive wild card. McKenna's had a recruitment team and a big budget, so it's hard to know how good his recruitment would be with tight purse strings and all the decisions being on him. |  |
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| How do we think KMcK would have done on 16:34 - May 1 with 1235 views | Swansea_Blue |
We probably wouldn’t be quite where was are, but seeing what he did with Cook’s side last season tells you he’s a cut above any of the managers we’ve had in a long time. |  |
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| How do we think KMcK would have done on 16:38 - May 1 with 1203 views | GeoffSentence |
| How do we think KMcK would have done on 16:32 - May 1 by jayessess |
How far are we re-winding in this counter-factual?
Scenario (A): We hire him in December 2021 but GC20 pull out, no more cash injections and we have to live within our means from then on. I reckon we're still a good shout to compete at the top end of the league, but maybe we have to get by on frees, academy players, good loan players.
Scenario (B): We hire him instead of Cook in March 2021 and the takeover never happens. Well, part of me thinks he'd have managed to continue Matt Gill's trajectory and get enough performances out of Lambert's lot to make the play-offs. We had a very gentle run in, get the tactics and mentality right and we might have got there. We'd have lost, because we weren't good enough to compete with the other teams up there. Summer 2021, there's a big clear out and after that is a massive wild card. McKenna's had a recruitment team and a big budget, so it's hard to know how good his recruitment would be with tight purse strings and all the decisions being on him. |
As far as you like.
We hire KMcK instead of Hurst - Stay up, comfortably, possibly pushing for the playoffs.
Instead of Lambert, we just avoid relegation then go on to solid mid-table performances in the subsequent years before he moves on to better things, Evans hires some other tosser and we get relegated then. | |
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| How do we think KMcK would have done on 16:38 - May 1 with 1202 views | positivity |
| How do we think KMcK would have done on 16:28 - May 1 by GeoffSentence |
Wasn't sure about Piggott's signing, but it was an example of the quality of player he might have been working with if GC20 weren't here and he was.
Actually, looking at that squad list, I think he could have done something with it. Wilson isa regular in Plymouth's team and was decent for us, Norwood can score, Downes, Skuse and Bishop (free of injuries) could be decent, we know he likes Jackson. McGuinness is playing in the championship. Stll not autos, but he would have got something out of that lot. |
wasn't norris the season before? seem to recall a good few of those were crocked by the time gamechanger came in | |
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| How do we think KMcK would have done on 16:42 - May 1 with 1175 views | positivity |
| How do we think KMcK would have done on 16:38 - May 1 by GeoffSentence |
As far as you like.
We hire KMcK instead of Hurst - Stay up, comfortably, possibly pushing for the playoffs.
Instead of Lambert, we just avoid relegation then go on to solid mid-table performances in the subsequent years before he moves on to better things, Evans hires some other tosser and we get relegated then. |
as far as you like? we hire mckenna instead of mcgiven.
despite only being 7, he does a better job of keeping us in the prem and we haven't been relegated since... marcus evans never exists! | |
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| How do we think KMcK would have done on 17:17 - May 1 with 1030 views | TractorFrog |
I enjoy hypothetical scenarios, so here is what I think would have happened if he had been signed instead of Paul Cook but had never had backing from gamechanger.
Firstly, the team he took over from Paul Lambert was not as terrible as people seem to think. Whereas Cook had them on relegation form, I think McKenna would have kept them just outside the playoffs and perhaps snuck into them. It was a comparatively poor level of league one teams and we had some good players. But I don't think we would have gone up.
Then the team for 2021/22. McKenna has to make his signings under Evans-level of investment, although the sales of Downes and Dozzell will help.
In goal, we had Tomas Holy and David Cornell. McKenna may not have Gamechanger backing but I think even under Evans he would have been allowed to sign a new first-choice goalkeeper and kept Holy as backup. This may have been Hladky, but under McKenna he would have done more like as well as this season, rather than having a shaky start like he did in reality. And he would likely have got more out of Holy and perhaps kept him in contention for a place.
At centre-back, we had Luke Chambers, Luke Woolfenden, James Wilson, Toto Nsiala and Corrie Ndaba. It seems likely that McKenna wouldn't have been able to strengthen here, but a starting pairing of Woolfenden and Wilson is pretty good for this level. And he may have picked out one new player instead of Chambers or Nsiala to improve the squad (perhaps Cameron Burgess, and he got far more out of him than Cook). So I think we would have started the season off better here than we did as well, despite not signing George Edmundson.
Right-back would be Janoi Donacien and Kane Vincent-Young, just like under Cook. They probably would have performed similarly. At left-back, I think McKenna would have released Stephen Ward and kept Myles Kenlock as backup, with another signing here. He wouldn't have had the funds to get someone as good as Leif Davis, but perhaps he would have gone for Dominic Thompson, perhaps a similar option to Matt Penney and Hayden Coulson.
In centre-midfield, we had Skuse, Nolan, Huws, Bishop, Downes and Dozzell, as well as McGavin and El Mizouni. Dozzell would have to have left because there was a clause in his contract, while Downes also would have been difficult to keep. At least he would have got a good amount of money for these two. But I think that he would have kept Bishop, Nolan, Skuse and El Mizouni (releasing Huws and loaning McGavin), and so would have to have strengthened here, perhaps with two new players. Ipswich's midfield struggled initially under Cook, but I think under McKenna without the funds it would have been a similar story and he wouldn't have been able to sign Sam Morsy. Perhaps if he had got Evans and Bakinson the midfield wouldn't have been too weak.
As the attacking options, McKenna started with Edwards, Judge, Lankester, Dobra, Sears. I think perhaps Edwards would have accepted the new contract, and Judge too, but Sears would probably have been released and the other two weren't quite there yet. So a signing would be needed here, but this area of the pitch would be far weaker than the Cook lineup of Burns, Fraser, Chaplin, Celina, Edwards and Aluko. Perhaps McKenna would have been able to get Burns and Aluko.
Up front, he had Norwood, Jackson, Hawkins and Drinan. Norwood and Jackson would surely have stayed with the other two released, although I think Drinan was underrated and McKenna could have got more out of him. I think McKenna would have wanted a new striker but may not have had the funds considering other areas of the pitch were a more pressing matter, but considering the money he got from Downes and Dozzell I will assume he does strengthen here. Let's say he gets Ladapo.
So the lineup for the season is (with the new signings likely to have been different players, but roughly of the same ability):
GK - Hladky (Holy)
CB - Woolfenden, Burgess (Wilson, Chambers, Ndaba)
RB - Donacien (Vincent-Young)
LB - Thompson (Kenlock)
CM - Evans, Bakinson (Bishop, Nolan, El Mizouni, Skuse)
AM - Burns, Aluko, G Edwards (Judge, Dobra, Lankester)
ST - Ladapo (Norwood, Jackson)
Ultimately, this lineup is certainly weaker than the one we had last year. But under McKenna's management for the whole season I think they would have done better than 11th and possibly made the playoffs. But I still don't think they would have gone up. Maybe McKenna could have strengthened further this season and made the playoffs. |  |
| They'd all laugh at me if they knew what I was trying to do. To create a new strain of super-wine in half-an-hour with a fraction of nature's resources and a FOOL for an assistant. 'Bernard Black, he's mad,' they'd say, 'he's insane, he's dangerous.' Well I'll show them! I'll show them all! | | Poll: | Who should start in CM with Cajuste? |
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| How do we think KMcK would have done on 18:14 - May 1 with 871 views | ringwoodblue |
| How do we think KMcK would have done on 17:17 - May 1 by TractorFrog |
I enjoy hypothetical scenarios, so here is what I think would have happened if he had been signed instead of Paul Cook but had never had backing from gamechanger.
Firstly, the team he took over from Paul Lambert was not as terrible as people seem to think. Whereas Cook had them on relegation form, I think McKenna would have kept them just outside the playoffs and perhaps snuck into them. It was a comparatively poor level of league one teams and we had some good players. But I don't think we would have gone up.
Then the team for 2021/22. McKenna has to make his signings under Evans-level of investment, although the sales of Downes and Dozzell will help.
In goal, we had Tomas Holy and David Cornell. McKenna may not have Gamechanger backing but I think even under Evans he would have been allowed to sign a new first-choice goalkeeper and kept Holy as backup. This may have been Hladky, but under McKenna he would have done more like as well as this season, rather than having a shaky start like he did in reality. And he would likely have got more out of Holy and perhaps kept him in contention for a place.
At centre-back, we had Luke Chambers, Luke Woolfenden, James Wilson, Toto Nsiala and Corrie Ndaba. It seems likely that McKenna wouldn't have been able to strengthen here, but a starting pairing of Woolfenden and Wilson is pretty good for this level. And he may have picked out one new player instead of Chambers or Nsiala to improve the squad (perhaps Cameron Burgess, and he got far more out of him than Cook). So I think we would have started the season off better here than we did as well, despite not signing George Edmundson.
Right-back would be Janoi Donacien and Kane Vincent-Young, just like under Cook. They probably would have performed similarly. At left-back, I think McKenna would have released Stephen Ward and kept Myles Kenlock as backup, with another signing here. He wouldn't have had the funds to get someone as good as Leif Davis, but perhaps he would have gone for Dominic Thompson, perhaps a similar option to Matt Penney and Hayden Coulson.
In centre-midfield, we had Skuse, Nolan, Huws, Bishop, Downes and Dozzell, as well as McGavin and El Mizouni. Dozzell would have to have left because there was a clause in his contract, while Downes also would have been difficult to keep. At least he would have got a good amount of money for these two. But I think that he would have kept Bishop, Nolan, Skuse and El Mizouni (releasing Huws and loaning McGavin), and so would have to have strengthened here, perhaps with two new players. Ipswich's midfield struggled initially under Cook, but I think under McKenna without the funds it would have been a similar story and he wouldn't have been able to sign Sam Morsy. Perhaps if he had got Evans and Bakinson the midfield wouldn't have been too weak.
As the attacking options, McKenna started with Edwards, Judge, Lankester, Dobra, Sears. I think perhaps Edwards would have accepted the new contract, and Judge too, but Sears would probably have been released and the other two weren't quite there yet. So a signing would be needed here, but this area of the pitch would be far weaker than the Cook lineup of Burns, Fraser, Chaplin, Celina, Edwards and Aluko. Perhaps McKenna would have been able to get Burns and Aluko.
Up front, he had Norwood, Jackson, Hawkins and Drinan. Norwood and Jackson would surely have stayed with the other two released, although I think Drinan was underrated and McKenna could have got more out of him. I think McKenna would have wanted a new striker but may not have had the funds considering other areas of the pitch were a more pressing matter, but considering the money he got from Downes and Dozzell I will assume he does strengthen here. Let's say he gets Ladapo.
So the lineup for the season is (with the new signings likely to have been different players, but roughly of the same ability):
GK - Hladky (Holy)
CB - Woolfenden, Burgess (Wilson, Chambers, Ndaba)
RB - Donacien (Vincent-Young)
LB - Thompson (Kenlock)
CM - Evans, Bakinson (Bishop, Nolan, El Mizouni, Skuse)
AM - Burns, Aluko, G Edwards (Judge, Dobra, Lankester)
ST - Ladapo (Norwood, Jackson)
Ultimately, this lineup is certainly weaker than the one we had last year. But under McKenna's management for the whole season I think they would have done better than 11th and possibly made the playoffs. But I still don't think they would have gone up. Maybe McKenna could have strengthened further this season and made the playoffs. |
Wow TractorFrog, you really thought through that completely pointless hypothetical situation very well.
I’m glad it happened as it did as without GC, we wouldn’t have such a positive future (hypothetically) |  |
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| How do we think KMcK would have done on 18:55 - May 1 with 776 views | OldFart71 |
Many managers have achieved much more than their resources allow. The biggest problem is after they have achieved what limited success they have to move on from that proves difficult. Look at the number of managers that have gained promotion at a club, it then falters the following season and they are shown the door. There's absolutely no doubt McKenna is a very good manager. But we look at previous managers at ITFC, some in the early days of the ME reign were given quite substantial backing, they failed. Later ones were not given adequate funds and even those that brought in decent players were either not allowed to add to the squad to achieve anything or were told to sell before buying. Is the Plymouth manager better than McKenna as he has put his team top of the table with fewer resources. It doesn't always follow that money buys success. Look at Keirans old club Man Utd. They have spent many millions on players and some that have cost more than every single player at PR and yet they aren't anywhere near their neoghbours. The thing you have to say about the setup at PR is yes they have spent money, but very little has been wasted. | | | |
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