| Szmodics back to Derby… 07:15 - Jul 23 with 4064 views | Gary_Knows |
… both loan and permanent deal being spoken about.
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| Did Szmodics travel to La Manga?? on 10:46 - Jul 23 with 797 views | PhilTWTD |
| Did Szmodics travel to La Manga?? on 10:32 - Jul 23 by unstableblue |
Apologies if already covered. |
He has a minor injury, which I believe is genuine rather than a smokescreen, so didn't travel. |  | | |
| Szmodics back to Derby… on 11:52 - Jul 23 with 679 views | Vic |
| Szmodics back to Derby… on 10:15 - Jul 23 by tractorboy1978 |
Who have we made much of a loss on under Gamechanger? Even Szmodics won't be too big of a loss on his amortised cost when push comes to shove. Ogbene will be one we take a decent hit on for sure.
We've made good profits on Delap, Omari and Broadhead. Woolfy/Baggott too who were pure profit as academy graduates. |
Omari Hutchinson - paid £20.0m, sold for £37.5m (£13.25m Profit)
Liam Delap paid £15.0m, sold for £30.0m (£14.4m Profit)
Nathan Broadhead - paid £1.5m, sold for £7.5m (£6.0m Profit)
Luke Woolfenden Paid - £0, sold for £4m (4.0m Profit)
George Edmundson - paid £750k, sold for £600k (£150k Loss)
Idris El Mizouni Paid - £0, sold for £400k (£400k Profit
Arijanet Murić - Paid £10.0m, sold for £6.0m (£4.0m Loss)
Elkan Baggott - Paid £0 sold for £1m (£1.0m Profit)
Others like Chappers were out of contract so don't really count.
That's a pretty healthy overall profit in my book. Any I've missed? |  |
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| Szmodics back to Derby… on 12:20 - Jul 23 with 621 views | Wakh |
| Szmodics back to Derby… on 11:52 - Jul 23 by Vic |
Omari Hutchinson - paid £20.0m, sold for £37.5m (£13.25m Profit)
Liam Delap paid £15.0m, sold for £30.0m (£14.4m Profit)
Nathan Broadhead - paid £1.5m, sold for £7.5m (£6.0m Profit)
Luke Woolfenden Paid - £0, sold for £4m (4.0m Profit)
George Edmundson - paid £750k, sold for £600k (£150k Loss)
Idris El Mizouni Paid - £0, sold for £400k (£400k Profit
Arijanet Murić - Paid £10.0m, sold for £6.0m (£4.0m Loss)
Elkan Baggott - Paid £0 sold for £1m (£1.0m Profit)
Others like Chappers were out of contract so don't really count.
That's a pretty healthy overall profit in my book. Any I've missed? |
On the red side, you are excluding clauses and sell ons.
On the green side you are not taking amortisation into account.
While the player is with us he generates income while his value amortises over the length of his contract. We haven’t got an income stream without those players.
So we haven’t made a 4 million loss on muric, not on the books anyway. We have no idea what the loan fee was. We also have no idea what percentage of wages we paid while he was at sassulo, nor how that weighed up against his decreasing book value. If we bought him for 10 million and say, depreciated him at £3.3m per year over 3 years and was paid a 500k loan fee then we made a 3.2m profit on the books I would imagine, minus any negative wages contribution.
I’m no expert on this, I’m sure others are but surely we can’t just look at start and end figures and ignore everything else. [Post edited 23 Jul 12:22]
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| Szmodics back to Derby… on 12:39 - Jul 23 with 576 views | Vic |
| Szmodics back to Derby… on 12:20 - Jul 23 by Wakh |
On the red side, you are excluding clauses and sell ons.
On the green side you are not taking amortisation into account.
While the player is with us he generates income while his value amortises over the length of his contract. We haven’t got an income stream without those players.
So we haven’t made a 4 million loss on muric, not on the books anyway. We have no idea what the loan fee was. We also have no idea what percentage of wages we paid while he was at sassulo, nor how that weighed up against his decreasing book value. If we bought him for 10 million and say, depreciated him at £3.3m per year over 3 years and was paid a 500k loan fee then we made a 3.2m profit on the books I would imagine, minus any negative wages contribution.
I’m no expert on this, I’m sure others are but surely we can’t just look at start and end figures and ignore everything else. [Post edited 23 Jul 12:22]
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I'm sure that you're right! Football finance is way to complicated for me; I'm a simple bloke and look at what we paid and what we sold for. Oh for the good old days before 'Amortisation'.
So I get what you're saying but I think when most of us fans think of Player trading we are thinking fairly black and white, paid and sold. But happy to be proved wrong and be in the minority. And happy to be educated in all these new fandangled ways :). | |
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| Szmodics back to Derby… on 12:46 - Jul 23 with 556 views | ReusersTown |
| Szmodics back to Derby… on 10:15 - Jul 23 by tractorboy1978 |
Who have we made much of a loss on under Gamechanger? Even Szmodics won't be too big of a loss on his amortised cost when push comes to shove. Ogbene will be one we take a decent hit on for sure.
We've made good profits on Delap, Omari and Broadhead. Woolfy/Baggott too who were pure profit as academy graduates. |
Amortised cost doesn't mean you just wipe it off if he's not here the whole time lol | | | |
| Szmodics back to Derby… on 13:05 - Jul 23 with 519 views | Wakh |
| Szmodics back to Derby… on 12:39 - Jul 23 by Vic |
I'm sure that you're right! Football finance is way to complicated for me; I'm a simple bloke and look at what we paid and what we sold for. Oh for the good old days before 'Amortisation'.
So I get what you're saying but I think when most of us fans think of Player trading we are thinking fairly black and white, paid and sold. But happy to be proved wrong and be in the minority. And happy to be educated in all these new fandangled ways :). |
Absolutely. But a business needs assets to trade. Our assets are largely our players. Those players have contributed enormously and generated a lot of income. Their contracts reduce; they might prefer to run it down and therefore we need to amortise them.
To support that squad surely we need a positive player trading model to allow us to support ambition. It can’t be just player trading. We need experienced players to (hopefully) help stay where we are or progress to maintain the income and then successful player trading to generate income.
If it was all about player trading then most players above 27 would be worthless to anyone (exaggeration there I know) and why the likes of Sammy shouldnt be lumped in to the player trading figures as those players would naturally reduce in book value while contributing to the revenue. [Post edited 23 Jul 13:07]
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| Szmodics back to Derby… on 13:26 - Jul 23 with 477 views | C_HealyIsAPleasure |
| Szmodics back to Derby… on 11:52 - Jul 23 by Vic |
Omari Hutchinson - paid £20.0m, sold for £37.5m (£13.25m Profit)
Liam Delap paid £15.0m, sold for £30.0m (£14.4m Profit)
Nathan Broadhead - paid £1.5m, sold for £7.5m (£6.0m Profit)
Luke Woolfenden Paid - £0, sold for £4m (4.0m Profit)
George Edmundson - paid £750k, sold for £600k (£150k Loss)
Idris El Mizouni Paid - £0, sold for £400k (£400k Profit
Arijanet Murić - Paid £10.0m, sold for £6.0m (£4.0m Loss)
Elkan Baggott - Paid £0 sold for £1m (£1.0m Profit)
Others like Chappers were out of contract so don't really count.
That's a pretty healthy overall profit in my book. Any I've missed? |
Obviously we’re going to be up if you arbitrarily decide to include profit on players not brought into the club, and exclude losses for players bought who then leave on a free…
In reality it’s difficult to say given majority of those bought for big fees are still in the squad currently. At this point the only things that you can say with certainty at this point is that overall transfer net spend under Gamechanger shows a massive loss, whilst position on those who have come in and gone shows a healthy profit
I suspect the latter will continue to be true based on likely fees for those still here (tbh I think most other than Leif would only just about break even but the Delap/Omari profits will continue to more and cover losses we’d get on the likes of Ogbene) |  |
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| Szmodics back to Derby… on 13:32 - Jul 23 with 458 views | C_HealyIsAPleasure |
| Szmodics back to Derby… on 12:20 - Jul 23 by Wakh |
On the red side, you are excluding clauses and sell ons.
On the green side you are not taking amortisation into account.
While the player is with us he generates income while his value amortises over the length of his contract. We haven’t got an income stream without those players.
So we haven’t made a 4 million loss on muric, not on the books anyway. We have no idea what the loan fee was. We also have no idea what percentage of wages we paid while he was at sassulo, nor how that weighed up against his decreasing book value. If we bought him for 10 million and say, depreciated him at £3.3m per year over 3 years and was paid a 500k loan fee then we made a 3.2m profit on the books I would imagine, minus any negative wages contribution.
I’m no expert on this, I’m sure others are but surely we can’t just look at start and end figures and ignore everything else. [Post edited 23 Jul 12:22]
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Amortisation may mean an in year profit but it doesn’t suddenly mean Muric was profitable for us
In the case of Muric (and using the figures you’ve quoted), he would have cost us £6.6m the 2 years he was here. We make a balance sheet profit this year from the sale figure however that doesn’t offset what he had cost us to date | |
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| Szmodics back to Derby… on 13:39 - Jul 23 with 407 views | berkstractorboy |
| Szmodics back to Derby… on 12:39 - Jul 23 by Vic |
I'm sure that you're right! Football finance is way to complicated for me; I'm a simple bloke and look at what we paid and what we sold for. Oh for the good old days before 'Amortisation'.
So I get what you're saying but I think when most of us fans think of Player trading we are thinking fairly black and white, paid and sold. But happy to be proved wrong and be in the minority. And happy to be educated in all these new fandangled ways :). |
I think you proved the point Vic that we are not making the losses some seem to think we our purchases. Yes there is more to the detail of the profit and losses but on the whole we seem to be in profit. | | | |
| Szmodics back to Derby… on 17:17 - Jul 23 with 289 views | WolfieAtTheBack |
I heard off a bloke today SS is going to Birmingham City. No idea if true. |  | | |
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