| Not a good look when Netanyahu reprimand you 18:14 - May 20 with 4337 views | eirannach_gorm |
Disgraceful treatment of people trying to bring humanitarian aid to Gaza.
Ben-Gvir is a real charmer.
https://www.irishexaminer.com/ |  | | |  |
| Not a good look when Netanyahu reprimand you on 18:28 - May 20 with 2146 views | Zx1988 |
Ben-Gvir is an absolute scumbag.
One of the absolute worst of an already terrible lot. | |
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| Not a good look when Netanyahu reprimand you on 20:34 - May 20 with 1934 views | BlueNomad |
And our government continues to say nothing……….. |  | | |
| Not a good look when Netanyahu reprimand you on 20:50 - May 20 with 1858 views | BanksterDebtSlave |
It's interesting to me some of the regulars on here that never upvote posts such as this. This isn't a team sport! |  |
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| Not a good look when Netanyahu reprimand you on 21:00 - May 20 with 1883 views | vapour_trail |
| Not a good look when Netanyahu reprimand you on 20:50 - May 20 by BanksterDebtSlave |
It's interesting to me some of the regulars on here that never upvote posts such as this. This isn't a team sport! |
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| Not a good look when Netanyahu reprimand you on 21:12 - May 20 with 1847 views | GlasgowBlue |
| Not a good look when Netanyahu reprimand you on 18:28 - May 20 by Zx1988 |
Ben-Gvir is an absolute scumbag.
One of the absolute worst of an already terrible lot. |
Ben-Gvir, like Smotrich, is a terrorist supporting zealot who should be nowhere near government. Bibi is beholden to the pair of them to prop him up and keep him out of jail.
Thankfully the polls are showing that a broad coalition will get more seats than the current mob but will need the help of the Arab parties. |  |
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| Not a good look when Netanyahu reprimand you on 21:17 - May 20 with 1845 views | reusersfreekicks |
| Not a good look when Netanyahu reprimand you on 21:12 - May 20 by GlasgowBlue |
Ben-Gvir, like Smotrich, is a terrorist supporting zealot who should be nowhere near government. Bibi is beholden to the pair of them to prop him up and keep him out of jail.
Thankfully the polls are showing that a broad coalition will get more seats than the current mob but will need the help of the Arab parties. |
They should then go to the Haig for war crimes |  | | |
| Not a good look when Netanyahu reprimand you on 21:19 - May 20 with 1827 views | GlasgowBlue |
| Not a good look when Netanyahu reprimand you on 21:17 - May 20 by reusersfreekicks |
They should then go to the Haig for war crimes |
Absolutely. | |
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| Not a good look when Netanyahu reprimand you on 21:59 - May 20 with 1714 views | wrightsrightglove |
| Not a good look when Netanyahu reprimand you on 21:19 - May 20 by GlasgowBlue |
Absolutely. |
History will look back upon all those who support and try to defend what Israel is doing in the same way that we view the Nazis as well. Hiding behind an article that calls it antisemitism to conflate Israel policy with the Holocaust is utterly disgusting. History will look back and ask all of the same questions; how was this allowed to happen? Why didn’t more people stand up against it? How could people defend what they could see with their own eyes?
Maybe you think history will look back kindly upon this genocide, or differently to what is considered the most definitive genocide to ever happen, but I don’t think that’s the case. There’s no antisemitism in comparing how history will compare these two genocides and ask the same questions. | | | |
| Not a good look when Netanyahu reprimand you on 22:26 - May 20 with 1641 views | Swansea_Blue |
| Not a good look when Netanyahu reprimand you on 21:17 - May 20 by reusersfreekicks |
They should then go to the Haig for war crimes |
100%. They’re utter c**** |  |
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| Not a good look when Netanyahu reprimand you on 22:31 - May 20 with 1607 views | Swansea_Blue |
| Not a good look when Netanyahu reprimand you on 20:34 - May 20 by BlueNomad |
And our government continues to say nothing……….. |
In fairness to our Government, it’s because they’re spineless weasels with no principles or morals. (See also easing sanctions on Russian oil because they’ve no other ideas). | |
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| Not a good look when Netanyahu reprimand you on 22:33 - May 20 with 1588 views | GlasgowBlue |
| Not a good look when Netanyahu reprimand you on 21:59 - May 20 by wrightsrightglove |
History will look back upon all those who support and try to defend what Israel is doing in the same way that we view the Nazis as well. Hiding behind an article that calls it antisemitism to conflate Israel policy with the Holocaust is utterly disgusting. History will look back and ask all of the same questions; how was this allowed to happen? Why didn’t more people stand up against it? How could people defend what they could see with their own eyes?
Maybe you think history will look back kindly upon this genocide, or differently to what is considered the most definitive genocide to ever happen, but I don’t think that’s the case. There’s no antisemitism in comparing how history will compare these two genocides and ask the same questions. |
What Israel has done to Gaza is indefensible. No One is defending their actions. I have stated on numerous occasions that there should be trials for war crimes. So you can knock the "defending' accusation on the head right now.
And I'm not hiding behind an article. I am linking you to the IHRA definition of Antisemitism, which states "drawing comparisons of contemporary Israeli policy to that of the Nazis" as an example of antisemitism.
https://holocaustremembrance.c
The state of Israel was formed by Holocaust survivors as a safe haven for Jews after the Nazis exterminated 6 million of them. You could have compared the actions if the Israeli state in Gaza with Holodomor, the Cambodian Genocide, the Armenian Genocide or Rwandan Genocide, You could have compared the actions of the Israeli state with those of Assad's Syria or Saddam's Iraq. But you went straight to the antisemitic comparison with the Nazis. Why was that? Why did you use the comparison with the nazis instead of one of the others I have just listed?
When you compare the actions of the Israeli state to the Nazis, you are attacking them as Jews. That they haven't learned a moral lesson from their own history. It also trivialises the Holocaust which is is nothing like what has happened in Gaza, no matter how awful and indefensible that conflict is. [Post edited 20 May 22:38]
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| Not a good look when Netanyahu reprimand you on 22:53 - May 20 with 1552 views | eirannach_gorm |
| Not a good look when Netanyahu reprimand you on 21:59 - May 20 by wrightsrightglove |
History will look back upon all those who support and try to defend what Israel is doing in the same way that we view the Nazis as well. Hiding behind an article that calls it antisemitism to conflate Israel policy with the Holocaust is utterly disgusting. History will look back and ask all of the same questions; how was this allowed to happen? Why didn’t more people stand up against it? How could people defend what they could see with their own eyes?
Maybe you think history will look back kindly upon this genocide, or differently to what is considered the most definitive genocide to ever happen, but I don’t think that’s the case. There’s no antisemitism in comparing how history will compare these two genocides and ask the same questions. |
Something strange has happened to this part of the thread as two posts have vanished. You posted and then got a response post from GlasgowBlue. This is your reply to that post which does not make sense without the two missing post. The reason I point this out was that I was also going to challenge the missing GlasgowBlue post as your post was not antisemitic and was a valid genocide comparison. This knee jerk response does not shield the Israeli government from criticism for their actions in Palestine. Just to point out that the party that Ben-Gvir is the leader of is anti Arab and follow the views of Rabbi Kahane who believed that most Arabs living in Israel are the enemies of Jews and Israel itself, and that a Jewish, Halakhic state, in which non-Jews would have no voting rights, should be created. This makes it a bit awkward when arabs live in the last bit of Palestine that Israel have yet to annex. | | | |
| Not a good look when Netanyahu reprimand you on 23:00 - May 20 with 1518 views | GlasgowBlue |
| Not a good look when Netanyahu reprimand you on 22:53 - May 20 by eirannach_gorm |
Something strange has happened to this part of the thread as two posts have vanished. You posted and then got a response post from GlasgowBlue. This is your reply to that post which does not make sense without the two missing post. The reason I point this out was that I was also going to challenge the missing GlasgowBlue post as your post was not antisemitic and was a valid genocide comparison. This knee jerk response does not shield the Israeli government from criticism for their actions in Palestine. Just to point out that the party that Ben-Gvir is the leader of is anti Arab and follow the views of Rabbi Kahane who believed that most Arabs living in Israel are the enemies of Jews and Israel itself, and that a Jewish, Halakhic state, in which non-Jews would have no voting rights, should be created. This makes it a bit awkward when arabs live in the last bit of Palestine that Israel have yet to annex. |
What part of the IHRA definition of Antisemitism, which states "drawing comparisons of contemporary Israeli policy to that of the Nazis" as an example of antisemitism, did you not understand?
Antisemitism is racism. Phil recently banned a poster for making a generalisation which was considered racist.
edit. It would be nice if we could discuss the war crimes and atrocities being committed by the Israeli state without falling into using lazy antisemitic tropes. Most normal and decent people cn do it. Some people can't.
I'll leave it there. [Post edited 20 May 23:05]
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| Not a good look when Netanyahu reprimand you on 23:37 - May 20 with 1447 views | Cafe_Newman |
| Not a good look when Netanyahu reprimand you on 21:17 - May 20 by reusersfreekicks |
They should then go to the Haig for war crimes |
And the 94% of non-Arab Israelis who actively support Natanyahu's continuing genocidal policies in Palastine and Lebanon and the illegal war on Iran should be banned from Eurovision along with anyone from Southampton and be replaced by the people of Iran. |  |
| FREE PALASTINE FROM ZIONIST BOMBS. FREE LEBANON FROM ZIONIST BOMBS. FREE IRAN FROM ZIONIST BOMBS. |
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| Not a good look when Netanyahu reprimand you on 23:50 - May 20 with 1429 views | BanksterDebtSlave |
| Not a good look when Netanyahu reprimand you on 22:33 - May 20 by GlasgowBlue |
What Israel has done to Gaza is indefensible. No One is defending their actions. I have stated on numerous occasions that there should be trials for war crimes. So you can knock the "defending' accusation on the head right now.
And I'm not hiding behind an article. I am linking you to the IHRA definition of Antisemitism, which states "drawing comparisons of contemporary Israeli policy to that of the Nazis" as an example of antisemitism.
https://holocaustremembrance.c
The state of Israel was formed by Holocaust survivors as a safe haven for Jews after the Nazis exterminated 6 million of them. You could have compared the actions if the Israeli state in Gaza with Holodomor, the Cambodian Genocide, the Armenian Genocide or Rwandan Genocide, You could have compared the actions of the Israeli state with those of Assad's Syria or Saddam's Iraq. But you went straight to the antisemitic comparison with the Nazis. Why was that? Why did you use the comparison with the nazis instead of one of the others I have just listed?
When you compare the actions of the Israeli state to the Nazis, you are attacking them as Jews. That they haven't learned a moral lesson from their own history. It also trivialises the Holocaust which is is nothing like what has happened in Gaza, no matter how awful and indefensible that conflict is. [Post edited 20 May 22:38]
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As repeatedly pointed out to you at the time, those definitions are bullsh1t and full of holes. Oh and something about beheaded babies....you helped lay the foundations of this genocide in your little way! | |
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| Not a good look when Netanyahu reprimand you on 00:27 - May 21 with 1395 views | WicklowBlue |
| Not a good look when Netanyahu reprimand you on 23:00 - May 20 by GlasgowBlue |
What part of the IHRA definition of Antisemitism, which states "drawing comparisons of contemporary Israeli policy to that of the Nazis" as an example of antisemitism, did you not understand?
Antisemitism is racism. Phil recently banned a poster for making a generalisation which was considered racist.
edit. It would be nice if we could discuss the war crimes and atrocities being committed by the Israeli state without falling into using lazy antisemitic tropes. Most normal and decent people cn do it. Some people can't.
I'll leave it there. [Post edited 20 May 23:05]
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Honest ignoramus question:
"I am linking you to the IHRA definition of Antisemitism, which states "drawing comparisons of contemporary Israeli policy to that of the Nazis" as an example of antisemitism."
From a quick review of the IHRA definition of antisemitism I didnt find any mention of comparisons between contemporary Israel policy to that of the Naxis being an example.
What I did see was the following "However, criticism of Israel similar to that leveled against any other country cannot be regarded as antisemitic"
For me I think the OPs post was quite rightly denouncing a member of Israel’s government in line with what would be called out across the modern world.
Dont get me wrong I acknowledge your call outs on the current Israeli government and dont agree with Nazi comparisons. However is what other people are calling out the same as what would be called out across the modern world and thus not be regarded as antisemitic?
(The above is not excusing obvious antisemitism that we have seen in recent times and should be dealt with as racism and what it is a hate crime) |  | | |
| Not a good look when Netanyahu reprimand you on 00:45 - May 21 with 1385 views | Sarge |
| Not a good look when Netanyahu reprimand you on 22:33 - May 20 by GlasgowBlue |
What Israel has done to Gaza is indefensible. No One is defending their actions. I have stated on numerous occasions that there should be trials for war crimes. So you can knock the "defending' accusation on the head right now.
And I'm not hiding behind an article. I am linking you to the IHRA definition of Antisemitism, which states "drawing comparisons of contemporary Israeli policy to that of the Nazis" as an example of antisemitism.
https://holocaustremembrance.c
The state of Israel was formed by Holocaust survivors as a safe haven for Jews after the Nazis exterminated 6 million of them. You could have compared the actions if the Israeli state in Gaza with Holodomor, the Cambodian Genocide, the Armenian Genocide or Rwandan Genocide, You could have compared the actions of the Israeli state with those of Assad's Syria or Saddam's Iraq. But you went straight to the antisemitic comparison with the Nazis. Why was that? Why did you use the comparison with the nazis instead of one of the others I have just listed?
When you compare the actions of the Israeli state to the Nazis, you are attacking them as Jews. That they haven't learned a moral lesson from their own history. It also trivialises the Holocaust which is is nothing like what has happened in Gaza, no matter how awful and indefensible that conflict is. [Post edited 20 May 22:38]
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I find this a very puzzling definition. All of the other bullet points are inarguable but I don’t understand why drawing comparisons between Israel and the Nazi’s is considered antisemitic. You’ve said that it’s because it attacks them as Jews but 1) does it? and 2) why does it, whereas comparing them to the Khmer Rouge, Soviet Union etc doesn’t? Wouldn’t this be more likely to be an attack on them as Jews if Jews perpetrated the Holocaust rather than were victims of it? Or is this what this is getting at, that conflating the two is a way of saying Jews committed the Holocaust?
The Holocaust was perpetrated by a racist, far right terrorist state. Surely this is a more likely parallel that’s being drawn and I would be willing to bet that the majority of people that criticise the actions of Israel - including yourself - are criticising the state, not the fact that they’re Jewish.
As to why the Holocaust, I would assume because of all the events mentioned it’s the one most burned into our collective consciousness, the one that changed the world the most, that left its mark on nearly every country around the world, the one widely considered the darkest chapter of modern human history, and the one that is remembered far more than any other the others. You, or the IHRA, may say that drawing parallels between the two is a deliberate and discriminatory choice but I think you’re inferring intent that for most people just isn’t there. It’s just what comes to mind when you think of genocide.
Undoubtedly it trivialises the Holocaust, and so claiming that the two are remotely similar is wrong. The scale is thankfully nowhere near, as is the case with several of the other genocides in living memory and so it would trivialise them too to varying extents. But the wording is ‘drawing comparisons’ and I find it strange that it is completely off limits to do this, as if denying that any comparisons of any kind are or could ever be there.
Worth saying too that definition, almost certainly because of this particular bullet point, has generated some criticism from civil rights groups and some Jewish groups. So it’s not without its controversy and my personal opinion is that it’s clumsy and counter productive. | | | |
| Not a good look when Netanyahu reprimand you on 00:46 - May 21 with 1383 views | Sarge |
| Not a good look when Netanyahu reprimand you on 00:27 - May 21 by WicklowBlue |
Honest ignoramus question:
"I am linking you to the IHRA definition of Antisemitism, which states "drawing comparisons of contemporary Israeli policy to that of the Nazis" as an example of antisemitism."
From a quick review of the IHRA definition of antisemitism I didnt find any mention of comparisons between contemporary Israel policy to that of the Naxis being an example.
What I did see was the following "However, criticism of Israel similar to that leveled against any other country cannot be regarded as antisemitic"
For me I think the OPs post was quite rightly denouncing a member of Israel’s government in line with what would be called out across the modern world.
Dont get me wrong I acknowledge your call outs on the current Israeli government and dont agree with Nazi comparisons. However is what other people are calling out the same as what would be called out across the modern world and thus not be regarded as antisemitic?
(The above is not excusing obvious antisemitism that we have seen in recent times and should be dealt with as racism and what it is a hate crime) |
It is in there, it’s the penultimate bullet point on the link GB posted. | | | |
| Not a good look when Netanyahu reprimand you on 00:47 - May 21 with 1375 views | GlasgowBlue |
| Not a good look when Netanyahu reprimand you on 00:27 - May 21 by WicklowBlue |
Honest ignoramus question:
"I am linking you to the IHRA definition of Antisemitism, which states "drawing comparisons of contemporary Israeli policy to that of the Nazis" as an example of antisemitism."
From a quick review of the IHRA definition of antisemitism I didnt find any mention of comparisons between contemporary Israel policy to that of the Naxis being an example.
What I did see was the following "However, criticism of Israel similar to that leveled against any other country cannot be regarded as antisemitic"
For me I think the OPs post was quite rightly denouncing a member of Israel’s government in line with what would be called out across the modern world.
Dont get me wrong I acknowledge your call outs on the current Israeli government and dont agree with Nazi comparisons. However is what other people are calling out the same as what would be called out across the modern world and thus not be regarded as antisemitic?
(The above is not excusing obvious antisemitism that we have seen in recent times and should be dealt with as racism and what it is a hate crime) |
It’s the second last example. I’ve highlighted in bold for you.
https://holocaustremembrance.c
Contemporary examples of antisemitism in public life, the media, schools, the workplace, and in the religious sphere could, taking into account the overall context, include, but are not limited to:
Calling for, aiding, or justifying the killing or harming of Jews in the name of a radical ideology or an extremist view of religion.
Making mendacious, dehumanizing, demonizing, or stereotypical allegations about Jews as such or the power of Jews as collective — such as, especially but not exclusively, the myth about a world Jewish conspiracy or of Jews controlling the media, economy, government or other societal institutions.
Accusing Jews as a people of being responsible for real or imagined wrongdoing committed by a single Jewish person or group, or even for acts committed by non-Jews.
Denying the fact, scope, mechanisms (e.g. gas chambers) or intentionality of the genocide of the Jewish people at the hands of National Socialist Germany and its supporters and accomplices during World War II (the Holocaust).
Accusing the Jews as a people, or Israel as a state, of inventing or exaggerating the Holocaust.
Accusing Jewish citizens of being more loyal to Israel, or to the alleged priorities of Jews worldwide, than to the interests of their own nations.
Denying the Jewish people their right to self-determination, e.g., by claiming that the existence of a State of Israel is a racist endeavor.
Applying double standards by requiring of it a behavior not expected or demanded of any other democratic nation.
Using the symbols and images associated with classic antisemitism (e.g., claims of Jews killing Jesus or blood libel) to characterize Israel or Israelis.
Drawing comparisons of contemporary Israeli policy to that of the Nazis.
Holding Jews collectively responsible for actions of the state of Israel. [Post edited 21 May 0:53]
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| Not a good look when Netanyahu reprimand you on 00:53 - May 21 with 1364 views | GlasgowBlue |
| Not a good look when Netanyahu reprimand you on 00:45 - May 21 by Sarge |
I find this a very puzzling definition. All of the other bullet points are inarguable but I don’t understand why drawing comparisons between Israel and the Nazi’s is considered antisemitic. You’ve said that it’s because it attacks them as Jews but 1) does it? and 2) why does it, whereas comparing them to the Khmer Rouge, Soviet Union etc doesn’t? Wouldn’t this be more likely to be an attack on them as Jews if Jews perpetrated the Holocaust rather than were victims of it? Or is this what this is getting at, that conflating the two is a way of saying Jews committed the Holocaust?
The Holocaust was perpetrated by a racist, far right terrorist state. Surely this is a more likely parallel that’s being drawn and I would be willing to bet that the majority of people that criticise the actions of Israel - including yourself - are criticising the state, not the fact that they’re Jewish.
As to why the Holocaust, I would assume because of all the events mentioned it’s the one most burned into our collective consciousness, the one that changed the world the most, that left its mark on nearly every country around the world, the one widely considered the darkest chapter of modern human history, and the one that is remembered far more than any other the others. You, or the IHRA, may say that drawing parallels between the two is a deliberate and discriminatory choice but I think you’re inferring intent that for most people just isn’t there. It’s just what comes to mind when you think of genocide.
Undoubtedly it trivialises the Holocaust, and so claiming that the two are remotely similar is wrong. The scale is thankfully nowhere near, as is the case with several of the other genocides in living memory and so it would trivialise them too to varying extents. But the wording is ‘drawing comparisons’ and I find it strange that it is completely off limits to do this, as if denying that any comparisons of any kind are or could ever be there.
Worth saying too that definition, almost certainly because of this particular bullet point, has generated some criticism from civil rights groups and some Jewish groups. So it’s not without its controversy and my personal opinion is that it’s clumsy and counter productive. |
I explained this in my previous post.
“ The state of Israel was formed by Holocaust survivors as a safe haven for Jews after the Nazis exterminated 6 million of them. You could have compared the actions if the Israeli state in Gaza with Holodomor, the Cambodian Genocide, the Armenian Genocide or Rwandan Genocide, You could have compared the actions of the Israeli state with those of Assad's Syria or Saddam's Iraq. But you went straight to the antisemitic comparison with the Nazis. Why was that? Why did you use the comparison with the nazis instead of one of the others I have just listed?
When you compare the actions of the Israeli state to the Nazis, you are attacking them as Jews. That they haven't learned a moral lesson from their own history. It also trivialises the Holocaust which is is nothing like what has happened in Gaza, no matter how awful and indefensible that conflict is
Not a good look when Netanyahu reprimand you by GlasgowBlue 20 May 22:33What Israel has done to Gaza is indefensible. No One is defending their actions. I have stated on numerous occasions that there should be trials for war crimes. So you can knock the "defending' accusation on the head right now.
And I'm not hiding behind an article. I am linking you to the IHRA definition of Antisemitism, which states " drawing comparisons of contemporary Israeli policy to that of the Nazis" as an example of antisemitism.
https://holocaustremembrance.com/resources/working-definition-antisemitism
The state of Israel was formed by Holocaust survivors as a safe haven for Jews after the Nazis exterminated 6 million of them. You could have compared the actions if the Israeli state in Gaza with Holodomor, the Cambodian Genocide, the Armenian Genocide or Rwandan Genocide, You could have compared the actions of the Israeli state with those of Assad's Syria or Saddam's Iraq. But you went straight to the antisemitic comparison with the Nazis. Why was that? Why did you use the comparison with the nazis instead of one of the others I have just listed?
When you compare the actions of the Israeli state to the Nazis, you are attacking them as Jews. That they haven't learned a moral lesson from their own history. It also trivialises the Holocaust which is is nothing like what has happened in Gaza, no matter how awful and indefensible that conflict is.
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| Not a good look when Netanyahu reprimand you on 05:23 - May 21 with 1276 views | Benters |
| Not a good look when Netanyahu reprimand you on 23:00 - May 20 by GlasgowBlue |
What part of the IHRA definition of Antisemitism, which states "drawing comparisons of contemporary Israeli policy to that of the Nazis" as an example of antisemitism, did you not understand?
Antisemitism is racism. Phil recently banned a poster for making a generalisation which was considered racist.
edit. It would be nice if we could discuss the war crimes and atrocities being committed by the Israeli state without falling into using lazy antisemitic tropes. Most normal and decent people cn do it. Some people can't.
I'll leave it there. [Post edited 20 May 23:05]
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Antisemitism is racism,you got that right buh.
Yes it’s a shame about GTSB1966 getting banned.I seriously think he’d ‘had a sniff of the barmaids apron’..He hated Reform and Farage,he fitted right in on here. [Post edited 21 May 5:28]
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| Not a good look when Netanyahu reprimand you on 08:02 - May 21 with 1141 views | wrightsrightglove |
| Not a good look when Netanyahu reprimand you on 22:33 - May 20 by GlasgowBlue |
What Israel has done to Gaza is indefensible. No One is defending their actions. I have stated on numerous occasions that there should be trials for war crimes. So you can knock the "defending' accusation on the head right now.
And I'm not hiding behind an article. I am linking you to the IHRA definition of Antisemitism, which states "drawing comparisons of contemporary Israeli policy to that of the Nazis" as an example of antisemitism.
https://holocaustremembrance.c
The state of Israel was formed by Holocaust survivors as a safe haven for Jews after the Nazis exterminated 6 million of them. You could have compared the actions if the Israeli state in Gaza with Holodomor, the Cambodian Genocide, the Armenian Genocide or Rwandan Genocide, You could have compared the actions of the Israeli state with those of Assad's Syria or Saddam's Iraq. But you went straight to the antisemitic comparison with the Nazis. Why was that? Why did you use the comparison with the nazis instead of one of the others I have just listed?
When you compare the actions of the Israeli state to the Nazis, you are attacking them as Jews. That they haven't learned a moral lesson from their own history. It also trivialises the Holocaust which is is nothing like what has happened in Gaza, no matter how awful and indefensible that conflict is. [Post edited 20 May 22:38]
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Why shouldn’t I use the way that history looks upon the Nazis as a comparison? Why wouldn’t I? The Holocaust is one of, if not the, biggest and most well known human tragedy in history. The other genocides you mention don’t have the same historic significance as the Holocaust, so why would I use them as an example? You’ve point don’t get to decide which historic event I get to compare an ongoing genocide to.
You’ve point that “drawing comparisons of contemporary Israeli policy to that of the Nazis” is antisemitic twice but that’s completely irrelevant to the point that I was making. I didn’t mention Israeli “policy” (are their current actions Israeli policy? Genuine question) I said that future generations will look back on them in the same way that we look back on the Nazis and ask the same questions; why did it happen, how did it happen, why didn’t people do more to stop it, how could people actively support that? I stand by that, and in no way is that antisemitic.
Trying desperately to spin something as antisemitic which is clearly not antisemitic only strips the word of its meaning | | | |
| Not a good look when Netanyahu reprimand you on 08:12 - May 21 with 1113 views | wrightsrightglove |
| Not a good look when Netanyahu reprimand you on 22:53 - May 20 by eirannach_gorm |
Something strange has happened to this part of the thread as two posts have vanished. You posted and then got a response post from GlasgowBlue. This is your reply to that post which does not make sense without the two missing post. The reason I point this out was that I was also going to challenge the missing GlasgowBlue post as your post was not antisemitic and was a valid genocide comparison. This knee jerk response does not shield the Israeli government from criticism for their actions in Palestine. Just to point out that the party that Ben-Gvir is the leader of is anti Arab and follow the views of Rabbi Kahane who believed that most Arabs living in Israel are the enemies of Jews and Israel itself, and that a Jewish, Halakhic state, in which non-Jews would have no voting rights, should be created. This makes it a bit awkward when arabs live in the last bit of Palestine that Israel have yet to annex. |
Thanks for the support, it’s pretty shocking the way that some people will throw around a term like that with impunity when it’s so clear and obvious what I was saying wasn’t antisemitic. Also fairly worrying that you can link to an irrelevant article and hit the report button and the post disappears without question which suggests the reporter was correct in their assertion.
I’m sure there’ll just be more doubling down rather than an apology but I stand by what I said | | | |
| Not a good look when Netanyahu reprimand you on 08:34 - May 21 with 1076 views | wrightsrightglove |
| Not a good look when Netanyahu reprimand you on 00:45 - May 21 by Sarge |
I find this a very puzzling definition. All of the other bullet points are inarguable but I don’t understand why drawing comparisons between Israel and the Nazi’s is considered antisemitic. You’ve said that it’s because it attacks them as Jews but 1) does it? and 2) why does it, whereas comparing them to the Khmer Rouge, Soviet Union etc doesn’t? Wouldn’t this be more likely to be an attack on them as Jews if Jews perpetrated the Holocaust rather than were victims of it? Or is this what this is getting at, that conflating the two is a way of saying Jews committed the Holocaust?
The Holocaust was perpetrated by a racist, far right terrorist state. Surely this is a more likely parallel that’s being drawn and I would be willing to bet that the majority of people that criticise the actions of Israel - including yourself - are criticising the state, not the fact that they’re Jewish.
As to why the Holocaust, I would assume because of all the events mentioned it’s the one most burned into our collective consciousness, the one that changed the world the most, that left its mark on nearly every country around the world, the one widely considered the darkest chapter of modern human history, and the one that is remembered far more than any other the others. You, or the IHRA, may say that drawing parallels between the two is a deliberate and discriminatory choice but I think you’re inferring intent that for most people just isn’t there. It’s just what comes to mind when you think of genocide.
Undoubtedly it trivialises the Holocaust, and so claiming that the two are remotely similar is wrong. The scale is thankfully nowhere near, as is the case with several of the other genocides in living memory and so it would trivialise them too to varying extents. But the wording is ‘drawing comparisons’ and I find it strange that it is completely off limits to do this, as if denying that any comparisons of any kind are or could ever be there.
Worth saying too that definition, almost certainly because of this particular bullet point, has generated some criticism from civil rights groups and some Jewish groups. So it’s not without its controversy and my personal opinion is that it’s clumsy and counter productive. |
Agree with what you’re saying completely. I just don’t see how it can be claimed to be antisemitic to suggest that history will compare the two events further down the line. Of course it’s not on the same scale at the Holocaust, but is as devastating to each family of a victim of the Israeli genocide as it was to each family of a victim of the Holocaust. Try telling the future Palestinian generations that they can’t draw comparisons between this genocide and the Holocaust because the Israelis didn’t kill enough people | | | |
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