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How many Palestinian lives is sufficient? 19:54 - Nov 2 with 290021 viewsnoggin

Yeah but Owen Jones...
[Post edited 3 Nov 2023 9:05]

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How many Palastinian lives is sufficiant? on 20:51 - Nov 2 with 49000 viewsNthQldITFC

It's hard to disagree with any of that. You can't destroy an ideology or a freedom movement or whatever you want to call it with bombs, you only make it stronger.

Surely an internationally enforced two state solution is the only sane solution, and this is not the way to get to that peaceful outcome.

# WE ARE STEALING THE FUTURE FROM OUR CHILDREN --- WE MUST CHANGE COURSE #
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How many Palastinian lives is sufficiant? on 21:06 - Nov 2 with 48957 viewsBanksterDebtSlave

Majd Souri, 7, was terrified by the explosions, said his father Ramez Souri.

He missed playing football with his school friends. He was devastated that the war had cancelled his Christian family’s much-anticipated trip to Nazareth, the town in Israel where tradition says Jesus grew up.

“Baba, where can we go?” Majd asked again and again when airstrikes roared. The family, devout members of Gaza’s tiny Christian community, finally had an answer — St. Porphyrius Greek Orthodox Church in Gaza City.

Souri said his son calmed down when they arrived at the church, where dozens of Christian families had taken shelter. Together, they prayed and sang.

On 20 October shrapnel crashed into the monastery, killing 18 people. Among the dead were Majd and his siblings, 9-year-old Julie and 15-year-old Soheil. Israel says it had been targeting a nearby Hamas command centre.

Majd was found beneath the rubble with his hands around his mother’s neck. His face was completely burned.

“My children just wanted peace and stability,” said Souri, his voice cracking. “All I cared about was that they were happy.”

"They break our legs and tell us to be grateful when they offer us crutches."
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How many Palastinian lives is sufficiant? on 21:14 - Nov 2 with 48945 viewsDJR

This, from the Guardian, seems extremely callous behaviour from the Foreign Office given all that UK citizens in Gaza have suffered.

"Another person waiting to be evacuated from Gaza said the Foreign Office had told him that the British government would pay for two nights’ accommodation in Cairo but would not facilitate flights.

The Londoner, who did not want to be named, said he received a message saying: “Once you have passed into Egypt, we will provide you transport to Cairo and two nights’ accommodation should you need it. We are not facilitating flights from Egypt at this time.”

In another message sent on Thursday afternoon, the rapid deployment team messaged the man saying: “We can offer some support with planning your onward travel but we are not at present facilitating flights from Cairo to the UK – this is at your own cost.”"
[Post edited 2 Nov 2023 21:16]
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How many Palastinian lives is sufficiant? on 21:16 - Nov 2 with 48917 viewsnoggin

How many Palastinian lives is sufficiant? on 20:51 - Nov 2 by NthQldITFC

It's hard to disagree with any of that. You can't destroy an ideology or a freedom movement or whatever you want to call it with bombs, you only make it stronger.

Surely an internationally enforced two state solution is the only sane solution, and this is not the way to get to that peaceful outcome.


If only America agreed with you.

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How many Palastinian lives is sufficiant? on 21:17 - Nov 2 with 48895 viewsnoggin

How many Palastinian lives is sufficiant? on 21:14 - Nov 2 by DJR

This, from the Guardian, seems extremely callous behaviour from the Foreign Office given all that UK citizens in Gaza have suffered.

"Another person waiting to be evacuated from Gaza said the Foreign Office had told him that the British government would pay for two nights’ accommodation in Cairo but would not facilitate flights.

The Londoner, who did not want to be named, said he received a message saying: “Once you have passed into Egypt, we will provide you transport to Cairo and two nights’ accommodation should you need it. We are not facilitating flights from Egypt at this time.”

In another message sent on Thursday afternoon, the rapid deployment team messaged the man saying: “We can offer some support with planning your onward travel but we are not at present facilitating flights from Cairo to the UK – this is at your own cost.”"
[Post edited 2 Nov 2023 21:16]


Unbelieveable.

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How many Palastinian lives is sufficiant? on 21:18 - Nov 2 with 48886 viewsBanksterDebtSlave

1h ago21.27 GMT

Palestinian women are being forced to give birth without anaesthesia, undergoing caesareans whilst awake and without pain killers amid intense bombardment of the Gaza Strip, an international charity has warned.

In a statement, ActionAid said it was “very concerned” about a lack of clean water contributing to a rise in sickness and a lack of hygiene, alongside the “serious deterioration in living conditions” across the Palestinian territory.

What little aid is “trickling” into Gaza will “barely touch the sides” of the humanitarian crisis that is unfolding in Gaza, it said.

It described the situation for hospitals in northern Gaza as particularly “precarious”, with Al-Quds and Al-Shifa hospitals not receiving any aid supplies at all due to ongoing hostilities.

“The chaos and horror unleashed in Gaza is affecting women in devastating ways,” Soraida Hussein-Sabbah, a gender and advocay specialist based in Ramallah ActionAid, said.

Every day we hear of doctors delivering the babies of women who are dying in childbirth. It is catastrophic

"They break our legs and tell us to be grateful when they offer us crutches."
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How many Palastinian lives is sufficiant? on 21:19 - Nov 2 with 48897 viewsfactual_blue

How many Palastinian lives is sufficiant? on 20:51 - Nov 2 by NthQldITFC

It's hard to disagree with any of that. You can't destroy an ideology or a freedom movement or whatever you want to call it with bombs, you only make it stronger.

Surely an internationally enforced two state solution is the only sane solution, and this is not the way to get to that peaceful outcome.


Responding in a grotesquely over-the-top version of an eye for an eye suggests a regime stuck in a deranged and cruel version of ancient history, not a modern democratic state.

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How many Palastinian lives is sufficiant? on 21:31 - Nov 2 with 48820 viewsnoggin

How many Palastinian lives is sufficiant? on 21:19 - Nov 2 by factual_blue

Responding in a grotesquely over-the-top version of an eye for an eye suggests a regime stuck in a deranged and cruel version of ancient history, not a modern democratic state.


Interesting to see who doesn't agree with this.

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How many Palastinian lives is sufficiant? on 21:34 - Nov 2 with 48802 viewsfactual_blue

How many Palastinian lives is sufficiant? on 21:31 - Nov 2 by noggin

Interesting to see who doesn't agree with this.


Only hardline zionists, I'd like to think.
[Post edited 2 Nov 2023 21:35]

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How many Palastinian lives is sufficiant? on 22:03 - Nov 2 with 48759 viewsGuthrum

How many Palastinian lives is sufficiant? on 21:31 - Nov 2 by noggin

Interesting to see who doesn't agree with this.


It's not that I disagree with it. Of course the killing must stop, it's already gone on too long and I don't believe the way Israel is conducting operations is even effective to achieve the ends they claim.

But a ceasefire is only the start. How is it to be enforced? The UN is currently about as much use as a wet paper bag. Who provides peacekeepers which would be acceptable to both sides? How do you persuade the Israelis to stop? How do you ensure that Hamas and all its splinter groups stop? How do you force the release of the hostages (or return of bodies)? How do you supply Gaza if Israel won't (a distinct possibility)?

This situation was not simple even before October 7th. It is even less so now.

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How many Palastinian lives is sufficiant? on 22:47 - Nov 2 with 48665 viewspositivity

How many Palastinian lives is sufficiant? on 21:19 - Nov 2 by factual_blue

Responding in a grotesquely over-the-top version of an eye for an eye suggests a regime stuck in a deranged and cruel version of ancient history, not a modern democratic state.


it's not an eye for an eye, it's far worse than that, nothing to do with judaism...

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How many Palastinian lives is sufficiant? on 22:50 - Nov 2 with 48657 viewspositivity

How many Palastinian lives is sufficiant? on 21:34 - Nov 2 by factual_blue

Only hardline zionists, I'd like to think.
[Post edited 2 Nov 2023 21:35]


isn't a zionist just someone who believes that the jewish people should have a state?

this is far beyond zionism

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How many Palastinian lives is sufficiant? on 23:11 - Nov 2 with 48561 viewsredrickstuhaart

How many Palastinian lives is sufficiant? on 22:47 - Nov 2 by positivity

it's not an eye for an eye, it's far worse than that, nothing to do with judaism...


It is far too easy to start saying its not about the religions involved.

They are fundamental.
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How many Palastinian lives is sufficiant? on 23:37 - Nov 2 with 48514 viewsmatteoblue

How many Palastinian lives is sufficiant? on 20:51 - Nov 2 by NthQldITFC

It's hard to disagree with any of that. You can't destroy an ideology or a freedom movement or whatever you want to call it with bombs, you only make it stronger.

Surely an internationally enforced two state solution is the only sane solution, and this is not the way to get to that peaceful outcome.


Would you be happy sharing a country with people who decapitate babies for fun? That should give you a clue to how possible a 'two-state solution' might be.

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How many Palastinian lives is sufficiant? on 23:42 - Nov 2 with 48507 viewsredrickstuhaart

How many Palastinian lives is sufficiant? on 23:37 - Nov 2 by matteoblue

Would you be happy sharing a country with people who decapitate babies for fun? That should give you a clue to how possible a 'two-state solution' might be.


No happier than I would be sharing a country with people who bulldoze my families' homes and oppress me.

But share, they must.
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How many Palastinian lives is sufficiant? on 06:48 - Nov 3 with 48310 viewsibbleobble

How many Palastinian lives is sufficiant? on 21:19 - Nov 2 by factual_blue

Responding in a grotesquely over-the-top version of an eye for an eye suggests a regime stuck in a deranged and cruel version of ancient history, not a modern democratic state.


Well said. With an estimated figure of between 7 - 9,000 people dead in Gaza and 3,000 of them children, it’s fair to say there is no respect for life or international law from the Israeli regime in its quest to “eradicate Hamas”. So, without wishing to be provocative I think it’s also fair to ask the question, how many of its own citizens would it sacrifice to wipe Hamas off the face of the earth? There will be retribution for the slaughter of 3,000 children so the idea that it’s protecting Israeli’s is an illogical, deplorable lie that should not be tolerated or entertained a day longer.
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How many Palastinian lives is sufficiant? on 07:22 - Nov 3 with 48221 viewsMattinLondon

How many Palastinian lives is sufficiant? on 23:37 - Nov 2 by matteoblue

Would you be happy sharing a country with people who decapitate babies for fun? That should give you a clue to how possible a 'two-state solution' might be.


Have those reports of babies being decapitated been confirmed?
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How many Palastinian lives is sufficiant? on 07:39 - Nov 3 with 48181 viewsBanksterDebtSlave

How many Palastinian lives is sufficiant? on 07:22 - Nov 3 by MattinLondon

Have those reports of babies being decapitated been confirmed?


Whatever the reality on the detail of any individual atrocities it is the fact that it has been used to frame the current ongoing treatment of all Gazans by the military might of the Israeli State and its allies that is the issue. Nothing can justify this.
Talk of it being done to rescue hostages is for la-la land too.

"They break our legs and tell us to be grateful when they offer us crutches."
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How many Palastinian lives is sufficiant? on 07:45 - Nov 3 with 48129 viewsGlasgowBlue

How many Palastinian lives is sufficiant? on 07:22 - Nov 3 by MattinLondon

Have those reports of babies being decapitated been confirmed?


Yes. They were also burned alive and had limbs cut off and left to die. There are graphic images out there of decapitated babies that I certainly wouldn't post on TWTD.

"The Jerusalem Post can now confirm based on verified photos of the bodies that the reports of babies being burnt and decapitated in Hamas's assault on Kfar Aza are correct".

https://www.jpost.com/breaking-news/article-767951

Trigger warning. The following article contains images of burned bodies.

https://themedialine.org/top-stories/evidence-on-display-at-israels-forensic-pat

"Kugel also explained that the age range of the victims spans from 3 months to 80 or 90 years old. Many bodies, including those of babies, are without heads".



There is also footage of a pregnant woman was filmed cut open, slapped in the face to stay awake while her baby beheaded in front of her. But I am unable to bring myself to watch this.



"There is evidence of mass rape of so brutal that they broke their victims’ pelvis – women, grandmothers, children."


The absolute barbarity of 7/11 is unimaginable.

But I'm wary of this thread turning into a tit for tat. This is a thread on innocent Palestinians being killed. What happened on October 7 doesn't justify that. It does however, justify the complete annihilation of Hamas.

Edit. Not suggesting that you were starting tit for tat. That was an earlier poster who brought up the babies. I don’t believe the actions of Hamas represent the majority of Palestinians who just want to live in peace.
[Post edited 3 Nov 2023 8:19]

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How many Israelis and Palestinians must die before this stops ? on 07:49 - Nov 3 with 48072 viewsWeWereZombies

How many Palastinian lives is sufficiant? on 07:22 - Nov 3 by MattinLondon

Have those reports of babies being decapitated been confirmed?


Not having seen the video of the 7th October atrocity that the Israeli Defence Force issued I cannot say for sure but the descriptions were of damaged necks and severe lacerations suggesting the use of knives. Whether the intention was to symbolically behead or just collateral damage (I hated typing that) in a frenzied attack I don't know but, having seen a march in Tunisia during the Jasmine Revolution and had the methods of 'psyching up' protesters (but the Hamas agents are on a for more extreme level than decent young men fighting for rights) explained to me I doubt that it was done for 'fun'. It would have required conditioning a lot more severe than the parade ground in my opinion.
[Post edited 3 Nov 2023 20:51]

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How many Palastinian lives is sufficiant? on 07:50 - Nov 3 with 48131 viewsDarth_Koont

How many Palastinian lives is sufficiant? on 23:37 - Nov 2 by matteoblue

Would you be happy sharing a country with people who decapitate babies for fun? That should give you a clue to how possible a 'two-state solution' might be.


Let’s not tar the Palestinian people with that particular brush. It’s dehumanising. I don’t think Palestinians would want to live alongside the genocidal extremists on the other side either but they’re not very representative of the wider Israeli population.

The key is to stop this conflict being shaped by extremism and focusing on the Israeli and Palestinian civilians who have far more in common than the labels and the forces that separate them.

Pronouns: He/Him

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How many Palastinian lives is sufficiant? on 07:51 - Nov 3 with 48113 viewsRyorry

How many Palastinian lives is sufficiant? on 07:22 - Nov 3 by MattinLondon

Have those reports of babies being decapitated been confirmed?


Yes - as I have now posted twice. Look back through my posts and you will see the evidence I linked.

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How many Palastinian lives is sufficiant? on 07:56 - Nov 3 with 48128 viewsDarth_Koont

How many Palastinian lives is sufficiant? on 07:45 - Nov 3 by GlasgowBlue

Yes. They were also burned alive and had limbs cut off and left to die. There are graphic images out there of decapitated babies that I certainly wouldn't post on TWTD.

"The Jerusalem Post can now confirm based on verified photos of the bodies that the reports of babies being burnt and decapitated in Hamas's assault on Kfar Aza are correct".

https://www.jpost.com/breaking-news/article-767951

Trigger warning. The following article contains images of burned bodies.

https://themedialine.org/top-stories/evidence-on-display-at-israels-forensic-pat

"Kugel also explained that the age range of the victims spans from 3 months to 80 or 90 years old. Many bodies, including those of babies, are without heads".



There is also footage of a pregnant woman was filmed cut open, slapped in the face to stay awake while her baby beheaded in front of her. But I am unable to bring myself to watch this.



"There is evidence of mass rape of so brutal that they broke their victims’ pelvis – women, grandmothers, children."


The absolute barbarity of 7/11 is unimaginable.

But I'm wary of this thread turning into a tit for tat. This is a thread on innocent Palestinians being killed. What happened on October 7 doesn't justify that. It does however, justify the complete annihilation of Hamas.

Edit. Not suggesting that you were starting tit for tat. That was an earlier poster who brought up the babies. I don’t believe the actions of Hamas represent the majority of Palestinians who just want to live in peace.
[Post edited 3 Nov 2023 8:19]


There is no justification for the “complete annihilation” of Hamas. As that necessarily will mean the death of tens of thousands of innocent civilians. Maybe even wiping Gaza off the map completely.

Of course, Hamas must be stopped and marginalised but that means dialogue and negotiation. That, as we know only too well ourselves in Northern Ireland, is the way to destroy terrorism.

Pronouns: He/Him

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How many Palastinian lives is sufficiant? on 08:03 - Nov 3 with 48079 viewsRyorry

How many Palastinian lives is sufficiant? on 22:03 - Nov 2 by Guthrum

It's not that I disagree with it. Of course the killing must stop, it's already gone on too long and I don't believe the way Israel is conducting operations is even effective to achieve the ends they claim.

But a ceasefire is only the start. How is it to be enforced? The UN is currently about as much use as a wet paper bag. Who provides peacekeepers which would be acceptable to both sides? How do you persuade the Israelis to stop? How do you ensure that Hamas and all its splinter groups stop? How do you force the release of the hostages (or return of bodies)? How do you supply Gaza if Israel won't (a distinct possibility)?

This situation was not simple even before October 7th. It is even less so now.


If Hamas truly wanted some progress on the whole ghastly situation instead of avowing to “wipe Israel off the face of the earth”, they could release the hostages. Why don’t they do that?

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How many Palastinian lives is sufficiant? on 08:05 - Nov 3 with 48065 viewsDJR

This paragraph, from the Guardian, indicates the US isn't putting any restraint on Israeli action.

"The US will not seek to impose any conditions on the support it gives Israel to defend itself in the wake of the Hamas attacks of 7 October, vice-president Kamala Harris said on Thursday. She refused to comment on Israel’s bombing of the Jabalia refugee camp, adding: “We are not telling Israel how it should conduct this war.”"

This is clearly the UK government and opposition line also, and will be so long as the US doesn't soften its stance.

All the US appears to be pursuing is a brief pause for humanitarian reasons. But they voted against this a couple of weeks ago, and I get the sense they have only changed their stance because of the diplomatic consequences in the Arab world of what is going on.

And where the US goes on pauses, so goes the main UK political parties.

Incidentally, this must be a unique conflict in the sense that people are trapped in such a small war zone and have nowhere to go. I can't think of any parallel because, for example, many people suffering in the Syrian war were able to escape the conflict if they wanted to.
[Post edited 3 Nov 2023 8:10]
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