| Banking problems in US 13:33 - Mar 13 with 3137 views | Perublue |
A problem for our owners ? and by default us [Post edited 13 Mar 2023 13:34]
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| Banking problems in US on 13:34 - Mar 13 with 2782 views | homer_123 |
Mainly tech companies being affected, as things stand I would say no. |  |
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| Banking problems in US on 13:36 - Mar 13 with 2751 views | Perublue |
| Banking problems in US on 13:34 - Mar 13 by homer_123 |
Mainly tech companies being affected, as things stand I would say no. |
My first thoughts,but it seems to be spreading out of that sphere ..I guess where all their funds are invested is the issue. | |
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| Banking problems in US on 13:37 - Mar 13 with 2749 views | giant_stow |
| Banking problems in US on 13:34 - Mar 13 by homer_123 |
Mainly tech companies being affected, as things stand I would say no. |
Do you think this is the next financial crisis kicking off, Homer? Seems like we're more vulnerable now and talk of only protecting depositors this time... |  |
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| Banking problems in US on 13:39 - Mar 13 with 2720 views | Perublue |
| Banking problems in US on 13:37 - Mar 13 by giant_stow |
Do you think this is the next financial crisis kicking off, Homer? Seems like we're more vulnerable now and talk of only protecting depositors this time... |
They have thrown investors under the bus without a blink ...which is fair enough but still | |
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| Banking problems in US on 13:44 - Mar 13 with 2664 views | homer_123 |
| Banking problems in US on 13:37 - Mar 13 by giant_stow |
Do you think this is the next financial crisis kicking off, Homer? Seems like we're more vulnerable now and talk of only protecting depositors this time... |
'...as things stand.'.
Time will tell. Certainly moves this side of the pond to deal directly with the SVB fallout.
Bear in mind they wanted to raise just shy of $2bn last week.....which sparked the downgrade and run.
Whether this goes further depends....hence my note above in the original reply.
Aramco, as an aside, has just announced profits of $161bn.... | |
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| Banking problems in US on 13:44 - Mar 13 with 2661 views | Daninthecampo |
It was all venture capital money going into tech start ups, crashing bond market alongside high inflation plus rising interest rates is never good within the tech market. No surprise there was an issue!
Our owners should be fine |  | | |
| Banking problems in US on 13:51 - Mar 13 with 2622 views | le2blue |
Unlikely. Given we're ultimately owned by a pension fund, the funds will be managed via banks and financial institutions at a different scale and risk than those that have encountered difficulties.
As well as having some poor operating processes, the run on SVB and problems at Signature and Silvergate are somewhat specific to the sectors that they all operate in, venture or growth tech-enabled sectors including crypto.
The business models of many of the businesses in these sectors have greater exposure to higher interest rates, given the current status of macroeconomics they have also had their business models, funding and valuations rightly questioned which impacts their ability to raise capital and ultimately squeezes liquidity. Not something a well-established pension fund will be exposed to in the same way. |  | | |
| Banking problems in US on 13:55 - Mar 13 with 2592 views | homer_123 |
| Banking problems in US on 13:51 - Mar 13 by le2blue |
Unlikely. Given we're ultimately owned by a pension fund, the funds will be managed via banks and financial institutions at a different scale and risk than those that have encountered difficulties.
As well as having some poor operating processes, the run on SVB and problems at Signature and Silvergate are somewhat specific to the sectors that they all operate in, venture or growth tech-enabled sectors including crypto.
The business models of many of the businesses in these sectors have greater exposure to higher interest rates, given the current status of macroeconomics they have also had their business models, funding and valuations rightly questioned which impacts their ability to raise capital and ultimately squeezes liquidity. Not something a well-established pension fund will be exposed to in the same way. |
And SVB went something like 8 months without a CRO.... | |
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| Banking problems in US on 14:00 - Mar 13 with 2541 views | le2blue |
| Banking problems in US on 13:55 - Mar 13 by homer_123 |
And SVB went something like 8 months without a CRO.... |
Always amazed that this isn't as unusual as most would think. From my experience, the UK division was more well-run than its US cousins. | | | |
| Banking problems in US on 14:01 - Mar 13 with 2540 views | blueislander |
| Banking problems in US on 13:55 - Mar 13 by homer_123 |
And SVB went something like 8 months without a CRO.... |
The problem with tech companies is that for several years they have after inception they have no income, and their value is based on ideas, and theories which are not actually being commercialized. This was what caused the dot com bubble to burst earlier this century. | | | |
| Banking problems in US on 14:11 - Mar 13 with 2454 views | clive_baker |
| Banking problems in US on 14:00 - Mar 13 by le2blue |
Always amazed that this isn't as unusual as most would think. From my experience, the UK division was more well-run than its US cousins. |
The UK sub was also completely ring fenced from the US, the US business couldn't take cash out of the UK. That doesn't stop the panic of course, and the run on the bank. I know and work with a number of people in this space who have been impacted, about 50% had terms that dictated they couldn't withdraw their funds for 30 days. A large minority were worse than that, some I spoke to was up to 270 days. So while many tried to act as quickly as they could on Thursday, there wasn't much they could do to actually physically get their money back.
Swift intervention though and HSBC acquisition here offers protection and brings a sense of calm. They will be able to get their money tomorrow should they still want it. I don't think there will be implications for the wider sector, but might (and has) been some contagion impact on other, likeminded regional banks. At the risk of this being my Michael Fish moment this will be chip paper pretty soon. |  |
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| Banking problems in US on 14:11 - Mar 13 with 2458 views | le2blue |
| Banking problems in US on 14:01 - Mar 13 by blueislander |
The problem with tech companies is that for several years they have after inception they have no income, and their value is based on ideas, and theories which are not actually being commercialized. This was what caused the dot com bubble to burst earlier this century. |
What we're seeing though is the natural outcome of a venture cycle when the market moves. The whole premise of venture capital is that it's based on placing lots of bets and getting enough upside on those that come off to cover your losses and some...when times change (consumer sentiment and interest rates) and those bets become riskier you then see the failures and capital move elsewhere. What we're seeing now is some of the infrastructure (banks) which have helped the sector also come under scrutiny. It's been a brutal 18 months and will continue for some time as a lot of the risker businesses fail.
Crypto or Emperor's new clothes as it should have been called, will continue to get absolutely hosed. Then it will re-emerge and actually solve consumer problems rather than a Ponzi scheme. | | | |
| Banking problems in US on 14:16 - Mar 13 with 2423 views | le2blue |
| Banking problems in US on 14:11 - Mar 13 by clive_baker |
The UK sub was also completely ring fenced from the US, the US business couldn't take cash out of the UK. That doesn't stop the panic of course, and the run on the bank. I know and work with a number of people in this space who have been impacted, about 50% had terms that dictated they couldn't withdraw their funds for 30 days. A large minority were worse than that, some I spoke to was up to 270 days. So while many tried to act as quickly as they could on Thursday, there wasn't much they could do to actually physically get their money back.
Swift intervention though and HSBC acquisition here offers protection and brings a sense of calm. They will be able to get their money tomorrow should they still want it. I don't think there will be implications for the wider sector, but might (and has) been some contagion impact on other, likeminded regional banks. At the risk of this being my Michael Fish moment this will be chip paper pretty soon. |
Yeah, it was looking particularly bleak, especially if you have payroll this week.
Thankfully it's been averted. Whilst Rishi may not be getting boats and the health service right, he has acted decisively here in an area which he is qualified to sort so all credit to him and the Treasury. | | | |
| Banking problems in US on 14:17 - Mar 13 with 2418 views | Illinoisblue |
| Banking problems in US on 14:11 - Mar 13 by le2blue |
What we're seeing though is the natural outcome of a venture cycle when the market moves. The whole premise of venture capital is that it's based on placing lots of bets and getting enough upside on those that come off to cover your losses and some...when times change (consumer sentiment and interest rates) and those bets become riskier you then see the failures and capital move elsewhere. What we're seeing now is some of the infrastructure (banks) which have helped the sector also come under scrutiny. It's been a brutal 18 months and will continue for some time as a lot of the risker businesses fail.
Crypto or Emperor's new clothes as it should have been called, will continue to get absolutely hosed. Then it will re-emerge and actually solve consumer problems rather than a Ponzi scheme. |
Re your last point, what problems will crypto solve? |  |
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| Banking problems in US on 14:18 - Mar 13 with 2417 views | clive_baker |
| Banking problems in US on 14:11 - Mar 13 by le2blue |
What we're seeing though is the natural outcome of a venture cycle when the market moves. The whole premise of venture capital is that it's based on placing lots of bets and getting enough upside on those that come off to cover your losses and some...when times change (consumer sentiment and interest rates) and those bets become riskier you then see the failures and capital move elsewhere. What we're seeing now is some of the infrastructure (banks) which have helped the sector also come under scrutiny. It's been a brutal 18 months and will continue for some time as a lot of the risker businesses fail.
Crypto or Emperor's new clothes as it should have been called, will continue to get absolutely hosed. Then it will re-emerge and actually solve consumer problems rather than a Ponzi scheme. |
It never ceases to stagger me how easy VC capital has been to get for so long now. I personally know people that have raised seed investment, pre revenue achieving £10m+ valuations. Very basic due diligence, flimsy decks that aren't particularly considered, for little more than ideas, even without a MVP.
As you say if you've got a lot of money to spend and you're not going to earn anything keeping it in the bank, as well as some very compelling incentives to invest, you might as well write some cheques. Those dynamics change when consumer sentiment shifts and you can make some interest on your money in the bank instead. | |
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| Banking problems in US on 14:22 - Mar 13 with 2385 views | Perublue |
Western Alliance down 84% I'm wondering if this is going to be allowed to fall even after Biden said none will....based in Phoenix. | |
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| Banking problems in US on 14:40 - Mar 13 with 2326 views | le2blue |
| Banking problems in US on 14:17 - Mar 13 by Illinoisblue |
Re your last point, what problems will crypto solve? |
Good question, maybe one to ask ChatGPT :)
There is some cool stuff happening in things like gaming, using blockchain and NFT's, which will really improve the experience, and also 'behind the scenes' in payments, financial services and identity. But Crypto needs to lose all the speculators and crap that goes with it today.
Having an unregulated currency which is marketed as an investment class has just not been a good idea, especially when you have joe public involved who does not understand the risks. A comparatively small number of people have made a serious amount of money from crypto, which means that a lot of people have lost a lot. | | | |
| Banking problems in US on 15:29 - Mar 13 with 2076 views | BlueBadger |
| Banking problems in US on 14:17 - Mar 13 by Illinoisblue |
Re your last point, what problems will crypto solve? |
Difficulties in money laundering, mostly. |  |
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| Banking problems in US on 16:13 - Mar 13 with 1935 views | DinDjarin |
| Banking problems in US on 14:17 - Mar 13 by Illinoisblue |
Re your last point, what problems will crypto solve? |
Crypto will come and go but the clever tech is the blockchain it sits on.
This is already massively used in the Health and Logistics areas and is going to be huge in the Financial markets over the next 5 years especially around SME's being able to get funding which is not available via traditional banking routes.
Web3 / DeFi / Blockchain is here to stay and will only grow and grow. |  | | |
| Banking problems in US on 16:22 - Mar 13 with 1899 views | StokieBlue |
| Banking problems in US on 16:13 - Mar 13 by DinDjarin |
Crypto will come and go but the clever tech is the blockchain it sits on.
This is already massively used in the Health and Logistics areas and is going to be huge in the Financial markets over the next 5 years especially around SME's being able to get funding which is not available via traditional banking routes.
Web3 / DeFi / Blockchain is here to stay and will only grow and grow. |
You said pretty much the same thing a few years back and yet here we are still waiting.
The issue is that Blockchain tech doesn't really solve real world problems any better than what was previously available and what has come since. In fact it usually introduces complexity and latency where there doesn't need to be any.
It's usually those with vested interests who continually talk it up, understandably I guess.
SB |  | | |
| Banking problems in US on 16:33 - Mar 13 with 1826 views | BlueBadger |
| Banking problems in US on 16:13 - Mar 13 by DinDjarin |
Crypto will come and go but the clever tech is the blockchain it sits on.
This is already massively used in the Health and Logistics areas and is going to be huge in the Financial markets over the next 5 years especially around SME's being able to get funding which is not available via traditional banking routes.
Web3 / DeFi / Blockchain is here to stay and will only grow and grow. |
Was 'real world' solutions does blockchain offer?
All it does is provide a home for NFT and bitcoin scams. | |
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| Banking problems in US on 16:49 - Mar 13 with 1768 views | braveblue |
Why would that be the case? Nothing to do with them. | | | |
| Banking problems in US on 20:02 - Mar 13 with 1452 views | DinDjarin |
| Banking problems in US on 16:22 - Mar 13 by StokieBlue |
You said pretty much the same thing a few years back and yet here we are still waiting.
The issue is that Blockchain tech doesn't really solve real world problems any better than what was previously available and what has come since. In fact it usually introduces complexity and latency where there doesn't need to be any.
It's usually those with vested interests who continually talk it up, understandably I guess.
SB |
Waiting? Look around, all big business are incorporating blockchain tech.
Just because you cannot see it does not mean it does not exist.
And it was last yr not a few yrs. [Post edited 13 Mar 2023 20:04]
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| Banking problems in US on 20:03 - Mar 13 with 1445 views | DinDjarin |
| Banking problems in US on 16:33 - Mar 13 by BlueBadger |
Was 'real world' solutions does blockchain offer?
All it does is provide a home for NFT and bitcoin scams. |
Yep. Course it does.
Do you know blockchain is not crypto? I guess you do but there ya go. | | | |
| Banking problems in US on 20:10 - Mar 13 with 1423 views | StokieBlue |
| Banking problems in US on 20:02 - Mar 13 by DinDjarin |
Waiting? Look around, all big business are incorporating blockchain tech.
Just because you cannot see it does not mean it does not exist.
And it was last yr not a few yrs. [Post edited 13 Mar 2023 20:04]
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Can you provide some examples of "all big businesses" incorporating Blockchain technology into something important?
I know that many large institutions don't take it seriously, it's an interesting concept but it's far from being anywhere near actual important infrastructure because of the reasons I already outlined.
SB [Post edited 13 Mar 2023 20:14]
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