| The sum of the parts argument 10:23 - Jan 24 with 1486 views | Bluefish |
Not only do we have easily one of the biggest and most expensive squads in the division but we have many players that would walk into any other team, especially in the midfield. I genuinely don't believe there are many of any in the league as good as Bishop or Downes and none have the ability of Dozzell. Those 3 would walk into teams in the top end of the championship. We have cast offs like donacien that can walk into top half league 1 (edit: not championship) sides.
We just always look like 11 players chucked on pitch. It is.like we have never played together befoe, when we do pass it is safe option backwards. Man 4 man we are miles ahead of Peterborough but they looked like a team. They have roles to play and they do them.
I genuinely believe that if you did get appointed with a mission to make us as bad as possible with the resources we have then you would struggle to do it better than Lambert has. He earns £10k per week and adds no value at all [Post edited 24 Jan 2021 10:27]
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| The sum of the parts argument on 10:25 - Jan 24 with 1460 views | BlueBadger |
Bit of a bold statement on Donacien, that. |  |
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| The sum of the parts argument on 10:27 - Jan 24 with 1448 views | Bluefish |
| The sum of the parts argument on 10:25 - Jan 24 by BlueBadger |
Bit of a bold statement on Donacien, that. |
Ah!! Was supposed to say league 1 | |
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| The sum of the parts argument on 10:28 - Jan 24 with 1434 views | brogansnose |
Essentially, we are 11 players chucked on a pitch.There is nothing beyond that. |  | | |
| The sum of the parts argument on 10:33 - Jan 24 with 1421 views | Guthrum |
| The sum of the parts argument on 10:28 - Jan 24 by brogansnose |
Essentially, we are 11 players chucked on a pitch.There is nothing beyond that. |
And yet, there are the occasional bursts of deft passing which show we have the capability to be so much more than that. Which makes it all the more disappointing. |  |
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| The sum of the parts argument on 10:38 - Jan 24 with 1391 views | textbackup |
The entire point of football is to score goals, and we take 1/2 shots on target in 90mins.
That is the part I can’t understand. Shoooooooooooot |  |
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| The sum of the parts argument on 10:39 - Jan 24 with 1384 views | Guthrum |
| The sum of the parts argument on 10:38 - Jan 24 by textbackup |
The entire point of football is to score goals, and we take 1/2 shots on target in 90mins.
That is the part I can’t understand. Shoooooooooooot |
Mind you, that has been a problem for longer than Lambert has been here. | |
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| The sum of the parts argument on 11:12 - Jan 24 with 1339 views | Bluefish |
| The sum of the parts argument on 10:28 - Jan 24 by brogansnose |
Essentially, we are 11 players chucked on a pitch.There is nothing beyond that. |
Which means he earns £10k per week for nothing. The player management off the pitch isn't there, the strategic recruitment isn't there, the fans connections has long gone, the media connection has gone. What does he give us that we wouldn't be better without? Just let Butch and Dyer muddle through if money is an issue. They would get the team together and hopefully install some direction of play | |
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| The sum of the parts argument on 11:13 - Jan 24 with 1333 views | Bluefish |
| The sum of the parts argument on 10:38 - Jan 24 by textbackup |
The entire point of football is to score goals, and we take 1/2 shots on target in 90mins.
That is the part I can’t understand. Shoooooooooooot |
He actually thought we created lots yesterday, he was delighted at that part. Utterly bizarre, we sit here each week wondering why he doesn't change it and it is because he can't see it | |
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| The sum of the parts argument on 11:17 - Jan 24 with 1311 views | Herbivore |
| The sum of the parts argument on 10:33 - Jan 24 by Guthrum |
And yet, there are the occasional bursts of deft passing which show we have the capability to be so much more than that. Which makes it all the more disappointing. |
That's in spite of the management though, Guthers. We have good footballers, occasionally they'll show bursts of their quality. That's what gets us points against the lesser sides, they are generally too poor to hurt us and we have enough individual quality to produce something to get a goal or two. But the side mostly looks totally disjointed and less than the sum of its parts and that is down to utterly abject management. |  |
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| The sum of the parts argument on 11:20 - Jan 24 with 1300 views | BlueBadger |
| The sum of the parts argument on 11:13 - Jan 24 by Bluefish |
He actually thought we created lots yesterday, he was delighted at that part. Utterly bizarre, we sit here each week wondering why he doesn't change it and it is because he can't see it |
I suspect he sees it, he just doesn't give a t0ss, because doing something about it would mean he'd actually have to earn his money. | |
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| The sum of the parts argument on 11:26 - Jan 24 with 1288 views | Dubtractor |
| The sum of the parts argument on 11:17 - Jan 24 by Herbivore |
That's in spite of the management though, Guthers. We have good footballers, occasionally they'll show bursts of their quality. That's what gets us points against the lesser sides, they are generally too poor to hurt us and we have enough individual quality to produce something to get a goal or two. But the side mostly looks totally disjointed and less than the sum of its parts and that is down to utterly abject management. |
Exactly this.
We have a group of professional footballers who play train together every day, of course they can occasionally ping the ball about nicely, but there is no purpose to it, no grand plan to create dangerous positions.
Look at Peterborough yesterday, they were pretty poor for the most part, our high press actually worked quite well in the first half, but they still created the 2 best chance of the first half because when they passed forward they had a real purpose, runners stretching our defence etc. |  |
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| The sum of the parts argument on 11:38 - Jan 24 with 1262 views | rfretwell |
| The sum of the parts argument on 11:26 - Jan 24 by Dubtractor |
Exactly this.
We have a group of professional footballers who play train together every day, of course they can occasionally ping the ball about nicely, but there is no purpose to it, no grand plan to create dangerous positions.
Look at Peterborough yesterday, they were pretty poor for the most part, our high press actually worked quite well in the first half, but they still created the 2 best chance of the first half because when they passed forward they had a real purpose, runners stretching our defence etc. |
Blue fish why would Dozzell Bishop and Downes "walk into other teams midfields"? as you put it? They rarely get a good shot away on goal, rarely score, Bish has a terrible injury record, Dozzell is making progress but no where near the finished article. We need alot more from them to get out of this division. |  | | |
| The sum of the parts argument on 11:40 - Jan 24 with 1258 views | Churchman |
Football is about attitude and professionalism as much as physical skill. Character, hunger to be the best you can be, desire to put the work in. The cliche the harder you work the luckier you get has truth in it. Players like Beckham had limitations in ability but ticked all the above boxes which is why they made the top of the game.
Now I’m not comparing the dregs of the professional game that shamble out for us with the top boys and you may be right that man for man we were miles ahead of Peterborough, but do our players have the above aspects to their game?
I remember years ago somebody like Chris Waddle being interviewed. Paraphrasing him, he said that when he was playing for a top club against a minnow in the FA Cup the little team’s players would often play to a much higher level than their league status and he could never understand why they were playing in the the dross leagues.
Then at the end of his career he played for a little club and saw that while these players might be able to raise their game for the odd big match, they just didn’t have it in them to do it week in week out and he could see why they were where they were.
As a minnow club sliding down the leagues, maybe our players, management and owner reflect that? |  | | |
| The sum of the parts argument on 11:42 - Jan 24 with 1242 views | Herbivore |
| The sum of the parts argument on 11:38 - Jan 24 by rfretwell |
Blue fish why would Dozzell Bishop and Downes "walk into other teams midfields"? as you put it? They rarely get a good shot away on goal, rarely score, Bish has a terrible injury record, Dozzell is making progress but no where near the finished article. We need alot more from them to get out of this division. |
Downes has barely played this season but was subject of a bid from Palace in the summer after being one of the best CMs in the league last season. Bishop has scored 4 or 5 goals this season from midfield already and when fit, which he mostly has been for a year now barring one contact injury, he's different gravy. Dozzell has loads of quality. Our issue isn't the players, it's the manager. | |
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| The sum of the parts argument on 12:12 - Jan 24 with 1194 views | Guthrum |
| The sum of the parts argument on 11:17 - Jan 24 by Herbivore |
That's in spite of the management though, Guthers. We have good footballers, occasionally they'll show bursts of their quality. That's what gets us points against the lesser sides, they are generally too poor to hurt us and we have enough individual quality to produce something to get a goal or two. But the side mostly looks totally disjointed and less than the sum of its parts and that is down to utterly abject management. |
Indeed, that was really my point. | |
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| The sum of the parts argument on 12:34 - Jan 24 with 1173 views | Bluefish |
| The sum of the parts argument on 11:38 - Jan 24 by rfretwell |
Blue fish why would Dozzell Bishop and Downes "walk into other teams midfields"? as you put it? They rarely get a good shot away on goal, rarely score, Bish has a terrible injury record, Dozzell is making progress but no where near the finished article. We need alot more from them to get out of this division. |
Because they are on completely different levels of technical ability. The way Bishop goes past players should see him at the top levels, only the injuries have stopped that | |
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| The sum of the parts argument on 12:35 - Jan 24 with 1164 views | Churchman |
| The sum of the parts argument on 11:42 - Jan 24 by Herbivore |
Downes has barely played this season but was subject of a bid from Palace in the summer after being one of the best CMs in the league last season. Bishop has scored 4 or 5 goals this season from midfield already and when fit, which he mostly has been for a year now barring one contact injury, he's different gravy. Dozzell has loads of quality. Our issue isn't the players, it's the manager. |
I see what you are saying and agree re management, but I’m not sure part of issue isn’t the players. Years ago my dad used to spend a lot of spare time watching the players train or just nosing round the ground. One summer, around late May/June, the gate was open so he nipped in to the football ground itself and a lonely figure was running up and down the stairs time after time.
It was Mickey Stockwell. He had a few serious injuries and at that time he was recovering from one. When he finished they had a chat and Mickey told him that the game was everything to him and whatever it took. Anyone who saw Stockwell will agree with me that he wasn’t the biggest, fastest most talented player they ever saw, but nobody had a better attitude to the game. 100% in everything he did. He played in the Premier League in the end and deserved to do so.
Can you see many of the current players with that kind of attitude? I can’t. | | | |
| The sum of the parts argument on 12:41 - Jan 24 with 1142 views | jayessess |
Regardless, if you've got the resources as a club to accumulate a squad of 31 pro footballers, many with Championship experience, most on very good wages for the division, you've definitely got the resources to assemble a smaller squad capable of winning this league. |  |
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| The sum of the parts argument on 15:56 - Jan 24 with 1042 views | Herbivore |
| The sum of the parts argument on 12:35 - Jan 24 by Churchman |
I see what you are saying and agree re management, but I’m not sure part of issue isn’t the players. Years ago my dad used to spend a lot of spare time watching the players train or just nosing round the ground. One summer, around late May/June, the gate was open so he nipped in to the football ground itself and a lonely figure was running up and down the stairs time after time.
It was Mickey Stockwell. He had a few serious injuries and at that time he was recovering from one. When he finished they had a chat and Mickey told him that the game was everything to him and whatever it took. Anyone who saw Stockwell will agree with me that he wasn’t the biggest, fastest most talented player they ever saw, but nobody had a better attitude to the game. 100% in everything he did. He played in the Premier League in the end and deserved to do so.
Can you see many of the current players with that kind of attitude? I can’t. |
That's a lovely story, but I'm not sure what it has to do with Downes, Bishop, and Dozzell being too good for this league. | |
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