| Massive 10 days for Hurst and Evans 09:16 - Jul 25 with 6706 views | itfcjoe |
Waghorn money will give them some movement to bring players in - but is also going to increase prices we are quoted. We've already had a 'rubbish' bid turned down by Scunthorpe.
I'm still concerned how short we are at CB - next in line is going out on loan today but club have insisted it is to a non league club as they need a recall on the deal.
I think a number 10 is desperately required too.
Obviously it must be best for their long term fitness - but we have Huws, Adeyemi, Garner and Bishop as 4 members of our small squad who must still be weeks away from being fully fit. |  |
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| Massive 10 days for Hurst and Evans on 10:08 - Jul 25 with 2164 views | footers |
| Massive 10 days for Hurst and Evans on 10:03 - Jul 25 by itfcjoe |
I do understand the point - if our wage bill last season was £x million and this season it is still £x million then has the money been re-invested in wages? Because that is what has happened.
The fees generated have just lowered ME's contribution - not increased the annual wage and fee budget. |
Sure, but if we spent the £8m for Waggy purely on players then to pay those additional 4-5 players would equal or see an increase in the wage bill.
Just frustrating that people often ignore that wages need to be paid, loan fees, signing on fees etc. |  |
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| Massive 10 days for Hurst and Evans on 10:09 - Jul 25 with 2158 views | Herbivore |
| Massive 10 days for Hurst and Evans on 09:47 - Jul 25 by Steve_M |
IF they were all fit, then yes but there are question marks over three of those after long-term injuries, Garner has an injury and Sears' form has been erratic over the last two years.
Bishop has really only played one full season too so we need a bit more in midfield and forward. |
Why is experience so important though? That's a genuine question even if it sounds flippant. The spine of the team still has Bart, Chambers and Skuse with the likes of Spence, Knudsen and Ward in the mix as well. How much Championship experience is really needed? |  |
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| Massive 10 days for Hurst and Evans on 10:12 - Jul 25 with 2140 views | ITFC_Forever |
| Massive 10 days for Hurst and Evans on 10:04 - Jul 25 by Reuser_is_God |
Anyone checked Morrison’s cafe? |
The most obvious place to look.... |  |
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| Massive 10 days for Hurst and Evans on 10:16 - Jul 25 with 2108 views | footers |
| Massive 10 days for Hurst and Evans on 10:12 - Jul 25 by ITFC_Forever |
The most obvious place to look.... |
Weeping into his hash browns and writing 'Evans Out' in ketchup. | |
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| Massive 10 days for Hurst and Evans on 10:29 - Jul 25 with 2043 views | ElderGrizzly |
| Massive 10 days for Hurst and Evans on 10:03 - Jul 25 by itfcjoe |
I do understand the point - if our wage bill last season was £x million and this season it is still £x million then has the money been re-invested in wages? Because that is what has happened.
The fees generated have just lowered ME's contribution - not increased the annual wage and fee budget. |
Although the wage budget has gone up every year under MM |  | | |
| Massive 10 days for Hurst and Evans on 10:30 - Jul 25 with 2034 views | itfcjoe |
| Massive 10 days for Hurst and Evans on 10:29 - Jul 25 by ElderGrizzly |
Although the wage budget has gone up every year under MM |
Not by much, a small percentage.
Certainly not in line with transfer dealings | |
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| Massive 10 days for Hurst and Evans on 10:34 - Jul 25 with 2005 views | ElderGrizzly |
| Massive 10 days for Hurst and Evans on 10:30 - Jul 25 by itfcjoe |
Not by much, a small percentage.
Certainly not in line with transfer dealings |
Almost £19m now in total isn’t it? Our total income is around £14m/£15m?
You can’t simply look at one year in isolation with wages vs transfer fees brought in.
But agree, Evans does need to allow most, if not all of that £8m to be reinvested in fees where possible, as wages will have dropped with McG, Waghorn etc leaving.
A PL loan is £1m as a minimum with fee and wages, so that won’t be a cheap back up option | | | |
| Massive 10 days for Hurst and Evans on 10:37 - Jul 25 with 1989 views | itfcjoe |
| Massive 10 days for Hurst and Evans on 10:34 - Jul 25 by ElderGrizzly |
Almost £19m now in total isn’t it? Our total income is around £14m/£15m?
You can’t simply look at one year in isolation with wages vs transfer fees brought in.
But agree, Evans does need to allow most, if not all of that £8m to be reinvested in fees where possible, as wages will have dropped with McG, Waghorn etc leaving.
A PL loan is £1m as a minimum with fee and wages, so that won’t be a cheap back up option |
Our wage bill was bigger under Jewell when income smaller if I remember correctly.
If our operating budget doesn't change with regards to transfer fees received - i.e. we lose about £5m a year excluding fees then the money isn't being reinvested properly | |
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| Massive 10 days for Hurst and Evans on 10:41 - Jul 25 with 1972 views | Radlett_blue |
| Massive 10 days for Hurst and Evans on 10:29 - Jul 25 by ElderGrizzly |
Although the wage budget has gone up every year under MM |
Yes, but other clubs' wage bills have increased by more. Not saying Evans is likely to become willing to lose £10m a year, just trying to put our situation in perspective. Mid table will be a good achievement for Hurst. Will be interested to see if his policy of picking up decent lower league players works, but fear it could all go very John Duncan (I hope I'm wrong). |  |
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| Massive 10 days for Hurst and Evans on 10:55 - Jul 25 with 1934 views | Garv |
| Massive 10 days for Hurst and Evans on 10:09 - Jul 25 by Herbivore |
Why is experience so important though? That's a genuine question even if it sounds flippant. The spine of the team still has Bart, Chambers and Skuse with the likes of Spence, Knudsen and Ward in the mix as well. How much Championship experience is really needed? |
Agrees. How much Championship experience was in the Royle sides? I'd imagine a similar amount to now. Looking forward to someone proving me wrong. |  |
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| Massive 10 days for Hurst and Evans on 11:00 - Jul 25 with 1916 views | Steve_M |
| Massive 10 days for Hurst and Evans on 10:09 - Jul 25 by Herbivore |
Why is experience so important though? That's a genuine question even if it sounds flippant. The spine of the team still has Bart, Chambers and Skuse with the likes of Spence, Knudsen and Ward in the mix as well. How much Championship experience is really needed? |
Mainly because it's a tough division, full of teams with players who can grind out results when necessary in matches without a lot of space. We've seen lots of younger players run out of energy in the second half of a season because of it.
Many would like to believe that it was only us under McCarthy who were dire and attritional at times, on the contrary only Bournemouth and Wolves have had success in recent years without being able to shut the game down at times.
This is particularly the case for defenders, it took Knudsen a couple of seasons to fully adapt for example. |  |
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| Massive 10 days for Hurst and Evans on 11:05 - Jul 25 with 1896 views | Steve_M |
| Massive 10 days for Hurst and Evans on 10:55 - Jul 25 by Garv |
Agrees. How much Championship experience was in the Royle sides? I'd imagine a similar amount to now. Looking forward to someone proving me wrong. |
The 2004-05 team was generally:
Davis
Wilnis de Vos Naylor Richards
Miller Magilton Horlock Westlake
Bent Kuqi
That would be two players without significant experience, three if you want to include Bent although he had a lot by then. In contrast, the year after we lost our good players and struggled badly at times.
We're not looking at a comparable situation now. | |
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| Massive 10 days for Hurst and Evans on 11:18 - Jul 25 with 1865 views | Herbivore |
| Massive 10 days for Hurst and Evans on 11:00 - Jul 25 by Steve_M |
Mainly because it's a tough division, full of teams with players who can grind out results when necessary in matches without a lot of space. We've seen lots of younger players run out of energy in the second half of a season because of it.
Many would like to believe that it was only us under McCarthy who were dire and attritional at times, on the contrary only Bournemouth and Wolves have had success in recent years without being able to shut the game down at times.
This is particularly the case for defenders, it took Knudsen a couple of seasons to fully adapt for example. |
But three of our four likely starters in defence do have plenty of Championship experience, as does our best sitting midfielder. I just don't see it as a huge issue myself, we need quality and our best chance of getting quality in our budget is signing good lower league players capable of stepping up and improving. There's sufficient experience within the squad to get through a Championship season. | |
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| Massive 10 days for Hurst and Evans on 11:20 - Jul 25 with 1857 views | CaptainObvious |
| Massive 10 days for Hurst and Evans on 09:58 - Jul 25 by BOjK |
What is your problem with this? |
Wages don't count, they are counter-balanced by the wages of the players leaving e.g. Webster, McGoldrick, Waghorn. |  |
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| Massive 10 days for Hurst and Evans on 11:21 - Jul 25 with 1841 views | CaptainObvious |
| Massive 10 days for Hurst and Evans on 09:59 - Jul 25 by footers |
Wages don't count as money for some people. It's a different kind of money- y'know, the kind that appears from nowhere and disappears somewhere. |
Waghorn, Webster and McGoldrick were playing for free were they? | |
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| Massive 10 days for Hurst and Evans on 11:25 - Jul 25 with 1821 views | CaptainObvious |
| Massive 10 days for Hurst and Evans on 10:01 - Jul 25 by Freddies_Ears |
And he would be correct. |
Wages only work one way? Looks like some are falling for the Mings money illusion all over again. | |
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| Massive 10 days for Hurst and Evans on 11:26 - Jul 25 with 1815 views | footers |
| Massive 10 days for Hurst and Evans on 11:21 - Jul 25 by CaptainObvious |
Waghorn, Webster and McGoldrick were playing for free were they? |
No, they were some of our highest wage earners. The point is that our squad last term was threadbare anyhow; fees from Webster and Waghorn will need to be used on more players in than out, to ensure we have squad depth. A good % of the fees should be used for signings, no doubt, but some will have to be set aside for other costs, especially as all deals are structured over years and we'll have nowhere near the full amount up front. | |
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| Massive 10 days for Hurst and Evans on 11:29 - Jul 25 with 1794 views | Keaneish |
| Massive 10 days for Hurst and Evans on 09:31 - Jul 25 by Herbivore |
I'm not quite so worried about this, when you look at the players we have with substantial experience at this level we're not badly stocked and I think the difference between this league and League 1 is really quality over physicality (the newly promoted sides last season seemed to do okay for the most part). We've currently got:
Bart
Spence
Chambers
Knudsen
Skuse
Ward
Adeyemi
Huws
Bishop
Sears
Garner
All of whom have played multiple seasons at this level. The likes of Kenlock, Emmanuel, Nydam and Dozzell have a decent number of appearances between them too. The key thing for me now is bringing in quality, I'm not worried about which league that quality comes from. |
Yeah, agreed. We're lacking genuine quality at this level. I think its too much to hope the sum of our parts are good enough. Having said that, what are our expectations this season?
We need good supply from the middle and someone prolific to stick the ball in the net. Don't see this in our squad at the moment. |  |
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| Massive 10 days for Hurst and Evans on 11:29 - Jul 25 with 1796 views | CaptainObvious |
| Massive 10 days for Hurst and Evans on 11:26 - Jul 25 by footers |
No, they were some of our highest wage earners. The point is that our squad last term was threadbare anyhow; fees from Webster and Waghorn will need to be used on more players in than out, to ensure we have squad depth. A good % of the fees should be used for signings, no doubt, but some will have to be set aside for other costs, especially as all deals are structured over years and we'll have nowhere near the full amount up front. |
It wasn't threadbare, it was supplemented by a lot of loan players. We are not paying those loan players anymore so there is money freed up there as well. | |
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| Massive 10 days for Hurst and Evans on 11:32 - Jul 25 with 1781 views | footers |
| Massive 10 days for Hurst and Evans on 11:29 - Jul 25 by CaptainObvious |
It wasn't threadbare, it was supplemented by a lot of loan players. We are not paying those loan players anymore so there is money freed up there as well. |
Hmm, agree to disagree on that one. In fact the CCV loan was a replacement for injury that wouldn't have been necessary had we had a larger squad. Most Championship sides have far more players than us and we need to recruit more to keep it competitive, both generally and in terms of competition for places. | |
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| Massive 10 days for Hurst and Evans on 11:38 - Jul 25 with 1742 views | CaptainObvious |
| Massive 10 days for Hurst and Evans on 11:32 - Jul 25 by footers |
Hmm, agree to disagree on that one. In fact the CCV loan was a replacement for injury that wouldn't have been necessary had we had a larger squad. Most Championship sides have far more players than us and we need to recruit more to keep it competitive, both generally and in terms of competition for places. |
Even if you still believe the squad was threadbare including the loan players, this was only because so many players were injured. Injured players are still on the payroll. | |
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