| Gorton and Denton By-election 19:20 - Feb 15 with 6847 views | gtsb1966 |
Greens odds on to win with Reform 2nd and Labour 3rd. Surely that would be the end of Starmer if that happened. One can only hope. I cant see some members of the party waiting for the annihilation in the May elections.
https://www.oddschecker.com/po |  | | |  |
| Gorton and Denton By-election on 12:50 - Feb 16 with 667 views | Churchman |
| Gorton and Denton By-election on 10:48 - Feb 16 by itfcjoe |
Johnson campaigned in a GE with a Get Brexit Done message, with an 'Oven Ready Brexit Deal', the whole campaign was based on a huge lie as it didn't exist. |
Actually Joe, 9/10ths of the ‘oven ready deal’ had been done. But Johnson had absolutely nothing to do with it. Most of Brexit ‘deal’ was about keeping the country functioning - quite literally and that had been taken just about as far as it could in the timescales (exit had already been delayed six months). Most of it was really boring stuff of no interest to the media.
The 1/10th was the bit that Johnson was too lazy and stupid to engage in so the idiot just ignored it. That included Northern Ireland which was completely insoluble and actually gave May’s government an obvious get out from the sorry mess that was Brexit. As it was, all lardarse BJ did was say ok, what we have will do, shake hands on it and worry about the consequences later. Easy to say ‘get Brexit done’ if you take that aporoach and so he did.
It was clear to the government there was no benefit whatsoever in the lunacy before 2020, They were blinded by their own arrogance and ignorance. And of course, they still are whether in tory or reform mode. |  | | |
| Gorton and Denton By-election on 12:56 - Feb 16 with 643 views | ElderGrizzly |
| Gorton and Denton By-election on 09:55 - Feb 16 by DJR |
https://theconversation.com/lo
A major weakness is in the fairness of the electoral rules for small parties. The electoral system generated a very disproportional result in 2024. Labour took nearly two-thirds of the seats in parliament, a total of 412, with less than 10 million votes (only 34% of votes cast). Labour won a massive majority in terms of parliamentary arithmetic but the the government did not enter office with widespread support.
By contrast, Reform and the Greens received 6 million votes between them, but only nine MPs. The electoral system may have worked when Britain had a two-party system – but the two-party system no longer holds. Today’s Britain is more diverse, and political support is more distributed.
The UK also scores poorly on voter registration. It is estimated that there are around 7 million to 8 million people not correctly registered or missing from the registers entirely. This is not many less than the 9.7 million people whose votes gave the government a landslide majority. The UK does not have a system of automatic voter registration, which is present in global leaders such as Iceland, where everyone is enrolled without a hiccup.
Another problem is participation. Turnout in July 2024 was low – with only half of adults voting, the lowest share of the adult population since universal suffrage. Voting has been made more difficult as the Elections Act of 2022 introduced compulsory photographic identification for the first time at the general election. This was thought to have made it more difficult for many citizens to vote because the UK does not have a national identity card which all citizens hold. [Post edited 16 Feb 9:58]
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But they've been the rules for every election.
As a Lib Dem, I can tell you I don't always agree with it, but it is the system.
I'm sure if Reform, or whatever they'll be called by 2029, win a majority they'll be the first to celebrate the system as it is.
None of those things listed in your past are Starmer's fault, but are frequently used to erode the legitimacy of Labour's mandate. |  | | |
| Gorton and Denton By-election on 13:38 - Feb 16 with 570 views | itfcjoe |
| Gorton and Denton By-election on 12:50 - Feb 16 by Churchman |
Actually Joe, 9/10ths of the ‘oven ready deal’ had been done. But Johnson had absolutely nothing to do with it. Most of Brexit ‘deal’ was about keeping the country functioning - quite literally and that had been taken just about as far as it could in the timescales (exit had already been delayed six months). Most of it was really boring stuff of no interest to the media.
The 1/10th was the bit that Johnson was too lazy and stupid to engage in so the idiot just ignored it. That included Northern Ireland which was completely insoluble and actually gave May’s government an obvious get out from the sorry mess that was Brexit. As it was, all lardarse BJ did was say ok, what we have will do, shake hands on it and worry about the consequences later. Easy to say ‘get Brexit done’ if you take that aporoach and so he did.
It was clear to the government there was no benefit whatsoever in the lunacy before 2020, They were blinded by their own arrogance and ignorance. And of course, they still are whether in tory or reform mode. |
I think if it doesn't exist in it's entirety it's fair to say it doesn't exist - because we went from having an 'Oven Ready Deal' to threatening a 'No Deal' Brexit - so both things can't be true even if I appreciate what you are saying re the structure and legwork having all been done.
The whole GE campaign was just a lie for me |  |
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| Gorton and Denton By-election on 13:45 - Feb 16 with 550 views | jasondozzell |
| Gorton and Denton By-election on 12:10 - Feb 16 by Herbivore |
It's clear that your grasp on facts is somewhere in the Boris Johnson ballpark. [Post edited 16 Feb 12:14]
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Which fact? |  | | |
| Gorton and Denton By-election on 13:49 - Feb 16 with 530 views | Herbivore |
| Gorton and Denton By-election on 13:45 - Feb 16 by jasondozzell |
Which fact? |
See, your grasp of facts is so poor you can't even recognise them anymore. |  |
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| Gorton and Denton By-election on 13:57 - Feb 16 with 505 views | jasondozzell |
| Gorton and Denton By-election on 12:35 - Feb 16 by eireblue |
Boris Johnson was sacked from The Times in 1987 for fabricating a quote in an article.
Starmer had just started as a Barrister.
Have fun counting back… |
It's just lazy.
It's the libs laziness on this that is why we are in the predicament we are in.
It's self soothing to make individuals and personalities like Boris the bogeymen. 'Boris is a shambles and Starmer is a grown up'. It's a short cut, an easy way to explain what is happening around us.
It's the same in the US. 'Trump is dreadful'. Well, yes, of course he is, but if you don't seek to understand why you end up with the disaster of the Dems under Biden. A party unable to self correct because of systemic issues, corruption and anti democratic in nature.
People don't really want to think much. It's easier to say 'Well, Starmer looks smart in a suit and I've been told he's forensic in hushed tones by the media so he must be a better operator and he's a bit unlucky' as opposed to actually read about what is going on under his watch. As an example, I wonder how many people knew who Morgan Mcsweeney was in 2018 - 2024. I would imagine very few. | | | |
| Gorton and Denton By-election on 13:57 - Feb 16 with 503 views | jasondozzell |
| Gorton and Denton By-election on 13:49 - Feb 16 by Herbivore |
See, your grasp of facts is so poor you can't even recognise them anymore. |
Name one. | | | |
| Gorton and Denton By-election on 14:02 - Feb 16 with 496 views | DJR |
| Gorton and Denton By-election on 20:40 - Feb 15 by jasondozzell |
'Broadly competent'
Are the centrists on hard drugs or is it their denial doing this?
The guy is a serial liar who has presided over a shambolic government and the destruction of his own party.
It's hard to state just how egregious the Starmer/Mcsweeney project has been.
Under their watch they have facilitated the capture of the Labour party by vested business interests and Mandelson, rampant corruption, a calculated deception of party members to win the leadership, dereliction of duty in not producing a coherent plan for government, getting into bed with huge and immoral US tech firms, BlackRock etc, showing terrible judgement over Gaza, a lack of any principles.
The Sunday Times piece on insiders saying that he has no politics, cannot make a decision and is more interested in making requests for 'business casual' wear at meetings just about sats it all.
The latest stuff about Labour Together paying thousands to have mainstream journalists smeared is deeply ironic as this is exactly the tactic the same body used to discredit Corbyn and the left of the party. Only now in Pogrund it's someone who matters (who by the way delighted in reporting Mcsweeney's smears as truth himself) so it's being called out.
It's the death throes of extreme centrism at the worst possible time. The only good thing is the party, beyond saving at this point, will be destroyed.
And speaking of Kinnock, I note that Stephen was busy posting a picture of himself and wife enjoying hospitality at Chequers during the middle of a national crisis. Just about says all you need to know about character of these people. |
I wouldn't necessarily put things precisely as you have but I can't say that there is much I disagree with.
As a former Labour member who voted for Starmer, I have a bit more knowledge than the average person as to all that has gone on. And I can't be accused of being a Corbynite because I didn't leave the party (as many did) when he ceased to be leader.
There was just a growing realisation, the more I discovered, that there was both a dishonesty and something underhand at the heart of the McSweeney/Starmer/Labour Together project.
And your point about it only now being an issue that Labour Together investigated journalists because the journalist involved worked for the Sunday Times is a good one. Indeed, the Today article on it only mentioned the Sunday Times journalist but John McDonnell (who was also interviewed and has an interest in these thing as an NUJ representative in Parliament) mentioned that Paul Holden, the source for the 2023 Sunday Times article was also investigated. He was also the author of "Fraud: Starmer, McSweeney and the Crisis of British Democracy", which surprise, surprise got no reviews in the national media.
As it is, it emerged last September that Holden had been investigated by Labour Together and this, from something I came across, sets out the timeline to conform the point you were making.
"So this is how investigative journalism works in the UK.
· September 30 2025: Peter Oborne and Richard Sanders write a detailed article in The National Newspaper revealing that Labour Together, the think tank behind Starmer’s rise to power that used to be run by his former chief of staff Morgan McSweeney, hired private investigators to dig dirt on the backgrounds of journalists critical of the Starmer government. Key targets were Paul Holden, whose book 'The Fraud' was particularly embarrassing for Starmer’s administration and Andrew Feinstein of Shadow World Investigations (and an activist who stood against Starmer in the 2024 election).
· February 5 2026: Peter Geoghegan and Khadija Sharife publish an exclusive on the Democracy for Sale blog building on Oborne and Sanders’ work. They report that Labour Together paid a US public affairs firm, APCO Worldwide, at least £30,000 to investigate journalists including not only Holden & Feinstein but also Gabriel Pogrund and Harry Yorke from the Sunday Times, Henry Dyer of the Guardian and John McEvoy of Declassified UK. It names the author of the APCO reports as Tom Harper, a former Times journalist.
· February 15 2026: lead article in the Sunday Times – “Labour activists paid for smear campaign against journalists” – repeats the allegations but focuses mainly on the (admittedly outrageous and intrusive) slurs against the Sunday Times journalists. However, it fails to mention the National story and makes one fleeting reference to the Democracy for Sale post right at the end of the story.
The Sunday Times story, and not the ones in either The National Newspaper or Democracy for Sale, is then splashed across BBC bulletins and articles (its online coverage actually states that this was “first reported by the Sunday Times”) because, presumably, something only becomes a real story across the mainstream media when one of their own is attacked and when one of their own publishes the story.
The independent journalists who broke the story are utterly ignored."
In my view this is a scandal right up there with Watergate given how embedded Labour Together is with all that has gone on but I won't hold my breath as to whether it will have any consequences.
And it is worth reposting what I posted elsewhere.
"Of course, the departure of McSweeney will no doubt take the heat off the shadowy role that Labour Together played in the toxic things that went on but it is worth bearing in mind that the following appeared on its website in 2023 when it finally came out in the open. Unsurprisingly it no longer appears on its website but it was captured by the Internet Archive..
https://web.archive.org/web/20 https:/labourtogether.uk/what-
"Labour Together was built by a group of MPs - Shabana Mahmood, Steve Reed, Bridget Philipson, Wes Streeting, Lucy Powell, Rachel Reeves, Jim McMahon, Jon Cruddas and Lisa Nandy - who wanted to see Labour back in power.
In Labour’s wilderness years, Labour Together fought to make the party electable again. In 2020, with Morgan McSweeney as Director, it united the party behind Keir Starmer’s leadership campaign. In the years since, Keir Starmer has reformed the party, placed the country’s interests at its heart, and put Labour on the path to power."
This means that all of the leadership candidates on the right are tarnished by what went on." [Post edited 16 Feb 14:08]
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| Gorton and Denton By-election on 14:07 - Feb 16 with 476 views | Churchman |
| Gorton and Denton By-election on 13:38 - Feb 16 by itfcjoe |
I think if it doesn't exist in it's entirety it's fair to say it doesn't exist - because we went from having an 'Oven Ready Deal' to threatening a 'No Deal' Brexit - so both things can't be true even if I appreciate what you are saying re the structure and legwork having all been done.
The whole GE campaign was just a lie for me |
There was never any such thing as ‘no deal Brexit’ in the sense that people understand it and the government tried to portray it. They could threaten all they wanted but even they were not stupid enough to go beyond flapping their mouths with empty threats - and the Europeans knew it. The consequences of true no deal brexit were worse than your worst nightmare.
Nor was what Johnson signed off ‘oven ready’. It was basically an endless list of agreed processes and arrangements some of which replaced what was already there and none of which were in UKs favour and key unresolved issues that the buffoon and his henchmen were too lazy to face. | | | |
| Gorton and Denton By-election on 14:11 - Feb 16 with 465 views | Ewan_Oozami |
| Gorton and Denton By-election on 13:57 - Feb 16 by jasondozzell |
It's just lazy.
It's the libs laziness on this that is why we are in the predicament we are in.
It's self soothing to make individuals and personalities like Boris the bogeymen. 'Boris is a shambles and Starmer is a grown up'. It's a short cut, an easy way to explain what is happening around us.
It's the same in the US. 'Trump is dreadful'. Well, yes, of course he is, but if you don't seek to understand why you end up with the disaster of the Dems under Biden. A party unable to self correct because of systemic issues, corruption and anti democratic in nature.
People don't really want to think much. It's easier to say 'Well, Starmer looks smart in a suit and I've been told he's forensic in hushed tones by the media so he must be a better operator and he's a bit unlucky' as opposed to actually read about what is going on under his watch. As an example, I wonder how many people knew who Morgan Mcsweeney was in 2018 - 2024. I would imagine very few. |
So I presume you're a Zack Polanski supporter? |  |
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| Gorton and Denton By-election on 14:13 - Feb 16 with 460 views | jasondozzell |
| Gorton and Denton By-election on 14:02 - Feb 16 by DJR |
I wouldn't necessarily put things precisely as you have but I can't say that there is much I disagree with.
As a former Labour member who voted for Starmer, I have a bit more knowledge than the average person as to all that has gone on. And I can't be accused of being a Corbynite because I didn't leave the party (as many did) when he ceased to be leader.
There was just a growing realisation, the more I discovered, that there was both a dishonesty and something underhand at the heart of the McSweeney/Starmer/Labour Together project.
And your point about it only now being an issue that Labour Together investigated journalists because the journalist involved worked for the Sunday Times is a good one. Indeed, the Today article on it only mentioned the Sunday Times journalist but John McDonnell (who was also interviewed and has an interest in these thing as an NUJ representative in Parliament) mentioned that Paul Holden, the source for the 2023 Sunday Times article was also investigated. He was also the author of "Fraud: Starmer, McSweeney and the Crisis of British Democracy", which surprise, surprise got no reviews in the national media.
As it is, it emerged last September that Holden had been investigated by Labour Together and this, from something I came across, sets out the timeline to conform the point you were making.
"So this is how investigative journalism works in the UK.
· September 30 2025: Peter Oborne and Richard Sanders write a detailed article in The National Newspaper revealing that Labour Together, the think tank behind Starmer’s rise to power that used to be run by his former chief of staff Morgan McSweeney, hired private investigators to dig dirt on the backgrounds of journalists critical of the Starmer government. Key targets were Paul Holden, whose book 'The Fraud' was particularly embarrassing for Starmer’s administration and Andrew Feinstein of Shadow World Investigations (and an activist who stood against Starmer in the 2024 election).
· February 5 2026: Peter Geoghegan and Khadija Sharife publish an exclusive on the Democracy for Sale blog building on Oborne and Sanders’ work. They report that Labour Together paid a US public affairs firm, APCO Worldwide, at least £30,000 to investigate journalists including not only Holden & Feinstein but also Gabriel Pogrund and Harry Yorke from the Sunday Times, Henry Dyer of the Guardian and John McEvoy of Declassified UK. It names the author of the APCO reports as Tom Harper, a former Times journalist.
· February 15 2026: lead article in the Sunday Times – “Labour activists paid for smear campaign against journalists” – repeats the allegations but focuses mainly on the (admittedly outrageous and intrusive) slurs against the Sunday Times journalists. However, it fails to mention the National story and makes one fleeting reference to the Democracy for Sale post right at the end of the story.
The Sunday Times story, and not the ones in either The National Newspaper or Democracy for Sale, is then splashed across BBC bulletins and articles (its online coverage actually states that this was “first reported by the Sunday Times”) because, presumably, something only becomes a real story across the mainstream media when one of their own is attacked and when one of their own publishes the story.
The independent journalists who broke the story are utterly ignored."
In my view this is a scandal right up there with Watergate given how embedded Labour Together is with all that has gone on but I won't hold my breath as to whether it will have any consequences.
And it is worth reposting what I posted elsewhere.
"Of course, the departure of McSweeney will no doubt take the heat off the shadowy role that Labour Together played in the toxic things that went on but it is worth bearing in mind that the following appeared on its website in 2023 when it finally came out in the open. Unsurprisingly it no longer appears on its website but it was captured by the Internet Archive..
https://web.archive.org/web/20 https:/labourtogether.uk/what-
"Labour Together was built by a group of MPs - Shabana Mahmood, Steve Reed, Bridget Philipson, Wes Streeting, Lucy Powell, Rachel Reeves, Jim McMahon, Jon Cruddas and Lisa Nandy - who wanted to see Labour back in power.
In Labour’s wilderness years, Labour Together fought to make the party electable again. In 2020, with Morgan McSweeney as Director, it united the party behind Keir Starmer’s leadership campaign. In the years since, Keir Starmer has reformed the party, placed the country’s interests at its heart, and put Labour on the path to power."
This means that all of the leadership candidates on the right are tarnished by what went on." [Post edited 16 Feb 14:08]
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Thank you. Excellent as ever, DJR.
Calmly and methodically addressed.
Thank you because sometimes it can make you feel like you're going mad when so many people are ignorant of this stuff. The media in this country has failed us.
I am bombastic in my approach at times, mainly because I agree this is Watergate level stuff, so your rational overview is very helpful.
It's just a tragedy that this, the Forde report etc. will never be widely known. | | | |
| Gorton and Denton By-election on 14:15 - Feb 16 with 454 views | jasondozzell |
| Gorton and Denton By-election on 14:11 - Feb 16 by Ewan_Oozami |
So I presume you're a Zack Polanski supporter? |
I voted Green in 2024 (before Polanski leadership bid). First time ever I haven't voted Labour.
I'm sympathetic to Polanski. Think he's talented. Broadly agree with the analysis.
They won't form the next government however. | | | |
| Gorton and Denton By-election on 14:20 - Feb 16 with 434 views | Herbivore |
| Gorton and Denton By-election on 13:57 - Feb 16 by jasondozzell |
Name one. |
Jason Dozzell played for Ipswich. | |
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| Gorton and Denton By-election on 14:29 - Feb 16 with 403 views | jasondozzell |
| Gorton and Denton By-election on 14:20 - Feb 16 by Herbivore |
Jason Dozzell played for Ipswich. |
Very good! | | | |
| Gorton and Denton By-election on 14:31 - Feb 16 with 390 views | Herbivore |
| Gorton and Denton By-election on 14:29 - Feb 16 by jasondozzell |
Very good! |
By contrast, Johnson went because of cake is not a fact. Thus ends lesson one. | |
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| Gorton and Denton By-election on 14:34 - Feb 16 with 378 views | DJR |
| Gorton and Denton By-election on 14:13 - Feb 16 by jasondozzell |
Thank you. Excellent as ever, DJR.
Calmly and methodically addressed.
Thank you because sometimes it can make you feel like you're going mad when so many people are ignorant of this stuff. The media in this country has failed us.
I am bombastic in my approach at times, mainly because I agree this is Watergate level stuff, so your rational overview is very helpful.
It's just a tragedy that this, the Forde report etc. will never be widely known. |
You probably wear your heart on your sleeve more than me but it does mean you get stick that you don't deserve, with people picking you up on sentences and the like and missing the overriding thrust of what you are saying.
I also voted Green at the last general election for the first time ever because I just couldn't bring myself to vote for Labour knowing all that I did then. And even more disturbing things have emerged since then. [Post edited 16 Feb 14:37]
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| Gorton and Denton By-election on 14:38 - Feb 16 with 359 views | jasondozzell |
| Gorton and Denton By-election on 14:34 - Feb 16 by DJR |
You probably wear your heart on your sleeve more than me but it does mean you get stick that you don't deserve, with people picking you up on sentences and the like and missing the overriding thrust of what you are saying.
I also voted Green at the last general election for the first time ever because I just couldn't bring myself to vote for Labour knowing all that I did then. And even more disturbing things have emerged since then. [Post edited 16 Feb 14:37]
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Exactly so. And thank you!
Yep, there was no way I was voting for them.
It's infuriating trying to explain any of this stuff as people are just not aware. | | | |
| Gorton and Denton By-election on 14:46 - Feb 16 with 339 views | DJR |
Gosh!
"No 10 says PM has confidence in Josh Simons, minister who commissioned probe into journalists when running thinktank
At the Downing Street lobby briefing the PM’s spokesperson also said journalists must be able to do their job “without fear or favour” in response to questions about the Labour Together investigation into reporters writing about it.
The spokesperson would not give details about the Cabinet Office investiation (see 9.53am and 10.45am) into what happened. But he confirmed that “of course journalism and the free press is a cornerstone of any democracy”.
The spokesperson also said Keir Starmer had full confidence in Josh Simons, the Cabinet Office minister who commissioned the report when he was running Labour Together before the general election."
Asked if Simons would be sacked if he were found to be at fault, the spokesperson said he would not comment on a “hypothetical” scenario”.
And don't forget Simons was parachuted into a plum seat only a few weeks before the election as were a whole load of other like people. | | | |
| Gorton and Denton By-election on 15:14 - Feb 16 with 275 views | DJR |
Leaving aside questions of integrity and political narrative, it does seem extraordinary that competence seems to be severely lacking in the govenrment with the number of U-turns, including the latest on delayed elections.
Maybe (as Michael Crick predicted) that's the result of groupthink and lack of internal challenge, or is it just that they all aren't up to the job? | | | |
| Gorton and Denton By-election on 15:18 - Feb 16 with 265 views | Herbivore |
| Gorton and Denton By-election on 15:14 - Feb 16 by DJR |
Leaving aside questions of integrity and political narrative, it does seem extraordinary that competence seems to be severely lacking in the govenrment with the number of U-turns, including the latest on delayed elections.
Maybe (as Michael Crick predicted) that's the result of groupthink and lack of internal challenge, or is it just that they all aren't up to the job? |
They are governing not dissimilarly to the shambolic Tory governments of the decade that preceded them. No cohesive vision or principles, government by media cycle and public reaction. They've been staggeringly incompetent in most areas. | |
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| Gorton and Denton By-election on 15:20 - Feb 16 with 261 views | Swansea_Blue |
| Gorton and Denton By-election on 15:14 - Feb 16 by DJR |
Leaving aside questions of integrity and political narrative, it does seem extraordinary that competence seems to be severely lacking in the govenrment with the number of U-turns, including the latest on delayed elections.
Maybe (as Michael Crick predicted) that's the result of groupthink and lack of internal challenge, or is it just that they all aren't up to the job? |
It happens so often, it could be a deliberate feature. If they’re not steered by any particular vision or strategy, which appears to be the case, it probably seems reasonable to them to pick one course of action and then pivot to the popular view based on feedback. |  |
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| Gorton and Denton By-election on 15:23 - Feb 16 with 250 views | DJR |
| Gorton and Denton By-election on 15:18 - Feb 16 by Herbivore |
They are governing not dissimilarly to the shambolic Tory governments of the decade that preceded them. No cohesive vision or principles, government by media cycle and public reaction. They've been staggeringly incompetent in most areas. |
That is true to an extent but I can't recall a government that has ever had as many U-turns in such a short period of time.
And with his forensic legal background, it's the last thing one might have expected of Starmer. [Post edited 16 Feb 15:29]
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| Gorton and Denton By-election on 15:30 - Feb 16 with 228 views | itfcjoe |
| Gorton and Denton By-election on 15:18 - Feb 16 by Herbivore |
They are governing not dissimilarly to the shambolic Tory governments of the decade that preceded them. No cohesive vision or principles, government by media cycle and public reaction. They've been staggeringly incompetent in most areas. |
Hard to know if this is just a feature or a bug now, is the country ungovernable in that regard? New crisis every day, no time for thinking, no broad coalitions in parties etc | |
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| Gorton and Denton By-election on 15:33 - Feb 16 with 224 views | DJR |
| Gorton and Denton By-election on 15:20 - Feb 16 by Swansea_Blue |
It happens so often, it could be a deliberate feature. If they’re not steered by any particular vision or strategy, which appears to be the case, it probably seems reasonable to them to pick one course of action and then pivot to the popular view based on feedback. |
But when it comes to confidence in the competence of a government, it's a complete failure.
And maybe it just confirms Peter Oborne's view that a political strategist (McSweeney) should never have been appointed as Chief of Staff. | | | |
| Gorton and Denton By-election on 15:37 - Feb 16 with 214 views | DJR |
| Gorton and Denton By-election on 15:30 - Feb 16 by itfcjoe |
Hard to know if this is just a feature or a bug now, is the country ungovernable in that regard? New crisis every day, no time for thinking, no broad coalitions in parties etc |
There were plenty of crises in the 70s and 80s but in my view there was just a better standard of politician then in both main parties. | | | |
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