| C19 vaccine IP rights 16:03 - Nov 20 with 1992 views | StokieBlue |
Some interesting developments here, India and South Africa have tabled a motion to the WTO that the IP rights for C19 vaccines should be waived.
This has been backed by China (who lets face it ignore IP anyway) but it's going to be voted down next month by the US and the EU.
So should companies make money from this or should they perhaps be compensated for their research and then make the vaccine at cost price or release the patents so anyone can make it?
SB |  |
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| C19 vaccine IP rights on 16:13 - Nov 20 with 1949 views | bluelagos |
I think the companies should definitely receive adequate reward. But also that every single nation should be provided with enough vaccines to prevent needless deaths.
If we don't eliminate the virus, then tourist goes to Ghana (or where ever) brings it home and it starts up again.
So it would be in everyone's interest to ensure every nation gets access. Whether that is by ignoring the IP rights, price fixing, or paying for vaccine at full cost and providing it to the developing world I have no strong opinions. But it has to happen. |  |
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| C19 vaccine IP rights on 16:21 - Nov 20 with 1935 views | blueislander |
| C19 vaccine IP rights on 16:13 - Nov 20 by bluelagos |
I think the companies should definitely receive adequate reward. But also that every single nation should be provided with enough vaccines to prevent needless deaths.
If we don't eliminate the virus, then tourist goes to Ghana (or where ever) brings it home and it starts up again.
So it would be in everyone's interest to ensure every nation gets access. Whether that is by ignoring the IP rights, price fixing, or paying for vaccine at full cost and providing it to the developing world I have no strong opinions. But it has to happen. |
I visited my GP today, and he stated that I would be vaccinated in January. He also said that he believes that the Oxford vaccine is far more advanced than they are letting on. |  | | |
| C19 vaccine IP rights on 16:22 - Nov 20 with 1926 views | bluelagos |
| C19 vaccine IP rights on 16:21 - Nov 20 by blueislander |
I visited my GP today, and he stated that I would be vaccinated in January. He also said that he believes that the Oxford vaccine is far more advanced than they are letting on. |
More advanced? As in closer to being used by NHS or has super powers of vaccination? | |
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| C19 vaccine IP rights on 16:25 - Nov 20 with 1922 views | blueislander |
| C19 vaccine IP rights on 16:22 - Nov 20 by bluelagos |
More advanced? As in closer to being used by NHS or has super powers of vaccination? |
In ready for use. It does have some practical advantages, particularly in respect of storage. Also the Oxford one uses “old “ technology apparently. [Post edited 20 Nov 2020 16:27]
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| C19 vaccine IP rights on 16:29 - Nov 20 with 1902 views | StokieBlue |
| C19 vaccine IP rights on 16:13 - Nov 20 by bluelagos |
I think the companies should definitely receive adequate reward. But also that every single nation should be provided with enough vaccines to prevent needless deaths.
If we don't eliminate the virus, then tourist goes to Ghana (or where ever) brings it home and it starts up again.
So it would be in everyone's interest to ensure every nation gets access. Whether that is by ignoring the IP rights, price fixing, or paying for vaccine at full cost and providing it to the developing world I have no strong opinions. But it has to happen. |
That's not quite true with regards to bringing the virus back, if people are vaccinated up to the required level and the immunity lasts then it doesn't matter if someone brings it back as they aren't going to infect people in a meaningful way. There are lots of things that exist outside the UK but if you bring them back they won't do anything assuming people have been vaccinated (measles for instance).
"So it would be in everyone's interest to ensure every nation gets access. Whether that is by ignoring the IP rights, price fixing, or paying for vaccine at full cost and providing it to the developing world I have no strong opinions. But it has to happen."
Totally agree.
SB | |
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| Invisibility..... on 16:29 - Nov 20 with 1899 views | Bloots |
| C19 vaccine IP rights on 16:22 - Nov 20 by bluelagos |
More advanced? As in closer to being used by NHS or has super powers of vaccination? |
....this deserves a thread of it's own. |  |
| Enduringly lovable, intelligent and thunderingly exquisite. |
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| C19 vaccine IP rights on 16:32 - Nov 20 with 1896 views | StokieBlue |
| C19 vaccine IP rights on 16:25 - Nov 20 by blueislander |
In ready for use. It does have some practical advantages, particularly in respect of storage. Also the Oxford one uses “old “ technology apparently. [Post edited 20 Nov 2020 16:27]
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They are reporting their results at the end of the year.
The Oxford vaccine is a adenoviral vaccine whilst the Pfizer one is mRNA. You are right that the Oxford one is older technology that takes a genetically modified chimp virus that then resembles C19 and thus triggers a body reaction.
The Pfizer vaccine is mRNA which uses a partial set of instructions from C19 to get the body to manufacture just the spike protein which the body can then recognise and react to.
SB | |
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| C19 vaccine IP rights on 16:34 - Nov 20 with 1880 views | homer_123 |
| C19 vaccine IP rights on 16:29 - Nov 20 by StokieBlue |
That's not quite true with regards to bringing the virus back, if people are vaccinated up to the required level and the immunity lasts then it doesn't matter if someone brings it back as they aren't going to infect people in a meaningful way. There are lots of things that exist outside the UK but if you bring them back they won't do anything assuming people have been vaccinated (measles for instance).
"So it would be in everyone's interest to ensure every nation gets access. Whether that is by ignoring the IP rights, price fixing, or paying for vaccine at full cost and providing it to the developing world I have no strong opinions. But it has to happen."
Totally agree.
SB |
Not if the virus picks up strains and mutations though? |  |
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| C19 vaccine IP rights on 16:35 - Nov 20 with 1881 views | bluelagos |
| C19 vaccine IP rights on 16:32 - Nov 20 by StokieBlue |
They are reporting their results at the end of the year.
The Oxford vaccine is a adenoviral vaccine whilst the Pfizer one is mRNA. You are right that the Oxford one is older technology that takes a genetically modified chimp virus that then resembles C19 and thus triggers a body reaction.
The Pfizer vaccine is mRNA which uses a partial set of instructions from C19 to get the body to manufacture just the spike protein which the body can then recognise and react to.
SB |
Seeing as how they have ordered over 300m different vaccines, do you think we as NHS punters would get a say in what we are given or will that be decided by those higher up the food chain? | |
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| C19 vaccine IP rights on 16:37 - Nov 20 with 1879 views | blueislander |
| C19 vaccine IP rights on 16:32 - Nov 20 by StokieBlue |
They are reporting their results at the end of the year.
The Oxford vaccine is a adenoviral vaccine whilst the Pfizer one is mRNA. You are right that the Oxford one is older technology that takes a genetically modified chimp virus that then resembles C19 and thus triggers a body reaction.
The Pfizer vaccine is mRNA which uses a partial set of instructions from C19 to get the body to manufacture just the spike protein which the body can then recognise and react to.
SB |
My GP reckoned that when they do report it will be 100% ready for use unlike the Pfizer and Moderna ones are at the moment. | | | |
| C19 vaccine IP rights on 16:41 - Nov 20 with 1860 views | StokieBlue |
| C19 vaccine IP rights on 16:34 - Nov 20 by homer_123 |
Not if the virus picks up strains and mutations though? |
That isn't specific to travelling and vaccinating other countries though. That could just as easily happen internally in the UK.
SB | |
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| C19 vaccine IP rights on 16:43 - Nov 20 with 1855 views | StokieBlue |
| C19 vaccine IP rights on 16:35 - Nov 20 by bluelagos |
Seeing as how they have ordered over 300m different vaccines, do you think we as NHS punters would get a say in what we are given or will that be decided by those higher up the food chain? |
I honestly don't know but I think it will be along the lines of:
"Here's your vaccine, you're lucky you're getting anything so don't complain about the type".
SB | |
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| C19 vaccine IP rights on 16:46 - Nov 20 with 1828 views | bluelagos |
| C19 vaccine IP rights on 16:43 - Nov 20 by StokieBlue |
I honestly don't know but I think it will be along the lines of:
"Here's your vaccine, you're lucky you're getting anything so don't complain about the type".
SB |
If we do get a choice, expect a few posts on which would be best. But suspect you're right. Which is fair enough in the circumstances. | |
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| C19 vaccine IP rights on 16:50 - Nov 20 with 1815 views | BloomBlue |
| C19 vaccine IP rights on 16:35 - Nov 20 by bluelagos |
Seeing as how they have ordered over 300m different vaccines, do you think we as NHS punters would get a say in what we are given or will that be decided by those higher up the food chain? |
I would prefer the one that wasn't tested on animals |  | | |
| C19 vaccine IP rights on 17:36 - Nov 20 with 1775 views | Basuco |
| C19 vaccine IP rights on 16:21 - Nov 20 by blueislander |
I visited my GP today, and he stated that I would be vaccinated in January. He also said that he believes that the Oxford vaccine is far more advanced than they are letting on. |
Son-in-law has been told that he will get a vaccine in December, he works in A&E, not sure which one. |  | | |
| C19 vaccine IP rights on 17:41 - Nov 20 with 1763 views | Basuco |
| C19 vaccine IP rights on 16:50 - Nov 20 by BloomBlue |
I would prefer the one that wasn't tested on animals |
I think you will find that they are all tested on animals prior to being tested on humans, I think this is an essential step to getting approval, but not sure. | | | |
| C19 vaccine IP rights on 18:49 - Nov 20 with 1702 views | andytown |
| C19 vaccine IP rights on 16:46 - Nov 20 by bluelagos |
If we do get a choice, expect a few posts on which would be best. But suspect you're right. Which is fair enough in the circumstances. |
I’m no expert, but is it the case that it depends on what the vaccines do? I understand that some vaccines stop you getting infected but others only stop you being contagious although you can still catch it. Are all these vaccines reporting of the former type? | | | |
| C19 vaccine IP rights on 19:13 - Nov 20 with 1668 views | J2BLUE |
I like the thought of this but I assume they've been assured this won't happen by the WHO and would we have had this many different vaccines to choose from (potentially) if individual vaccines weren't funded how they have been?
I hope the Oxford one works (£3 a dose) and our government spends a decent chunk of money on providing it to the world's poorer countries. |  |
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| C19 vaccine IP rights on 19:57 - Nov 20 with 1627 views | IpswichKnight |
Health service journal reporting that everyone over 18 will be vaccinated by April
Care home residents and staff, healthcare workers — from the beginning of December;
Ages 80 plus — from mid-December;
Everyone aged 70-80 — from late December;
Everyone aged 65-70 — from early January;
All high and moderate risk under 65s — from early January;
Everyone aged 50-65 — from mid-January; and
Everyone aged 18-50 — from late January; but with the bulk of this group vaccinated during March. | | | |
| C19 vaccine IP rights on 19:59 - Nov 20 with 1614 views | J2BLUE |
| C19 vaccine IP rights on 19:57 - Nov 20 by IpswichKnight |
Health service journal reporting that everyone over 18 will be vaccinated by April
Care home residents and staff, healthcare workers — from the beginning of December;
Ages 80 plus — from mid-December;
Everyone aged 70-80 — from late December;
Everyone aged 65-70 — from early January;
All high and moderate risk under 65s — from early January;
Everyone aged 50-65 — from mid-January; and
Everyone aged 18-50 — from late January; but with the bulk of this group vaccinated during March. |
That would be amazing. | |
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| C19 vaccine IP rights on 20:27 - Nov 20 with 1565 views | Pinewoodblue |
| C19 vaccine IP rights on 19:13 - Nov 20 by J2BLUE |
I like the thought of this but I assume they've been assured this won't happen by the WHO and would we have had this many different vaccines to choose from (potentially) if individual vaccines weren't funded how they have been?
I hope the Oxford one works (£3 a dose) and our government spends a decent chunk of money on providing it to the world's poorer countries. |
I was under the impression that months ago the UK government pledged to use overseas aid funds to provide vaccines to poorer countries. The Oxford vaccine looks like it will be supplied at a cost of around £3 but the Moderna vaccine will be sold at twenty times that.
Incidentally it seems GPs will get a little over £12 to deliver each shot. |  |
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