| The world has gone mad (part 78,957) - Trump to win by a landslide Iowa caucus 13:50 - Jan 15 with 13200 views | unstableblue |
Just consider this:
1) Trump hired a group of lawyers to prove the election was 'rigged', they reported no evidence. He hired a second group to do the same, and not only did they not find any evidence on wrongdoing, they turned into an-anti Trump group highlighting the fallacy of Trump's position.
2) Trump is facing 91 felony charges across 4 prosecutions
3) He without doubt instigated the Capitol insurrection
He has lied 1000s of times, and on all of the issues above. He is out of control in court, seemingly thinking he has impunity. He has radicalised huge swathes of the American public to be anti-State.
If he is put up against Biden.. he will A) Win and/or B) further radicalise and polarise the American population.
Trump for me is one of the maddest events/movements we have ever seen in our lifetimes.
BONKERS |  |
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| The world has gone mad (part 78,957) - Trump to win by a landslide Iowa caucus on 10:58 - Jan 16 with 1587 views | DanTheMan |
| The world has gone mad (part 78,957) - Trump to win by a landslide Iowa caucus on 10:28 - Jan 16 by Europablue |
Here's the dictionary definition "a person, typically one more remote than a grandparent, from whom one is descended."
We have a proud history in Britain. Yes, we built on past civilizations like the ancient Greeks, and America took on some of the best of our enlightenment thinking.
Parents and grandparents are also considered ancestors.
My grandfather fought in WW2 against Nazis and Fascists. All of my grandparents were hardworking and were very family-oriented. Obviously, there are some things that they believed that I disagree with, but the point is that they and the collective people of Britain have handed down a cultural legacy and we should think very carefully before we discard anything. It's not to say that young people don't have value and things can't be changed.
Young British people have a duty to build on those strong foundations in the spirit of an open society with the principles of fair play. |
You've written a few times about people being "family-oriented" or having "family values". Can you define what you mean as it's a fairly wishy-washy term? |  |
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| The world has gone mad (part 78,957) - Trump to win by a landslide Iowa caucus on 11:15 - Jan 16 with 1548 views | Europablue |
| The world has gone mad (part 78,957) - Trump to win by a landslide Iowa caucus on 10:54 - Jan 16 by StokieBlue |
Can I ask why you say "we have a proud history in Britain" whilst continually writing in American English?
SB |
Can you point to any examples of what you consider American English. I'm from Essex, I haven't lived in the UK for about 10 years, I live in Germany now. |  | | |
| The world has gone mad (part 78,957) - Trump to win by a landslide Iowa caucus on 11:26 - Jan 16 with 1530 views | Europablue |
| The world has gone mad (part 78,957) - Trump to win by a landslide Iowa caucus on 10:58 - Jan 16 by DanTheMan |
You've written a few times about people being "family-oriented" or having "family values". Can you define what you mean as it's a fairly wishy-washy term? |
Thank you for a direct question related to what I actually said.
I personally position family in contrast to the individual, so thinking of others over self-indulgence.
You could also liken it to how Ipswich is often referred to as a family club.
There is just too much selfishness in the world and too many people obsessed with material things and self-actualization.
My idea of family includes extended family, but also long-term friends who you consider family.
I think society should be built around what is best for children, but also room for adult recreational activities. We should be caring for the elderly and those less fortunate. | | | |
| The world has gone mad (part 78,957) - Trump to win by a landslide Iowa caucus on 11:38 - Jan 16 with 1509 views | leitrimblue |
| The world has gone mad (part 78,957) - Trump to win by a landslide Iowa caucus on 10:28 - Jan 16 by Europablue |
Here's the dictionary definition "a person, typically one more remote than a grandparent, from whom one is descended."
We have a proud history in Britain. Yes, we built on past civilizations like the ancient Greeks, and America took on some of the best of our enlightenment thinking.
Parents and grandparents are also considered ancestors.
My grandfather fought in WW2 against Nazis and Fascists. All of my grandparents were hardworking and were very family-oriented. Obviously, there are some things that they believed that I disagree with, but the point is that they and the collective people of Britain have handed down a cultural legacy and we should think very carefully before we discard anything. It's not to say that young people don't have value and things can't be changed.
Young British people have a duty to build on those strong foundations in the spirit of an open society with the principles of fair play. |
Interesting enough views Europa, though I do have a few queries.
For instance what do the Ancient Greeks have to do with Britain's proud history?
What do you mean by ' the collective people of Britain have handed down a cultural legacy and we should think very carefully before we discard anything? |  | | |
| The world has gone mad (part 78,957) - Trump to win by a landslide Iowa caucus on 11:41 - Jan 16 with 1490 views | nodge_blue |
| The world has gone mad (part 78,957) - Trump to win by a landslide Iowa caucus on 11:26 - Jan 16 by Europablue |
Thank you for a direct question related to what I actually said.
I personally position family in contrast to the individual, so thinking of others over self-indulgence.
You could also liken it to how Ipswich is often referred to as a family club.
There is just too much selfishness in the world and too many people obsessed with material things and self-actualization.
My idea of family includes extended family, but also long-term friends who you consider family.
I think society should be built around what is best for children, but also room for adult recreational activities. We should be caring for the elderly and those less fortunate. |
"There is just too much selfishness in the world and too many people obsessed with material things and self-actualization."
Yet you say that Trump is preferable to Biden when Trump is the epitome of your sentence. |  |
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| The world has gone mad (part 78,957) - Trump to win by a landslide Iowa caucus on 11:47 - Jan 16 with 1467 views | DanTheMan |
| The world has gone mad (part 78,957) - Trump to win by a landslide Iowa caucus on 11:26 - Jan 16 by Europablue |
Thank you for a direct question related to what I actually said.
I personally position family in contrast to the individual, so thinking of others over self-indulgence.
You could also liken it to how Ipswich is often referred to as a family club.
There is just too much selfishness in the world and too many people obsessed with material things and self-actualization.
My idea of family includes extended family, but also long-term friends who you consider family.
I think society should be built around what is best for children, but also room for adult recreational activities. We should be caring for the elderly and those less fortunate. |
I fail to see how Ron DeSantis represents family-values in that case, the modern Republicans seem to be very much individualistic. Are there any particular policies you can point at that explain further what you mean? I'm just struggling to see it. | |
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| The world has gone mad (part 78,957) - Trump to win by a landslide Iowa caucus on 11:51 - Jan 16 with 1454 views | Europablue |
| The world has gone mad (part 78,957) - Trump to win by a landslide Iowa caucus on 11:38 - Jan 16 by leitrimblue |
Interesting enough views Europa, though I do have a few queries.
For instance what do the Ancient Greeks have to do with Britain's proud history?
What do you mean by ' the collective people of Britain have handed down a cultural legacy and we should think very carefully before we discard anything? |
Someone else mentioned the Greeks. I just agreed that we learnt from the Greeks, just like we have learnt from all civilizations that have come before us. The Greeks had a huge impact on the Romans and the Romans had a huge effect on us.
There is a theory about fences called Chesterton's Fence "Chesterton's Fence is a simple rule of thumb that suggests that you should never destroy a fence, change a rule, or do away with a tradition until you understand why it's there in the first place. The principle assumes that fences have a purpose, were carefully planned, and cost time and money to erect."
I basically subscribe to that concept. It is natural for children to think they know everything about the world, but the difference is when I was a clueless know-it-all kid, the whole of society did not defer and pander to me.
I was born into what I viewed as a free country, we have made some improvements like we have better food now, but a lot of the other changes that seemed good at the time or on the surface have had some pretty bad unanticipated effects on society. | | | |
| The world has gone mad (part 78,957) - Trump to win by a landslide Iowa caucus on 11:56 - Jan 16 with 1434 views | Europablue |
| The world has gone mad (part 78,957) - Trump to win by a landslide Iowa caucus on 11:41 - Jan 16 by nodge_blue |
"There is just too much selfishness in the world and too many people obsessed with material things and self-actualization."
Yet you say that Trump is preferable to Biden when Trump is the epitome of your sentence. |
Did you read what I said about Biden? I think he's dangerous as there is effectively a power vacuum. Whilst I do have an opinion and care about what happens in America, I'm most interested in what the US president means for international relations and stability.
One of the good things about Trump getting reelected is that he wouldn't be running for office again, so we can finally stop talking about him. | | | |
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| The world has gone mad (part 78,957) - Trump to win by a landslide Iowa caucus on 12:05 - Jan 16 with 1409 views | positivity |
| The world has gone mad (part 78,957) - Trump to win by a landslide Iowa caucus on 11:56 - Jan 16 by Europablue |
Did you read what I said about Biden? I think he's dangerous as there is effectively a power vacuum. Whilst I do have an opinion and care about what happens in America, I'm most interested in what the US president means for international relations and stability.
One of the good things about Trump getting reelected is that he wouldn't be running for office again, so we can finally stop talking about him. |
if you're interested in international relations and stability, trump would be a complete disaster on that.
the difference between trump and biden is that biden works with a team, trump will quickly get rid of anyone who disagrees. there will be no adults at the top, a complete power vacuum.
trump's isolationalism would mean all brakes on the likes of russia and israel would be off again. all work on combatting climate change would be halted, which is probably the biggest danger for stability. | |
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| The world has gone mad (part 78,957) - Trump to win by a landslide Iowa caucus on 12:11 - Jan 16 with 1395 views | Europablue |
| The world has gone mad (part 78,957) - Trump to win by a landslide Iowa caucus on 11:47 - Jan 16 by DanTheMan |
I fail to see how Ron DeSantis represents family-values in that case, the modern Republicans seem to be very much individualistic. Are there any particular policies you can point at that explain further what you mean? I'm just struggling to see it. |
Again, it was a case of someone latching on to small point I made. I was just comparing the moral example of a comparison of Trump and DiSantis. I wasn't talking about specific policies, more that DiSantis appears to be a family man, whereas Trump, although he has a family, he also comes across as a philanderer. I don't know his policies inside out, but if you want one example it would be parental rights to be informed of issues with children at school. I have the impression that DiSantis believes that parental authority should not be usurped by the state. Aside from cases such as physical abuse, when it is appropriate for the state to intervene. | | | |
| The world has gone mad (part 78,957) - Trump to win by a landslide Iowa caucus on 12:26 - Jan 16 with 1370 views | nodge_blue |
| The world has gone mad (part 78,957) - Trump to win by a landslide Iowa caucus on 11:56 - Jan 16 by Europablue |
Did you read what I said about Biden? I think he's dangerous as there is effectively a power vacuum. Whilst I do have an opinion and care about what happens in America, I'm most interested in what the US president means for international relations and stability.
One of the good things about Trump getting reelected is that he wouldn't be running for office again, so we can finally stop talking about him. |
You made a bunch of arguments that vary from untrue through to contradictory.
But that's the internet for you. And I can't be that bothered to engage. | |
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| The world has gone mad (part 78,957) - Trump to win by a landslide Iowa caucus on 12:34 - Jan 16 with 1336 views | eireblue |
| The world has gone mad (part 78,957) - Trump to win by a landslide Iowa caucus on 10:28 - Jan 16 by Europablue |
Here's the dictionary definition "a person, typically one more remote than a grandparent, from whom one is descended."
We have a proud history in Britain. Yes, we built on past civilizations like the ancient Greeks, and America took on some of the best of our enlightenment thinking.
Parents and grandparents are also considered ancestors.
My grandfather fought in WW2 against Nazis and Fascists. All of my grandparents were hardworking and were very family-oriented. Obviously, there are some things that they believed that I disagree with, but the point is that they and the collective people of Britain have handed down a cultural legacy and we should think very carefully before we discard anything. It's not to say that young people don't have value and things can't be changed.
Young British people have a duty to build on those strong foundations in the spirit of an open society with the principles of fair play. |
Yea, so ancestors are not typically grandparents. Anyhoo
Everyone has a history they can claim they are proud of. You just ignore the bits you are not proud of.
Every culture has a cultural history and legacy, that isn’t saying, well anything. [Post edited 16 Jan 2024 13:19]
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| The world has gone mad (part 78,957) - Trump to win by a landslide Iowa caucus on 12:52 - Jan 16 with 1303 views | DanTheMan |
| The world has gone mad (part 78,957) - Trump to win by a landslide Iowa caucus on 12:11 - Jan 16 by Europablue |
Again, it was a case of someone latching on to small point I made. I was just comparing the moral example of a comparison of Trump and DiSantis. I wasn't talking about specific policies, more that DiSantis appears to be a family man, whereas Trump, although he has a family, he also comes across as a philanderer. I don't know his policies inside out, but if you want one example it would be parental rights to be informed of issues with children at school. I have the impression that DiSantis believes that parental authority should not be usurped by the state. Aside from cases such as physical abuse, when it is appropriate for the state to intervene. |
I think describing it as "issues" is doing a lot of work there when, if we're talking about the same act (Parental Rights Act), it seems primarily targeted at the LGBTQ+ community.
I've seen little in the way of other policies that suggest he's a man who likes to help others unless those others happen to align with his worldview and interests. | |
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| The world has gone mad (part 78,957) - Trump to win by a landslide Iowa caucus on 12:59 - Jan 16 with 1284 views | NthQldITFC |
| The world has gone mad (part 78,957) - Trump to win by a landslide Iowa caucus on 11:56 - Jan 16 by Europablue |
Did you read what I said about Biden? I think he's dangerous as there is effectively a power vacuum. Whilst I do have an opinion and care about what happens in America, I'm most interested in what the US president means for international relations and stability.
One of the good things about Trump getting reelected is that he wouldn't be running for office again, so we can finally stop talking about him. |
'One of the good things about Trump getting reelected is that he wouldn't be running for office again, so we can finally stop talking about him.'
 I just have to assume that you are saying that in jest, but there's a nagging part of my mind... |  |
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| The world has gone mad (part 78,957) - Trump to win by a landslide Iowa caucus on 13:09 - Jan 16 with 1270 views | leitrimblue |
| The world has gone mad (part 78,957) - Trump to win by a landslide Iowa caucus on 11:51 - Jan 16 by Europablue |
Someone else mentioned the Greeks. I just agreed that we learnt from the Greeks, just like we have learnt from all civilizations that have come before us. The Greeks had a huge impact on the Romans and the Romans had a huge effect on us.
There is a theory about fences called Chesterton's Fence "Chesterton's Fence is a simple rule of thumb that suggests that you should never destroy a fence, change a rule, or do away with a tradition until you understand why it's there in the first place. The principle assumes that fences have a purpose, were carefully planned, and cost time and money to erect."
I basically subscribe to that concept. It is natural for children to think they know everything about the world, but the difference is when I was a clueless know-it-all kid, the whole of society did not defer and pander to me.
I was born into what I viewed as a free country, we have made some improvements like we have better food now, but a lot of the other changes that seemed good at the time or on the surface have had some pretty bad unanticipated effects on society. |
Sorry, I missed the earlier discussion on Ancient Greece. Though I would add from a merely personal perspective that I think Roman influence on the UK as been greatly exaggerated. Don't get me wrong, they carried out some very worthwhile Civil engineering projects but the actual influence on our culture I'm not so sure. Think a lot of the perceived Ancient Rome and Greeces influence over the UK as more to do with public schoolboys obsession with the classics then any real cultural identification.
I think when you are discussing 'fences' what you are describing are cultural norms. Your right that in many ways it is these shared cultural norms that that in some way give us cultural, tribal or national identity. But it is completely normal for these cultural norms to be tested and adjusted continuously. Has they have been since the beginning of human grouping.
The cultural norms can not stay the same otherwise we would still have the same cultural views as our mesolithic or iron age ancestors. Who I'm pretty sure thought very differently from us.
What changes do you personally think have been bad for society I wonder?
Personally I'm far from convinced the adoption of agriculture and leaving behind our successful hunter gatherer past was such a wise move  | | | |
| The world has gone mad (part 78,957) - Trump to win by a landslide Iowa caucus on 13:16 - Jan 16 with 1238 views | NthQldITFC |
| The world has gone mad (part 78,957) - Trump to win by a landslide Iowa caucus on 13:09 - Jan 16 by leitrimblue |
Sorry, I missed the earlier discussion on Ancient Greece. Though I would add from a merely personal perspective that I think Roman influence on the UK as been greatly exaggerated. Don't get me wrong, they carried out some very worthwhile Civil engineering projects but the actual influence on our culture I'm not so sure. Think a lot of the perceived Ancient Rome and Greeces influence over the UK as more to do with public schoolboys obsession with the classics then any real cultural identification.
I think when you are discussing 'fences' what you are describing are cultural norms. Your right that in many ways it is these shared cultural norms that that in some way give us cultural, tribal or national identity. But it is completely normal for these cultural norms to be tested and adjusted continuously. Has they have been since the beginning of human grouping.
The cultural norms can not stay the same otherwise we would still have the same cultural views as our mesolithic or iron age ancestors. Who I'm pretty sure thought very differently from us.
What changes do you personally think have been bad for society I wonder?
Personally I'm far from convinced the adoption of agriculture and leaving behind our successful hunter gatherer past was such a wise move |
'Personally I'm far from convinced the adoption of agriculture and leaving behind our successful hunter gatherer past was such a wise move'
That's when it all went wrong! The moment you start stockpiling and claiming ownership of land you create inequity and then greed and envy and poverty destroy your functional society. | |
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| The world has gone mad (part 78,957) - Trump to win by a landslide Iowa caucus on 13:21 - Jan 16 with 1221 views | StokieBlue |
| The world has gone mad (part 78,957) - Trump to win by a landslide Iowa caucus on 13:16 - Jan 16 by NthQldITFC |
'Personally I'm far from convinced the adoption of agriculture and leaving behind our successful hunter gatherer past was such a wise move'
That's when it all went wrong! The moment you start stockpiling and claiming ownership of land you create inequity and then greed and envy and poverty destroy your functional society. |
Maybe even hunting and gathering is going too far?
When we moved into that paradigm we also moved into the lands of our fellow homo cousins, took their resources and drove them to extinction.
SB |  | | |
| The world has gone mad (part 78,957) - Trump to win by a landslide Iowa caucus on 13:32 - Jan 16 with 1209 views | leitrimblue |
| The world has gone mad (part 78,957) - Trump to win by a landslide Iowa caucus on 13:16 - Jan 16 by NthQldITFC |
'Personally I'm far from convinced the adoption of agriculture and leaving behind our successful hunter gatherer past was such a wise move'
That's when it all went wrong! The moment you start stockpiling and claiming ownership of land you create inequity and then greed and envy and poverty destroy your functional society. |
I think in many ways you are correct. I would suggest that the move from hunter gatherer to agriculture (mesolithic/neolithic) is probably the biggest cultural change we have faced.
Our understanding of ownership of land and objects obviously completely changes after this transition.
I'm not sure if you have ever seen it but if you get a chance you may enjoy reading the Marshall Sahlins books, Original Affluent Society or Stone Age Economics. He was a anthropologist who spent a lot of time living with hunter gatherer groups in the 1960,s and 70,s and who spent a lot of his time concerning himself with their views on ownership and communal ownership. Still very interesting today. | | | |
| The world has gone mad (part 78,957) - Trump to win by a landslide Iowa caucus on 13:44 - Jan 16 with 1175 views | Europablue |
| The world has gone mad (part 78,957) - Trump to win by a landslide Iowa caucus on 12:59 - Jan 16 by NthQldITFC |
'One of the good things about Trump getting reelected is that he wouldn't be running for office again, so we can finally stop talking about him.'
I just have to assume that you are saying that in jest, but there's a nagging part of my mind... |
It would have been way better if Trump were elected last time. The world would have been more stable and then in 2 years time Trump will never be able to run for office again. Now Trump will be in public life for a minimum of 6 years. | | | |
| The world has gone mad (part 78,957) - Trump to win by a landslide Iowa caucus on 13:50 - Jan 16 with 1164 views | Europablue |
| The world has gone mad (part 78,957) - Trump to win by a landslide Iowa caucus on 12:26 - Jan 16 by nodge_blue |
You made a bunch of arguments that vary from untrue through to contradictory.
But that's the internet for you. And I can't be that bothered to engage. |
Fair enough, but don't even bother saying that I made untrue or contradictory arguments in that case. By not providing details, you are validating my points or at least strengthing them. To be fair some of my arguments are just opinions. | | | |
| The world has gone mad (part 78,957) - Trump to win by a landslide Iowa caucus on 14:00 - Jan 16 with 1140 views | StokieBlue |
| The world has gone mad (part 78,957) - Trump to win by a landslide Iowa caucus on 13:44 - Jan 16 by Europablue |
It would have been way better if Trump were elected last time. The world would have been more stable and then in 2 years time Trump will never be able to run for office again. Now Trump will be in public life for a minimum of 6 years. |
Please explain how the world would have been more stable under Trump without using the words "power vacuum" which you've provided no evidence for whatsoever.
SB | | | |
| The world has gone mad (part 78,957) - Trump to win by a landslide Iowa caucus on 14:13 - Jan 16 with 1097 views | NthQldITFC |
| The world has gone mad (part 78,957) - Trump to win by a landslide Iowa caucus on 13:44 - Jan 16 by Europablue |
It would have been way better if Trump were elected last time. The world would have been more stable and then in 2 years time Trump will never be able to run for office again. Now Trump will be in public life for a minimum of 6 years. |
Do your tour dates sell out often?
It's a class of humour which I just don't understand. I must be getting old. | |
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| The world has gone mad (part 78,957) - Trump to win by a landslide Iowa caucus on 14:20 - Jan 16 with 1069 views | Swansea_Blue |
Quite mad that there's so much support for someone like Trump, but that's the world we live in I suppose.
American's do get a bad rep for being crazy idiots, but that's pretty unfair imo. Most we mixed with when we lived there weren't openly political and if anything were embarrassed about Trump. It's only the loonies who make the highlight reels.
But then 47% of the electorate in polls apparently support Trump's latest white supremacist language around immigrants "contaminating" American blood. Bonkers. That's his legacy. |  |
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| The world has gone mad (part 78,957) - Trump to win by a landslide Iowa caucus on 14:25 - Jan 16 with 1057 views | Blueschev |
| The world has gone mad (part 78,957) - Trump to win by a landslide Iowa caucus on 14:20 - Jan 16 by Swansea_Blue |
Quite mad that there's so much support for someone like Trump, but that's the world we live in I suppose.
American's do get a bad rep for being crazy idiots, but that's pretty unfair imo. Most we mixed with when we lived there weren't openly political and if anything were embarrassed about Trump. It's only the loonies who make the highlight reels.
But then 47% of the electorate in polls apparently support Trump's latest white supremacist language around immigrants "contaminating" American blood. Bonkers. That's his legacy. |
I find the anti-immigrant rhetoric from certain sections of the US completely astounding. Do they know nothing of the history of the nation they claim to love? Not to mention the history of their own family heritage? |  | | |
| The world has gone mad (part 78,957) - Trump to win by a landslide Iowa caucus on 15:32 - Jan 16 with 983 views | leitrimblue |
| The world has gone mad (part 78,957) - Trump to win by a landslide Iowa caucus on 14:20 - Jan 16 by Swansea_Blue |
Quite mad that there's so much support for someone like Trump, but that's the world we live in I suppose.
American's do get a bad rep for being crazy idiots, but that's pretty unfair imo. Most we mixed with when we lived there weren't openly political and if anything were embarrassed about Trump. It's only the loonies who make the highlight reels.
But then 47% of the electorate in polls apparently support Trump's latest white supremacist language around immigrants "contaminating" American blood. Bonkers. That's his legacy. |
That's such a hard sentence to get yer head around- 'immigrants contaminating American blood' Where to start?
Perhaps they are talking about Native Americans? | | | |
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